Marimite S2 Ep.11 (official thread)

[atua]

Originally Posted by lordwu

Actually, anyone who hasn't read the novel wants to take a shot at guessing what's Sachiko's business? What's she doing behind Yumi's back? There was a poll held before the release of Parasol o Sashite and there were some interesting results then.

I'll give it a stab... just don't laugh at my wildly incorrect guesses.

My take on Sachiko:

It seems that Sachiko has been pre-occupied with some internal, family related issues (eg conflict/illness/death/something to do with her father/grandfather etc) which has been taking up much of her spare time and thoughts. As a result she's been less attentive to what's going on than usual. Since it's a personal problem, Sachiko didn't want to overly worry or burden Yumi and feels that it's something that she should handle herself. Mind you, this doesn't nullify Shigan's point that Sachiko's current level of inter-personal relationship skill really isn't worthy of a Rosa Chinensis (compared with Youko, for instance) especially considering what had happened during the Valentine's Day incident.

This partly explains why Touko's been hanging around Sachiko so much lately; it's natural as a relative to want to support Sachiko at this time if she can. I really feel that the way Touko's been acting is more out of protectiveness of Sachiko than any conniving or maliciousness towards Yumi. The problem is, Touko is stepping into what Yumi considers her territory and Yumi's already feeling vulnerable. Touko's condescending and snobby attitude doesn't help either... ^^;

Suguru's sudden appearance at Sachiko's home also seems to support the family problem theory. He acted like he thought Yumi already knew what was going on and was only ringing to check up on Sachiko, so obviously he thought Sachiko had told her what's going on already...

Sachiko's biggest mistake this episode was that she should've learnt her lesson from the Valentine's Day incident and been upfront with Yumi all along. She probably should've been more attentive of Yumi as well, but then again her people observation skill was never her strongest point.

My take on Yumi:

Since this episode was told from Yumi's point of view, it's easy as a member of the audience to sympathise for her plight. Having said that, I don't think Yumi is entirely blameless in this mess either. Her lack of self confidence really comes into play this episode, though the series of events that occur, such as her talk with Minako, and the repeat outing cancellations didn't help her cause.

Though Yumi is a huge fan of Sachiko, or maybe it's *because* she's such a big fan, Yumi is rarely open with Sachiko about her true thoughts and feelings. Instead she hides her fears and frustrations behind her smile, when she should've tried to confront and thus deal with her feelings. For example, she didn't voiced her misgivings about Sachiko's cancellation whilst she had Sachiko's uninterrupted attention on the phone but instead just brushed it off as if it didn't really bothered her. Sure Yumi's actions were understandable and I'm sympathetic to her feelings as a viewer, but it looks like Sachiko isn't the only one who should've remembered what happened on Valentine's Day...

Yumi also has a habit of going to Sei (though admittedly an accident this time) for emotional support whenever she has problems with Sachiko instead of dealing with Sachiko directly. I think Sachiko's always been somewhat jealous of Sei & Yumi's easy familiarity and closeness, in contrast to her own more awkward and formal relationship with Yumi. Sachiko would've been quite hurt when rebuffed by Yumi during her attempted explanation for what's happening only to see Yumi run straight into Sei's arms and ignoring all attempts at getting her attention.

At any rate, I enjoyed this episode a great deal and am looking forward to the Yumi/Touko/Sachiko show down!

[SleeplessHeart]

This is surely the most emotional episode so far with a great background music (too bad, they don't have a song).

I rewatched this episode several times to observe what Touko has done.
I did not see that she has done anything wrong here. The problem lies between Yumi and Sachiko. They have taken their relationship for granted. They don't realize that they are very different characters.

[laurore31]

if sachiko has a family problem, she should tell yumi what's going on. it's natural for friends to be here... or she shoud tell only that she has a problem and she can't go on date with her, Yumi would probably understand... whereas she moves away from Yumi... and yumi is sad... so sad... :-(

I think Touko benefits from the situation... and looks high on Yumi... I hate this type of person... Always and always, she suddenly appears when yumi is arround sachiko...

yes, this is the most emotional episode...

[Yumisuke]

I just watched ep 11. I am poor english speaker, sorry. And please don't laugh at my guess (and my english ).

I never doubt Sachilo loves Yumi. But why Sachiko said nothing. Why she didn't took Yumi away from Sei . I guess that refusing Sachiko in Sei's arms, Yumi wanted her to do so and confide everything. That was last chance (for yumi too), but she left... I want to say to Sachiko as she said to Yumi on the day before Valentine's Day in the greenhouse. "Why did you give rosary ?"(I don't remember correct dialog;; )

So I guess Sachiko was worried that if Yumi knows everything, Yumi gives rosary back to her. But what is "evertthing"?? Nothing occurs to me, because I believe also Yumi never dislikes Sachiko whatever happens.

I am really looking forward to next ep.

[Nequam]

I just watched episode 11, and boy was I impressed. While I haven't read the novel for a comparison, I thought that the script writing, voice acting, music, and everything was spot on to create the most dramatic episode I've seen in Marimite so far.

As for the events of the episode, I honestly can't level any hate towards Touko and I certainly don't blame her for this whole mess (though she certainly didn't help things with her attitude). In fact, it isn't any one person's fault in my eyes. Personally, I think this is just a classic example of a failure to communicate between Yumi and Sachiko... those two really need to work out some of the kinks in their relationship.

Of course, we can always count on Sei to save the day... or at least bring some much needed levity to a heartbreaking situation for poor Yumi. Oooh, I can't wait for the next episode to air!

[Proto]

Since Ayu loves you all they have included Marimite 11 and Marimite 12 in their mass exodus releases: Props to Ayu and the Marimite team

[BonBon]

*Melts*

Yumi-chan...she's just...

Waaaa! I want to give her a big cuddle!

That mean Sachiko. I don't care what her excuses are. Yumi doesn't deserve to be made to feel like this!

*Is emotional all over the place*

[baik!]

it's a good thing ayu released both at one time. i am really grateful! thanks! if not, i would have been left to stew in this episode's ending for a long time.......

yeah, the art is awesome. props to the producers for bringing in the big guns at the end. yumi-chan looked like yumi-chan, sachiko looked like sachiko, everyone looked like themselves.

kj1980, your write-up is awesome too. if i could read kanji, i would take it upon myself to translate the books like how you did with that little excerpt you posted. i love it.

after being spoiled silly by all the spoilers that have permeated into this forum, i had a vague idea of what was about to happen. spoiled it a little, so my opinions may be skewed. it was rather difficult to fault sachiko, since it was rather obvious what the circumstances were, and yumi-chan was just worrying about nothing. so to answer your question, as a non-novel reader i still felt as if a big part of the equation wasn't revealed, since the sachiko-touko relationship wasn't implied forcefully enough (in the anime). vague happenings here and there don't constitute sachiko's 'betrayal'; i just felt that we didn't get her half of the story. yumi was jumping to conclusions, sachiko was being vague. both tried to speak (sachiko trying to explain things with touko around, yumi's shouting), but the way they tried was rather.... uneffective.

as for touko, since we're in the dark about what is really happening, i can't say i hate her. the animators tried to make her 'evil' using her facial expressions, but it doesn't seem that way to me. in the next episode, the encounter in the cafeteria drops the evil down by many many notches. it becomes so obvious that yumi got it all wrong.

reading your posts, alot of you think that sachiko was at fault for keeping quiet about things. i agree only to a certain extent, nequam said it well, it felt like just a big miscommunication. when i was watching the scene in the bara no yakata, my mind jumped back to valentine's day too (like alot of you), it was so similar! yumi-chan with her pent-up emotions, sachiko with her inability to express herself well. when yumi shouted at sachiko, it reminded me of that scene where sachiko said "why aren't you attacking me with your feelings (or was it words?)? i won't know what you're thinking if you don't tell me!". yumi shouting at sachiko shows how far she has progressed, and how much sachiko stayed the same. watching it, i felt as if yumi shattered there; but kj1980's post shows how yumi felt more angry and betrayed instead of dismayed and defeated.

atua typed out a great post, i agree with what he (or she) said about both the characters. and with suguru suddenly appearing, i also think it is a family issue.... now lets see, if it involves alot of driving and it is a family issue.... someone got lost? they're searching for something? or they're visiting people to seek help? those are the only things i can think of right now. i don't think it has anything to do with sachiko's family though, since she already mentions that her family is in good health. maybe it's a cancelling of the marriage engagement? (yaaaaay!!!!! )

i cried with yumi-chan.

more in the next thread.

[ZeusIrae]

Bouuuuuuuouh that'so saaaaaad!I cried at the end of the ep.poor yumi,it'so sad.I need something this so sad.I am i can't see ep2 yet this too much for one day.
This is the first anime that make me feel so sad.that's terrible.
Am i very rationnal here?
try to calm down.......it's so saaaad my fingers are shaking.

[Revd]

I just registered to say

After learnining to patiently wait for the subs two eps in one day is a great reward! Thanks Ayu.

[LucifersGirl]

It's nice to see more discussion open up again on this Ep, is the fansub just out? Anyway, I do agree with most opion here regarding Sachiko-Yomi-Touko; howver, as a anime-watcher I see Touko more of annoying than Evil.

One thing that bother me is that almost every post the issue that Sachiko's fault for not telling Yumi anything comes up.
Didn't Sachiko try to? In front of school building, regardless of who she's really waiting for, Sachiko would have told Yumi what's going on, if Yumi didn't run off and refuse to even look at her when she called out to.
I know it's a little late, but at least she made an effort to. Bad timing on Touko, but don't think it's intentional.

[JokerD]

Originally Posted by LucifersGirl

One thing that bother me is that almost every post the issue that Sachiko's fault for not telling Yumi anything comes up.
Didn't Sachiko try to? In front of school building, regardless of who she's really waiting for, Sachiko would have told Yumi what's going on, if Yumi didn't run off and refuse to even look at her when she called out to.
I know it's a little late, but at least she made an effort to. Bad timing on Touko, but don't think it's intentional.

Because it IS her fault for not saying anything. Words which are not spoken cannot be heard. And for more than (?) 3 weeks too. Plus she was seen being close to Touko and not her own seour during this period.
That being said, Yumi should have been a lot more assertive and asked the cause but I guess at that point in time she would not have the self confidence to face Sachiko and Touko together.

[LucifersGirl]

Ok, maybe I phase the question wrong. I agree that it's Sachiko bad for keeping it for so long, no excuse for that. What I meant to say is why everyone seems to forget to mention that Sachiko did try to tell Yumi what's going on (Before Touko show up and Yumi ran), and still try to talk to her when she's with Sei? Did I miss understand the scene? Does Sachiko not intend to explain her situation in that scene?

[JokerD]

Yes, she did seem she wanted to tell Yumi something. But right now we don't really know what Sachiko wants to say.
For that I actually blame Touko, lousy timing, lousy choice of words. A simple talk between them, but Touko shows and it all goes to hell. For all Yumi know the next words coming out of Sachiko's mouth could be "Please return my rosery, I want Touko to be my seour now"

I guess in Yumi's state of mind at that moment it would be a "so that's it" kinda thing.
(Am I answering the question? Or am I off the point again?)

[LucifersGirl]

Originally Posted by JokerD

For all Yumi know the next words coming out of Sachiko's mouth could be "Please return my rosery, I want Touko to be my seour now"

I guess in Yumi's state of mind at that moment it would be a "so that's it" kinda thing.
(Am I answering the question? Or am I off the point again?)

Yes that answered my question. I guess I wasn't thinking what Yumi would have thought at the time. Thanks a lot, JokerD.

[lordwu]

Originally Posted by LucifersGirl

Ok, maybe I phase the question wrong. I agree that it's Sachiko bad for keeping it for so long, no excuse for that. What I meant to say is why everyone seems to forget to mention that Sachiko did try to tell Yumi what's going on (Before Touko show up and Yumi ran), and still try to talk to her when she's with Sei? Did I miss understand the scene? Does Sachiko not intend to explain her situation in that scene?

There was a reason why Sachiko couldn't tell Yumi what she was up to. It was revealed at the very end of the Parasol o Sashite arc in the novel. I don't believe it was told in the anime though.

[Proto]

Would you mind to spoil us please

[lordwu]

Spoiler:

Sachiko told her grandmother a lot of happenings about Yumi when she visited her from time to time. Sachiko's grandmother grew quite fond of Yumi even though she never met her in person and enjoyed listening to Sachiko recounting everything happened between her and Yumi including the date (at the end of the first season). So when Sachiko's grandmother was hospitalized, she asked Sachiko not to tell Yumi about it. Why? She simply didn't want to have Yumi worried about her. And the reason why Sachiko didn't cancel the date to amusement park outright because she actually did want to go with Yumi and to tell her grandmother about the date afterwards to cheer her up in the hospital.

[LucifersGirl]

Originally Posted by lordwu

Spoiler:

Sachiko told her grandmother a lot of happenings about Yumi when she visited her from time to time. Sachiko's grandmother grew quite fond of Yumi even though she never met her in person and enjoyed listening to Sachiko recounting everything happened between her and Yumi including the date (at the end of the first season). So when Sachiko's grandmother was hospitalized, she asked Sachiko not to tell Yumi about it. Why? She simply didn't want to have Yumi worried about her. And the reason why Sachiko didn't cancel the date to amusement park outright because she actually did want to go with Yumi and to tell her grandmother about the date afterwards to cheer her up in the hospital.

Thanks Lordwu: That helps me understand more..
In the anime, Sachiko also gave reason why she couldn't bring herself to tell Yumi what's going on, although it's a different reason from what explain in the Novel. I think the novel's reason makes a lot more sense. The season given in anime isn't all that conviencing.

[Lyca]

Originally Posted by lordwu

Spoiler:

Sachiko told her grandmother a lot of happenings about Yumi when she visited her from time to time. Sachiko's grandmother grew quite fond of Yumi even though she never met her in person and enjoyed listening to Sachiko recounting everything happened between her and Yumi including the date (at the end of the first season). So when Sachiko's grandmother was hospitalized, she asked Sachiko not to tell Yumi about it. Why? She simply didn't want to have Yumi worried about her. And the reason why Sachiko didn't cancel the date to amusement park outright because she actually did want to go with Yumi and to tell her grandmother about the date afterwards to cheer her up in the hospital.

I have often thought that the writers of the show have given Sachiko a colder personality compared to how she actually is in the Novels. From what little I have read on these forums about the Novels it does seem like this has been done deliberatly, possibly to spice the show up a bit.