Byakugan, Sharingan & Rinnengan

[Sharfan]

I beleive the Byakugan can only track chakra flow in relation throughout the body. The Sharingan gets a general sense of chakra flow throughout the body, but also in relation to the surrounding area, allowing the sharingan user to track movement. The Byakugan is specialized, but the Sharingan is much more generalized.

Spoiler for Manga:

Plus, EMS has to kick massive butt. Or else, the upcoming fight between Sasuke and Naruto would be completely one-sided, with Naruto winning without much of a fight. It be really sucky if you ask me.

So, I'm all for the Sharingan.

[tkdtiger]

Originally Posted by Neji112

I was re-reading chapter 230 with Sasuke vs. Naruto. When Sasuke activates his 3rd Tomoe and gains/heightens the ability to predict movements it's chakra based. He says that he can see the chakra as it enters Naruto's body creating an image of sort allowing him to predict Naruto's movement.

In theory if that's the case wouldn't the Byakugan be able to do something similar. It can see the flow of chakra and the gentle fist alone would require you to track charka within a moving body pretty accurately.

Well there have been arguments on an earlier chapter when it talks about the byakugan's perception. People still argue this point too if what was said had a little more meaning. Although, I doubt it would be the same thing if it were the case. Besides the byakugan can already see all around, which means it can see everything so being able to predict movements like the sharingan is kind of pointless not to mention it can see attacks coming from a distance so again it has no reason to have that extra predictability, but than again if it had a differnt kind of perception I think that would be cool

[Rurik]

Regarding Zabusa technique, as Hunter mentioned, it was that the Mist was so tick, that the visibility was basically brought down to 0, at this point neither Zabuza nor Kakashi could see anything at all, Zabuza had the advantage given he was specialize in killing trough this condition..

Originally Posted by tkdtiger

Well there have been arguments on an earlier chapter when it talks about the byakugan's perception. People still argue this point too if what was said had a little more meaning. Although, I doubt it would be the same thing if it were the case. Besides the byakugan can already see all around, which means it can see everything so being able to predict movements like the sharingan is kind of pointless not to mention it can see attacks coming from a distance so again it has no reason to have that extra predictability, but than again if it had a differnt kind of perception I think that would be cool

That perception or prediction would be dependant totally on the Ninjas abbility and not the eye itself. just like for example any Ninja could deflect a flying shuriken with a Kunai, good reflexes.

[tkdtiger]

Originally Posted by Rurik

Regarding Zabusa technique, as Hunter mentioned, it was that the Mist was so tick, that the visibility was basically brought down to 0, at this point neither Zabuza nor Kakashi could see anything at all, Zabuza had the advantage given he was specialize in killing trough this condition..



That perception or prediction would be dependant totally on the Ninjas abbility and not the eye itself. just like for example any Ninja could deflect a flying shuriken with a Kunai, good reflexes.

I agree, but even the sharingan's predictablity has the flaw that it doesn't predict attacks coming from behind. The byakugan though can see all around itself and from a fair distance from their body so this in itself should give the byakugan the ability to dodge most attacks coming at them from a distance. Both technically are skill based. Sharingan allows it to dodge attacks, but at the same time if the attack is really fast and the person hasn't trained their body to move that fast than it can't be dodged.

[Rurik]

Originally Posted by tkdtiger

I agree, but even the sharingan's predictablity has the flaw that it doesn't predict attacks coming from behind. The byakugan though can see all around itself and from a fair distance from their body so this in itself should give the byakugan the ability to dodge most attacks coming at them from a distance. Both technically are skill based. Sharingan allows it to dodge attacks, but at the same time if the attack is really fast and the person hasn't trained their body to move that fast than it can't be dodged.

Well, Yeah not denying that, just Look at Neeji vs Kidoumaru as a good example of that. is Just that the Byakugan would not be able to help the person avoid a punch, like the Sharigan does help.

[tkdtiger]

Originally Posted by Rurik

Well, Yeah not denying that, just Look at Neeji vs Kidoumaru as a good example of that. is Just that the Byakugan would not be able to help the person avoid a punch, like the Sharigan does help.

agreed although the byakugan has also been shown to be able to see subtle movements and such one must wonder if he can tell your beginning to throw a punch before actually throwing it.

[Sharfan]

Well, anyone could tell if you're about to throw a punch just by looking at how your body is moving, i.e. seeing the opponent's balance shift to left leg when about to kick. It most definitely relies on individual skill. And, personally, I don't see why a Byakugan can't be used to predict movement.

[Sabaku Kyu]

Originally Posted by Sharfan

Well, anyone could tell if you're about to throw a punch just by looking at how your body is moving, i.e. seeing the opponent's balance shift to left leg when about to kick. It most definitely relies on individual skill. And, personally, I don't see why a Byakugan can't be used to predict movement.

A Byakugan user(or any fighter for that matter) with a enough skill and practice could learn to predict movements to a degree. But it's not their Byakugan that allows them to do that, Byakugan only allows them to see the attacks coming from any direction, their skill allows them to predict movements.

Sharingan gives the ability to see and predict movements immediately without practice or experience. How well they react is a matter of reflexes like Rurik said. However, it's not simply seeing chakra and movements that gives the ability, but the way Sharingan can instantly interpret what it sees.

[tkdtiger]

Originally Posted by Sharfan

Well, anyone could tell if you're about to throw a punch just by looking at how your body is moving, i.e. seeing the opponent's balance shift to left leg when about to kick. It most definitely relies on individual skill. And, personally, I don't see why a Byakugan can't be used to predict movement.

yeah but you'd expect the byakugan would see the subtle movements that aren't so clear such as the twitch of a muscle as it tenses...and even chakra build up...

[CuXe]

I am in favor of Byakugan but Sharingan wins because they gave kyubi-like powers to it....

[Mr.Amazing]

Originally Posted by Sabaku Kyu

A Byakugan user(or any fighter for that matter) with a enough skill and practice could learn to predict movements to a degree. But it's not their Byakugan that allows them to do that, Byakugan only allows them to see the attacks coming from any direction, their skill allows them to predict movements.

Sharingan gives the ability to see and predict movements immediately without practice or experience. How well they react is a matter of reflexes like Rurik said. However, it's not simply seeing chakra and movements that gives the ability, but the way Sharingan can instantly interpret what it sees.

I'm an anime only viewer, and from what I've seen the sharigan has been made so overpowered for Sasuke and Itachi, and whatever Madara may be able to use, that the byakugan just no longer compares. Full visibilty just can't compete against unquenchable fire, gigantic suits of armor, amazing genjutsu, and predictability of future attacks. The byakugan is cool, and hard to knock, they just made the sharingan better, especially here in part 2 . I love the idea of the byakugan though.

[Sharfan]

Originally Posted by Sabaku Kyu

A Byakugan user(or any fighter for that matter) with a enough skill and practice could learn to predict movements to a degree. But it's not their Byakugan that allows them to do that, Byakugan only allows them to see the attacks coming from any direction, their skill allows them to predict movements.

Sharingan gives the ability to see and predict movements immediately without practice or experience. How well they react is a matter of reflexes like Rurik said. However, it's not simply seeing chakra and movements that gives the ability, but the way Sharingan can instantly interpret what it sees.

Yeah, I see what you're saying. The Sharingan isn't simply the eye, but it also extends into the brain. Not only can you predict the movement, but you can predict the movement at a much greater speed. And, you don't even have to train: you just can automatically predict. I wish Kishi would have included the byakugan a little more. It should have a suped-up form like the Sharingan.

[Mr.Amazing]

This is slightly off topic, but does anyone ever feel like the sharingan is like going super-saiyan?
super saiyan is the first form, then SS-2 when the second tomoe forms, then SS-3 with the third tomoe. THen the MS is super saiyan 4. I'm just sayin.

[Stearsle]

Will the Sharingan gives you the ablility to either summon giant skeletons with doom swords, burn people with an neverending fire of doom or summon a blackhole at any point in time by blinking. Then again the byakugan does give you 360 degree vision.

[Neji112]

Originally Posted by Sabaku Kyu

A Byakugan user(or any fighter for that matter) with a enough skill and practice could learn to predict movements to a degree. But it's not their Byakugan that allows them to do that, Byakugan only allows them to see the attacks coming from any direction, their skill allows them to predict movements.

Sharingan gives the ability to see and predict movements immediately without practice or experience. How well they react is a matter of reflexes like Rurik said. However, it's not simply seeing chakra and movements that gives the ability, but the way Sharingan can instantly interpret what it sees.

I slightly disagree with the statement. The Byakugan grants not only 360 degrees of vision but a clarity of Chakra flow. The Byakugan certainly gives a user an immediate understanding of what goes on within it's sphere especially when chakra is involved. It's the reason why in the Kidomaru fight Neji was able to knock away the kunais with his 64 hit combo.

While the argument can be made the Byakugan's power is based more in the present than the Sharigan, the results would be very similar. A 3 tomoe Sharingan creates a pre-image of what an opponent movement about to be based on chakra flow. It's a prediction yes but it's based on the whats happening. It's not like a Sharigan user would know I'm about to punch him until I begin the actual motions. The action has to already begun to have taken place and the Sharigan would automatically interpret what direction an attack is going. The Byakugan wouldn't have the instant interpretation at the level of a pre-image but the user would simply be aware that you're about to punch, even up to the point when you're gathering energy to attack and would be able to track movement because it's all visible to them within the radius.

[Hunter]

The Byakugan doesn't give its user any understanding of what goes on, that's actually what the Sharingan does and why it can break down jutsu and foresight Taijutsu among other things.
The Byakugan "only" provides unadulterated informations of all there is around its user. It can see that someone is gathering chakra in his hand but it can't analyze it and inform its user what jutsu it's about. It could be to make a Chidori, or chakra increased punch, or a Rasengan, or anything really. It can see chakra firing inside a body but it can't provide an analysis of what it means and a prediction of its result.

Badically it's a better scanner but it doesn't possess the "software" to run and understand the informations it sees.

[tkdtiger]

Originally Posted by Neji112

I slightly disagree with the statement. The Byakugan grants not only 360 degrees of vision but a clarity of Chakra flow. The Byakugan certainly gives a user an immediate understanding of what goes on within it's sphere especially when chakra is involved. It's the reason why in the Kidomaru fight Neji was able to knock away the kunais with his 64 hit combo.

While the argument can be made the Byakugan's power is based more in the present than the Sharigan, the results would be very similar. A 3 tomoe Sharingan creates a pre-image of what an opponent movement about to be based on chakra flow. It's a prediction yes but it's based on the whats happening. It's not like a Sharigan user would know I'm about to punch him until I begin the actual motions. The action has to already begun to have taken place and the Sharigan would automatically interpret what direction an attack is going. The Byakugan wouldn't have the instant interpretation at the level of a pre-image but the user would simply be aware that you're about to punch, even up to the point when you're gathering energy to attack and would be able to track movement because it's all visible to them within the radius.

To a degree I can agree with some of your points. The byakugan probable can see things a chakra base attack is about to occur. So in a sense he would predict an attack is coming. I think the best example would be when characters like Neji sees increases in Chakra flow. So yes than at that point he could predict an attack coming, but that's not necessarily the same thing. The Sharingan not only see's the attack. but can pinpoint where the attack is going to land. The byakugan would know an attack is coming, but not where it's going or where the person is going to attack. In other words it's like a goal vs a soccer player. He knows something is coming, but not nec. where it is going to go. Whereas the Sharingan user knows exactly where it's going to go.

Now the Byakugan can not only see chakra, but can even see the differences in chakra of different individuals. It seems chakra and the techniques used could be similar to a finger print

Spoiler:

Ao saw that Danzou was using Shishui (sp?) Sharingan in an attempt to control Mizukage, because he recognized the chakra and had fought Shishui before.

[Mr.Amazing]

Originally Posted by Hunter

The Byakugan doesn't give its user any understanding of what goes on, that's actually what the Sharingan does and why it can break down jutsu and foresight Taijutsu among other things.
The Byakugan "only" provides unadulterated informations of all there is around its user. It can see that someone is gathering chakra in his hand but it can't analyze it and inform its user what jutsu it's about. It could be to make a Chidori, or chakra increased punch, or a Rasengan, or anything really. It can see chakra firing inside a body but it can't provide an analysis of what it means and a prediction of its result.

Badically it's a better scanner but it doesn't possess the "software" to run and understand the informations it sees.

Basically yeah, the Sharingan is an advance byakugan when it comes to identifying chakra attacks. It just seems like they created the byakugan to show how much better the sharingan is.

[Neji112]

Originally Posted by Hunter

The Byakugan doesn't give its user any understanding of what goes on, that's actually what the Sharingan does and why it can break down jutsu and foresight Taijutsu among other things.
The Byakugan "only" provides unadulterated informations of all there is around its user. It can see that someone is gathering chakra in his hand but it can't analyze it and inform its user what jutsu it's about. It could be to make a Chidori, or chakra increased punch, or a Rasengan, or anything really. It can see chakra firing inside a body but it can't provide an analysis of what it means and a prediction of its result.

Badically it's a better scanner but it doesn't possess the "software" to run and understand the informations it sees.

That's a slightly different argument than what I'm making. The understanding I'm referring to is an awareness to whatever is happening within it's range. I'm not claiming that the Byakugan will process then interpret the information for a user in the same way the Sharingan does. But it still provides enough information for the user to anticipate more accurately. What each individual Byakugan user can do with that information will vary as will the amount of information collected but the eye does provide information of what's happening around it to a far greater extent and detail than normal eyes.

As for the punch, rasengan and chidori differentiation... the extent to which the flow in each of the techniques differs or any technique differs would determine the extent of how useful the information is. Whether or not someone can use the information meaningfully is also a another issue.

[bbduece]

The story dictates that the sharingan be over powered to meet the plot demands. Byukugan has since left the main plot line.