2012-04-20, 18:32 | Link #3261 | |
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With that couldn't we say that both Amata and Kagura are indeed the reincarnation of Apollonius [note how I do not say Apollo]. The portion from the original Aquarion could have died the same time as Apollo did for all we know and it would start to bring things together. [With Amata making the new legend with Zessica, since both are reincarnations of Apollonius and Celaine] I could elaborate on my crack-pot theory if you want |
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2012-04-20, 19:11 | Link #3262 | |
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Location: New York, NY
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So Kagura has never had any past visions at all (outside of the false one), so his authenticity is still in question. |
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2012-04-20, 19:30 | Link #3263 |
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Join Date: May 2011
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wisteria233: I think it's still unclear what's going on with Mykage. Is it:
(a) he doesn't know what happened 12k years ago (because he was asleep maybe?) (b) he knows the truth, but his plans need him to give Kagura bad information anyways (for reasons we don't know yet) ...? I don't think we know which is more accurate, yet. |
2012-04-20, 19:38 | Link #3264 |
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Well I did say that his level of non-romantic threat was that of a joke threat that served as exposition of how our main cast has powered or how powerful they were. I mean, in Episode 6, he was basically turned into Shrade's scratching post.
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2012-04-20, 19:44 | Link #3265 | |
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2012-04-20, 20:11 | Link #3266 |
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Whatever Kawamori/Okada direction is, I agree that it is better they start to move the strings. I hope that they are not waiting for the beach episode to move. So far surely they are playing soft on both parts. Amata and Mikono are on hold, Zessica was on hold till last episode. Kagura, well he is the only one who worked hard for the little time he had, but if he had to have some more relevant role in the whole story he was on hold in developing his good points. That's why I think that they are holding back til the beach episode. And I'm addressing it to bad writing.
Still, I don't see why Amata should be blamed for going against the fated lovers. if the matter had been handled differently and consistently things would be different now. But we saw the real thing only after 16 episodes. Until now we have seen only movie references. (And it better they will give us a good explanation to that ). That's why I can't see any real definitive change in direction coming. Except for the twist that was foreseen by Ceyenne, twist that if they will wait more it will happen in the last couple of episodes
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2012-04-20, 20:18 | Link #3267 | ||||
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However, I think that Kagura still works a little bit as a romantic threat because Mikono feels some sort of weird connection with him, and she definitely feels pity for the poor guy. But note I call him "poor guy", and not with an ounce of irony. And that's because he's become really hard to hate or root against. He's actually pitiable at this point, in spite of all the death and destruction he's caused, imo. You're right - He's handled more like a classic underdog protagonist (downright Popeye-esque, even ) than as a major villain. If this is all due to some grand bait-and-switch planned by Okada (we actually get Kagura/Mikono at the end) then I tip my hat to her for beautifully subverting several anime romance cliches/tropes. But without such a bait-and-switch, this is a puzzling handling of Kagura's character at best. Quote:
And maybe that's all Kagura is... although the new OP seems to suggest otherwise. Quote:
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There's nothing wrong with the main pairing here - with Amata/Mikono. In fact, I find them cute together, and they've had a lot of nice scenes together. But the problem is that the challengers on both sides of it (Kagura on one, Zessica on the other) are coming across as working harder for it/wanting it more than the core pairing themselves do. In other words, I get a sense that Kagura wants to be with Mikono more than Amata does, and I also get a sense that Zessica wants to be with Amata more than Mikono does. That obviously doesn't reflect well on the presumptive main pairing. I mean, actions speak louder than words, and the actions are that Kagura is doing everything in his power to get his 'wench', and now Zessica has loudly confessed her feelings to Amata while also showing more consistent concern for Amata than Mikono has, imo. Again, if this is all setup for a trope subverting bait-and-switch, then it might work out beautifully. But if (as is likely the case) the anime goes through with Amata/Mikono, then it's a strange way to go about it. At the very least, they're going to need to start making a more compelling case for Amata/Mikono by having one or both of them really strive harder to make it happen.
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2012-04-20, 20:36 | Link #3268 | |
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Anyway, this wouldn't be so bad if Kagura has some other objectives that could be allow to achieve- If the writers don't want the kidnap to happen yet, they shouldn't make it his sole existence =_= But regardless, I still stand by what I've said that just because he didn't win, doesn't mean he lost easily.
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2012-04-22, 07:18 | Link #3269 | |
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Join Date: Feb 2012
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But it makes him look a bit like an hypocrite. |
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2012-04-22, 20:36 | Link #3270 | |||
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Join Date: Dec 2009
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Age: 34
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If you ever get around to visiting here again Triple_R, after this episode we can continue our discussion I wager. I'll spoiler tag what I say since people may not have yet seen the episode.
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Spoiler for Possible Spoilers:
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Spoiler for Possible Spoilers:
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Spoiler for Possible Spoilers:
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2012-04-22, 22:44 | Link #3271 |
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Join Date: May 2011
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Vena: you flatter me, but to give credit where credit is due I'm 99% sure you were the one who first pointed out that inconsistency ("why hasn't Aquarion gone berserk for Amata and Mikono yet?"), all I can claim credit for is
Spoiler for possible spoilers:
In terms of generally "what are these writers thinking (about Zessica/Kagura)?", I think what it has to be is that Amata and Mikono are the main characters, but for there to be meaningful issues around the identities of the reincarnations the writers decided there needs one more of each lead (whence Zessica and Kagura)...but for them to believably fit into the reincarnation shenanigans, etc., and to make them plausible they need to be built up into at least "major minor character status". That's all there is too it, I'm thinking. Note this isn't meant to take a stance on the actual reincarnation shenanigans, just that to have them also in the running means committing to a certain level of focus and certain amount of screentime. In particular, they can't have Zessica exit the stage so soon, because she's working two jobs (romantic foil to the leads, but also involved in the reincarnation shenanigans). |
2012-04-23, 00:47 | Link #3272 |
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Join Date: Feb 2012
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^The way it's written it's difficult for me to think Mikono is in love with Amata. She's never shown sparing him a though. Right after episode 1/2 I would have bought it but now. I'm also actually questioning Amata's feelings. The dude that won't try to move on anything unless he fears Mikono is going to be taken away.
You cannot possibly start strong and then nothing happens for 17-2 episodes straight. I'm now coming with my kitchen psychology for explaining why they are clutching to one another while apparently not being that motivated in becoming more romantically involved. It's probably just sloppy writting and the fact they choose the wrong type of pairing to be dragged for 26 episodes. They should have stuck to the 'I hate you at first' formula. It leaves room for actual developement and not stagnation/backpedaling like now. Now I'm reduced to cross my finger expecting they won't feel like 'developping' (stagnating is a more acurate word in fact) their main pairing to not lower the mood of the episode. |
2012-04-23, 01:06 | Link #3273 |
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Wouldn't having both Kagura and Zessica as "major minor characters" kinda redundant though? IMO one of them is more than enough to create obstacles for Mikono/Amata. Now we have the main relationship stagnant in ep 17, Zessica confessed and then got rejected by Amata and Kagura who I think has less chance than Zessica. It's weird that the plot only gets intense this late into the series and the final result will probably be Mikono/Amata because it's too late for other characters.
And for a main female lead (Mikono) the writers sure make her unlikeable. I wonder why. If Ano natsu can have two interesting love interests in Kanna and Ichika why can't Aquarion do the same? I like Mikono but Okada is making her too indecisive and passive for my liking. Amata really needs to be more straightforward soon. Perhaps he should meet his mother. Last edited by crayven; 2012-04-23 at 01:18. |
2012-04-23, 01:07 | Link #3274 | |
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Age: 34
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Spoiler for Genesis reference for sake of comparison:
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2012-04-23, 01:44 | Link #3275 | ||
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Episode 3, he couldn't gattai because he was being miserable because of her. Episode 7, he almost lose to Jin because he was being miserable because of her. Episode 13, 15, 17 was feeling miserable because of her. It's rare it's actually shown in a positive light. Not that everything has to be blamed on Mikono in my own opinion. Amata seems to put her on some sort of pedestal which prevents him from being confrontational. Quote:
At first, seeing Amata and Mikono bonding so strongly from day one, I though they would use Kagura actually kidnapping Mikono for more than one episodes to avoid the stagnation and repetetiveness and their going nowhare despite having nothing in their way, and test their commitment. But it never happened. I'm astounded that confirmed writters could end up doing such blatant mistakes. I'm not even speaking of that awkward 'fight destiny' theme. That's why I'm one to still hope in some sort of bait and switch counting on troll Kagura (maybe with the help of troll Mikage). He's the one getting cockblock by Amata not the other way around. It is his love story !! Believe it ! Well that's why I want to believe because the writting is more satisfying this way. Last edited by Zuul; 2012-04-23 at 02:15. |
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2012-04-23, 13:30 | Link #3276 | |
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Join Date: Apr 2012
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I like Zessica's development, but Amata's such a stale character. He's going nowhere. I'm starting to get the feeling this show is being hijacked by Zessica and Fudo Zen. They seem to have more screen time than Amata atm. |
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2012-05-06, 13:46 | Link #3280 |
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Join Date: Jan 2012
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New Aquarion EVOL POLL:
Male: http://anime.biglobe.ne.jp/userranking/chara/32229/ Female: http://anime.biglobe.ne.jp/userranking/chara/32228/ Current male positions: 1. Jin 2. Kagura 3. Operator Guy 4. Shrade 5. Cayenne Current female positions: 1. Sasanka 2. Zessica 3. Mikono 4. MIX 5. Yunoha |
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comedy, science fiction |
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