Sony killed Lik-Sang

[Zero1]

Thought I'd throw this one in as a point of interest.

Now I know about taxes, and this per capita stuff, but according to that list, UK is further down than US and Japan, yet we pay well over the odds

Item				US MSRP ($)	UK MSRP (£)	UK MSRP ($)

Wii console + Wii sports	249.99		179.99		336.83
Nintendo Nunchuck		 19.99		 14.99		 28.05
Nintendo Remote			 39.99		 29.99		 56.12
Nintendo Classic Controller	 19.99		 14.99		 28.05
Nintendo Classic Controller	 19.99		 14.99		 28.05
Super Smash Brothers:Brawl	 49.99		 39.99		 74.84
Super Mario Galaxy		 49.99		 39.99		 74.84
Sonic and the Secret Rings	 49.99		 39.99		 74.84
Zelda: Twilight Princess	 49.99		 39.99		 74.84
Need for Speed Carbon		 49.99		 39.99		 74.84
FIFA 07				 49.99		 39.99		 74.84

TOTAL				649.89		494.89		926.14

1.00 GBP = 1.8714 USD

If I were to import this from the US I would only pay 17.5% on top of the US MSRP, a total of $763.62 or £408.05. Fortunately I got a discount off every game, so the total was £452.

I'll add in that the combined MSRP at US prices without import tax works out at £347.27. That seems like one heck of a good deal to me.

[OutPhase]

Originally Posted by uLTraCarL-

I'm getting just the barebone game itself (preordered at play-asia)
i would like a keychain, but i cant justify spending that much on all those goodies

I'm getting the LE since it might be thelast style that has music worth listening to if GOLD's soundtrack sucks.

Glad I didn't get too fond of Lik-Sang.

[Omiane]

Originally Posted by Razer_2mb

I'm getting the LE since it might be thelast style that has music worth listening to if GOLD's soundtrack sucks.

Glad I didn't get too fond of Lik-Sang.

Wel.... I did

[evil|plushie]

Originally Posted by Benoit

This is not true. It's because of the differing economy of the continents.

Consider that popular RPGs in Japan cost $80. US people would be enraged, but the Japanese are fine with it, because for them it's a normal price. Why's that? Because they earn more money and have more money to spend on themselves after paying things like the rent, food, etc.

Europeans can spend more money than US people. Hence our games are more expensive. We have more 'buying strength' (loosely translated).

I don't think europeans have more purchasing power than american citizens. Not after you take into account taxes, rent, necessities like water, food, electricity, which I think cost a lot more in europe than america. Just because the currency is stronger than US doesn't mean anything.


And yeah, I think Japanese are being stiffed. Looks like the europeans will be next.

[Onizuka-GTO]

bleh.

Sony Empire..... The Nintsoft Wii60 Alliance will defeat yoooou!

[DaFool]

Originally Posted by Benoit

This is not true. It's because of the differing economy of the continents.

Consider that popular RPGs in Japan cost $80. US people would be enraged, but the Japanese are fine with it, because for them it's a normal price. Why's that? Because they earn more money and have more money to spend on themselves after paying things like the rent, food, etc.

Europeans can spend more money than US people. Hence our games are more expensive. We have more 'buying strength' (loosely translated).

The post hints of ignorance. Prices are a combination of factors, such as standard of living, tariffs / government subsidies, and setting the best price they can get away with (i.e. to maximize profit).

Necessities like food and gasoline are one thing (overall cheaper in the United States due to economies of scale). Entertainment is another. I can literally pay just 2 bucks for a Hollywood movie on its premier worldwide release, because its ridiculous for them to ask the same price as in other countries, the people just wouldn't pay and just pirate.

If there is one thing though that's a solid fact, is that Japanese consumers are always screwed.

This is just a protectionist measure by Sony. They want to be able to export your manufacturing jobs to cheaper places, but they don't want you to be able to import your manufactured goods from cheaper places.

[evil|plushie]

Of course they don't. If they can charge customers in area X $Y and charge customers in area Z $Y+B, why would they ever allow imports to come in so that customers in area Z only pay $Y. But then, the trick to do this is NOT to let people find out. It's also not to try and blatantly stop people and make it obvious that you're only protecting your profits.

Sony phails.

[Zero1]

Yes, years ago they could get away with it, but with the internet now, information is so freely available. At the push of a button you can find out how much it costs in other countries and even how much the average salary is.

It would have been to much trouble to go for, for the average person say 10 years ago.

I don't care that it's not particularly cheap, I care because it's not particularly fair, coupled with the fact we always get everything last and sometimes not at all (there have been a good number of US + Japan only releases).

[evil|plushie]

Shrugs. my personal belief is that if people are willing to import it from overseas, run the risk of possible defects, wait long periods of time for the product, then the local marketing dept has probably done something wrong.

[Kupop]

Also, people who import on a regular basis (maybe not everyone who imports... someone who imports a game or system for the first time without doing any research or having any knowledge about things like PAL vs. NTSC and the difference in voltage might not) already know about the "risks" they're taking.

[Onizuka-GTO]

so what? People should have the CHOICE to run those risk, Sony took that away, inthe process, turning away a majority of hardcore costomers who have the money to spend, to their rivals.

Besides, this wasn't even aboutthe PS3 it was about the PSP. So whats going to happened to American/Japanese importers of the PS3 to Europe? I won't be surprised is Sony, happy with this victory will threaten any importers who are thinking about it.

Effectively, this has imprisoned Europe. We are now a third world citizen in terms of consumers to Sony.

Screw you Sony!!!!

[Kupop]

Errm... I think you misunderstood what I said... because you basically restated my post.

[Onizuka-GTO]

er....Of course i was restating your post!

I was...er...merely testing everyone...yeah!

Heil Sony!





p.s: was reading about the Lik-sang case and a user called Alistair Hutton from penny-arcade forum by far has given the clearest explaination of how Sony managed to bring a case against Lik-Sang:

Just to be clear, what lik-sang has done that has been ruled illegal is not the selling of PSPs. What is illegal is saying they are selling PSPs. The ruling is that lik-sang are illegally using Sony's trademark without permission. If Lik-Sang had say said they were selling "Top Brand name portable gaming system" without ever mentioning Sony or the PSP , or displaying pictures of it then Sony wouldn't have had an attack angle.

This is a legal precedent that was set my brand name clothing companies, especially Levi's, who used the same agruement to prevent British supermarkets from importing the goods from non-British-Levi official sources at a lower price. Just to be clear, the supermarkets were selling genuine Levi goods from genuine Levi suppliers, just not the British Levi suppliers.

It's fundamentally an outrgeous cockmonger of an arguement that is blatantly anti-competative and why it hasn't been struck down I am ata loss to explain.

So lik-sang was killed because it was promoting real sony products, with sony trading name, and was sucessful??! well thanks frecking European Union!! And you ask us Brit's why we didn't join yuo fully! just dipping our toes into it has screwed little companies like lik-Sang!


Europe = Sony's Slave Labour Camp

[OutPhase]

Onizuki-GTO, from what I have noticed, you seem to twist the wording of what they said to make it sound like they are just shutting down Lik-Sang for no reason. They used Sony's name without permission. Also:

The statement begins by observing that Sony Computersuccessfully sued Pacific Game Technology, which uses Lik-Sang as one of its trading names, for infringing intellectual property rights.
"Lik-Sang did not contest this case (i.e. they did not turn up and therefore incurred no legal costs). We have been awarded substantial costs against Lik-Sang which have not been paid," the statement claims.
"We would therefore strongly deny that our actions have had anything to do with this website closing (we assume the legal entity is still trading), and would suggest that this release is sour grapes on behalf of Lik-Sang which is aimed to belittle Sony Computer Entertainment and the British judicial system that found against them."
Earlier today, Lik-Sang announced it was going out of business, citing a series of lawsuits filed by Sony as the reason for the closure. The retailer also alleged that several SCE executives purchased import PSP hardware and software on its website.
Sony responded, "The purchasing of PSP consoles by SCE employees would be for investigatory purposes. We would also like to express our surprise at a company releasing personal information about its consumers, as this is contrary to data protection principles around the world."

http://gamesindustry.biz/content_page.php?aid=20564


In the end, Lik-Sang was not the main target, but rather, a victim. Besides, there are far better sites that I can import games from.

[Lebron]

eh if they go after another site like Play-Asia or something, then yea yall may have a case. But untill that happens, I really don't think they were totally out to get Lik-Sang just for the hell of it, and trying to prevent europeans from buying imported Sony products.

They already owned Europe, I doubt they would want to do it again. Just sounds to me like Lik-Sang had it coming, but then again I could care less. Never used the site, and didn't plan on getting a PS3 anytime soon. Now that I know the main games I wanted are coming out sometime in '08

[Shinoto]

Originally Posted by Onizuka-GTO

bleh.

Sony Empire..... The Nintsoft Wii60 Alliance will defeat yoooou!

Im liking that a bit more than The Super Computer^^

[Secca]

In Asia they been had it easy with the copyright laws, that's why they had alot of piracy problems to deal with. In America, you can get sued just for using Micky Mouse name without Disney permission, seriously. >_<;;;

[Lebron]

Thats because Disney is crazy, hell you should watch out, since you used their key characters reference w/o their permission, you just may find 7 little dwarfs waiting outside your house 2morrow with baseball bats :P

[Sides]

Originally Posted by Lebron

eh if they go after another site like Play-Asia or something, then yea yall may have a case. But untill that happens, I really don't think they were totally out to get Lik-Sang just for the hell of it, and trying to prevent europeans from buying imported Sony products.

Like mentioned before, play-asia and some smaller sites already stopped
selling PSP stuff to the UK and Europe,
when they received legal letters from sony back in 2004/05.
Lik-sang was the only site who refused to stop shipping stuff to the EU
and got into this legal case.

PS2 stuff are not affected in anyway at the moment,
it is only about jpn/asian PSP products and the EU.
The situation with the PS3 isn't clear yet (since it isn't on the market),
but yesasia already state that they won't be shipping it to the EU,
mostlikely other asian based site will follow soon.
But US based companies do not seems to be affected, i.e NCSX
so we can get JPN stuff via NA which will be a bit pricier.

[Onizuka-GTO]

Originally Posted by Razer_2mb

Onizuki-GTO, from what I have noticed, you seem to twist the wording of what they said to make it sound like they are just shutting down Lik-Sang for no reason. They used Sony's name without permission.

I'm not twisting any words, what I just posted, was the intepretation of the ruling, that I found understandable.

As for that statement that you have quoted, im not sure why you made some statments in bold.

Well, if you wish to justify those, I will humour you.

Sony Computersuccessfully sued Pacific Game Technology, which uses Lik-Sang as one of its trading names, for infringing intellectual property rights.

Okay, I don't really understand why you bold out thisbut meh.

"Lik-Sang did not contest this case (i.e. they did not turn up and therefore incurred no legal costs).

Fact 1) Lik-Sang has no representative in the UK or Europe.

Fact 2) They face the same case in 50+ countries. The British one was just the first to come up.

Fact 3) They are exactly 1/40 of the financial size of Sony.

Fact 4) European Court of Law, made a landslide case against deframing Brand Identity. In Levi versus Tesco Supermarket. THe Judgement rule that Tesco's action of buying authentic Levi jeans from an overseas country at a far cheaper bulk price then the official imports and selling them in the Supermarket chain at a cheaper price then the national levi jean price, was damaging the company brand, and was using it's "IP" (Brand) without it's permission.

(So, in theory if someone register the trademark "Sex" and sells a tool called "sex" , anyone else who buys your product, but sells it without your permission can be sued for damages. You might own the product, but the name of that product belongs to the company regardless if the product youhave is a authentic licenced item from that company.
How messed up is that?!)

There for it was using the company brand name for it's authentic goods, which the comany did not like.

This is effect is the quvilent of you travelling to America buying a PSP, which is now legally yours, take it back to Europe. But if you wish to sell that good in Europe, you are not allowed to say you are selling a "PSP" or its' by "SONY" .

It is a typical anti-consumer policy.

UK ruling will only apply to UK, but since Sony filed the same law suit in all major European court, I really don't see why they should even show up. The European Court of law affects all European Union member court of law, some more then others.

If you have the no MONEY to contest even one case, i doubt a lik-sang will have the resources to fight them all.

It's common sense, that when you see a non-sensical ruling, then jump to defend yourself knowing you have less then a advantage of winning, only a fool will march on to defeat.

We would also like to express our surprise at a company releasing personal information about its consumers,

Personal information which was....?

Names? = Check

Product Order information? = Check

Personal Details? = No

Contact Details? = No

Payment Details? = No

Delivery Details? = No

Will this affect a dead company? = No

Does the HK Data protection Law apply to dead companies when releasing data information concerning identity and product order information? =certianly, as certain as a company is in adminstration. In the worse case that can be inflicted is to be fined, a very low end number, between HK$100,000 - HK$200,000 (depending on the size of the company profit and nature of the breach of the law) and even then this will have to be settle with the liquidators, and when a company is in bankuracy they are also subjected to some other form of protection which I admit Im unfamiliar with.

(I've study,lived and worked in HK for 10yrs so I know a little bit about the business practice there)

When you have to face a small fine of HK$200,000+ instead of a trillion dollar lawsuit with Sony...HAHAHAHA seems like good money just to slap Sony inthe face.

Typical Hong Kongie defiance.