2008-03-26, 02:07 | Link #22581 | |||||||||||
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
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Too busy for a full reply, so I'll have to pick. I'll do the command stuff first, then the rest later.
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Since a mage has many similarities to an aviator (higher than average intelligence, character from being sole master of an expensive and powerful piece of machinery ... etc), it stands to reason that if carrier aviators can make at least adequate captains, so can shipborne mages. Quote:
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In the end, what's important is what the Commander is supposed to be. You think his main specialty should be shiphandling. But a TSAB Vessel Commander's primary force is his mages. His ship is a battle-taxi, and may even be unarmed. Even if it is armed, the usage of armament already signifies the failure of the mission, with the only decision left being how big a failure it is. Given this, where a Captain's primary orientation should be, and what he should hand down to the technical crew, is clear. While we've only seen two TSAB ships, both ships seem to support my position that the Captains should be good mages. Of course, the TSAB is hardly a tactical authority, but this time, IMO they do have the blessing of the very well regarded USN and RN. Quote:
For another thing, does the "normal troop" truly "deserve" the position more than the powerful novice (relatively speaking)? Sure, the normal trooper has more time in service. But this pretty much ends his short list of advantages. The novice not only has more magic power than him, but is probably also more highly intelligent, so his base qualities are already better. Even in experience and accomplishments, unless you push novice to extremes, the novice is unlikely to lose. Being sent all over the TSAB as a reinforcement, he cuts more Lost Logia and criminals in a week than Normal Trooper does a year. So who's really better qualified as a veteran and a leader? Last edited by arkhangelsk; 2008-03-26 at 02:53. Reason: Finished WO shunt |
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2008-03-26, 02:55 | Link #22582 | |
~ I Do ~
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Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: In the XV-8A Spartan "00"
Age: 38
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Now that is just made of WIN and AWESOME! Dere-Keroko FTW, but Yuuno's the key in this piece. And I feel sorry for Jun for being missing in action till now... Eto... I wanted to do that for UBW KhaxKeroko, since Keroko loves tech and all, Kha's mode of attack would be through there since he has access to an armory of Belka-pattern Bolter devices...
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Last edited by Kha; 2008-03-26 at 03:23. |
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2008-03-26, 04:03 | Link #22583 | ||||||
Truth Martyr
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Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Doing Anzu's paperwork.
Age: 38
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Posting on the run, cannot respond in full, will respond fully tomorrow if possible, posting using unfamillair comp and keyboard, laptop gone and probably will never see it again.
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(Tangent: Funny, you seem to have stopped mentioning Hayate bringing Earth zietgeist to teh TSAB. Any raeson why?) Quote:
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Besides, you're assuming that your couch potato Captain isn't willing to listen and take into consideration the needs of the mages, which does not jive with an example of, oh, say, General Tommy Franks, CINC CENTCOM, an artilleryman, ordering infantry and armor into Iraq, or special forces into Afghanistan. Franz was an artilleryman by trade and yet he understood the differing approaches needed for both theaters. Likewise General Anthony Zinni, his predecessor, or Army Chief of Staff Eric Shinseki who was an infantryman by trade and training... and yet commanded the 1st Cavalry Division. Quote:
On shore tours: To take my RN Captain friend as an example, he started out as a communications officer, and when he finally got command, it was in charge of an ASW frigate - after a period of 20-odd years. This was in between shore tours (in fact he retired from a shore tour at a NATO billet). The shore tours that the US subjects its officers to are intended to make them well-rounded in various aspects of the military life, such as paperwork, social skills - joint service billets, in particular, are intended to function as places where officers from the different services meet and share ideas and get a feel for how the other side lives. These shore tours are typically up to a year, no more, and they return to sea. Quote:
Why? Because he's no longer a naval aviator. He may wear a pilot's wings, but his job is to manage and fight his carrier - that means evasive action, battlefield management, optimum positioning of the ship for flight ops, making sure that everything's running smoothly. When the shit hits the fan, that carrier Captain is more needed to run his ship than as another pilot. In fact, it's not his job to manage the air wing at all, just to run the ship. Running the air wing is the Commander Air Group. It is the CAG who does the management of the fighters, tankers, and such. Thus in this instance we can have a captain who only concerns himself with the ship, while the senior mage onboard, filling the CAG role, organises things. The captain may order the air wing into battle, but it is the CAG who commands the mages in combat.
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2008-03-26, 05:19 | Link #22584 | |||||||
Love Hina?
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Kangaroos live in my backyard =P
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Going to get to the longer posts a bit later.. Busy busy busy
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2008-03-26, 05:40 | Link #22585 | ||
Secret Society BLANKET
Graphic Designer
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: 3 times the passion of normal flamenco
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Yuuno pawns Keroko's heart for 500 gold Yuuno is PIMPING
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2008-03-26, 06:49 | Link #22586 | ||
*facepalm.jpg*
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Male or not, Nanoha is still and always is the White Demon. Also... [vader] The boyband is strong within this one. [/vader] *runs* ============== Quote:
Yuuno finally shows the world he's still DA' MAN!!!! |
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2008-03-26, 07:44 | Link #22587 | |||||||||||
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
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In any case, artillery, infantry and cavalry are still part of the three "combat branches" of the US Army. Thanks to the combined arms dialectic, they should have very similar zeitgeists and worldview. An example where it doesn't go so well is when Admiral Woodward, a submariner, took command of the Falklands liberation fleet. Because he doesn't know much about aviation, he basically gave it up to Hermes to control. While the overall results were satisfactory (they won, after all), it might have gone better. At that time, the Invincible people were making their Harrier's avionics sing, while the Hermes people were not. But Hermes was flag, and Woodward had allowed Hermes ops staff to control the air battle, so the plans and instructions were written assuming the avionics on all the planes don't work reliably, and all of them were given the Authority Stamp of the admiral. Had Woodward been an aviator, he would probably have handled the air battle more personally and might have had a more balanced assessment of the avionics than Hermes staff (which understandably favored their own aircrew's version), thus leading to different decisions. And he'll have retained control. Instead, he lost it. One of the more practical effects, was the loss of Sheffield. Apparently, Hermes called a CAP off, under the Authority of the Flag, to conduct a visual search for surface ships. The pilots obeyed (since they were Invincible's, they wondered why they didn't just turn on the radar and make a sweep) - some Argie planes slipped through the gap and that was that... This is the danger when a commander isn't knowledgable. Lacking confidence in his own ability to lead due to his lack of knowledge, he delegates the parts where he's weak to others, and is unable to guide his less experienced staff with his own experience, or to make an intelligent decision between advisors that may be telling him different stories. Of course, a commander cannot be really knowledgable in every field, and so he has to delegate something to his staff and hope they are proficient. However, one wonders about the wisdom of necessitating the delegation of the most important field. Quote:
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And you'll notice that despite the fact that his job turned shipborne, they still insist on the Captain being a naval aviator, to ensure he is indeed knowledgable about the primary mission - which is of course, planes. |
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2008-03-26, 08:27 | Link #22588 | |||||||||||||
Truth Martyr
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Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Doing Anzu's paperwork.
Age: 38
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Actually, a better analogy, now that I think of it, would be of a ship captain ordering the onboard Marine detachment to go and do stuff. The ship captain is not a Marine, would have at the most cursory understanding of VBSS and other elements of shipboard Marine det skillsets, and yet the Marine Lieutenant leading the det would follow orders. Another example would be 24th MEU(SOC)'s rescue of USAF Captain Scott O'Grady in Bosnia. Had the Kearsarge's CO decided that it was too dangerous to risk a rescue attempt, 24th MEU(SOC) would have to stand down (ultimately the decision was made much, much higher up the chain than either 24th MEU(SOC)'s CO or Kearsarge's Captain). Quote:
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...right, that's not gonna happen ever. Quote:
Again, on further thought, I think an analogy that would work better would be as the mages being Marines and the ship being whatever patrol ship is hauling Marines around, putting out fires. They then have a delineation of responsiblity/authority: off the ship, on-mission, the Marines listen to their CO; back from the mission, and on the ship, awaiting go orders, the Marine CO listens to the ship Captain. We even see this in fiction: in the Halo novel, ODST Marine Major DaSilva has no choice but to obey orders from Captain Keyes despite the fact that Keyes is a naval officer and DaSilva has more experience in this matter - Keyes overrules him and he has to obey. Also, something that occured to me: Ark, regarding your complaints of the WO shunt being a way to push mages aside and make them unhappy with no career prospects & suchs... I point you at the SEAL community. Enlisted SEALs can, if they're good enough, stay SEALs for life. But SEAL officers? Their prospects are fairly limited. They can't transfer to the surface fleet, and field-grade SEAL officer billets are limited (SEAL Teams are commanded by Lieutenant Commanders, SEAL Team Six is the only SEAL team that allows a Captain to lead it - then again it IS the Navy's answer to Delta Force, and in the 60-year history of the UDTs and SEALs there has been only ONE SEAL 4-star. The head honcho SEAL is, IIRC, only a 2-star). Options outside active duty are essentially staff jobs. That said the reason the SEALs aren't hemmoraghing officers is because it takes so long to train new SEAL officers so they slow down the droppings of officers and retirements - plus many in the SEAL community are all motivated with the GWOT. *rolls eyes* We sidestep this all in the OFM fics by making it very clear that the Aus'ruf's skipper takes his marching orders from Erick, and in how the OFM are rather Marine-like at times. (Along with a healthy mix of SEAL and Delta and ONI.) Then again, Erick is an infantryman, and infantry officers are expected to lead from the front...
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Last edited by Wild Goose; 2008-03-26 at 08:42. |
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2008-03-26, 08:37 | Link #22589 | ||
~ I Do ~
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Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: In the XV-8A Spartan "00"
Age: 38
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Okay, maybe I made Nanoha more GAR than before, but it's just because of the higher testosterone level. Quote:
And I believe you guys are catching the Tsukasa Domyouji vibes that I've implanted a little in Nanoha? Once the images appear, I'll bend the rest of the female Aces over! ... ...wait that didn't sound right.
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Last edited by Kha; 2008-03-26 at 08:58. |
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2008-03-26, 10:42 | Link #22590 | |||||||
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
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2) How pleased was DaSilva? Also, I'll presume that unlike a TSAB ship, a Halo patrol vessel has armament that is regularly employed, and thus the marine unit is but one of the several means at Captain Keyes' disposal. In that case, subordinating the Marine detachment under the ship Captain is appropriate, similar to how it would be done on a real destroyer with such a detachment. Quote:
Another will be the US warrant officer branch in general. Some people actually don't have ambitions in command and such a path is perfect for them to begin with. However, what Tk3997 is suggesting is that in the name of the TSAB, all elite mages are to be forced (or at least pressured) down the shunt and barred from other roads. They won't be allowed to be commanders or planners because having elite mages in such roles is a waste - they all have to be in the field. So, imagine the SEAL community, only that there are no officers. Everyone higher up is drawn from elsewhere. Still fun? Quote:
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2008-03-26, 10:47 | Link #22591 |
Residential Nutcase
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Outer Cadia
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OI!!!! Wrong thread you guys. Move the Military discussion to the Military, Authority & Decisions In MSLN series Thread. All this talk doesn't belong here.
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2008-03-26, 11:25 | Link #22592 | ||||||||||||||
Adeptus Animus
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Join Date: Jan 2007
Age: 36
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Still waiting. :3 Quote:
MOAR! Quote:
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That.... that.... that.... THAT WAS AWESOME! If I recall... this is the first Yuunoko piece up untill now. Gotta get off my lazy butt and write.... Anxiously awaiting the chapter. :3:3:3 No problems here. |
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2008-03-26, 12:51 | Link #22593 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Gaf's Room
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It's been awhile. Almost feels strange to be posting profiles here again.
Starting off with the expanded Jack profiles is Jac. Spoiler for Jack of Spades:
Next up, Jag. Spoiler for Jack of Hearts:
Last profile. Revised and toned down to better fit what I think is a more accurate profile. P.S: I'm using the image as a visual reference only. It is in no way a port of the person howsoever. Spoiler for The Black Fist:
Well that took quite long. --- Next batch of profiles will be the next two Jacks, Jec and Jat. And the reworked profile of Katrina. Also, rewriting the Signum/Lutecia piece sometime for a different approach..perhaps. Looks like tough work ahead, seeing as I'm doing so many of the girls at one go.. ...
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Last edited by Tormenk; 2008-03-29 at 04:05. |
2008-03-26, 15:57 | Link #22595 | |||||
NERV Personnel
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Ryotaro: Yup. She's got a kind heart
Oh boy... Quote:
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Epic BLUECHESSIUM is EPIC!! Great story there, TK! It was definitely worth all the wait. Quote:
Wh-what is this?! Yuunoko? HERE? DO WANT Quote:
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KKKKKKKKHHHHHHHHHHHHHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!! !! Yes...never underestimate the power of the internet. And I wonder who ever could have been the one to make such a little post? KITAAAA!!!! Oh man...poor, poor Farukon . I wonder if he did something to piss Hayate off to deserve all of this . Glad to finally see the Belkarangers in action, though. Gonna be interesting to see Hammer and the Rangers on the upcoming mission. And poor Vivio...she probably has to put up with Syn's ranting about how stupid the rangers are at night |
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2008-03-26, 16:07 | Link #22596 |
Adeptus Animus
Author
Join Date: Jan 2007
Age: 36
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"Less Syn hairpulling then I expected, but we got lots of laughs in return, so it's cool. Red Falcon, hehehe.
By the way, I did-" "Keroko-kun! Keroko-kun!" "Wha? Keroko-tan?" What looked like a tiny Rein sized version of Keroko-chan flew into the room at great speed. As soon as her eyes found Keroko-kun she started pulling on his shirt. "Come on! Come on! Kane-san called for us! We need to go!" "Wait, Keroko-tan calm down, can't you just go by yourself as usual?" "No way! Kane-san send me to get you personally, it's really really big! Come on, come on!" Pulling Keroko-kun from his seat, the tiny girl proceeded to push him towards the door. "Wai- Keroko-tan, stop pushing!" "Hayaku! Hayaku!" As Keroko-kun was forcibly retrieved to fullfill his duties as a member of Kane's inner circle, a short silence fell over the room, before being broken by the sound of roaring engines and the cries of many. Keroko-kun stood on the high spot of a Raider Buggy, Keroko-tan on his shoulder. He stared at his subordinates, seated on Attack Bikes or in tanks or Reckoners, who had come to pick up their commander. He raised his fist in the air, and with a deafening roar the vehicles surged forward, and a massive cry roared througout the street. KANE LIVES! Yes I picked up Kane's Wrath today, yes it is awesome, yes Keroko-tan is enjoying it immensely as well. Last edited by Keroko; 2008-03-26 at 18:18. |
2008-03-26, 16:21 | Link #22597 | |
NERV Personnel
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*checks his new message* "I-it's time!" He runs to his basement and pulls his body armor, helmet, and rifle from the hidden wall compartment. A push of a concealed button reveals a Recon Bike cleaned and fueled. A short ride later, the roar of the bike's engine is drowned out by the sound of the other bikes, buggies, and tanks. The procession of vehicles slowed to a stop to allow the newcomer, his commander ranks glistening in the sun, transfer to his position on the Scorpion tank. With the loud roar of dozens of engines, the procession...the army drove on to meet their brothers in arms. "Sir!" called out the driver below, "ETA to rendezvous with Deathwing... 20 minutes." He raised a fist to the sky to proclaim the glorious news: PEACE THROUGH POWER!!! THE MESSIAH LIVES!!!! Awaits for his pre-order to be delivered to day upon returning home from work...mwahahaha.... |
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2008-03-26, 16:36 | Link #22599 |
Loveable Jerk
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Kane's Wrath the C&C Ex-Pack is dropping this week.
Of course I fight for the side of justice! TK grabs a long trench coat, a pair of heavy boots, and a beret from his closet and heads outside to where the Steel Talon's Battalion is already forming up. ascending a later he takes his position in the open Copula of of a MARV adjusting his cap slightly before waving his armored battalion froward. "Alright Boys we've got some Religious Fanatics to smack some sense into one hyper velocity rail gun slug at a time so let's get rolling!"A sound like rolling thunder echoes across the land as dozens of 60 ton walkers fall into formation behind the mammoth armored vehicle at the head of the formation.
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Last edited by Tk3997; 2008-03-26 at 16:50. |
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