jounin vs chuunin levels (manga spoilers)

[ChouOishii]

fair warning, this contains spoilers for the current arc in the manga, and I'm not using tags for the entire thing.

I'm just wondering if this was bothering anyone else: y'know how in the chuunin exam prelims, gai jumps in to save lee and pretty much just brushes gaara's strongest attack aside like it's nothing?

well, that's jounin level vs chuunin/high genin level, right?

and gaara was probably the strongest fighter in the test (no arguing on this point - sasuke lost in the end and naruto couldn't beat him without kyuubi), and neither of the konoha genin we've seen fight in the current arc (neji and chouji) have developed *that* much since then, so if the sound ninjas at curse seal level 2 are really jounin level, which I think has been agreed upon in other threads, why isn't there a similar gap in their levels of power as there seemed to be between gai and gaara?

oh, and is gai a taijutsu expert because he wants to be or can he not use ninjutsu/genjutsu like lee? because if he did that with just a non-magical wave of his hand, that would seem to increase the difference in power even more.

[CaSe-]

Originally Posted by ChouOishii

fair warning, this contains spoilers for the current arc in the manga, and I'm not using tags for the entire thing.

I'm just wondering if this was bothering anyone else: y'know how in the chuunin exam prelims, gai jumps in to save lee and pretty much just brushes gaara's strongest attack aside like it's nothing?

well, that's jounin level vs chuunin/high genin level, right?

and gaara was probably the strongest fighter in the test (no arguing on this point - sasuke lost in the end and naruto couldn't beat him without kyuubi), and neither of the konoha genin we've seen fight in the current arc (neji and chouji) have developed *that* much since then, so if the sound ninjas at curse seal level 2 are really jounin level, which I think has been agreed upon in other threads, why isn't there a similar gap in their levels of power as there seemed to be between gai and gaara?

oh, and is gai a taijutsu expert because he wants to be or can he not use ninjutsu/genjutsu like lee? because if he did that with just a non-magical wave of his hand, that would seem to increase the difference in power even more.

Well regarding the Gaara/Gai thing, i think that Gai is an expert at Taijutsu, but he can use Ninjutsu and genjutsu unlike Lee. Cause if not, he would have been useless to Neji and Tenten

[Jack Zodiac]

The four Sound-nin took on two Jounin and made it out exhausted, so they're, individually, about as strong as half a Jounin, which puts them at around Chuunin level with special abilities.

And Gai can use ninjitsu. He summons turtles.

[Dragon Flame]

thats because the sound nins are not Jounin level at curse level two, Sasuke most likely will be cuz hes just that damned good of a ninja prodigy, but remember,,it took 4 sound nins to kill two jounins, and they WERE injured, look at their pics in the manga, they look all scruffy, at best they're jsut really high level chuunin just below jounin level at leve 2, and Sasuke will be a weak jounin level at curse 2

Gai is an ELITE jounin, hes the best of the best of the best, murdering some piss ant like gaara is nothing for him

[ChouOishii]

Originally Posted by Dragon Flame

thats because the sound nins are not Jounin level at curse level two, Sasuke most likely will be cuz hes just that damned good of a ninja prodigy, but remember,,it took 4 sound nins to kill two jounins, and they WERE injured, look at their pics in the manga, they look all scruffy, at best they're jsut really high level chuunin just below jounin level at leve 2, and Sasuke will be a weak jounin level at curse 2

Gai is an ELITE jounin, hes the best of the best of the best, murdering some piss ant like gaara is nothing for him

lol, ok, that was an easy answer ^^;

regarding the turtle thing: where? did I miss something? o_o

[CaSe-]

Originally Posted by ChouOishii

lol, ok, that was an easy answer ^^;

regarding the turtle thing: where? did I miss something? o_o

When Rock lee challenged Saskue before the exams

[Nine Devil]

gai can use ninjustu or genjutsu.Example

Spoiler:

He used Genjutsu encounter when Kabuto secretly used Genjutsu on them

[GreyArea]

Originally Posted by Nine Devil

gai can use ninjustu or genjutsu.Example

Spoiler:

He used Genjutsu encounter when Kabuto secretly used Genjutsu on them

Spoiler:

I dont think the genjutsu counter is a gen/ninjitsu technique, just a basic technique

Also, you shouldnt think of Jounin / Chuunin as levels, they are rank. Like a General in an army isnt necessarily a really hard soldier, he has other qualities (leadership and resource management skills etc). Which is why you dont become a Chuunin just because your strong. Gaara wouldnt have become a chuunin (even if he wasnt mental), because he isnt a particularly clever combatant

[Lee-pimp]

well like dragonflame-sama said gai is an elite jounin which isnt a real rank but basically means that he is a beast where gaara is a low chuunin lvl fighter i think the four sounds are gennin normally correct me if im wrong but when they use the seal lvl two they become like high mid and high chuunin lvl so bassically like elite chuunin

[Nine Devil]

It's a basic it's still genjutsu lee can't even do that

[ChouOishii]

Originally Posted by Nine Devil

It's a basic it's still genjutsu lee can't even do that

hmm, so in other words... even sakura could kick lee's ass if she used genjutsu on him o_o man, geji mayu is weak :|

[GreyArea]

Originally Posted by Nine Devil

It's a basic it's still genjutsu lee can't even do that

You sure? I was under the impression (from the GBA game admittedly) that it was just a normal skill (not gen or ninjitsu). Does it say so somewhere in the manga?

[Jack Zodiac]

Spoiler:

Kakashi said that because Sakura's Genjutsu was so strong, she was immune to Kabuto's sleeping technique. But then, she didn't knowingly use it. So, maybe it's just a tolerance thing.

[Hunter]

Originally Posted by Jack Zodiac

Spoiler:

Kakashi said that because Sakura's Genjutsu was so strong, she was immune to Kabuto's sleeping technique. But then, she didn't knowingly use it. So, maybe it's just a tolerance thing.

Not at all.

Spoiler:

She's just good at genjutsu and she did a genjutsu counter to avoid the genjutsu of Kabuto that's all.
Like Shikamaru in fact.
She isn't immune nor has a tolerance to anything.

[Jack Zodiac]

Then there you go. She can counter a Jounin-level Genjutsu, and there is indeed a counter to Genjutsu. Two questions answered at once.

[Hunter]

Spoiler:

Actually Naruto is the only ninja that we saw asleep, all the others were simple spectator.

There weren't any question.

[Dragon Flame]

alot of the ppl in the audience had forehead protectors

[Hunter]

Originally Posted by Dragon Flame

alot of the ppl in the audience had forehead protectors

Yeah, but none of them was sleeping.

[Vicious]

Genin, Chuunin, Jounin.
They're simply military ranks.

Like, Itachi's a Chuunin. But he's as strong as a Kage. Kabuto is a Genin. But Kabuto's strong as Kakashi (an elite Jounin). Naruto, Neji, Sasuke, Gaara. They're as strong as Chuunins, but they're Genins.

Being a Genin doesn't actually mean you're weaker than a Chuunin. It's a just a matter of taking Exams. Kabuto failed the Chuuni Exam about 15 times for Oro, but he could easily pass it.

Saying a Chuunin is necesseraly stronger than a Genin, a Jounin is necesseraly stronger than a Chuunin is the same thing as saying you can't grow your strenght if you don't grow your rank. And that isn't true (though normally, Jounins are stronger than Genins and Chuunins- just that Kabuto's and Itachi's are special cases)

You may analyze a character by his/her strenght, not by his/her military rank.

[ChouOishii]

Originally Posted by Vicious

Genin, Chuunin, Jounin.
They're simply military ranks.

...They're as strong as Chuunins, but they're Genins.

see, it's that kind of statement that make me wonder ;P people say "they're not power levels!" and then go on to use them to describe the relative strengths of characters... oh well

anyway, that reminds me of another question: is iruka a chuunin or a jounin? I assumed jounin until..

Spoiler:

shikamaru is given a flak jacket for becoming chuunin

..but damn, he's so weak o_o he got his ass handed to him by mizuki, the dude that naruto beat up in the first issue o_o I mean come on, even sakura probably wouldn't have lost to naruto at that point..