[Nomination Phase] AnimeSuki Choice Awards 2013

[Sugetsu]

How many people here have watched or read Hunter x Hunter 2011 and didn't like it? And how many haven't even heard of it?

In my opinion this show by far the best ongoin shonen/drama anime atm probably one of the best ever. Its mangaka is on the level of Kentarou Muira. He also created Yuyu Hakushu. I ask this because the series doesnt seem to be popular in this boards. I just wish to underdstand what is the cause of its obscurity.

Thanks!

[felix]

Its the same issues as Gintama. Didn't hook me when I initially tried it; largely because I really didn't get it or maybe got it wrong. In any case from my perspective it's gotten so big I feel like I have to watch XXX amounts of really old episodes to get it; something like what you need if you want to get into One Piece. And even then there's this issue of fatigue. I can say I got into One Piece's antics but kind of made only up to episode 100, because other shit needed to be done too...

Anyway, I'm more then happy to play the role of guinea pig here. Go ahead, sell HxH anime/manga (whichever works best) to me. :P You can spoil away since as I recall I tried and failed to get into it probably 2 times before.

[SuitUp]

Originally Posted by Kanon

It's an investment. A worthy one. These first 26 episodes don't even represent 10% of the series. The remaining 90% are gold. It doesn't merely get good, it becomes one of the funniest series ever (imo there's nothing that comes close to it save for maybe Seinfeld, and I've watched a ton of comedy series, whether anime or live action). You just need to have the patience to get this far. Yes, it's entirely a matter of patience. If you'd rather settle for inferior series for the sole reason they pay off sooner, that makes you impatient.
Keep in mind it's not like the first episodes are painful to watch. There are even plenty of people who liked the series from the start. However, absolutely everybody agrees the beginning is very different and nowhere near as good as the rest of the series, that's why it's recommended to watch until episode 30 or so before deciding to drop it. I wish there was some kind of "Gintama test" you could take to make sure right away you'll like it, it would make it so much easier to convince people to watch it.

Well, the thing is, they're painful to watch, that's something i've seen every Gintama fan agree, except those who're downright so in love that would have Gintama's kids.
Then there's the issue, it's not like Gintama it's the epitome of comedy and/or anime, so yes, color me impatient if a rather watch something "inferior" (because, lets face it, with 26 eps I could very well watch one of many shows that are just as good as this, and I would not have to limp through the first few episodes) because it pays off sooner, this is not the stock market, this is tv prefences and some outright do not have the time to invest in the first few horrid episodes while waiting for something to get good, that it's the downfall of practically any show...

[SeijiSensei]

Might I suggest that this thread has now gone way off topic?

[Haak]

The whole point of these Awards is to get people motivated and interested in watching anime that aired during the year so I don't think it's way off topic.

[Guardian Enzo]

Originally Posted by felix

Its the same issues as Gintama. Didn't hook me when I initially tried it; largely because I really didn't get it or maybe got it wrong. In any case from my perspective it's gotten so big I feel like I have to watch XXX amounts of really old episodes to get it; something like what you need if you want to get into One Piece. And even then there's this issue of fatigue. I can say I got into One Piece's antics but kind of made only up to episode 100, because other shit needed to be done too...

Anyway, I'm more then happy to play the role of guinea pig here. Go ahead, sell HxH anime/manga (whichever works best) to me. :P You can spoil away since as I recall I tried and failed to get into it probably 2 times before.

All I can really say is for my money, H x H 2011 is the best shounen adaptation ever, and solidly in the mix for greatest manga adaptation in anime history.

It's hard to know what to say to recommend it to someone without knowing what the obstacle is. In the first place, I think people get caught up in the fact that Gon & Killua are cute young boys and assume they're looking at a kiddie adventure series. That disconnect is a problem for a lot of potential readers/viewers, right off the bat.

Another problem is considering H x H in the same vein as other benchmark shounen titles, when Togashi is doing something completely different here. I think H x H is kind of a seinen in shounen clothes, or a deconstruction of shounen manga if you prefer. Togashi is, for me, unequalled in shounen in his mastery of plot development, unpredictability and psychological subtlety. H x H is dark, disturbing and constantly surprising. It has a lot of comedy and its rousing adventurous moments, but the underlying nature of the show is messing with the heads of the characters in a big way. Maybe that isn't obvious immediately, but it is soon enough - I think Hisoka's arrival is really the first major sign that things are not what they seem.

[kitten320]

Hmmm I have hard time saying which H x H version is better. Old one took a while for me to appreciate since it had slow beginning while new version jumps straight into action. Grunted it skips a bit but for first time viewers I think new one works better.

HxH starts pretty childish and innocently what might put some people off but as series progress it gets darker and darker. For me real deal started at the Phantom troupe arc which I still consider to be the best since that's where real dark stuff happens and then follows in current chimera arc. Actually I prefer this arc in old version. Especially those 6 OVAs.

What makes HxH good for me is the depth of the story and characters. All of them are different with different priorities and issues. Granted some things are predictable as in any shonen but some are not.

I think that in order to really appreciate it you need to watch quiet a bit of episodes. As I said, for me real thing began in Phantom arc which I still believe to be the best one in all shounen series I have watched.

For starters, unlike many I'm not big fan of MCs aka Gon and Killua, especially Gon so it was good to have an arc focused on another character. However, even though Chimera arc is about Gon again, it is far more appealing and so far Gon does not bother me. Probably because there are so many other points you can focus on. Besides it is probably even drker than Phantom arc though that one was probably a bit more tragic.

So yeh, try to watch quiet a bit of episodes. The first arc is of them passing the Hunter exam. 2nd arc gives a background info on fans favourite Killua. Third arc involves them learning new skills and putting them to practice, 4th (phantom arc) shows all those skills including other characters on higher and more intriguing and darker level. And so on. In each arc there is something new to look forward to. Current chimera arc has a pretty intriguing villain aka Chimera Ant King.

So yeh...

[Ithekro]

More people need to see Space Battleship Yamato 2199. The North American release will be next month under the "Star Blazers 2199" title. Same thing as the original since it is only subtitled, and not dubbed.

[Sheba]

Originally Posted by Ithekro

More people need to see Space Battleship Yamato 2199. The North American release will be next month under the "Star Blazers 2199" title. Same thing as the original since it is only subtitled, and not dubbed.

Seriously, Yamato 2199 offers people some good old space opera, complete with compelling characters that is always welcome. I don't know why it got so little attention here.

[Ithekro]

Yamato 2199 wasn't on the standard streaming services. That might be one reason is was overlooked a lot of the time. Also its theatrical releases very three or so months for seven chapters (26 episodes). But the TV run in 2013 wents straight through and almost outpaced the theatrical releases in September.

[Obelisk ze Tormentor]

I already watched the original Yamato (yes, that ancient Japanese series) and enjoyed it quite a bit. I only watched bits of Yamato 2199 raws some time ago. I might look for the proper fansub when I have the time.

[Ithekro]

There is no need for a fansub. The Blu-ray come with subtitles (in English) and the North American release (under the "Star Blazers 2199" titles) will have English and Spanish subtitles starting next month.

[Haak]

Originally Posted by Ithekro

More people need to see Space Battleship Yamato 2199. The North American release will be next month under the "Star Blazers 2199" title. Same thing as the original since it is only subtitled, and not dubbed.

I actually watched the first episode yesterday and thought it was fairly average and almost boring at times. Is it one of those that takes a few episodes to get into?

[Dextro]

Originally Posted by Haak

I actually watched the first episode yesterday and thought it was fairly average and almost boring at times. Is it one of those that takes a few episodes to get into?

I depends if you enjoy SciFi in general and Space Operas in particular or not. The genre isn't particularly fast paced to begin with (even if the show does pick up steam later on).

[felix]

Originally Posted by Haak

I actually watched the first episode yesterday and thought it was fairly average and almost boring at times. Is it one of those that takes a few episodes to get into?

It ramps up ya.

[Sackett]

Well I hope that more people decide to check out Space Battleship Yamato 2199 and Jojo's Bizarre Adventures.

Space Battleship Yamato 2199 puts me in mind of the remake of Battlestar Glactica. It's that good. (Also, note that the original Yamato came out before either Star Wars or Galactica). A lot of the cheesier moments and plot holes have been removed. Instead of Yuki/Nova as the only female they have a more evenly mixed crew. A lot of the unimportant plot lines have been removed and narrowed to the main story. And all the heart of the original has been captured. The appalling post apocalyptic nature of Earth, the desperate struggle of the humans to survive, and the ambiguous nature of the difference between the heroes (humans) and the villains (Gamalians).

They even have several nods to the original's cheesiness while making it better! The poorly explained shift of pink skinned Gamilians to blue skinned becomes the absorption of conquered peoples into the Gamalian empire, creating Romanesque (and American for that matter) elements. Even the convenient "robots" from Star Blazers (the English dub version) are incorporated to fix plot holes instead of making them, and is also used to add to the depth and complexity of the "What measure is a human?" questions that so filled the original.

It is quite simply one of the best remakes I have ever seen. The original was already focused on adult questions about nuclear war, World War II, and dealing with the irrational hated created by war. This is just the cleaned up and streamlined version of it. With updated cleaner art, while still maintaining that older less idealized style of the 70s.

Jojo's Bizzare Adventures on the other hand is not a remake. It stands out to me for the precise opposite reason as Yamato. Like Yamato, Jojo has a straightforward epic plot. However, Yamato deals with the ambiguity about humanity and war, Jojo is a clear and magnificent establishment of good vs evil. Jonathan is archetype of the good hero. Dio is the archetype of evil. By making them "brothers" who are mirror images in many ways, Jojo emphasizes that it is our choices that determine our future... but also that it is our past and raising that tends to influence our choices. Furthermore Jojo doesn't just say good is better than evil, but also suggests that being good requires sacrifice in a way that evil doesn't. It's a very well done morality play.

Then Jojo goes on to explore other archetype heroes in the form of "the next generation" of Joestars. Joseph becomes our exploration of the rouge hero. Someone who is good but uses trickery and plays around with rule breaking. (Also, his introduction scene has to be the greatest Coca-Cola commercial ever!) Mami fans will like Jonathon, Homura fans will like Joseph. (I who liked both liked both Jojos).

I should also to remember to mention the Manliness of Jojo. The fights are Manly, the tears are Manly! The fabulous poses are Manly! The women are... uh.. well not Manly, but damn awesome anyways! Jojo just reeks of good hearted testosterone. Even more than DBZ.

[Sugetsu]

Originally Posted by felix

Anyway, I'm more then happy to play the role of guinea pig here. Go ahead, sell HxH anime/manga (whichever works best) to me. :P You can spoil away since as I recall I tried and failed to get into it probably 2 times before.

Oh, I defensively recommend that you check out the anime. The 2011 version follows the manga very closely and captures it in a magnificent way. The anime is amazing at capturing emotions and playing with the viewer's emotional attachments. It will have you on the edge of your seat many times.

[Ithekro]

Space Battleship Yamato 2199 is a space opera, so it takes a little bit to pick up speed. The first two episodes are the ramp up. After that it is the ship and crew pressing forward, getting into more and more dire threats as they get deeper and deeper into enemy territory.

The first episode impressed me, because I had seem the orignal series. The first episode is basically the same for both. There are differences and those differences mount out as the episode count increases. But the first impressive thing for me was the space battle. In the original, the Earth flagship fired basically one shot, then the fleet was blow to pieces until Kodai's bother's ship arrived and took out some enemy ships at the end. This time, the whole fleet opened fire and kept firing for the entire engagement. There were more types of ships involved as well. They also changed the motivation of Kodai's brother for staying behind. It matched more closely the English dubbed version of the noble sacrifice to save the greater number of lives rather than the original Japanese version's "death before dishonor" ideal.

As the show progresses, the action picks up again as Yamato comes into the show. It slows down again from time to time to get character building episodes, since as episode 7 were they spend the whole of the episode having the crew call home one last time before they leave radio range of Earth. It is emotional since they can only talk for five minutes each. (They do this while the ship is under repair from the previous battle). As they go on, they run into more and more Gamilas warships and plots as they become a threat. Earth was a backwater world that resisted for eight years, but it wasn't a threat to the Empire. Now, suddenly, they have one ship that is technologically superior to anything in the Empire's fleet, and has destroyed dozens, to hundreds, to thousands of ships. Usually in one massive blow (and that blow is not always the wave motion gun). The show focuses more on the Gamilas side of things than the pervious versions. They get a lot more personality and we get more on their political problems and plots as the show goes on.

Also there are a lot more women this time around. In the past there was usually only two or maybe three women of any importance in an entire season, from all sides. One on Yamato, one Space Goddess type, and maybe one enemy concubine or something. Now, the Yamato has about a 30% female crew. Of which five are important and another five or so are notable in repeat appearances. There are multiple alien females we see, and I think six that have status or importance to the story. (Xebec designs on the women).

And as mentioned, this is probably the best remake of anything ever made. It can be considered superior to the original in many ways (not all ways, there are some things you can't improve on). The story is different in subplots, but the main plot is the same. Take one ship, and go to a mysterious planet to get a high technologyh device to save Earth, and return that device to Earth. All in one year. That year being 2199.