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Old 2017-03-23, 15:07   Link #401
BWTraveller
Azure Dragon reborn
 
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
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Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
Yeah, but when you describe the grandfather's thought process as "the kid makes good money" and literally nothing else, combined with the fact Hina has shown no romantic interest in Rei, it sounds pretty gold-diggy.
It's kind of hard to define "romantic interest" from my perspective when they haven't had much opportunity for romantic interaction. She certainly doesn't seem disinterested. In fact, she cares quite a lot about him, got jealous over him not paying attention because Kyouko was there, and has made quite a few faces toward him that suggest a really great warmth. I'd say people have enough to suggest a budding romantic interest; not anything concrete yet, but still there.

I agree that saying nothing about all of Rei's other qualities does paint the wrong picture though. It's important, but it's more important how serious he is, how earnest he is, how kind and thoughtful he is, how smart he is, etc. That said, a parent or guardian would still worry about a child in a relationship that may lead to marriage with a person who has very poor financial prospects. And they'd feel a certain security in seeing a budding love for someone likely to be able to support them financially no matter what the future holds for them.
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Old 2017-03-23, 15:19   Link #402
Ulin
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In fact, I think we have seen so far more romantic interest by Hina's part than Rei's, who seems to be still hooked by Kyoko, but the way she seemed flustered when meeting Kyoko, how he was the first person she thinks about calling when trying out the sweets tells that, maybe not now since she is pretty "childish" and has a crush in her childhood friend, but I guess this is a good beginning.
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Old 2017-03-23, 15:31   Link #403
Anh_Minh
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Originally Posted by BWTraveller View Post
It's kind of hard to define "romantic interest" from my perspective when they haven't had much opportunity for romantic interaction. She certainly doesn't seem disinterested. In fact, she cares quite a lot about him, got jealous over him not paying attention because Kyouko was there, and has made quite a few faces toward him that suggest a really great warmth. I'd say people have enough to suggest a budding romantic interest; not anything concrete yet, but still there.
Momo was also upset. And, though she was more mature about it, Akari didn't like Kyouko either. It's normal not to like Kyouko, under the circumstances.

Besides, Hina isn't exactly subtle when she likes a boy. Remember Takahashi?

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I agree that saying nothing about all of Rei's other qualities does paint the wrong picture though. It's important, but it's more important how serious he is, how earnest he is, how kind and thoughtful he is, how smart he is, etc. That said, a parent or guardian would still worry about a child in a relationship that may lead to marriage with a person who has very poor financial prospects. And they'd feel a certain security in seeing a budding love for someone likely to be able to support them financially no matter what the future holds for them.
Rei's future isn't that secure. He makes good money as long as he wins and lives up to his promise as a precocious maybe-genius. But what if he has a few bad seasons?
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Old 2017-03-23, 16:21   Link #404
BWTraveller
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Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
Momo was also upset. And, though she was more mature about it, Akari didn't like Kyouko either. It's normal not to like Kyouko, under the circumstances.
You can't just lump all of them together. Their reactions were different because their feelings were different as well as their personalities. Akari, judging from her reaction then and later, seemed mainly concerned about Rei being with someone who doesn't seem good for him: she read the situation and saw the complexity. When she found out they were foster siblings, she became worried because she realized that the strange mix of bad feelings she felt there were part of his life at home and a big part of the reason he left. Momo was terrified, didn't like fighting and didn't like Rei getting picked on, and so trembled and asked if she was in the presence of a witch. When she came back up later, she was still scared. Hina got mad that Rei was ignoring them and that he was taking everything she said without a response. Later, she steeled herself and demanded to know who she was, and got very relieved to know they were siblings. These are very different reactions and suggest different feelings. Hina's is the only one that suggests jealousy.

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Besides, Hina isn't exactly subtle when she likes a boy. Remember Takahashi?
There are different kinds of love and romantic interest that manifest differently. What she has for Takahashi is what you'd call a "crush", mixed with your standard starstruck fangirl admiration. What she feels for Rei has been growing slowly but surely, and I doubt even she realizes it yet. This is FAR from uncommon. There are plenty of shows where a girl or boy has a crush on one person for a long time, is all awkward and uneasy around them and always struggles to get closer, while also clearly having another person who's far more important, with whom they are much more comfortable, and who they eventually realize was really the one they love and have loved all along. The "crush" is frequently marked by freak-outs and blushes and all kinds of craziness, but the softer and deeper love toward the main interest is more marked by momentary blushes, glances full of feeling, comfort, constant attention and concern, and occasionally jealousy and other demonstrations of the true feelings peeking through.

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Rei's future isn't that secure. He makes good money as long as he wins and lives up to his promise as a precocious maybe-genius. But what if he has a few bad seasons?
You could say the same thing of any occupation. Sure you make good money as long as you keep doing a great job and keep up with your peers, but what if you start to fail? Anyway, there are other ways to make money with his level of talent. They'd be difficult for him considering his semi-autistic social awkwardness, but with work and motivation he could still pull something off.
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Old 2017-03-23, 17:03   Link #405
Anh_Minh
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Originally Posted by BWTraveller View Post
You could say the same thing of any occupation. Sure you make good money as long as you keep doing a great job and keep up with your peers, but what if you start to fail?
I'm not saying there aren't equally risky, if more conventional, occupations. Including some where your prosperity doesn't even depend as much on your own effort as it does in professional sports.

But there are also a lot of jobs where you can pretty much coast and as long as you're not terrible, you'll keep your job and your salary will do nothing but increase. You don't need to compete all year long with people who are also at the top of the field and work hard specifically to defeat you. You need to learn how to perform a few tasks, but that's all.

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Anyway, there are other ways to make money with his level of talent. They'd be difficult for him considering his semi-autistic social awkwardness, but with work and motivation he could still pull something off.
I don't know. He could give shogi the best years of his life, and then be just a guy with a high school diploma with none of what people will recognize as real work experience.

I'm not saying it'll definitely happen or even that it's likely. I'm just saying that thinking he's got it made for life is somewhat short-sighted.
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Old 2017-03-23, 17:51   Link #406
BWTraveller
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Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
I'm not saying there aren't equally risky, if more conventional, occupations. Including some where your prosperity doesn't even depend as much on your own effort as it does in professional sports.

But there are also a lot of jobs where you can pretty much coast and as long as you're not terrible, you'll keep your job and your salary will do nothing but increase. You don't need to compete all year long with people who are also at the top of the field and work hard specifically to defeat you. You need to learn how to perform a few tasks, but that's all.



I don't know. He could give shogi the best years of his life, and then be just a guy with a high school diploma with none of what people will recognize as real work experience.

I'm not saying it'll definitely happen or even that it's likely. I'm just saying that thinking he's got it made for life is somewhat short-sighted.
Give me a break. What you're saying is roughly equivalent to saying that a pro football player could give the best years of his life and then end it with "none of what people will recognize as real work experience". This's ridiculous. Do you honestly believe that the only thing you can do with shogi is compete? There's money to be made teaching, writing books and articles, analyzing, and doing a variety of other things. And in all of these fields, I can guarantee they'll look at his record and they won't say he has "no experience". Just like a former football player could aim to become a coach and they wouldn't tell him he had absolutely no experience. It's frankly insulting to suggest that what he's doing will be that useless unless he's winning tournaments.

Ultimately, even if you don't admit it, he's a guy who is already a working professional with great potential and plenty of routes to guarantee financial stability.
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Old 2017-03-23, 19:36   Link #407
DragoonKain3
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On the topic of Shogi as something to earn money from, just look at Kouda Dad. He was barred from entering the league because he couldn't beat Rei, and he still makes enough to sustain his family, including all of Kyouko's credit card expenses. He became a pro at 19, and I really don't think he has a 'regular day job' either (implied that Rei's dad quit Shogi to continue with his studies while Kouda did the opposite), since it's all about shogi to him.

As for Hina, I still stand by my previous statement that she is romantically in love with Rei, she just doesn't know it yet. This is Umino we're talking about... it wouldn't be the first character she would have made that's open about being romantically interested in someone, but she is quietly just as attached (or even more) to someone else. It's these multi-faceted characters that makes Umino such a great storyteller, and I don't think Hina is any different.

As for the final episode, I'm just glad it's back to Rei being the main focus again. Looks like the new term hasn't changed much, but Sensei is truly a Great Teacher. "You didn't come back to high school just to eat alone at the rooftop" is as close as it gets to Rei, and Sensei really gets it. Not sure if an after-school club is the answer when Rei isn't there like half the time, but I guess anything is progress with Rei.

So second season come October? Can't come fast enough. See you guys then.
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Old 2017-03-24, 02:26   Link #408
Anh_Minh
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Originally Posted by BWTraveller View Post
Give me a break. What you're saying is roughly equivalent to saying that a pro football player could give the best years of his life and then end it with "none of what people will recognize as real work experience". This's ridiculous. Do you honestly believe that the only thing you can do with shogi is compete? There's money to be made teaching, writing books and articles, analyzing, and doing a variety of other things. And in all of these fields, I can guarantee they'll look at his record and they won't say he has "no experience". Just like a former football player could aim to become a coach and they wouldn't tell him he had absolutely no experience. It's frankly insulting to suggest that what he's doing will be that useless unless he's winning tournaments.
He doesn't need to actually win tournaments. But most of those jobs you talked about? Active shogi players fill them. And how many such openings are there, really? And how good is Rei's record? Fujimoto may have been an asshole in how he said it, but he wasn't entirely wrong when he said "middle school pro" was ultimately meaningless if he didn't achieve stuff afterwards.

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Originally Posted by DragoonKain3 View Post
On the topic of Shogi as something to earn money from, just look at Kouda Dad. He was barred from entering the league because he couldn't beat Rei, and he still makes enough to sustain his family, including all of Kyouko's credit card expenses. He became a pro at 19, and I really don't think he has a 'regular day job' either (implied that Rei's dad quit Shogi to continue with his studies while Kouda did the opposite), since it's all about shogi to him.
Kouta lost one game against Rei, which stopped his participation in one tournament. That's all. He's still in a higher league than Rei.

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As for the final episode, I'm just glad it's back to Rei being the main focus again. Looks like the new term hasn't changed much, but Sensei is truly a Great Teacher. "You didn't come back to high school just to eat alone at the rooftop" is as close as it gets to Rei, and Sensei really gets it. Not sure if an after-school club is the answer when Rei isn't there like half the time, but I guess anything is progress with Rei.
Best answer they had available, I think. It's a small group of friendly people who understand his situation with regards to his absences.
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Old 2017-03-24, 09:28   Link #409
BWTraveller
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Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
He doesn't need to actually win tournaments. But most of those jobs you talked about? Active shogi players fill them. And how many such openings are there, really? And how good is Rei's record? Fujimoto may have been an asshole in how he said it, but he wasn't entirely wrong when he said "middle school pro" was ultimately meaningless if he didn't achieve stuff afterwards.
Active pros fill the positions yes, but that doesn't mean only pros who are currently winning big in tournaments teach. It's not like Rei's going to quit just because he has a losing streak, and if he already has fame as well as friends in the league who want to help him, he's likely enough to find somewhere to work You really that determined to make his work unstable? Good luck, he's not likely to "lose" his job as long as he's still capable, even if he does go down in rank from a losing streak. And even if he has a slump and doesn't make much of anything from tournaments, there are plenty of positions he could take to make ends meet. Whether you recognize it or not, he's a professional who has already gained a very impressive status within his field that give him a lot of opportunities. It's not that easy getting into class B or winning as much as he has won, even if there's still a good distance to go before any titles will be within reach.

Basically, unless he suffers some sort of head injury, he's got a good financial future for himself that is more than strong and stable enough to make Hina's family feel secure.
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Old 2017-03-24, 15:38   Link #410
Anh_Minh
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Originally Posted by BWTraveller View Post
Active pros fill the positions yes, but that doesn't mean only pros who are currently winning big in tournaments teach.
I'm sure a lot of small local clubs are coached by non-pros. But how many of them would actually pay good money (full time job money) for a coach? And again, how many openings are there? And that's not even getting into whether he'd be any good in that position. I'm sure he'll get better with time and experience, but right now, he's not very good at explaining shogi, so things like teaching or writing probably wouldn't be very good fit.

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It's not like Rei's going to quit just because he has a losing streak,
Funny you should say that, when one bad loss made him turn to a job magazine.

Right now, his main reason for being a pro is that he feels he has no other choice. What if, through Hina's love, his neuroses start to heal and he stops feeling that way? What if he thinks what he really wants to do is help Hina with the wagashi shop? Then who's supporting whom?

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and if he already has fame as well as friends in the league who want to help him, he's likely enough to find somewhere to work
He wouldn't be the first kinda famous, promising person to fall. And how much help can his friends really be, especially if he decides he's done with shogi?

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You really that determined to make his work unstable? Good luck, he's not likely to "lose" his job as long as he's still capable, even if he does go down in rank from a losing streak. And even if he has a slump and doesn't make much of anything from tournaments, there are plenty of positions he could take to make ends meet. Whether you recognize it or not, he's a professional who has already gained a very impressive status within his field that give him a lot of opportunities. It's not that easy getting into class B or winning as much as he has won, even if there's still a good distance to go before any titles will be within reach.

Basically, unless he suffers some sort of head injury, he's got a good financial future for himself that is more than strong and stable enough to make Hina's family feel secure.
As of the anime, he's still in C1. And his present status was never in question. My point is that being a successful professional now doesn't mean he'll still be one ten or twenty years down the road, so calling him

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Originally Posted by BWTraveller View Post
someone likely to be able to support them financially no matter what the future holds for them.
is vastly overstating how secure his situation is.

Again, I'm not saying he's likely to quit. But I wouldn't throw words like "no matter what" either. And compared to, say, a French civil servant, who practically can't be fired, I wouldn't call his job situation "stable", either. Even without going to that extreme, a pro's life is hard and stressful. So shit can definitely happen.

Last edited by Anh_Minh; 2017-03-24 at 15:57.
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Old 2017-03-24, 18:08   Link #411
BWTraveller
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Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
I'm sure a lot of small local clubs are coached by non-pros. But how many of them would actually pay good money (full time job money) for a coach? And again, how many openings are there? And that's not even getting into whether he'd be any good in that position. I'm sure he'll get better with time and experience, but right now, he's not very good at explaining shogi, so things like teaching or writing probably wouldn't be very good fit.
He has problems EXPLAINING shogi. That doesn't mean he'd have problems teaching a class of shogi players. There's a big difference, in that the people know how the pieces work and how to play, they're looking for someone to teach them and help them. Not every course is Shogi 101, and not every shogi book is an illustrated children's guide to the fundamentals. I'm sure he can't write a beginner's book or teach a beginner's class, but if he's writing strategy or problems for a more advanced audience or teaching people in the mid- to upper-amateur levels he'll probably do much better than he did with Hina. Also, that was his first and only attempt at explaining the game; he had no clue what he was doing.

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Funny you should say that, when one bad loss made him turn to a job magazine.
It feels like you ignored a lot of what happened this season. The guy has GROWN. He started out simply doing it because it's what he does, but his feelings about the game have been growing and evolving as his confidence and sense of worth and belonging have grown. He went through a point where he was mortified and thought of quitting, but then he grew stronger and even sought to train under the guy who trounced him. Just because he thought of quitting at one point doesn't mean he'll take any new losing streaks like that.

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Right now, his main reason for being a pro is that he feels he has no other choice. What if, through Hina's love, his neuroses start to heal and he stops feeling that way? What if he thinks what he really wants to do is help Hina with the wagashi shop? Then who's supporting whom?
Have you actually watched the same show? His view of the game has changed drastically across the course of this season. At the start it was like you said. Shogi was just what he does, a way to make money and guarantee that he can find a face in front of him from time to time. Due to this, because he only wanted to be able to have some vague interaction and enough money to pay the rent, he settled for staying where he was. He didn't want to advance, he wanted to stay on his little "island" where everything was "safe". Since then, he's been growing like crazy. His confidence and worth have grown. His feelings about the game and his ability have shifted. He's started to seriously push for greater heights, to advance himself. Additionally, his vague, meaningless interactions have turned into deep bonds of friendship. It's really ridiculous to suggest that he still sees it as something he has no choice but to do, or to think that it's all because of his trauma and once he's healed he'll quit.

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He wouldn't be the first kinda famous, promising person to fall. And how much help can his friends really be, especially if he decides he's done with shogi?



As of the anime, he's still in C1. And his present status was never in question. My point is that being a successful professional now doesn't mean he'll still be one ten or twenty years down the road, so calling him


is vastly overstating how secure his situation is.

Again, I'm not saying he's likely to quit. But I wouldn't throw words like "no matter what" either. And compared to, say, a French civil servant, who practically can't be fired, I wouldn't call his job situation "stable", either. Even without going to that extreme, a pro's life is hard and stressful. So shit can definitely happen.
And you're vastly understating his job security. Again, it's like you're suggesting that a professional football player who leaves the pros would find himself completely unable to work because he has nothing others would call "experience". There are plenty of routes within the shogi world to make money to supplement one's income from winnings, and additionally he's already entered the professional world with high skill in his field. Being a young professional doesn't mean that he's better than other pros at his level, as that guy said, but it DOES mean that he's got plenty of time to continue his climb.

Also, when I said "no matter what the future may hold" I wasn't saying that nothing could possibly happen. What I meant was that he's the type to keep going, that he wouldn't give up, and that he has the talent to make it. No matter what comes, he'll keep pushing forward for himself and for those he loves, and with his talent chances are he'll find a way. If you really want to stretch your imagination, of course there are possibilities that could lead to him becoming unable or unwilling to play. But it'd take a real stretch, enough so that it hardly gives him any "insecurity" that others would worry about. He won't likely be able to make Hina filthy rich, but his financial situation is much better than you keep claiming.
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Old Yesterday, 11:17   Link #412
Anh_Minh
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Originally Posted by BWTraveller View Post
He has problems EXPLAINING shogi. That doesn't mean he'd have problems teaching a class of shogi players. There's a big difference, in that the people know how the pieces work and how to play, they're looking for someone to teach them and help them. Not every course is Shogi 101, and not every shogi book is an illustrated children's guide to the fundamentals. I'm sure he can't write a beginner's book or teach a beginner's class, but if he's writing strategy or problems for a more advanced audience or teaching people in the mid- to upper-amateur levels he'll probably do much better than he did with Hina. Also, that was his first and only attempt at explaining the game; he had no clue what he was doing.
He also had problems explaining his thoughts to the rest of the study group.


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It feels like you ignored a lot of what happened this season. The guy has GROWN. He started out simply doing it because it's what he does, but his feelings about the game have been growing and evolving as his confidence and sense of worth and belonging have grown. He went through a point where he was mortified and thought of quitting, but then he grew stronger and even sought to train under the guy who trounced him. Just because he thought of quitting at one point doesn't mean he'll take any new losing streaks like that.
And your basis for saying that? I'm not saying he'll quit at the drop of a hat. But his mettle hasn't really been tested yet. His loss against Shimada barely counts as a setback, and he didn't react too well. There's been no other such instance.


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Have you actually watched the same show? His view of the game has changed drastically across the course of this season. At the start it was like you said. Shogi was just what he does, a way to make money and guarantee that he can find a face in front of him from time to time. Due to this, because he only wanted to be able to have some vague interaction and enough money to pay the rent, he settled for staying where he was. He didn't want to advance, he wanted to stay on his little "island" where everything was "safe". Since then, he's been growing like crazy. His confidence and worth have grown. His feelings about the game and his ability have shifted. He's started to seriously push for greater heights, to advance himself. Additionally, his vague, meaningless interactions have turned into deep bonds of friendship. It's really ridiculous to suggest that he still sees it as something he has no choice but to do, or to think that it's all because of his trauma and once he's healed he'll quit.
He's stopped resenting it, yes. But ask him what else he could be doing instead, and he'll come up blank. He's not like Souma (Shokugeki no Souma) who optimistically thought he could stop cooking and be a salaryman or a lawyer instead.

And ask him whether he's got some burning ambition to become the Meijin or something, and he'll deny it.


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And you're vastly understating his job security. Again, it's like you're suggesting that a professional football player who leaves the pros would find himself completely unable to work because he has nothing others would call "experience".
1. Football isn't a great comparison because it's such a huge industry employing so many people.
2. It's not like he can't work. It's that he'll have a to find his place and start at the bottom. In most jobs, "shogi" belongs in the hobby section of the CV.

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There are plenty of routes within the shogi world to make money to supplement one's income from winnings,
I'm not so sure that's true, for former players.

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and additionally he's already entered the professional world with high skill in his field.
He's good at playing shogi. It's not that useful, outside of being a pro player.

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Being a young professional doesn't mean that he's better than other pros at his level, as that guy said, but it DOES mean that he's got plenty of time to continue his climb.

Also, when I said "no matter what the future may hold" I wasn't saying that nothing could possibly happen. What I meant was that he's the type to keep going, that he wouldn't give up, and that he has the talent to make it. No matter what comes, he'll keep pushing forward for himself and for those he loves, and with his talent chances are he'll find a way. If you really want to stretch your imagination, of course there are possibilities that could lead to him becoming unable or unwilling to play. But it'd take a real stretch, enough so that it hardly gives him any "insecurity" that others would worry about. He won't likely be able to make Hina filthy rich, but his financial situation is much better than you keep claiming.
We're getting into stuff that's only tangentially related to his situation. If you see a kid who's smart, earnest, hard-working... You can think he'll be ok. That he'll be able to deal with whatever life throws at him, provided it's not too crazy. He doesn't need to be a genius, or to already have a full time job at 17.

But conversely, having that job? It's not such a leg up.
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Old Yesterday, 12:51   Link #413
BWTraveller
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Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
He also had problems explaining his thoughts to the rest of the study group.



And your basis for saying that? I'm not saying he'll quit at the drop of a hat. But his mettle hasn't really been tested yet. His loss against Shimada barely counts as a setback, and he didn't react too well. There's been no other such instance.
Again, I can't help but wonder whether we watched the same series. At the start he didn't care at all. He chose a place to be and sat there, hardly even able to feel concerned about whether he started to fall back. Now, he's actively pushing forward. Before, he holed himself up and kept to himself, but now he is actively spending time with people. He's not finished growing for sure, but he's FAR from unchanged and more than changed enough to make one doubt whether he'd call it quits just because he found a difficult wall to climb.

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He's stopped resenting it, yes. But ask him what else he could be doing instead, and he'll come up blank. He's not like Souma (Shokugeki no Souma) who optimistically thought he could stop cooking and be a salaryman or a lawyer instead.
What's your point? Just because he can't imagine himself in a different career doesn't mean he's doomed. Plenty of people have found their niche and can't imagine themselves in another field. Even though he started basically doing it because it was the only thing he had, that doesn't mean that's still his only reason. There's nothing wrong with reaching a point where you can't imagine yourself anywhere else, as long as it's for the right reasons. At the start he felt this for all the wrong reasons, but his reasons are clearly evolving.

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And ask him whether he's got some burning ambition to become the Meijin or something, and he'll deny it.
You don't have to be aiming for the top to do well in a field. He doesn't show a burning ambition to achieve a title true, but he also doesn't show a lack of ambition in individual games, at least not anymore. He wants to grow better and become stronger. You don't have to believe you can be the next Bill Gates or even want to be in order to be a programmer and want to become the best programmer possible. He doesn't look far enough into the future or have enough confidence yet to really consider it realistic to aim for the Meijin title. He just aims to defeat the next opponent he'll face, and the one after that, and the one after that. What's wrong with this?

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1. Football isn't a great comparison because it's such a huge industry employing so many people.
2. It's not like he can't work. It's that he'll have a to find his place and start at the bottom. In most jobs, "shogi" belongs in the hobby section of the CV.
I'll need statistics for this one. Shogi may not be football, but it's popular enough, and there are much more amateurs trying to become better than there are pros. Even if he's not great at standing in front of a large hall, there are still ways to make money.

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I'm not so sure that's true, for former players.

He's good at playing shogi. It's not that useful, outside of being a pro player.
Again, you're saying this based on the assumption that his kneejerk reaction to the FIRST MAJOR DEFEAT HE HAD is indicative of how he'll react to ALL future setbacks. He was extremely immature at the time, failing to even give any respect to a Class A opponent, and his pain was as much about his attitude as it was about his loss. Take another look at it. He's mortified because he acted like he was fighting a low-level opponent with no real skill and suddenly realized that he was actually dealing with a powerful, battle-hardened veteran. It wasn't just the fact that he lost and lost miserably that made him grab that job book, it was also to a large extent a matter of how lightly he'd taken it. A recognition of immaturity which was followed by a gradual effort to grow.

And also once again, you're going to have to provide actual numbers.

Quote:
We're getting into stuff that's only tangentially related to his situation. If you see a kid who's smart, earnest, hard-working... You can think he'll be ok. That he'll be able to deal with whatever life throws at him, provided it's not too crazy. He doesn't need to be a genius, or to already have a full time job at 17.

But conversely, having that job? It's not such a leg up.
Please quit putting down an occupation that many pursue and many others wish to pursue unless you can back it up. Yes, experience playing on a board will likely be difficult to present as work experience in unrelated fields, just like experience programming won't be much use when applying for a marketing job and experience as a construction worker won't do much good for clerical positions. But I have not seen a single thing besides claims with no clear evidence that there aren't enough actual jobs involving shogi to give a hard-working young man a chance to find work if he's not winning enough at the moment. Additionally, while being a kishi won't be directly useful, if he talks about the hours and hours of practice and study and dedication it took to reach his current level then at the least he can prove a very strong work ethic and commitment, as well as a seriousness and initiative. But this is irrelevant considering that he seems to have grown to a point where it's highly unlikely that he'd just up and quit the way you keep saying.

And anyway, the entire point was how he looks to the Kawamoto family and whether there's reason to consider him viable as a supporter of a household. And I think he has more than enough for them to feel some valid security in this area.
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Old Yesterday, 23:22   Link #414
Alf
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Well, a discussion about how would Hina's grandfather would regard Rei in terms of possible future husband, have turned into a talk of status of pro Shogi in Japan, and we have no reference in hand.

Actually I don't think we need to look too far. We've been shown that Rei as a C rank player has higher income than a highschool teacher, and that is all we need. Because rather than the objective truth about pro Shogi player, the signal in that particular scene is that being a pro Shogi player has good income, with highschool teacher as a reference. That's all we need to know, unless we need to find out whether Rei is able to earn enough for all three sister's living.

As to risk of being a pro player, it's always there for most kind of jobs. Even being employed isn't truely secure because it's just letting the employer to handle the risk. Being a pro player is to keep up with the competition, but for the time being no one would think Rei will fall to the bottom in the long run because of the talent he have shown.

And even if you think of the risk more throughly, you never know when are you going to have heavy sickness affecting your performance, but those are up and downs in life to be handled. What the grandfather would likely consider is his motivation, as what you would usually find in parent in older mangas.
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Old Yesterday, 23:37   Link #415
orion
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alf View Post
Well, a discussion about how would Hina's grandfather would regard Rei in terms of possible future husband, have turned into a talk of status of pro Shogi in Japan, and we have no reference in hand.

Actually I don't think we need to look too far. We've been shown that Rei as a C rank player has higher income than a highschool teacher, and that is all we need. Because rather than the objective truth about pro Shogi player, the signal in that particular scene is that being a pro Shogi player has good income, with highschool teacher as a reference. That's all we need to know, unless we need to find out whether Rei is able to earn enough for all three sister's living.

As to risk of being a pro player, it's always there for most kind of jobs. Even being employed isn't truely secure because it's just letting the employer to handle the risk. Being a pro player is to keep up with the competition, but for the time being no one would think Rei will fall to the bottom in the long run because of the talent he have shown.

And even if you think of the risk more throughly, you never know when are you going to have heavy sickness affecting your performance, but those are up and downs in life to be handled. What the grandfather would likely consider is his motivation, as what you would usually find in parent in older mangas.
These articles give a hint on the salary.

http://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/200.../#.WNdEh3QrIUE

http://en.rocketnews24.com/2016/05/1...ue-to-society/


Salary is based on ranking, game fees and other related income.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japan_...iation#Players
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