AnimeSuki Forums

iamandragon · 2015-05-25, 11:18

Just rewatched the episode again. Oh my gosh what is wrong with the animation quality. First they draw out the light shining through the windows in the castle, then they added the light effects as the screen moves, and then they add the dust particles in the light beams.

And the reality marble oh my god the moving fog...and if you look closely THE GEARS ARE ACTUALLY TURNING. The whole screen is ALIVE.

Unlimtied Blade Works? More like, Unlimited Budget Works. I can't imagine how much money they actually pour in this.

Levani · 2015-05-25, 11:23

Got scared there for a sec, thought you were slamming the animation xD

iamandragon · 2015-05-25, 11:24

Oh dear me, I can't stop laughing at this:

Spoiler:

iamandragon · 2015-05-25, 11:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Levani

Got scared there for a sec, thought you were slamming the animation xD

I am, effectively, slamming the animation of every other shows. UBW has ruined me forever on animation quality.

Oh well, that's a good thing, because I don't have time for anime. The Fate franchise is the only thing that is making me remain.

GreyZone · 2015-05-25, 11:29

Origin of sword is not enough. You need to have the affinity for it as well. Shirou has both due to fire and Avalon being inside him for 10 years.

iamandragon · 2015-05-25, 11:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by GreyZone

Origin of sword is not enough. You need to have the affinity for it as well. Shirou has both due to fire and Avalon being inside him for 10 years.

Absolutely correct, I missed that. I'll fix.

chaos_alfa · 2015-05-25, 13:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by GreyZone

Origin of sword is not enough. You need to have the affinity for it as well. Shirou has both due to fire and Avalon being inside him for 10 years.

Don't you automatically get an affinity of swords if your origin is sword?

Lorhand · 2015-05-25, 13:39

If your origin is such an outwardly driving force, it's possible that your origin will change your elemental affinity into it.

So yes, Shirou's affinity became sword, because his origin was sword.

GDB · 2015-05-25, 14:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by iamandragon

I am, effectively, slamming the animation of every other shows. UBW has ruined me forever on animation quality.

Oh well, that's a good thing, because I don't have time for anime. The Fate franchise is the only thing that is making me remain.

Just imagine how Heaven's Feel will look. UBW? That's merely TV budget. HF will be movie budget.

Axyp · 2015-05-25, 14:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by GDB

Just imagine how Heaven's Feel will look. UBW? That's merely TV budget. HF will be movie budget.

aka, A large budget into something worth it.

**Klashikari** · 2015-05-25, 14:56

I'm usually not nitpicky when an anime series take some liberties in the adaptation (and Ufotable did improve the franchise with few stuff in FSN in general) and I have a love-hate relationship when it comes to FSN lore but...

There are 2 big issues here which seem to be glaring oversight. Namely Rin with 3 command spells (visible when she was talking to lancer), and Archer being able to cast UBW despite being masterless -and- running out of Mana.

In any case, I'm certainly the minority here (again?) but this episode was more or less a bag of mixed feelings for me.
I really liked lancer's scenes, but I just couldn't dig Archer/Shirou ones at all. Archer's emotions were raw and intense, but everything related to Shirou were so slow and dull I couldn't really enjoy them (partly because I probably don't care about him to begin with).
No matter how Ufotable tried to embellish this part, Shirou's logic remains as empty as it was in the VN, so jokes aside, the whole "you are right / correct" part just couldn't click on me, because Shirou just came out as a brat who arrogantly believes he "won't" be like Archer.

I wouldn't have trouble with Shirou trying his best to turn the tables against that potential future, but the whole conviction in being a superhero just left me completely uninterested from start to finish.

Levani · 2015-05-25, 15:06

Quote:

Namely Rin with 3 command spells (visible when she was talking to lancer)

What's the problem with this exactly?

Quote:

and Archer being able to cast UBW despite being masterless -and- running out of Mana.

He chants it and just stands there. I think he can squeeze out power if he isn't fighting. Plus, in the VN, he is somehow alive at the end to even chant Rho Aias so... Archer, he does this kind of stuff xD

**Klashikari** · 2015-05-25, 15:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Levani

What's the problem with this exactly?

A Master doesn't receive any extra command spells, regardless the number of contracts they have performed with Servants.

Quote:

He chants it and just stands there. I think he can squeeze out power if he isn't fighting. Plus, in the VN, he is somehow alive at the end to even chant Rho Aias so... Archer, he does this kind of stuff xD

There isn't any indication how many UBW Archer can deploy before being dry, but he already deployed it once after Rin has made her contract with Saber.

During his fight against Shirou, he was already subject to symptoms that he is already running out of mana.

And that part with Archer saving Shirou with Rho Aias is something I consider as a giant plot convenience back in the VN.

Levani · 2015-05-25, 15:17

Quote:

A Master doesn't receive any extra command spells, regardless the number of contracts they have performed with Servants.

This rule has been said in the VN?

**Klashikari** · 2015-05-25, 15:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Levani

This rule has been said in the VN?

No, but confirmed by the materials. See Reference 1.

GreyZone · 2015-05-25, 15:19

I always suspected the fact that Archer actually got magic circuits compared to other heroes, which possibly gives him the ability to regenerate his prana in this age in the same way that Magi do. The issue Archer was facing was the fact that he has no "anchor", which usually gives Servants the ability to have a physical form. So since Archer cannot maintain his form perfectly anymore, he starts to "leak" his prana. But since he still has enough prana in reserve, he can still cast the RM.

As for command spells: It can just all be blamed on Caster, who tinkered with the CS system and created "bugs" in the "system", like Rin getting back her 1 unused CS, along with Caster's 2 unused ones.

Well actually in the VN Rin had 2 CS instead of 3, when she made the contract with Saber, but it was still more than she had before losing Archer, which was 1... so in the VN she probably just got the 2 from Caster for some reason, while her own just disappeard, while in the anime she gets both the ones from Caster, as well as her own.

Levani · 2015-05-25, 15:21

Are you sure you saw all 3 Command Spells on Rin? I'm too lazy to go and check <_<

Well, if they are, probably a visual screw-up. Probably will be fixed in the BD.

**Klashikari** · 2015-05-25, 15:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by GreyZone

I always suspected the fact that Archer actually got magic circuits compared to other heroes, which possibly gives him the ability to regenerate his prana in this age in the same way that Magi do. The issue Archer was facing was the fact that he has no "anchor", which usually gives Servants the ability to have a physical form. So since Archer cannot maintain his form perfectly anymore, he starts to "leak" his prana. But since he still has enough prana in reserve, he can still cast the RM.

Independent action makes up for the lack of Anchor, but the said skill wouldn't really make up for the prana issue.

Also, Considering archer stats, it is very unlikely his magic circuits would allow him to sustain -two- reality marbles within such short period without any prana supply. Even Gilgamesh with A+ needs prana supply if he wants to use his NP.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Levani

Are you sure you saw all 3 Command Spells on Rin? I'm too lazy to go and check <_<

Well, if they are, probably a visual screw-up. Probably will be fixed in the BD.

No doubt about that. Compare Episode 13 with Episode 20.
This has also occured in the VN for some reason, and the materials retconned that.

Levani · 2015-05-25, 15:29

Quote:

This has also occured in the VN for some reason, and the materials retconned that.

Meaning it happens in the VN too? What madness is this. I guess we can just ignore that rule about contracts since nothing of sort is said in the actual visual novel. All is fine like this.

**Klashikari** · 2015-05-25, 15:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Levani

Meaning it happens in the VN too? What madness is this. I guess we can just ignore that rule about contracts since nothing of sort is said in the actual visual novel. All is fine like this.

You cannot ignore materials like that, since they are exactly what they are: they are meant to supplement the original material and expand data and lore.

Without them, we would have never known that none of Fate/UBW/HF Shirou would have became Archer whatsoever.
These are as canon as you can get, and they are often more accurate than the original VN which was vague as hell.
For instance, Archer declaring he can reproduce Excalibur is a baffling bluff, since Nasu confirmed he can't retrace sacred swords of such caliber.

View Poll Results: F/SN UBW TV - Episode 20 Rating
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6 out of 10 : Average	0	0%
5 out of 10 : Below Average	0	0%
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2015-05-25, 11:29	Link #125
GreyZone "Senior" "Member" Join Date: Jan 2012	Origin of sword is not enough. You need to have the affinity for it as well. Shirou has both due to fire and Avalon being inside him for 10 years. __________________

2015-05-25, 14:56	Link #131
Klashikari 阿賀野型3番艦、矢矧 Lv180 Graphic Designer Moderator Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Belgium, Brussels Age: 37	I'm usually not nitpicky when an anime series take some liberties in the adaptation (and Ufotable did improve the franchise with few stuff in FSN in general) and I have a love-hate relationship when it comes to FSN lore but... There are 2 big issues here which seem to be glaring oversight. Namely Rin with 3 command spells (visible when she was talking to lancer), and Archer being able to cast UBW despite being masterless -and- running out of Mana. In any case, I'm certainly the minority here (again?) but this episode was more or less a bag of mixed feelings for me. I really liked lancer's scenes, but I just couldn't dig Archer/Shirou ones at all. Archer's emotions were raw and intense, but everything related to Shirou were so slow and dull I couldn't really enjoy them (partly because I probably don't care about him to begin with). No matter how Ufotable tried to embellish this part, Shirou's logic remains as empty as it was in the VN, so jokes aside, the whole "you are right / correct" part just couldn't click on me, because Shirou just came out as a brat who arrogantly believes he "won't" be like Archer. I wouldn't have trouble with Shirou trying his best to turn the tables against that potential future, but the whole conviction in being a superhero just left me completely uninterested from start to finish. __________________ [Sig art: Kagura Yuu, Nunukko, Maku Rako & Mishima Kurone] / [Twitter]

2015-05-25, 15:19	Link #136
GreyZone "Senior" "Member" Join Date: Jan 2012	I always suspected the fact that Archer actually got magic circuits compared to other heroes, which possibly gives him the ability to regenerate his prana in this age in the same way that Magi do. The issue Archer was facing was the fact that he has no "anchor", which usually gives Servants the ability to have a physical form. So since Archer cannot maintain his form perfectly anymore, he starts to "leak" his prana. But since he still has enough prana in reserve, he can still cast the RM. As for command spells: It can just all be blamed on Caster, who tinkered with the CS system and created "bugs" in the "system", like Rin getting back her 1 unused CS, along with Caster's 2 unused ones. Well actually in the VN Rin had 2 CS instead of 3, when she made the contract with Saber, but it was still more than she had before losing Archer, which was 1... so in the VN she probably just got the 2 from Caster for some reason, while her own just disappeard, while in the anime she gets both the ones from Caster, as well as her own. __________________

2015-05-25, 11:18	Link #121
iamandragon Martian diplomat Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Mars	Just rewatched the episode again. Oh my gosh what is wrong with the animation quality. First they draw out the light shining through the windows in the castle, then they added the light effects as the screen moves, and then they add the dust particles in the light beams. And the reality marble oh my god the moving fog...and if you look closely THE GEARS ARE ACTUALLY TURNING. The whole screen is ALIVE. Unlimtied Blade Works? More like, Unlimited Budget Works. I can't imagine how much money they actually pour in this.

2015-05-25, 11:23	Link #122
Levani 貴方が私のマスターか？ Join Date: Jul 2014 Location: Georgia, Tbilisi	Got scared there for a sec, thought you were slamming the animation xD

2015-05-25, 11:24	Link #123
iamandragon Martian diplomat Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Mars	Oh dear me, I can't stop laughing at this: Spoiler:

2015-05-25, 13:39	Link #128
Lorhand Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2013	If your origin is such an outwardly driving force, it's possible that your origin will change your elemental affinity into it. So yes, Shirou's affinity became sword, because his origin was sword.

2015-05-25, 15:21	Link #137
Levani 貴方が私のマスターか？ Join Date: Jul 2014 Location: Georgia, Tbilisi	Are you sure you saw all 3 Command Spells on Rin? I'm too lazy to go and check <_< Well, if they are, probably a visual screw-up. Probably will be fixed in the BD.