AnimeSuki Forums

Zero Hurricane · 2012-01-10, 07:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Akiyoshi

Assuming she's not the only agent allowed to do that considering how vast the TSAB is ....why they didn't called some of those special agents to be part of Section Six? certainly they at least have a slightly better fighting chance against an Eclipse Driver or at least Eclipse carriers. Or by that matter? Why they don't trained the mages of S6 in the use of hybrid devices like Silver Dagger and equpped them with some of those? If Signum is to be believed they were on the Huckebein's tail for quite some time by the start of the season.

I don't know. But the only thing I know is that the Bureau itself too soft to revoke a person's life. In fact they are too pacifist to give the death penalty for any high profile criminal (save for Jail's case).

If this happens, what can the Bureau do? There is no other way than to allow them to use the deadly force to execute the criminal itself, even with death punishment.

Keroko · 2012-01-10, 07:36

Dunno about the no death penalty being 'too pacifistic.' There's a lot of countries in this world that abandoned the death penalty. And it did come in handy for SSX to still have him around.

Zero Hurricane · 2012-01-10, 07:50

What I mean is, the Bureau itself, because their pacifistic nature, they themselves don't know how to give severe punishment for heavy criminal itself.

Compare with the legal system in the real world. They can only provide relief for the defendants in certain cases, but they may provides penalties for those found to be doing some specific crimes. If the Bureau itself can not implement this kind of thing, I can only say that the Bureau had failed in his duty.

rxrx · 2012-01-10, 07:52

I thought the TSAB only spare this people in return of their assistance. You know that they are contsantly understuff so it is good to have people work for you. All you need is some programs to make them think your way and then it is perfect.

Zero Hurricane · 2012-01-10, 08:08

It must be admitted, which became a trend in Nanoha series is: every anti-villain in each series, after they are forgiven, they will join with the hero. When they joining the Bureau, the Bureau itself offering them some key positions.

The problem is, in Force, the Bureau face an enemy much more dangerous than ever. The Bureau know that the Huckebeins have deep problems, but they themselves are rather stubborn to show their pain. No matter in any way, either kinship or coercion, did not shake them to maintain their nature. If they don't immediately give a reason why they do things like that, I must say that they have been damaged in conscience.

rxrx · 2012-01-10, 08:12

They are. If not, how do you think they adjust to the fact that they have to kill to survive?
I think they all have bad experiences with the TSAB and though there are good and bad people in an organization, they mostly met with the bad ones and thus makes them distrust the TSAB.

Also, I have a feel that some dirty parts of the TSAB might be funding the development of the Dividers and the virus to eventually have powerful weapons for them to use.

Keroko · 2012-01-10, 08:12

What you said just now is the exact reason why Force interests me so much. In every other series, all if not the majority of the bad guys were simply misunderstood. Even most of the numbers only tagged along because it was the only life they knew, and jumped ship when they got the chance.

The Hucks on the other hand, don't give a damn about the TSAB or whatever redemption they offer. They've grown to like their lives and are making the best of it.

The puzzle of how the cast is going to "save" the Hucks is what interests me.

rxrx · 2012-01-10, 08:17

Not just the Hucks but Touma as well. Let's say that the virus is uncurable, then what?
Will the TSAB decide to kill them all off or 'seal' them like what Graham was planning to do to Hayate? For the Hucks fine but if they do that to Touma then it is where the story will be fun.

Meltyred · 2012-01-10, 08:26

Maybe the Zero divider will be the key to all that, and then to cure them, Touma has to use Zero divide and kill everything related to the virus and that all dividers and reactors will be destroyed and Touma has a dilemma between curing the huckbeins and himself or being with Lily.
But of course this will never happen right?
Cause people will be whining about how someone dies.

Zero Hurricane · 2012-01-10, 08:31

Because the only way to stop the prolonged problem is to destroy the source of the problem itself. Most likely, there are three source of problem itself: Hucks, Vandin, and Lily itself.

In the Lily's case, if Force itself really follow the A's path, there is possibility that she will sacrifice her own life, so no one will suffer, or Thoma himself perform a euthanasia to her.

Or maybe Thoma and Lily will have to make the ultimate sacrifice.

rxrx · 2012-01-10, 08:35

I think it will end with Touma and Lily dead as I don't see the guy willingly sacrifice her for anything. Even in the manga, he have said that he would do anything to protect her. So if she wants to die, so will he to go out together.

Or the ultimate ending where the Zero Divider cures all but Touma only and he has to walk the earth with Lily to avoid being capture. A downer ending will be the TSAB decides to 'seal' them while assuring the others he would remain safe while they play with his genetics and Lily's to create another form of virus. The End?

Zero Hurricane · 2012-01-10, 08:44

Thoma, despite his status as Poisonous Person, she is a nice boy, even too nice to the extent that he had "unstable friendly nature". If he wants to be ordinary human, then the curse in his body should be abolished once and for all.

For Lily, if she doesn't want to see innocent casualties because of her, then she should be sacrificed for good. Or if she wants to be a ordinary human, a curse inside her must also be eliminated.

rxrx · 2012-01-10, 09:00

Yeah. So far, I can only see things end with either Touma or Lily or the both dead to resolve the Eclipse Virus crisis eventually.

Akiyoshi · 2012-01-10, 12:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by rxrx

They are. If not, how do you think they adjust to the fact that they have to kill to survive?
I think they all have bad experiences with the TSAB and though there are good and bad people in an organization, they mostly met with the bad ones and thus makes them distrust the TSAB.

I don't think the Huckebein are distrustfull of the TSAB because of fear, they didn't even care about retribution from them. I feel it's more like they consider the TSAB too incompetent or uncapable of helping them so they decided to not bother with their offers and search solution of their problems by themselves. They also seem to be firmly planted on this mind setting, just see how usually calm and smooth talking Fortis reacted when his ideals of survival were challenged by Tohma.

They apparently put all their faith on Curren as their savior, and so far Curren seems to be extremely efficient in achieving her goals and making her plans work so, in their eyes, she's much more capable than the TSAB in saving them, the fact that she also offers them a home, a family to stay with it's also a pretty attractive offer. Again, look at their faces when Curren appeared and skewered Hayate, they reminded me off impressed people who look at Superman entering the scene xD!

Curren have all beauty, brains and brawns. And knows how to cash on her charisma to attract "lost kids". The fact that Tohma can see her in a sympathetic light even after all has happened and the fact he's now under the care of his other family says tons about that. Like a combination of a Mafia-boss and a gang leader(excells at both, bussiness and battles).

Quote:

Originally Posted by rxrx

Also, I have a feel that some dirty parts of the TSAB might be funding the development of the Dividers and the virus to eventually have powerful weapons for them to use.

Don't give too much credit to the TSAB xDU If anything, that has more to do with the apparently shady connections between Caledfwich Techniques and Vandin Corp. the TSAB is the victim here, those two are creating the situations and the products to force the TSAB to buy new equipement and, in the future, stablish them as their main suppliers of armament.

Justin_Brett · 2012-01-10, 14:51

And also the power to make people reading the story worship her even though she's done nothing impressive beyond typical jobbing BS.

LostSome · 2012-01-10, 17:46

So there is a death flag on Lily now ?
Well, now that Thoma has no issues with seeing her naked... That`s a giant flag !

rxrx · 2012-01-10, 19:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Justin_Brett

And also the power to make people reading the story worship her even though she's done nothing impressive beyond typical jobbing BS.

Hayate only did something useful in A's by restoring the Book of Darkness back to Book of Night Sky. Other than that, she is not a very competent commander and was stabbed in the back. Curren might not be as impressive as you say, but since Hayate is being played in her hands so far, I wonder who is better?

Justin_Brett · 2012-01-10, 19:37

I don't doubt the story wants you to think Curren is way better, but again, it didn't really do that with competence from her, just a lack of it from Hayate.

rxrx · 2012-01-10, 19:41

True, a little fustrating that the writers decide to put Hayate in a commanding position yet she lacks so much. Maybe it is the lack of experience that's why she is a victim of the loophole trap that Curren set on her. Also, I hope that some of the contents of the PSP game will not be included, as if it does, Hayate will not only be a commader that is lacking, but also a hypocrite as she will be using Touma, Lily and Isis as punching bag as she 'punish' them for breaking equipments while she have been doing that all the time before getting Rein II.

Akiyoshi · 2012-01-10, 19:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by rxrx

True, a little fustrating that the writers decide to put Hayate in a commanding position yet she lacks so much. Maybe it is the lack of experience that's why she is a victim of the loophole trap that Curren set on her.

Problem is that is supossed that by this point Hayate already have years of experience on the matter(nearly a decade), enough to be recognized by other people(Curren included). So, the Nanohaverse want us to believe Hayate is a capable commander as also to buy that Curren is making a great accomplishment in outsmarting her.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sheba

Stormbringer. That motherfcker EATS THE SOUL of those she hit, even from a mere scratch. And being eaten by Stormbringer IS getting subject to a fate worse than death.

By this point we can just put whatever cool sword we like on Signum's hands xD!

Signum holding the Sword of Omens.

HO!

2012-01-10, 07:50	Link #5223
Zero Hurricane I'm here for the reason.. Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Surabaya, East Java, Indonesia Age: 31	What I mean is, the Bureau itself, because their pacifistic nature, they themselves don't know how to give severe punishment for heavy criminal itself. Compare with the legal system in the real world. They can only provide relief for the defendants in certain cases, but they may provides penalties for those found to be doing some specific crimes. If the Bureau itself can not implement this kind of thing, I can only say that the Bureau had failed in his duty. __________________ "Use of deadly force is authorized"

2012-01-10, 08:08	Link #5225
Zero Hurricane I'm here for the reason.. Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Surabaya, East Java, Indonesia Age: 31	It must be admitted, which became a trend in Nanoha series is: every anti-villain in each series, after they are forgiven, they will join with the hero. When they joining the Bureau, the Bureau itself offering them some key positions. The problem is, in Force, the Bureau face an enemy much more dangerous than ever. The Bureau know that the Huckebeins have deep problems, but they themselves are rather stubborn to show their pain. No matter in any way, either kinship or coercion, did not shake them to maintain their nature. If they don't immediately give a reason why they do things like that, I must say that they have been damaged in conscience. __________________ "Use of deadly force is authorized"

2012-01-10, 08:31	Link #5230
Zero Hurricane I'm here for the reason.. Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Surabaya, East Java, Indonesia Age: 31	Because the only way to stop the prolonged problem is to destroy the source of the problem itself. Most likely, there are three source of problem itself: Hucks, Vandin, and Lily itself. In the Lily's case, if Force itself really follow the A's path, there is possibility that she will sacrifice her own life, so no one will suffer, or Thoma himself perform a euthanasia to her. Or maybe Thoma and Lily will have to make the ultimate sacrifice. __________________ "Use of deadly force is authorized"

2012-01-10, 08:44	Link #5232
Zero Hurricane I'm here for the reason.. Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Surabaya, East Java, Indonesia Age: 31	Thoma, despite his status as Poisonous Person, she is a nice boy, even too nice to the extent that he had "unstable friendly nature". If he wants to be ordinary human, then the curse in his body should be abolished once and for all. For Lily, if she doesn't want to see innocent casualties because of her, then she should be sacrificed for good. Or if she wants to be a ordinary human, a curse inside her must also be eliminated. __________________ "Use of deadly force is authorized"

2012-01-10, 17:46	Link #5236
LostSome Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Canada	So there is a death flag on Lily now ? Well, now that Thoma has no issues with seeing her naked... That`s a giant flag ! __________________ Nyohohohoho ! It`s the law of the universe that only wizards die as virgins. You can`t let yourself die as a virgin, right ? -Old geezer.

2012-01-10, 07:36	Link #5222
Keroko Adeptus Animus Author Join Date: Jan 2007 Age: 36	Dunno about the no death penalty being 'too pacifistic.' There's a lot of countries in this world that abandoned the death penalty. And it did come in handy for SSX to still have him around.

2012-01-10, 07:52	Link #5224
rxrx Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2011	I thought the TSAB only spare this people in return of their assistance. You know that they are contsantly understuff so it is good to have people work for you. All you need is some programs to make them think your way and then it is perfect.

2012-01-10, 08:12	Link #5226
rxrx Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2011	They are. If not, how do you think they adjust to the fact that they have to kill to survive? I think they all have bad experiences with the TSAB and though there are good and bad people in an organization, they mostly met with the bad ones and thus makes them distrust the TSAB. Also, I have a feel that some dirty parts of the TSAB might be funding the development of the Dividers and the virus to eventually have powerful weapons for them to use.

2012-01-10, 08:12	Link #5227
Keroko Adeptus Animus Author Join Date: Jan 2007 Age: 36	What you said just now is the exact reason why Force interests me so much. In every other series, all if not the majority of the bad guys were simply misunderstood. Even most of the numbers only tagged along because it was the only life they knew, and jumped ship when they got the chance. The Hucks on the other hand, don't give a damn about the TSAB or whatever redemption they offer. They've grown to like their lives and are making the best of it. The puzzle of how the cast is going to "save" the Hucks is what interests me.

2012-01-10, 08:17	Link #5228
rxrx Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2011	Not just the Hucks but Touma as well. Let's say that the virus is uncurable, then what? Will the TSAB decide to kill them all off or 'seal' them like what Graham was planning to do to Hayate? For the Hucks fine but if they do that to Touma then it is where the story will be fun.

2012-01-10, 08:26	Link #5229
Meltyred Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2011	Maybe the Zero divider will be the key to all that, and then to cure them, Touma has to use Zero divide and kill everything related to the virus and that all dividers and reactors will be destroyed and Touma has a dilemma between curing the huckbeins and himself or being with Lily. But of course this will never happen right? Cause people will be whining about how someone dies.

2012-01-10, 08:35	Link #5231
rxrx Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2011	I think it will end with Touma and Lily dead as I don't see the guy willingly sacrifice her for anything. Even in the manga, he have said that he would do anything to protect her. So if she wants to die, so will he to go out together. Or the ultimate ending where the Zero Divider cures all but Touma only and he has to walk the earth with Lily to avoid being capture. A downer ending will be the TSAB decides to 'seal' them while assuring the others he would remain safe while they play with his genetics and Lily's to create another form of virus. The End?

2012-01-10, 09:00	Link #5233
rxrx Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2011	Yeah. So far, I can only see things end with either Touma or Lily or the both dead to resolve the Eclipse Virus crisis eventually.

2012-01-10, 14:51	Link #5235
Justin_Brett Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Canada, Sault Ste. Marie	And also the power to make people reading the story worship her even though she's done nothing impressive beyond typical jobbing BS.

2012-01-10, 19:37	Link #5238
Justin_Brett Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Canada, Sault Ste. Marie	I don't doubt the story wants you to think Curren is way better, but again, it didn't really do that with competence from her, just a lack of it from Hayate.

2012-01-10, 19:41	Link #5239
rxrx Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2011	True, a little fustrating that the writers decide to put Hayate in a commanding position yet she lacks so much. Maybe it is the lack of experience that's why she is a victim of the loophole trap that Curren set on her. Also, I hope that some of the contents of the PSP game will not be included, as if it does, Hayate will not only be a commader that is lacking, but also a hypocrite as she will be using Touma, Lily and Isis as punching bag as she 'punish' them for breaking equipments while she have been doing that all the time before getting Rein II.