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Old 2020-11-08, 16:20   Link #61
Tenzen12
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It doesn't matter whether he is hero or villain as long as he's protagonist. Being mastermind isn't enough, you have to have charisma, especialy if you follow someone doing unsavory stuff. You need more effort to emphasy with someone significantly older, then younger, becuse even old people were young, but young are alien to old and neither young or old like think about being old anyway.

As for Watson, he was enlisted pretty much right after getting bechelor tittle and retired due injuri two years later. So yeah, he should still be in his twenties. That joke is on you.
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Old 2020-11-08, 16:55   Link #62
AC-Phoenix
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tenzen12 View Post
It doesn't matter whether he is hero or villain as long as he's protagonist. Being mastermind isn't enough, you have to have charisma, especialy if you follow someone doing unsavory stuff. You need more effort to emphasy with someone significantly older, then younger, becuse even old people were young, but young are alien to old and neither young or old like think about being old anyway.

As for Watson, he was enlisted pretty much right after getting bechelor tittle and retired due injuri two years later. So yeah, he should still be in his twenties. That joke is on you.
Being in your twenties, and looking like you are still in college old are two different things.

Also, Watson had a fully blown Doctorate, not just a a Bachelor, which is two titles below that. I've yet to see a bachelor even in a drug store btw., they all have their masters, but it might be different in other countries.

That being said, going by how Watson was born around 1853, and his study taking place around 81, he'd be 28~ish, while the guy in the intro looks 20 at best.

Moriarty doesn't build on people emphasizing with him btw., but on him claiming to emphasize with them. As for weaponized Charisma... One word: There are actually a few good examples in current, and soon to be gone, politicians, and not all of them are exactly their youngest.
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Old 2020-11-08, 17:32   Link #63
SeijiSensei
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About their ages...

We see from Frida's grave that the events in this week's episode take place in 1875. That's twelve years before the first Holmes story, A Study in Scarlett, which was published in 1887. The short story, "The Final Problem," about Holmes confrontation with Moriarty at Reichenbach Falls, was published in 1893. So if Moriarty is, say, twenty-five in this series, he'd be forty-three in the "Final Problem." Those dates and ages make sense to me.
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Old 2020-11-08, 17:34   Link #64
Tenzen12
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To be fair I wouldn't be surprised if Final Problem wasn't moved to earlier date, so YnM could make Great Finale with it's events.

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Being in your twenties, and looking like you are still in college old are two different things.

Also, Watson had a fully blown Doctorate, not just a a Bachelor, which is two titles below that. I've yet to see a bachelor even in a drug store btw., they all have their masters, but it might be different in other countries.

That being said, going by how Watson was born around 1853, and his study taking place around 81, he'd be 28~ish, while the guy in the intro looks 20 at best.

Moriarty doesn't build on people emphasizing with him btw., but on him claiming to emphasize with them. As for weaponized Charisma... One word: There are actually a few good examples in current, and soon to be gone, politicians, and not all of them are exactly their youngest.
We are talking about audience rooting for him, what he's claiming has no bearing on that. Look even on this very thead you got another two or three people confirming what I said and not single one agreeing with your point. While having majority doesn't make anyone necessarily right on factual matters, by definiton majority decide what's popular and this is small but valid sample.

And I don't see reason why this Watson couldn't be 28. There is lot of actors that still play university or even high school students at that age.
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Old 2020-11-08, 18:24   Link #65
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Originally Posted by Tenzen12 View Post
To be fair I wouldn't be surprised if Final Problem wasn't moved to earlier date, so YnM could make Great Finale with it's events.



We are talking about audience rooting for him, what he's claiming has no bearing on that. Look even on this very thead you got another two or three people confirming what I said and not single one agreeing with your point. While having majority doesn't make anyone necessarily right on factual matters, by definiton majority decide what's popular and this is small but valid sample.

And I don't see reason why this Watson couldn't be 28. There is lot of actors that still play university or even high school students at that age.
And if the majority gulps it up like that a 100 times over, it doesn't put it above critique, nor the possibility that regular moriarty might work just as well, if not better if we had the same thing featuring him.

An older Moriarty would also be an enhancement for the general tone.

It's also easy to say the majority would think this is more popular when there is literally no counter example, as the anime you mentioned is not only another genre, but also features a completely different story.

The other thing, I almost forgot myself, is that we weren't arguing more popular to begin with, but the claim that only four people on the forums would even give it a shot.
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Old 2020-11-08, 20:49   Link #66
Tenzen12
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Yes, that something is popular doesn't put it above criticism, I absolutely agree. That said there is nothing to critique about using young Moriarty. If young Moriarty was used wrong, then it would be worth. And no old Moriarty wouldn't work " as well or better" as long as sales are included in "work"

It also wouldn't improve tone. It would different. Noone can say if it would be good, but lot of people wouldn't give it chance even if it happened to be masterpiece. Because reason already mentioned and not just by me.

In the end it does not matter at slightest how old William is. He could be child genius or prodigy teenager. He could also be 700 years old vampire (but in each case anime would be completely different). As long as people are willing give it a shot, only execution matter.
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Old 2020-11-08, 21:13   Link #67
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Ep 5 covers Chp 3, Vol 1 of the manga. (Vol 1 only had 3 main chapters.)

In the original Sherlock Holmes stories, Moran was a villain of the week introduced in The Adventure of the Empty House (part of the Return of Sherlock Holmes collection; public pressure forced Conan Doyle to resurrect Holmes). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Ad...he_Empty_House

A decorated British Army soldier and skilled marksman, Moran was recruited as an assassin for Moriarty after his retirement. He was also described as making a living from card-gambling. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colonel_Moran

The most prominent usage of Moran I recall was in the movie A Game of Shadows (aka. Robert Downey Jr as Sherlock Holmes), where Moran also served as Moriarty's right-hand man. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dKqCFhKvF28 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r2Z9T39QhmU&t

Also, Fred is likely based on Fred Porlock, a minor character from another Holmes story, The Valley of Fear. He served as Moriarty's informant.

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Not sure what the purpose of the sniper with the Hollywood Silencer was if they were just gonna push the guy off the bridge anyway. Here's hoping something more of a long running plot starts emerging next episode.
I think it was William's way of giving Dudley a poetic justice punishment.
True, he could just simply push Dudley off the bridge. But William wanted to make Dudley suffer, to make him personally experience what the dead girl went through.

Last edited by zztop; 2020-11-08 at 22:26.
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Old 2020-11-09, 08:40   Link #68
SeijiSensei
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Informative piece about grapefruit juice and quinine. Little evidence of any bad interactions between the two. However mixing the juice with an isomer of quinine, quinidine, can be dangerous.

https://anitrendz.net/news/2020/11/0...dy-in-quinine/
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Old 2020-11-13, 20:21   Link #69
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Crunchyroll posted an article and a preview teaser for the 2nd cour of Moriarty the Patriot which is scheduled to start in April 2021. You can find the article and teaser here.
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Old 2020-11-13, 21:29   Link #70
Guardian Enzo
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Holmes can't arrive too soon for me. This is already feeling kind of stale.
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Old 2020-11-14, 12:38   Link #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AC-Phoenix View Post
And if the majority gulps it up like that a 100 times over, it doesn't put it above critique, nor the possibility that regular moriarty might work just as well, if not better if we had the same thing featuring him.

An older Moriarty would also be an enhancement for the general tone.

It's also easy to say the majority would think this is more popular when there is literally no counter example, as the anime you mentioned is not only another genre, but also features a completely different story.

The other thing, I almost forgot myself, is that we weren't arguing more popular to begin with, but the claim that only four people on the forums would even give it a shot.
To finish soon, bishis sell better, at least in Japan. Is not so difficult or I think the author though in this way. Seems it worked as we are watching the anime.
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Old 2020-11-15, 15:46   Link #72
AC-Phoenix
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Holmes can't arrive too soon for me. This is already feeling kind of stale.
Tbh, I think the previous arc's idea was mainly establishing how Moriarty can know how opium smells.
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Old 2020-11-16, 06:41   Link #73
Guardian Enzo
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That debut was a bit unnerving for me.

The reason the Holmes-Moriarty dynamic worked is that Doyle had the confidence to make Moriarty a true equal of Holmes. This will only work if the converse is true here. If Holmes is just another caricature to make William look smarter by comparison, it's not going to fly. Way too early to tell, but that was definitely staged for William to make a fool out of Sherlock.
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Old 2020-11-16, 06:56   Link #74
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Could you elaborate on "staged for William to make a fool out of Sherlock"?
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Old 2020-11-16, 07:11   Link #75
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Could you elaborate on "staged for William to make a fool out of Sherlock"?
Basically Holmes was made to look like a ludicrous popinjay. Smart enough but using his wits on cheap parlor tricks, and no match for big bad Will (who got in some good digs at him, just as a garnish).
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Old 2020-11-16, 07:49   Link #76
Tenzen12
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I didn't take it that way. Sherlock obviously is ludicrous popinjay, but it didn't felt like he "lost". Or at least Sherlock himself looked really pleased to meet challange for once. It seems to me he even took liking William to degree.
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Old 2020-11-16, 09:16   Link #77
Guardian Enzo
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We’ll see. I don’t think it’s an exaggeration to say that the fate of the series largely falls on whether that relationship works on screen, so I’m hoping for the best.
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Old 2020-11-16, 14:21   Link #78
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So I guess the other guy was Holmes...

In terms of keeping score of "equal-ness", I'd give it a 55:45 split to Moriarty. For the most part they seemed pretty equal to me but the slight difference was that there was a hint of obnoxiousness from Holmes that betrayed a bias from the writer. But that split is open to re-evaluation if Holmes royally screws up Moriarty's plans and he regrets dismissing Holmes as a non-issue.

The "ludicrosity" of Holmes is I think more a reflection on the story's "artistic" portrayal of intelligence and deductive skills rather than a reflection of the character. And I think that's also apparent in Moriarty's plan this episode. I thought he was on point with his theory on the effectiveness a public death can have on socio-politics (considering our long history of social unrests triggered by perceived unjust deaths) but there was also a fair amount of waffle and I didn't follow his link to crime whatsoever.

But I am pleased with the direction the story appears to be going. I was wondering myself if the story would venture beyond monster of the week revenge stories, and it looks like it's starting to happen. That's a good sign.
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Old 2020-11-16, 14:43   Link #79
Tenzen12
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Holmes was always self-centered prick, who treats murders and crimes as mere sport irc. I think in that regard author is pretty much at point. It's not something to be chalked as bias. Well, I wouldn't guess this version as person who randomly start shoot into walls though at least.

Ultimatelly I don't think Sherlock will not be "heroic" character, but rather adversary who would try ruin William grand revolution just to satisfy his obsession with finding answers.
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Old 2020-11-16, 17:02   Link #80
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Holmes was always self-centered prick, who treats murders and crimes as mere sport irc. I think in that regard author is pretty much at point. It's not something to be chalked as bias. Well, I wouldn't guess this version as person who randomly start shoot into walls though at least.

Ultimatelly I don't think Sherlock will not be "heroic" character, but rather adversary who would try ruin William grand revolution just to satisfy his obsession with finding answers.
Well, emotions tend to get in the way of intelligent work. He's supposed to be a detective for goodness sake. If you wanted sympathy, hire a crying woman for the funeral.
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