2007-09-05, 00:10 | Link #21 | |
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DUDE!!! Saturation = 100% isn't high contrast. It looks horrid even if you have Red, 100% Saturation, and 50% intensity... PEOPLE READ WHAT I JUST WROTE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Why you should avoid using red at all costs, because of the YV12 colorspace which can misinterpret the colors!!! Get the concept straight dudes. By PURE I MEAN SATURATION 100%... INTENSITY CAN BE 25% FOR WHAT I DON'T CARE. Need I give you a lecture on YV12 colorspace and HSV colors? I think not. You should go research before trying to flame here. |
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2007-09-05, 00:24 | Link #22 | |
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Secondly, it will highly contrast with the screen and its readability vs the background and its blending colorspace mumbojumbo regardless. Saturation is simply how much of that color is being used to define it which creates a big nasty-looking mess on the screen, not just in YV12 so I don't know why you're fixated on it. Last edited by salkaman; 2007-09-05 at 00:31. Reason: Typos |
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2007-09-05, 00:30 | Link #23 |
done
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Join Date: Nov 2003
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I don't believe he ever said saturation... He said contrast. Saturation and contrast are completely different functions. I would like it also if you would not try to prove a point with a bunch of "!". It doesn't make the point any more valid to the discussion.
To get back on topic, here are some style settings I have used in the past that I have found to work for me. Change the font and size to ones you have and like. The following are [V4+ Styles] Style: SDD1,CastleT,35,&H00F0F3F3,&H000000FF,&H00001F30,& H70001F30,0,0,0,0,100,100,0,0,1,2,1.5,2,20,20,30,0 Style: SDD2,CastleT,35,&H00FFF9EE,&H000000FF,&H00302701,& H70302701,0,0,0,0,100,100,0,0,1,2,1.5,2,20,20,30,0 Style: SDDT,CastleT,35,&H00FFF9FA,&H000000FF,&H00330000,& H70370000,0,1,0,0,100,100,0,0,1,2,1.5,2,20,20,30,0 Style: SDDF,CastleT,35,&H00ECECE7,&H000000FF,&H003E3E39,& H703E3E39,0,1,0,0,100,100,0,0,1,2,1.5,2,20,20,30,0 Style: FMPTSRMD1,LeawoodStd-Medium,52,&H00FFFFFF,&H00888888,&H00000000,&HA0000 000,0,0,0,0,100,100,0,0,1,1.5,2,2,30,30,37,0 Style: FMPTSRMD2,LeawoodStd-Medium,52,&H00FFE8D5,&H00888888,&H00000000,&HA0000 000,0,0,0,0,100,100,0,0,1,1.5,2,2,30,30,37,0 Style: FMPTSRMDT,LeawoodStd-Medium,52,&H00ffffff,&H00888888,&H00000000,&HA0000 000,0,1,0,0,100,100,0,0,1,1.5,2,2,30,30,37,0 Style: FMPTSRMDR,Metrostyle EC,53,&H00FFFFFF,&H00888888,&H00000000,&HA0000000, 1,0,0,0,100,100,0,0,1,1.5,2,2,30,30,37,0 Style: FMPTSRMDF,LeawoodStd-Medium,52,&H00D4CFBC,&H00888888,&H00000000,&HA0000 000,0,1,0,0,100,100,0,0,1,1.5,2,2,30,30,37,0 Style: FMPTSRMDC,As seen on TV,70,&H00FFFFFF,&H00888888,&H00000000,&HA0000000, 1,0,0,0,100,100,0,0,1,1.5,1.5,2,30,30,28,0 Style: PPDMD1,Elected Office,62,&H00F6E0FF,&H00888888,&H00000000,&HA0000 000,1,0,0,0,100,100,0,0,1,1.75,2,2,30,30,30,0 Style: PPDMD2,Elected Office,62,&H00FFFFD4,&H00888888,&H00000000,&HA0000 000,1,0,0,0,100,100,0,0,1,1.75,2,2,30,30,30,0 Style: PPDMDT,Elected Office,62,&H00EAFFE2,&H00888888,&H00000000,&HA0000 000,0,1,0,0,100,100,0,0,1,1.75,2,2,30,30,30,0 Style: PPDMDF,Elected Office,62,&H00CECBBE,&H00888888,&H00000000,&HA0000 000,0,1,0,0,100,100,0,0,1,1.75,2,2,30,30,30,0 Style: PPDMDN,American CLassic Extra Bold,58,&H00FFFFFF,&H00888888,&H00000000,&H8000000 0,1,0,0,0,100,100,0,0,1,1.75,2,2,30,30,28,0 Style: YTMD1,CooperBlaDBol,46,&H00A1CCD4,&H00FFFFFF,&H000 00000,&H00000000,0,0,0,0,90,100,0,0.00,1,1.5,1,2,3 0,30,30,0 Style: YTMD2,CooperBlaDBol,46,&H00C6CED6,&H00FFFFFF,&H000 00000,&H00000000,1,0,0,0,90,100,0,0.00,1,1.5,1,2,3 0,30,30,0 Style: YTMDT,CooperBlaDBol,46,&H00C2B3BE,&H00FFFFFF,&H000 00000,&H00000000,1,0,0,0,90,100,0,0.00,1,1.5,1,2,3 0,30,30,0 Style: YTMDF,CooperBlaDBol,46,&H00A1CCD4,&H00FFFFFF,&H000 00000,&H00000000,0,0,0,0,90,100,0,0.00,1,1.5,1,2,3 0,30,30,0 Style: YTMDC,As seen on TV,58,&H00FFFFFF,&H00FFFFFF,&H00000000,&H00000000, 1,0,0,0,100,100,0,0.00,1,1.5,1,2,30,30,30,0 Style: YTMDN,Conso Display SSi,40,&H00FFFFFF,&H00FFFFFF,&H00000000,&H00000000 ,1,0,0,0,100,120,0,0.00,1,1.5,1,2,30,30,30,0 Style: SNS3MD1,Slider,50,&H00FFFFFF,&HFFFFFFFF,&H00000000 ,&H80000000,1,0,0,0,100,100,0,0.00,1,2.00,1.00,2,2 0,20,30,0 Style: SNS3MD2,Slider,50,&H00FFE9CB,&HFFFFFFFF,&H00000000 ,&H80000000,1,0,0,0,100,100,0,0.00,1,2.00,1.00,2,2 0,20,30,0 Style: SNS3MDT,Slider,50,&H00E7F6CB,&HFFFFFFFF,&H00000000 ,&H80000000,1,1,0,0,100,100,0,0.00,1,2.00,1.00,2,2 0,20,30,0 Style: SNS3MDR,Metrostyle EC,54,&H00FFFFFF,&HFFFFFFFF,&H00000000,&H80000000, 1,0,0,0,100,100,0,0.00,1,2.00,1.00,2,20,20,30,0 Style: SNS3MDN,Slider,50,&H00FFFFFF,&HFFFFFFFF,&H00000000 ,&H80000000,1,0,0,0,100,100,0,0.00,1,2.00,1.00,2,2 0,20,30,0 Style: MD1,Blobfont G98,50,&H00F1D9C3,&Hffffffff,&H00000000,&H80000000 ,0,0,0,0,80,100,0,0.00,1,1.5,1.5,2,20,20,20,0 Style: MD2,Blobfont G98,50,&H00C8C5FF,&Hffffffff,&H00000000,&H80000000 ,0,0,0,0,80,100,0,0.00,1,1.5,1.5,2,20,20,20,0 Style: MDT,Blobfont G98,50,&H00D9C4D3,&Hffffffff,&H00000000,&H80000000 ,0,0,0,0,80,100,0,0.00,1,1.5,1.5,2,20,20,20,0 Style: MDN,Apple Chancery,55,&H00FFFFFF,&Hffffffff,&H00000000,&H800 00000,1,0,0,0,110,100,0,0.00,1,1.5,1.5,2,20,20,20, 0 Style: MDP,Apple Chancery,55,&H00D5C2CC,&Hffffffff,&H00000000,&H800 00000,1,0,0,0,110,100,0,0.00,1,1.5,1.5,2,20,20,20, 0 Style: DAMDF,Slider,40,&H00773E35,&Hffffffff,&H00ffffff,& Hffffffff,0,1,0,0,100,100,0,0.00,1,1.5,0,2,0,0,30, 0 Style: DAMDR,As seen on TV,54,&H00F2B9B0,&Hffffffff,&H00000000,&Hffffffff, 0,0,0,0,100,100,0,0.00,1,1.5,0,8,0,0,30,0 Style: DAMD1,Slider,40,&H00ffffff,&Hffffffff,&H00600E0E,& Hffffffff,0,0,0,0,100,100,0,0.00,1,1.5,0,2,20,0,30 ,0 Style: DAMD2,Slider,40,&H00FFEAD4,&Hffffffff,&H00600E0E,& Hffffffff,0,0,0,0,100,100,0,0.00,1,1.5,0,2,20,0,30 ,0 Style: DAMDS,Slider,40,&H00ffffff,&Hffffffff,&H00743E79,& Hffffffff,0,0,0,0,100,100,0,0.00,1,1.5,0,2,20,0,30 ,0 style: CMD1,Abadi MT Condensed Extra Bold,52,&H00DCEBE6&,&HFFFFFFFF&,&H00000000&,&HC000 0000&,0,0,0,0,100,100,0,0.00,1,1.75,1.5,2,30,30,30 ,0 style: CMD2,Abadi MT Condensed Extra Bold,52,&H00E7DFD1&,&HFFFFFFFF&,&H00000000&,&HC000 0000&,0,0,0,0,100,100,0,0.00,1,1.75,1.5,2,30,30,30 ,0 style: CMD3,Abadi MT Condensed Extra Bold,52,&H00D1DFCA&,&HFFFFFFFF&,&H00000000&,&HC000 0000&,0,0,0,0,100,100,0,0.00,1,1.75,1.5,2,30,30,30 ,0 style: CMDT,Abadi MT Condensed Extra Bold,52,&H00DCEBE6&,&HFFFFFFFF&,&H00000000&,&HC000 0000&,0,1,0,0,100,100,0,0.00,1,1.75,1.5,2,30,30,30 ,0 style: CMDF,Abadi MT Condensed Extra Bold,52,&H00D1DFCA&,&HFFFFFFFF&,&H00000000&,&HC000 0000&,0,1,0,0,100,100,0,0.00,1,1.75,1.5,2,30,30,30 ,0 style: SRMD1,Conso Display SSi,52,&H00DCEBE6&,&HFFFFFFFF&,&H00000000&,&HC0000 000&,1,0,0,0,100,100,0,0.00,1,1.75,1.5,2,30,30,30, 0 style: SRMD2,Conso Display SSi,52,&H00EBFAE4&,&HFFFFFFFF&,&H00000000&,&HC0000 000&,1,0,0,0,100,100,0,0.00,1,1.75,1.5,2,30,30,30, 0 style: SRMDT,Conso Display SSi,52,&H00DCEBE6&,&HFFFFFFFF&,&H00000000&,&HC0000 000&,1,1,0,0,100,100,0,0.00,1,1.75,1.5,2,30,30,30, 0 style: SRMDF,Conso Display SSi,52,&H00F8EBE4&,&HFFFFFFFF&,&H00000000&,&HC0000 000&,1,1,0,0,100,100,0,0.00,1,1.75,1.5,2,30,30,30, 0 style: SRMDN,Trebuchet MS,52,&H00FFFFFF&,&HFFFFFFFF&,&H00000000&,&HC00000 00&,1,0,0,0,100,100,0,0.00,1,1.75,1.5,2,30,30,30, 0 style: SRMDR,Metrostyle EC,60,&H00ffffff,&H00888888,&H00000000,&HA0000000, 1,0,0,0,100,100,0,0.00,1,2,2,2,30,30,30,0 I apologize for ones that don't render great. Some were font specific, and the sizes are all based on different aspects. There are no doubt repeat styles here and there because I had certain ones I liked and that worked well on another series. With that said, do not be afraid to reuse font you like that fit something. You _DO NOT_ need a new font all the time. Using what works is a big part of styling. Remember that if it fits, don't fuck with it. |
2007-09-05, 00:33 | Link #24 | |
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Join Date: Jul 2004
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>>>>>>>>>>>>> Never pick `pure` (100% saturation or close) red colors or orange colors in styling for "Hardsub text" in "YV12 video" due to the fact that YV12 misinterprets red colorings. Don't know any of those terms? Google it. <<<<<<<<<<<<< ^ exact quote. I hope my red colors catch your eyes again. The intensity doesn't matter in determining the purity of a color. Contrast is a combination of saturation and intensity. Hence it doesn't apply that way... YV12 handles pure blue just fine, but not so good with pure red. And hue determines it, but it's quite obvious anyways. 0 degrees = red. |
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2007-09-05, 00:41 | Link #25 |
done
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Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Yokosuka, JP
Age: 43
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We have read what you said ever time, and it is a mute point if you follow what was said in the very few first posts. And just a FYI, watch bleach's op kara by anime-keep. There is a line that has black border solid red primary, and no blocking. But like I said, mute point as long as they follow what has been said since pretty much any color except yellow or white from primarys will be hard to read due to their ability to contrast a border in a legiable manor...
This is my last post about this specific sub topic... it's a waste of my own person time, and the time of everyone reading this for information. |
2007-09-05, 00:49 | Link #26 | |
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2007-09-05, 00:49 | Link #27 | |
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No, I'm talking about general portrayal of colorings... Why you should avoid using it... Have you ever encoded stuff or even tried using reds in typesetting? I already tried a few things and concluded that there will be substantial amount of problems when reds are being used in YV12 footages. If you want to follow my advice, that's fine. If you're going to be stubborn, I don't need to say much until you experienced what I have said is accurate.
Quote:
Last edited by pichu; 2007-09-05 at 01:01. |
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2007-09-05, 01:05 | Link #28 | |
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Join Date: Oct 2004
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Quote:
With the proper encoder settings and filters, that problem is fixable because I've used it myself in my final works for a good number of episodes and have seen it used using pure red at 100% in YV12 videos, it works when matched with the rest of the scenes it is used in properly, otherwise it can produce some funky results when wrongly used, yes. Maybe you need to try something different than you have already, and we shall progress from here. Forums only suck when things get personal. |
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2007-09-05, 01:25 | Link #29 | |
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To the topic: Glossary of terms: (I think it will be appropriate to provide this) High Contrast = High Luminosity or High Saturation with Medium-High-level Luminosity. (see below) Pure colors = 100% saturated colors with a set Hue level defined of your 'color.' HSL/HSV = Hue Saturation Luminance/Intensity is used for easy-to-use colors selection. Hue determines your color selection in the rainbow spectrum, Saturation determines the purity of that color, and Luminance/Intensity determines the brightness. Faux Bold = extra BOLD weight added to the normal font by adding a border, rather than from a known bold font (like Times New Roman-Bold). A very basic way to do faux bold is to add an extra border around the font (i.e. \1c&H000000&\3c&H000000&\bord1). A more advanced way is to resize the glyph and weight it. Faux Italics = Italics made from the default normal font (i.e. italicizing Verdana/Tahoma font), rather than from the Italics font (i.e. Arial-Italic). (i.e., \fax0.3 in vsfilter-svn) It's also known as slant, but normally it's set by a default of 15° slant. Glyph = the character in the font. -- And I'm off... for another few weeks. Last edited by pichu; 2007-09-05 at 05:23. |
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2007-09-05, 05:12 | Link #30 | ||
Just call me Ojisan
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: U.K. Hampshire
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Quote:
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Can I ask that posts and discussion remain within the intended scope. Perhaps the thread should be closed since the purpose was to provide a statement (i.e. the opening post was intended as a guide), but I hope that it can be used to ask questions and to discussion further typesetting issues. |
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2007-09-05, 05:27 | Link #31 | |
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--- I decided to append this to this post: Come to think of it... High contrast is basically highly distinguishable colors. All the context used here is clearly wrong. I didn't wear my glasses when I replied, so I couldn't think straight. Let me try to point out an example: White on black is High Contrast. This is the basic sub style. Low contrast is like white on gray. This type of colors should always be avoided using since they get blended too well, thereby allowing the text to be hard to distinguished from the scene... A few test cases are shown as shown: Technically, it's a better idea to use high contrast colors for your styles (i.e. brighter primary colors in dark border/shadow colors). Can't argue in that. A picture is worth a thousand words... I don't believe in describing styling with words alone... Last edited by pichu; 2007-09-05 at 05:39. |
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2007-09-05, 05:36 | Link #32 |
done
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Join Date: Nov 2003
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>.>... gets back to the point.
Knowing what possible types of fonts are available is very important. Also having full font families is equally important. What do I mean by a font family? Does it mean it is serif or sans? Yes but that is only the tip of the iceberg. There is much more to consider when creating a list of usable fonts. A fully detailed set has a hierarchy like this. The following style attributes are possible: Category : The main division of classes. i.e. Language, Symbol, Picture, Scientific family : The main fontface type. i.e. sans, serif, system. Subfamily : What kind of special stylization a font has if any. i.e. normal, outline, shadow, 3d, etc... Proportion : The character sets method of spacing between characters. i.e. monospaced, proportionate. Subproportion : Is the main proportion set modified to have wider or smaller spacing. i.e. Condensed, Expanded, etc... style : The type of traditional style formatting present. i.e. bold, underlined, italics Style Variant : declares any specific formatting done for special script types. i.e. subscript, superscript, all caps, strikethrough, etc... weight : How "thick" a font is or the amount of boldness it has. Weight is normally declared in a font set with numerous weights. i.e. blahlight, blahmedium, blahheavy are weights. size : default size of a font. If you set 20 different fonts to the same pixel size you will notice they show up as different sizes, this is because all fonts have a certain pica size they are created at. Here’s an example of a classified font with many special tags. Gill Sans-3D MT Ext Condensed Med ITC.ttf That breaks down to font name - gill Family - Sans Subfamily - 3D = three dimensional Proportion - MT = Monotype Subproportion - Ext Condensed = Extra Condensed style - ITC = Italics weight - Med = Medium A font like "gill" has many types already made, will all different kinds of styling done beforehand. It is best to use this to your advantage since every override you use with textsub is going to distort the font ever so slightly and not be as smooth. Most all fonts that are worth using as a dialogue font have large multi formatted sets such as this. Remember, you are only as versatile as the tools at your disposal. |
2007-09-05, 05:46 | Link #33 |
done
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Join Date: Nov 2003
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You are sorta write and sorta not all there. Contrast as in the scale from black to white within RGB is what we were speaking of most recently. Not as in contrasting, meaning traits which set specific items apart. Iaybe I wasn't clear on this, who knows. What I was getting at is a primary is something you want at a very near the absolute white spectrum with only a hint of your color wanted. Then you use either a complimentary color or a color of the same primary scale and shift it's contrast very near absolute black contrast and use that as a border color. When your border which is very dark and primary which is very light render and mix they will acquire traits of each other naturally while maintaining a healthy "contrasting relationship".
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2007-09-05, 05:48 | Link #34 |
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Yeah, I hope you don't mind my corrections.
ITC = International Type Corp, it's a font foundry MT = Mono Type; it's a company. MonoType basically owns ITC, so ITC is a subsidiary division of MT. They have nothing to do with font styles. ^^; (I still have to look into company acquisitions, but i think they were once two separate companies -- too lazy right now hehe) |
2007-09-05, 09:59 | Link #35 |
done
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True and True, but those are also the abbreviations for those terms. You find them a lot on newsgroup font downloads.
L = Light LT = Light Lig = Light M = Medium Med = Medium H = Heavy Hig = Heavy I=Italics ITC = Italics or that one companies name he mentioned above Bk = Book MT = Monotype or that one companies name he mentioned above Bru = Brush Eng = Engraved Ext = Extended (Not extra my bad) SSi = Southern Software Ince HE = Hollow Extended Ho = Hollow D = Demi DroSha = Drop Shadow Wd = Wide Ult = Ultra B = Bold Bd = Bold Bol = Bold Th = Thin Alts = Alternate style C = Condensed Cn = Condensed Con = Condensed BT = Bitstream Rnd = Rounded Tw = Twentieth Century Scr = Script Sha = Shadow LET - Letraset Caps = All upper case characters TT= Truetype JTC = Bla = Black Reg = Regular Got= Gothic Trans = Transparent Sys = System Hand = Handwriten |
2007-09-05, 10:15 | Link #36 |
done
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Join Date: Nov 2003
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Heres a demo video of color sweeps. I'll try to play wiht it more later so it displays as near to the original as possible on youtube.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7f7wMR29cbI |
2007-09-06, 12:16 | Link #37 | |
Give them the What For!
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2007-09-07, 01:09 | Link #39 |
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Why styling? You want to fit your subs into the video as much as possible. So, it might worth mentioning about fading, crossfading, and other transitions (clips, etc) in your styles. I find them as important as picking a style for your subs since you want them to blend in correctly in anime. And it takes another few pages of tutorial to show how to do crossfading properly in subs. I find most people can't do them correctly at all. (Simple way: \fad; Better way: \t with accelerators and/or colors with alpha; best way: use original video - not recommended heh)
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2007-09-08, 10:48 | Link #40 |
Aegisub dev
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Age: 39
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On the subject of fading, remember that VSFilter has a bug that causes fades (with \fad, \fade and iirc. also \alpha, but not \1a etc.) to "fade to grey". This does however not happen if you set alpha 2 to non-zero, ie. \2a&H01& or \2a&HFF&.
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