[Manga] Chapter 460 Discussion

[Sazelyt]

Originally Posted by Mr. Johnny 5

The thing about his Sharingan was not fully awakened or the reasons why he lost to Killerbee are terrible excuses. Killerbee is simply on higher level which Sasuke could not keep up with. He lost his powers that he gained from Orochimaru (this includes the advanced healing, snakes and cursed seal) but gained new ones (MS) and then to say it wasnt fully awakened while Killerbee could if he wanted kill them all is weird to say.

For a sharingan user, I think it matters a lot whether he can use the full potential of the eye or not. If you would project this argument into what we had seen before, regarding what the current Kakashi would have done during his initial encounter with Deidara, I think you will get an answer of better or much better. Even though the result may not be clear, but we should have gotten a better performance from him. In Sasuke's case, performance improvement may be higher, as he is an original Sharingan-user. Will the eye be enough to compensate for the difference in swordsmanship? Yes I think, because regardless of how good Killerbee is, I don't see a way for him to escape the Amaterasu, especially in his human form. And the reason why Amaterasu wasn't used before is a combination of two, how Sasuke looked at his fight against Killerbee, and how well he adapted to the powers of his eyes.

[james0246]

Well, it is Raikage confronting Sasuke, though the Raikage appears to have lost most of his clothing somehow . And, the shadowy image of Sasuke is quite...weird; it's a nebulous shape that could signify almost anything - mind control, hatred, insanity, etc.

Also, it seems that the Samurai can use chakra. But, it, as we predicted, is directed from their swords.

[Sasuke_Bateman]

Yeah so...Madara could have killed Naruto if he wanted to this chapter

[Sazelyt]

Originally Posted by Sasuke_Bateman

Yeah so...Madara could have killed Naruto if he wanted to this chapter

A good idea, if he had wanted to spend the rest of his life trying to bring Kyuubi back from the world of unknown, death or whatever.

[Im_A_MoP]

Spoiler for mangai>>:

So the raikage just runs up nd snaps zetsu's neck lol steven segal style. O yea, nd sasuke is being controlled by danzou obviously

[darkmaster074]

Originally Posted by lotus_lee

Come on Raikage, teach that emo boy a lesson!

And WTB more Mizukage screentime.

i dont think Raikage can kill sasuke

it so obvious

[Scorpian]

Originally Posted by Mr. Johnny 5

Though if it werent...(only if) for his special teleportation he would've probably been defeated by the 4th aswell. I think the key to defeat that guy lies in defeating or disabling his teleportation.

...Can you post up some reasoning behind that? Especially considering the fact that we know next to nothing about either of them? Because, when Minato described Madara, he spoke as if he were on a different level all together. His tone didn't suggest that it was just one move keeping Madara ahead at all.

[Sabaku Kyu]

Originally Posted by Mr. Johnny 5

But like i said... Sasuke is in a terrible position and he simply doesnt stand a chance against the kages. (that is what i believe)

True, that's why I'll be surprised if Raikage vs. Sasuke comes down to a battle to the death. Probably a quick scuffle before something/someone interrupts the fight.

Originally Posted by james0246

Well, it is Raikage confronting Sasuke, though the Raikage appears to have lost most of his clothing somehow . And, the shadowy image of Sasuke is quite...weird; it's a nebulous shape that could signify almost anything - mind control, hatred, insanity, etc.

The Raikage didn't seem to be a fan of shirts to begin with, but at least maybe those huge wrist bands have some purpose (besides training weights). He might use them to conduct/amplify his Raiton chakra or something...

Also, I almost thought the shape behind Sasuke was the Kyuubi for a sec.

[james0246]

^The Hands on the shadow reminded me of the hand/wing protrusions that Sasuke gained in his full CS2 form. But, besides that, it didn't really seem to signify anything...well, besides some sort of control (hands looming around an individual is a fairly common visual metaphor for control/puppetry).

[Ero-Senn1n]

In chapter 386 when Itachi acts like an evil MS user we see a monster behind him, maybe the MS has some secret that involves a demon of war taking control over the MS user if he has a lot of hatred in him. Similar to selling your soul to the devil in exchange for power. The whole act of gaining the MS and then gaining the EMS is done by doing evil to gain power. Not only evil but also it is an act of destroying the love around someone, by killing the family (brother) and friends (best friend), by this the one who kills destroys his ties to the real world and maybe what remains for him is ties with some kind of demonic world that gives the powers of the MS and EMS. Sasuke is destroying everything that connects him to the real world, to real people, and it seems by that he gains more and more power but also he loses his human self. That's why Madara doesn't let Sasuke kill Danzou. Right now Sasuke is stronger than he was against KillerBee, and also he has more hatred, more of the strange evil power that the MS gives. So raikage is in big trouble.

[SpyderSidiouss]

Originally Posted by james0246

the shadowy image of Sasuke is quite...weird; it's a nebulous shape that could signify almost anything - mind control, hatred, insanity, etc.
.

I think it might be him being possessed by the powers of the mangenkyo; like Itachi said Madara was when he took his brothers eyes.

[DeDe]

Honestly it looks like the Raikage and his fodder guard are the first sacrificial lambs to showcase Evil Sasuke's hatred. It sucks, but that's shonen. After the Killerbee fight Sasuke needed to be built back up to a different level. It also fits into the story. The Raikage, Tsuchikage, and Danzou are the old war hawks who have to perish so the old ideals die. The spoiler says the Raikage and Sasuke fight leads to an outbreak of war. The crap is about to hit the fan.

After this fight we are suppose to be left wondering how Naruto and the Konoha gang have any chance against Evil Bastard Sasuke.

[Alca]

After this fight we are suppose to be left wondering how Naruto and the Konoha gang have any chance against Evil Bastard Sasuke.[/QUOTE]

Naruto most likely would win the skirmish between the 2 if they were to fight right now. This isnt fan boy talk, Zetsu gives that conformation after naruto's fight with pain. Keep in mind this is after sasuke fight with killer bee, so if there was a major change in sasuke's strength it would of been dually noted because zetsu was there aswell.

[Rahan]

Originally Posted by DeDe

Honestly it looks like the Raikage and his fodder guard are the first sacrificial lambs to showcase Evil Sasuke's hatred. It sucks, but that's shonen. After the Killerbee fight Sasuke needed to be built back up to a different level. It also fits into the story. The Raikage, Tsuchikage, and Danzou are the old war hawks who have to perish so the old ideals die. The spoiler says the Raikage and Sasuke fight leads to an outbreak of war. The crap is about to hit the fan.

But then, you have to wonder what was the point of Naruto going to the Raikage ? Did Kishi show Raikage looking back at Naruto before leaving only to give Naruto fans false hopes before making Sasuke stomp on everything Naruto believe in again ?
Naruto is supposed to change the mentalities. He can not let Sasuke kill all the old timers so that Naruto can rule with his friends without changing anything.

If the Raikage dies, the whole subplot with Naruto and the Cloud officially become filler because Kishi never intended to go anywhere with that.

After this fight we are suppose to be left wondering how Naruto and the Konoha gang have any chance against Evil Bastard Sasuke.

Yeah, it was clear their current situation wouldn't last very long ...
Naruto will be the underdog until the end. It was only a matter of time before Kishi would put back Sasuke ahead...
At least, it won't be done with Sasuke humiliating Naruto again. (at least, not physically, because Naruto will still look like a dumbass if Sasuke hurts someone from the Cloud)

[darkmaster074]

Originally Posted by Ero-Senn1n

In chapter 386 when Itachi acts like an evil MS user we see a monster behind him, maybe the MS has some secret that involves a demon of war taking control over the MS user if he has a lot of hatred in him. Similar to selling your soul to the devil in exchange for power. The whole act of gaining the MS and then gaining the EMS is done by doing evil to gain power. Not only evil but also it is an act of destroying the love around someone, by killing the family (brother) and friends (best friend), by this the one who kills destroys his ties to the real world and maybe what remains for him is ties with some kind of demonic world that gives the powers of the MS and EMS. Sasuke is destroying everything that connects him to the real world, to real people, and it seems by that he gains more and more power but also he loses his human self. That's why Madara doesn't let Sasuke kill Danzou. Right now Sasuke is stronger than he was against KillerBee, and also he has more hatred, more of the strange evil power that the MS gives. So raikage is in big trouble.

good point

[DeDe]

Originally Posted by Rahan

But then, you have to wonder what was the point of Naruto going to the Raikage ? Did Kishi show Raikage looking back at Naruto before leaving only to give Naruto fans false hopes before making Sasuke stomp on everything Naruto believe in again ?

It could have been to set up some poignant last words from the Raikage to Naruto. Perhaps Naruto's words did touch the Raikage. It just seems when you have the old vs. the young in a fight that the chances are that the old will die. That's the way this fight feels. It's intended to show how truly evil Sasuke has become without Kishi totally burning all bridges to what's left of his humanity. Killing Kakashi or a named Konoha ninja would be the point of no return for Sasuke. But killing some samurai and the reckless and rash Raikage is fair game.

Originally Posted by Rahan

If the Raikage dies, the whole subplot with Naruto and the Cloud officially become filler because Kishi never intended to go anywhere with that.

Killerbee is still alive and will likely have to met Naruto at some point. And there is still Team Samui who Naruto has a strong connection with. Samui might very well become the new Raikage if Kirabi refuses.

[ChojinLocke]

Might just be the case that Naruto has to fight Sasuke to the death. For Naruto that would be a hard decision..actually I dont think Sasuke would like to kill Naruto too.

But more likely some kind of control from Madara..this moon eye plan comes to mind. Who knows maybe Sasuke is Madara's gateway to creating a new Kyubi from Sasuke's hatred. If so then maybe Naruto can still save him and the ninja world by removing Madara's influence from Sasuke..but somehow I think Madara's plan have to come to fruition at least half way to keep the suspense..

By the way James..where do you find these avatars..I mean..I dont want to say horrible but you know..let's just say 'weird'. I mean whatever turns you on I suppose eh? No disrespect ..

[ShadowAssasin]

Originally Posted by Ero-Senn1n

In chapter 386 when Itachi acts like an evil MS user we see a monster behind him, maybe the MS has some secret that involves a demon of war taking control over the MS user if he has a lot of hatred in him. Similar to selling your soul to the devil in exchange for power. The whole act of gaining the MS and then gaining the EMS is done by doing evil to gain power. Not only evil but also it is an act of destroying the love around someone, by killing the family (brother) and friends (best friend), by this the one who kills destroys his ties to the real world and maybe what remains for him is ties with some kind of demonic world that gives the powers of the MS and EMS. Sasuke is destroying everything that connects him to the real world, to real people, and it seems by that he gains more and more power but also he loses his human self. That's why Madara doesn't let Sasuke kill Danzou. Right now Sasuke is stronger than he was against KillerBee, and also he has more hatred, more of the strange evil power that the MS gives. So raikage is in big trouble.

Nice. Several times in the story, Sasuke exhibited a certain glare that followed a "killing intent" so visceral, people near him seemed to instantly notice, and often commented on it. (on different occasions, it managed to frighten Sakura, Suigetsu, Jugo, Kabuto, alert "Tobi", and excited Orochimaru lol) When I read that chapter and seen the deity behind Itachi, I interpreted it as one's Id somehow manifested into an entity by awakening their mangekyo... I believe the shadowy figure in the panel may be Sasuke's Id actually shown instead of merely commented on by people around him... (or something to that effect) I think the author is trying to give us an idea of how his killing intent looks(a scary, intimidating visage), and hence what others feel when confronted by it.

Originally Posted by ChojinLocke

By the way James..where do you find these avatars..I mean..I dont want to say horrible but you know..let's just say 'weird'. I mean whatever turns you on I suppose eh? No disrespect ..

lol I always wanted to ask him who that character is but always forgot... It looks like it might be a character from an anime that I wouldn't watch; something like that horrible "one piece". lol either way, who is that?

[itachi29al]

So were goin to sasuke vs Raikage, cool. I wonder how he goin do against him seeing as his two of his three basic powers are gone. Im guessing first of all that lightening not goin to be very useful against the "Raikage". Also from what Zetsu said it seems that the man has incredible speed, something sasuke has been commended of number of times, given his most likely superior power that not goin to be very useful. So if Sasuke want to win this its going to have to be all from sharingan tricks. But seing as the Raikage probably got plety of info on the sharingan and its abilities for Konoha even that might not be so good. Although a doubt that the village had too much info on MS, so he still has that up his sleeve. Sill this isnt going to be an easy opponent for him.
Juggo will probably fight blond haired dude and the guy with the sword will be up against suigetsu.

[james0246]

Originally Posted by ChojinLocke

By the way James..where do you find these avatars..I mean..I dont want to say horrible but you know..let's just say 'weird'. I mean whatever turns you on I suppose eh? No disrespect ..

This from the man that uses an obscure 80s Shounen King manga series as his avatar and "name"? j/k .

Originally Posted by ShadowAssasin

lol I always wanted to ask him who that character is but always forgot... It looks like it might be a character from an anime that I wouldn't watch; something like that horrible "one piece". lol either way, who is that?

Oh the Hate. What did One Piece ever do to you (besides being great) .

That being said, my avatars are all based on my favourite animated comedy Jungle wa Itsumo Hare nochi Guu, with particular emphasis on the titular character of Guu.