All Spoilers OK F/SN UBW TV - Episode 3 Spoiler Discussion / Poll

[Nayrael]

Originally Posted by Amarantine

She's confident in her abilities, just like Rin who still merrily goes to school when the war's already started. But I think it's clear the threat of Archer unsettled her, which is why she goes hikikomori in this route, unlike in Fate and HF where she's constantly strolling around town.

Rin is not worth attacking in day light. Illya is a different story though: everyone is aware that Berserker is OP and can't be fought against with proper means and even an alliance between all Masters may not result in victory. Unlike Shirou and Rin, she does not have the luxury of walking around and not worrying too much about it.

And we don't know if she barricaded herself in the castle. Shirou did not stumble upon her, but that does not immediately mean that she went Hikimori, it just means that Shirou did not meet her for whichever reason. It will most likely not mean in the Anime as they will most definitely expand her role by having her strolling around Fuyuki and meeting Shirou.

And as said: Archer is NOT the only one who can blow her up from afar. Caster can blow her up, Rider can charge at her and blow her up, Assassin can cut her throat, Lancer can throw Gae Bolg at her, Saber can blow her up with Excalibur... more or less, every servant, no matter their identity, has the ability to blow up that loli without her knowing what hit her, and the desperate Einzberns should have made it clear to her.

[TwilightsCall]

I honestly don't think Illya is the type to be worried about that sort of thing. She has absolute confidence in herself, and absolute confidence in Berserker - this is perfectly displayed in the Fate route when she just wanders around town like a tourist during the day, even willing to go so far as to casually spend time with Shirou who she has been essentially taught to hate since she was 8 years old.

I think trying to say she left the battlefield because she was "afraid" is kind of missing a vital part of her character. She's not afraid, she doesn't even really know what it means to be afraid, not til much later in the route at least. She left for the reasons she said she did - she thought Archer was interesting, and on a whim decided not to kill him just yet. So that meant she couldn't kill Rin, otherwise Archer would disappear, and she already didn't want to kill Shirou, so the only reason she'd have to stay is to fight Saber, who she didn't particularly care about. She left because she was done - simple as that.

I think, that in all honesty, if Archer had really wanted to kill Illya, then Illya would be dead. And that would probably be the end of the Holy Grail War right there, as there would be no vessel left for the Grail, unless Archer did some super-precise headshot on her instead of obliterating her outright, which is possible I suppose considering he probably remembers that she's the vessel. Illya might have changed her plan of attack if Archer and Saber had specifically targeted her, but until then I think she left herself dangerously open, thanks to her overconfidence in herself and Berserker. Though in that respect she could probably defend against Archer's normal attacks if she could see them coming for at least long enough for Berserker to help her. She'd be SoL against a Broken Phantasm or against Saber though.

edit: lots of ninja posts agreeing with me. Now my post seems out of context

[chaos_alfa]

Originally Posted by TwilightsCall

She'd be SoL against a Broken Phantasm or against Saber though.

I have seen it used a few times on the Fate/series board, but what does SoL stand for actually?

[MeoTwister5]

I'm guessing that next week will likely include Rin's ambush of Shirou in school and end with the first Rider encounter.

[TwilightsCall]

Originally Posted by chaos_alfa

I have seen it used a few times on the Fate/series board, but what does SoL stand for actually?

In this case, shit out of luck. The other usage you've seen is probably Slice of Life lol.

[Amarantine]

Originally Posted by Nayrael

Rin is not worth attacking in day light. Illya is a different story though: everyone is aware that Berserker is OP and can't be fought against with proper means and even an alliance between all Masters may not result in victory. Unlike Shirou and Rin, she does not have the luxury of walking around and not worrying too much about it.

Any Master is worth attacking. All the more if your Servant is hard to beat, of course, but Kotomine said it himself that the easiest way to win the war and eliminate the Servants is to kill the Masters. But as we've seen that doesn't mean Masters will become paranoid about being attacked at anytime. Magi are too proud for that.

Originally Posted by Nayrael

And we don't know if she barricaded herself in the castle. Shirou did not stumble upon her, but that does not immediately mean that she went Hikimori, it just means that Shirou did not meet her for whichever reason. It will most likely not mean in the Anime as they will most definitely expand her role by having her strolling around Fuyuki and meeting Shirou.

Illya's main interest in the war is her vendetta against Shirou. If Shirou did not meet her it's because she did not seek him, which supports the idea that she wanted to avoid facing Archer for now since Shirou and Archer's Master were almost always together. Although the anime might change that, yeah.

Originally Posted by Nayrael

And as said: Archer is NOT the only one who can blow her up from afar. Caster can blow her up, Rider can charge at her and blow her up, Assassin can cut her throat, Lancer can throw Gae Bolg at her, Saber can blow her up with Excalibur... more or less, every servant, no matter their identity, has the ability to blow up that loli without her knowing what hit her, and the desperate Einzberns should have made it clear to her.

Sure, but Archer (and Saber) is the only one of those we've seen her fight and therefore the only one whose ability and willingness to snipe and drop nukes she's truly aware of. It's one thing knowing there's a chance you'll be targeted, it's another to experience that threat directly and witness an opponent dish out a freaking nuke from halfway across the city with complete disregard for his apparent allies.

I just don't see why Illya would say she's impressed by and interested in Archer if not for her realizing he could very well kill her off. It's not like he really posed a threat to Berserker who just tanked his super attack. Especially in the anime, where they made Saber's attacks on Berserker look more effective than Archer's Caladbolg, yet Illya didn't care for her.

Originally Posted by TwilightsCall

I honestly don't think Illya is the type to be worried about that sort of thing. She has absolute confidence in herself, and absolute confidence in Berserker - this is perfectly displayed in the Fate route when she just wanders around town like a tourist during the day, even willing to go so far as to casually spend time with Shirou who she has been essentially taught to hate since she was 8 years old.

Yes, and it's possible that confidence was shaken upon seeing a Servant who, again, is willing and able to dish out a nuke from halfway across the city with complete disregard for anyone but his Master. Not only that, the anime now added her being visibly caught off guard by his more precise shots, which only makes it more likely she saw him as a threat.

Originally Posted by TwilightsCall

I think trying to say she left the battlefield because she was "afraid" is kind of missing a vital part of her character. She's not afraid, she doesn't even really know what it means to be afraid, not til much later in the route at least. She left for the reasons she said she did - she thought Archer was interesting, and on a whim decided not to kill him just yet. So that meant she couldn't kill Rin, otherwise Archer would disappear, and she already didn't want to kill Shirou, so the only reason she'd have to stay is to fight Saber, who she didn't particularly care about. She left because she was done - simple as that.

Again, it's possible her previously absolute confidence was shaken a little with this fight, which was probably her first in the war. I'm not saying she was shaking and scared to death, just that she became more aware of the threat she was under and decided to rethink her usual strategy of just popping up and challenging Shirou/Rin whenever. That's my interpretation, but yeah I can see why people might disagree.

[Touko]

Originally Posted by ninja_pintu

I wonder why Archer never tried to kill Illya? If he could save Rin, then he should have been able to hit Illya as well since she was standing just a few metres in front of Rin.

It made no sense because that wasn't how it happened in the VN.

In the VN, Berserker was never far away from Ilya.

Berserker successfully shielded Ilya from Gilgamesh's barrage for a while, Archer will get no luck with any sniping.

Eye of the Mind basically negates any surprise factor against Berserker or his Master.

[Ernietheracefan]

Originally Posted by MeoTwister5

I'm guessing that next week will likely include Rin's ambush of Shirou in school and end with the first Rider encounter.

And we'll see a certain jerk in glory...(for a while)

I wonder if we'll have another version of Die Lorelei..??

[GDB]

Originally Posted by Key Board

They do but only once they have absorbed that spirit as a grail
Ilya knew who Shirou was once she took Archer's spirit as grail in HF

Pretty sure she knew beforehand. Once Archer was gravely injured and his arm was being passed to Shirou, she knew it'd work. It's only logical that his arm would disappear when Archer did if it wasn't attached by the time he disappeared, and she was convinced it would work, so...

Originally Posted by rladls2121

Shiro, he admits he is useless in the battle and he still dives into it, thinking he wants to help others as always does at school and jobs.
What do we call that?

Survivor's Guilt coupled with suicidal tenancies.

Originally Posted by Jaden

Then, thinking the other way around...why isn't Ilya worried about being killed by Archer? Does she know about him somehow, or is she really confident in her magic?

Based on how she looked in Archer's direction after he shot down her sword-bird, I'd say she either got careless and forgot about him or thought she had obscured herself from his sight and didn't expect him to have moved. His first barrage came from a hill, after all, while this barrage came from the bridge in the city.

Originally Posted by Amarantine

I don't recall this Berserker having a similar ability at all (in fact I often hear people say how he would have been so much stronger under a different Servant class), so maybe Nasu just liked what Urobuchi gave Lancelot and decided what the hell let's give it to Herakles as well?

He lost the ability to use his special techniques like Nine Lives, but he wouldn't lose muscle memory fighting styles.

Originally Posted by Touko

In the VN, Berserker was never far away from Ilya.

Once they entered the graveyard, he was never in a position that he could have shielded her from Archer's barrage had he wanted to fire one. Remember, Rin had to find cover, but Illya didn't and wasn't right next to Berserker, so she was clearly far enough away from the immediate battle site that she wasn't in danger of Archer's explosion radius.

[arkxkra]

this episode fighting was awesome!

can see slight reaction when heard Einzbern, guess that make her remember Iri.

damn, Archer arrow was like a atomic boom，but too bad Berserker got many life.

[Rev Okkin]

My theory of Illya being impressed by Archer was that he was as pragmatic as Kiritsugu (or what Acht led her to think of.)

Archer shot a NP with the intention of not only trying to kill Berserker, but to eliminate Saber and Shirou as well. Then coupled with the fact that one of reasons of fighting was to know/kill/do body horrors to Shirou, someone trying to kill him with pragmatic stuff like Kiritsugu is someone she will take interest in.

[Craxuan]

Ironically enough, we know that Berserker may seem incredibly OP, but its weakness is also glaringly huge.

Its Noble Phantasm is 7 Lives. While it made him near invincible, since he can heal back his life after a battle and become invulnerable to the same blow as a result, and will need someone to kill him 7 times in a row, it also meant that it does not have an Ultimate Killer Blow that every other servant does. It's like using a character with super enhanced stats but no Skills or Spells to use in an RPG. Normally it will be a huge advantage, but a Servant's Noble Phantasm can and will turn the tides of battle instantly. So even though F/SN Berserker looks invincible, he's actually one of the most vulnerable class out of them all.

Even Lancer can theoretically kill Berserker, since his Gae Blog ignores causes and always sure kills his enemy without fail, so as long as he can use it 7 times in a single battle he will win the fight. Theoretically. The only one who has no chance of winning is Caster (ultimate counter), but everyone else who might have a special effect NP, or a Anti-Castle/Army NP like Saber can beat it without question.

[Rising Dragon]

... Berserker's Noble Phantasm is called God Hand, actually, and it's 12 lives, not 7. 7 is just the amount of times Caliburn killed him in the Fate route, which IIRC was 1 or 2 lives more than necessary at that point.

Also, Lancer can't kill Berserker. Gae Bolg, for all of its lethality, is a B-rank Noble Phantasm, and would be negated by the other properties of God Hand. Lancer lacks the strength and magic to cut through God Hand as well. All things considered, Caster technically has better chances against Berserker.

[bakato]

Man. Reading God's Hand in the wiki makes him seem super OP. It might seem a little weak considering it only gives him 12 lives, but considering it gives him resistance to attacks that killed him AND he can regenerate the lives lost with enough time he really seems invincible.

[Rev Okkin]

Wait till a certain blond foreigner curbstomp him into pieces

[Rising Dragon]

Originally Posted by bakato

Man. Reading God's Hand in the wiki makes him seem super OP. It might seem a little weak considering it only gives him 12 lives, but considering it gives him resistance to attacks that killed him AND he can regenerate the lives lost with enough time he really seems invincible.

Not only that, but thanks to the sheer amount of prana he has access to from Ilya, over time he can actually regenerate the lives lost.

[B214]

Ufotable is definitely doing a better job than Deen at this point, the episode was just awesome. Berserker showing animalistic instinct as well as a warrior's instinct. Archer showing off his archery skills. Saber showing why she's the King of Knights. Illya using Iri's magic was very neat. If only Saber was there to see it.

BTW, in the preview, it was mentioned that it's rare to see a foreign exchange student. Possible new scenes for the new anime?

[Ernietheracefan]

Originally Posted by B214

Illya using Iri's magic was very neat. If only Saber was there to see it.

Only Maiya & Kirei who see Iri's magic

Originally Posted by B214

BTW, in the preview, it was mentioned that it's rare to see a foreign exchange student. Possible new scenes for the new anime?

Plot twist : it's actually a certain blond..

[rladls2121]

Since I already saw Fate Kaleid series, it is kind of unbearable for me to see Rin and Iliya against each other as enimies.
And I think their role is rather reversed.

[HtwoN]

Originally Posted by B214

BTW, in the preview, it was mentioned that it's rare to see a foreign exchange student. Possible new scenes for the new anime?

No, it's not a new scene.

That line is in the visual novel. Shirou just chooses to go to the student council room instead of staying at the archery. And he meets Kuzuki there. It's so good that they adapt this choice. This means we will have more about Kuzuki. Lucky enough, we may have his backstory covered.

Here if you want to be spoiled: http://lparchive.org/Fatestay-night/Update%20239/