2009-07-10, 21:29 | Link #243 |
Gamilas Falls
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Republic of California
Age: 46
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Wouldn't Mikuru, Yuki, and Itsuki be the gatekeepers? As well as the watchers.
They keep the gate and only through them does the key have access to what lies beyond ("Snow White", "Sleeping Beauty", "Why don't you you come up from behind her and say 'I love you'.")
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2009-07-10, 21:41 | Link #244 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2009
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As to what Kyon and Haruhi are, I prefer Yuki's take on it in her short story in Indignation:
"The man started singing in a low voice. Synchronizing with the white cloth's dance." Of course, Kyon is so dense that he doesn't realize who the man and the woman wearing the white cloth represent. Just popped in to say that. Will pop out now. |
2009-07-10, 21:53 | Link #246 | |
Homo Ludens
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Canada
Age: 34
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2009-07-11, 00:01 | Link #248 | |
Name means little...
Graphic Designer
Join Date: Dec 2004
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Well Kaisos, looks like it's time we head over to Copenhagen and look at Bohr and the gang once more...
(And I am surprised that ontology thread will see a return from the dead like this. I will fill up my argument once I start looking up at research) @Kaisos Erranon: Because it's a return to the Future with Clannad AS. I just started to read about Transactional interpretation and it seems to explain Nagato pretty good, well up to a point... Basically, unlike Clannad Afterstory, the world view of Haruhi is firmly grounded with the idea of waveform collapse, which... Quote:
It is damn tempting for me to try looking at Endless Eight as a case of many worlds, but this runs completely against the copenhagen views. In short, I am going to spend the time looking at how one can have these 2 week loops, having nagato retaining all of the memories and kyon the conventional observer knowing nothing and all.
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Last edited by panzerfan; 2009-07-11 at 00:42. |
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2009-07-14, 15:26 | Link #250 | |
Newb in training
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: California
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Wow, I've haven't seen a anime-inspired conversation like this since the Noein thread.
As one who enjoys the study of theology, I applaud of the use of the word "ontology" here. It definitely had me laughing! Quote:
I've heard that in the original novels, "dimensional travelers" is always included alongside espers, time travelers, and aliens in the list that Haruhi cites. |
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2009-07-14, 15:49 | Link #253 | |
Homo Ludens
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Canada
Age: 34
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The worlds in the many-worlds interpretation would just be different versions of the same universe. A completely alternate universe would have had completely different origins, a completely different start point. And I don't believe in the many-worlds interpretation in regards to this series anyway. It seems rather... counter to the time travel Kyon has gone through. |
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2009-07-14, 16:04 | Link #254 | |
Newb in training
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: California
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I've only read a few bits and pieces of the novels, but the whole solution to the endless eight Spoiler for spoiler for novels:
However, what if Haruhi is indeed the original source and is pushing the powers off on him, rather than vice versa as the theory goes? It might also be possible that they both have powers, with Kyon serving as a balance or counter agent to Haruhi. It might explain why the others are so open with him about their origins in any case. |
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2009-07-14, 16:12 | Link #255 | |
Explodes when thrown
IT Support
Join Date: Jan 2009
Age: 37
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Jeez, I just can't think straight today. Lemme try this again.
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Of course, according to that, time-travel doesn't actually exist per se, making Mikuru a slider as much as a time-traveler.
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2009-07-14, 16:15 | Link #256 | |
Homo Ludens
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Canada
Age: 34
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You have to take some things at face value, especially because Kyon even draws attention to how his time travel contradicts what Mikuru told him. |
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2009-07-14, 17:53 | Link #257 |
Name means little...
Graphic Designer
Join Date: Dec 2004
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Well, the reason why many worlds does not work well with Haruhi standpoint lies in the fact that many world rests on the idea that there is no such thing as the waveform collapse (ie: Kyon's preference killing off other possibilities so we get one reality to base things out of)
Many world looks at waveform collapse as something called decoherance. This in this sense mean that... Kyon, who is unable to perceive things as a bunch of probabilities (branching), will end up looking at exactly that as he goes on in the course of life and he is skewed into thinking that those other paths that have flown by would been "collapsed" as in "other probabilities cease to have any function in the real world". Just in this alone Haruhi, which to me is based off of Copenhagen viewpoint would not reconcile with many worlds. The hilarious thing that also made me conclude that Haruhi's based off Copenhagen is in Wigner's Friend thought experiment, where Wigner, who owns the Schrödinger's cat had his friend does the experiment, that will take a day before anyone learns the result, argues that the set of dead cat/sad friend or live cat/happy friend is determined by: either it happened the moment when you open the box or it happened sometime before that. Note that the friend's convinced that the cat lives and he's optimistic, while we the observer think that it's 50-50. Well to Copenhagen, each observer (Wigner and his friend) has different information and therefore different wave functions, showing how subjective probability can be... and that what his friend thinks hold no impact on what Wigner sees. whereas in many worlds, the very history splits the moment when Wigner cracks open that box, into a happy friend and a depressed friend world. The friend won't be the wiser about any of this... as his friend can comprehend that two histories are formed out of this. Wigner, the trained physicist would realize that despite having no Wigner world A talking to Wigner world B.
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Last edited by panzerfan; 2009-07-14 at 18:18. |
2009-07-21, 17:08 | Link #259 | |
True Believer of Haruhi
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Somewhere, everywhere..
Age: 38
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Except for the star mole and Bamboo Leaf and Vanishment and Intrigues. So Yeah. |
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2009-07-21, 17:21 | Link #260 | |
Senior Member
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(what is "fiasco" BTW? We have the same word in portuguese, but it don't seens to fit here) *e* Three post at same time!! |
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