Magika no Kenshi to Basileus [Light Novel]

[GLDarkLord]

^I haven't read volume 9 yet , but I can assume that Kanae was probably serious on that duel with kazuki. A serious Kanae is very fast, faster than her default speed which is already above to kazuki'stand default speed. Added to her training to become a better swordswoman is probably another factor.

[TXBPNTVN]

^That was the same guy who blocked ilyailiya's attacks with the speed of LIGHT.So kanae who didn't contract with any divas is even fater than the queen of russia ?

[charasu]

@^ battle with kanae, kazuki can't got to serious cause ikousai match for tomorrow
and if you remember kazuki have 3 weakness,

> <Zekorbeni> control.
> His nonexistent resistance against mind magic.
> His slow chanting speed.

well, he slowly worked up every weakness but still not perfect enough(zekor via battle, mind hack via miyabi, lastly via koyuki)
and you must remember that even though it same lv.1 spell, kaguya and kazuki in term of chanting spell, there is huge gap skill casting beetwen them.
you can say in casting time rank, compare to the girls, kazuki is below the girls

[GLDarkLord]

Basically then, Kanae is pressing on kazuki weekness on slow chanting speed.

[TXBPNTVN]

^But it shouldn't be too slow to not be able to chant level 1 magic in time.
My point is kazuki should be able to defeat kanae in his normal form,if we treat zekorbeni as his power up form.Only opponents at ikousai's level or higher should forced him to use zekorbeni.Not to mention kanae also received a power up which in my opinion is op as f*ck.Now she is faster,stronger and every of her strike is either shiniki or a critical strike.The author is trying too hard to make kanae not become obsolete.I wouldn't be surprised if she can defeat kazuki with his zekorbeni activated.

[charasu]

in sword contest beetwen swordman even in distance 3 meter, kanae speed can cover it in 1 second
one chant probably took more than second
than aiming
afterthat casting

without shin'iki kanae can distrub normal magician chant with only her fast attack
then here kanae use shin'iki than make chant completly stoped.
and kazuki not like kaguya that can chanting while got showering slash from kanae

so many factor that lead kazuki cant use summoning magic while fighting kanae:v
thats from my viewpoint analisys

[Xvenic]

Originally Posted by TXBPNTVN

^But it shouldn't be too slow to not be able to chant level 1 magic in time.
My point is kazuki should be able to defeat kanae in his normal form,if we treat zekorbeni as his power up form.Only opponents at ikousai's level or higher should forced him to use zekorbeni.Not to mention kanae also received a power up which in my opinion is op as f*ck.Now she is faster,stronger and every of her strike is either shiniki or a critical strike.The author is trying too hard to make kanae not become obsolete.I wouldn't be surprised if she can defeat kazuki with his zekorbeni activated.

you got all the things wrong, kazuki can evade illya attack because he can read the killing intent, not because he can see illya movement...

frankly speaking I think kanae power is above ikousai actually... kazuki mention in the book 6 actually why he can fight on par with ikousai because he fight faster opponent before which is kanae...

Spoiler for vol 6:

“You have never fought somebody that was even faster than you. That’s why in a match where our speed is equal you feel impatient and your judgment lagged behind. But I have come this far fighting against opponents above me many times over.”
Since his childhood period, Kazuki had been continuously worked hard by a swordsman named Kanae who was far faster than him.

Dont forget that by kanae getting power up, in instant kazuki should receive his power up.

also somehow I got the feeling the last battle will be fate stay night all over, which is fighting gilgamesh again

[TXBPNTVN]

Sure he can feel her killing intent but it is meaningless if his BODY could not react.It was the freaking speed of light we are talking about.The paragraph you quote mention that kanae was stronger than him and ikousai as a GENERAL magic swordman.He and ikousai are summoning magic swordmen,it is ridiculous for them as kings to not be stronger than a feeble swordman who can only use general magic.In other words,do you honestly believe that kanae without any diva is faster than the queen of russia,and stronger than ikousai the contractor of susanoo?

[Xvenic]

Originally Posted by TXBPNTVN

Sure he can feel her killing intent but it is meaningless if his BODY could not react.It was the freaking speed of light we are talking about.The paragraph you quote mention that kanae was stronger than him and ikousai as a GENERAL magic swordman.He and ikousai are summoning magic swordmen,it is ridiculous for them as kings to not be stronger than a feeble swordman who can only use general magic.In other words,do you honestly believe that kanae without any diva is faster than the queen of russia,and stronger than ikousai the contractor of susanoo?

she was faster than ikousai but lacking in the power department
she was slower than illya but winning in term of controlling her killing intent

Illya case:
even if your body can react, if you can't feel what will happen how the hell you're supposed to react?
just like that kazuki body should be able to react to kanae, but he can do nothing which mean he can't feel what kanae will do
kazuki body can react to illya attack, and he can feel what illya will do.. thats why he can dodge her attack

ikousai case:
Ikousai can use susanoo strengthening magic which give her more speed and power, unfortunately kazuki at that time can use berserk and ride lightning giving him more speed and power than ikousai

in this case kanae seal ride lightning, and other kazuki magic, which leaving him in basic state... same thing will happen to ikousai
the paragraph referring to kazuki basic state < kanae basic state

kinda like
ikousai + buff < kazuki + buff + buff
ikousai = kazuki
kanae > kazuki
kanae < kazuki + buff

since kanae can seal the buff magic... kanae > ikousai

Spoiler for kanae speed:

Immediately Kanae’s figure vanished with a jump. It was similar with a reinforced Beatrix and Ikousai, a speed in the dimension where a naked eye was helpless to do anything.
He had to read her movement using only the portent of the magic power.

[TXBPNTVN]

.with only general magic the best she could do is reaching mach 1.you cannot seperate his killing intent sensing skill and his body reaction to the speed of light.for f sake it is the speed of light,the ultimate speed in the universe.he didnt only block her attacks coming at him.he Threw his body in the trajectory of an attack of the speed of LIGHT which means he himself was moving at the speed of light.with a mind and body that can compete with the speed of light how can he lose in speed to anyone

Edit:Let me point out more of the flaw in this duel.Lotte with her level 5 SUMMONING magic can reach and break the sound barrier.Saying kanae can be as fast as sound with only GENERAL magic is too generous.

[Xvenic]

Originally Posted by TXBPNTVN

.with only general magic the best she could do is reaching mach 1.you cannot seperate his killing intent sensing skill and his body reaction to the speed of light.for f sake it is the speed of light,the ultimate speed in the universe.he didnt only block her attacks coming at him.he Threw his body in the trajectory of an attack of the speed of LIGHT which means he himself was moving at the speed of light.with a mind and body that can compete with the speed of light how can he lose in speed to anyone

Edit:Let me point out more of the flaw in this duel.Lotte with her level 5 SUMMONING magic can reach and break the sound barrier.Saying kanae can be as fast as sound with only GENERAL magic is too generous.

Spoiler for the fight:

Pylevaja Zvezda(Flying Stardust)
- wide range, small meteor
- ranged attack (so there's a room for reaction)
- nothing said about speed of light..
- kazuki evade it by reading the killing intent

Ogni Fonarei(Fire of Wound Vessel), Meč(Swordification)
- close range, attack with sword
- kazuki receive the killing intent before the engagement allowing him to block
- even if the movement is 3x10^8 m/s if the killing intent was received 1s before the engagement it should be possible to block IMO

2nd engagement, kazuki feel ilya will target his companion, and illya specifically tell him that she will target.. enough time to react as well

3rd engagement kazuki use ride lightning

The next moment it returned back to a right hand blade and slashed at Kazuki. The killing intent gave off an advance warning of that movement. Kazuki blocked and then parried it. Hayashizaki-style’s <Instant Positioning> immediately broke Ilyailiya’s posture. He landed a counterattack right there. He had no intention to be outdone in a close-quarter combat!

advance warning, even 1s advance warning should be enough (considering human response time is 0.26s on average) and he use ride lightning before to buff reaction time as well
when shinobu fall, again kazuki receive the killing intent, his reaction got enhanced by ride lightning, and he use blazing wings to catch up..
after that double level 10 enhance magic...

assuming 0.26s average response time, kazuki should be have more than that from his swords man training... then improved with ride lightning...

if the killing intent received even only 0.5s before illya start to move it should give time to react... funny thing is illya never do continuous attack, so there's 0.5s gap on every attack..

TL;DR
its not about illya action speed, but more about her gap time between thinking the attack (giving of the killing intent) and the action (moving and attacking), this was the time for kazuki to react

PS: i'm not the one that saying kanae speed, it's what the book say that kanae speed is same with reinforced beatrix or ikousai

[SoloPanda]

Originally Posted by TXBPNTVN

.with only general magic the best she could do is reaching mach 1.you cannot seperate his killing intent sensing skill and his body reaction to the speed of light.for f sake it is the speed of light,the ultimate speed in the universe.he didnt only block her attacks coming at him.he Threw his body in the trajectory of an attack of the speed of LIGHT which means he himself was moving at the speed of light.with a mind and body that can compete with the speed of light how can he lose in speed to anyone

Edit:Let me point out more of the flaw in this duel.Lotte with her level 5 SUMMONING magic can reach and break the sound barrier.Saying kanae can be as fast as sound with only GENERAL magic is too generous.

Because he didn't do those things while she was moving at the speed of lightning (not light) he did them before she started moving. She telegraphed her movement before she started moving, Kazuki moved took action, then she attacked at the speed of lightning. This wasn't Kazuki beating Ilyailya in terms of speed. He merely reacted and defended before she moved herself. So yes he can be beaten in terms of speed. What he won at was merely his strategic positioning of himself to prepare for opponents with much greater speed. Just because she moves at lightning speed doesn't mean she thinks or reacts at lightning speed.

speed of light = 1/299 792 458 miles per second
speed of lightning = 1/186,291 miles per second

[bakapervert]

Don't forget how Kanae is continuously using Shin'iki against Kazuki. The other advantage Kanae has is that she is the one that know Kazuki the best. That's why its easier for her to use that technique against Kazuki, added with her obseesion to Kazuki that increased her concentration even further, Kanae that fought Kazuki is several times stronger than Kanae who fought Kaguya. Another differnce of her with Ilyailiya is matter of sword skill. Even Kazuki had acknowledged Kanae as the best swordsman in Japan. And if you want to know how crazy a master swordsman skill is, just read rakudai no kishi. I think its perfectly acceptable how Kanae can pressed Kazuki that much.

Kazuki need several second to use level 1 magic, Kanae need maybe less than a second for a slash of Shin'iki.

[XFire]

There's also the fact that despite Kanae managing to disrupt all his spells, she couldn't hurt him at all, so it's not like he was completely overwhelmed.

[Liuen]

Okay, let's take this in parts.

First, it is not impossible for Kanae to be as fast as Beatrix or Ikousai only with general magic. While it is true that theother two are summoners, Kanae has trained as a swordman all her life, and morover with an emphasis is speed, so her Enchant Aura is probably otop-class. Summoners have to train in all the other types of magic, be it Psychokinesis or Pyrokinesis to use resist, or Telephaty to chant faster. All of that time and dedication went to reinforcment magic in Kanae's case. I's obvious her results would be significant.

Second, Kazuki could chant level 1 magic. Problem is, level 1 usually are simple spells, fast to chant but without much power. Among all of the spells he had on that level, none would be effective in reversing the situation. It was from level 2 that Kanae was able to negate them.

Third, Kanae has been observing Kazuki for years. His habits, tactics, most likely reactions, she is the one who knows them the best. That makes it easier for her to predict his movements to some extent, and thus be more succesful with Shin'ki.

Fourth, Kazuki is not as fast as Ilyailiya. It was stated that she was the fastest of the kings, making her the fastest in the world (bar divas). What Kazuki did was predict which course she was going to take to launch an attack and move himself, at his top speed (reinforced and buffed, obviously) before she even began to make hers. That doesn't mean he's faster or he can move at light-speed.

Fifth, the condition of both Kazuki and Kanae was different. Kanae was giving it all she had, while Kazuki had to reserve himself for next day's battle. In other words, Kanae's condition was the best she ever had, while Kazuki not that much.

Lastly, in terms of plain sword skill, Kanae is better than Kazuki, since she has only dedicated herself to it, while Kazuki invested most of his time in training the magic he didn't need till he became a summoner.

[TXBPNTVN]

@bakapervert : I don't think we can apply rakudai's logic to this series.Yes she is the best swordman in Japan but Kazuzi is the strongest Magika stigma in Japan.Arthur could push back 7 strongest magika stigma of china,not 7 strongest swordmen but 7 strongest magika stigma,while severely holding back.As Arthur's peer,I find it hardly acceptable that Kazuki couldn't defeat 1 strongest swordman without using zekorbini.
@Liuen : No matter how much she trained her general magic,it is still magic that is generated by a human.It can never compare with the reinforcement magic generated by godlike beings.
Level 1 magic is still effective against Kanae in term of destructive power,it just couldn't hit her.But "After that Kazuki attempted low level magic three times",judging from the context he could only cast level 1 magic at that time but it was also crushed by Kanae."Crushed" could mean that it failed to hit her or she disrupt them all.

[OmegaWeaponZ]

Basically, Kanae trumps Kazuki in pure sword skills and speed, while Kaguya trumps Kazuki in magic control, usage and chant speed. This(talking about his magic skills here) however applies only whilst he is in normal mode.

Zekorbeni basically buffs his overall ability, due to its many benefits. In addition, Kazuki had poor resist and concentration when chanting spells, as compared to most other magi.

He also started the duel at 47 m shorter than a normal duel as a magi.

He himself has stated that his sword training in the past few months has been slack, concentrating mostly on his magic training, where as Kanae was continuously honing her sword skills, to the point of quintessence.

In the case of Illyailya, she moves at the speed of lightning, but is nonetheless still the fastest king. However, that being said, she is still just a magi, and has no expertise in the sword. Adding to that the massive killing intent that she gave of, in addition to the buffs he got from level 10 spells(he was able to dodge before these, but they helped to significantly tilt the fight in his favor), he was able to evade nearly all her attacks. In short, it was a telephone punch - like attack.

Kanae would have no killing intent, as she had no intention to harm him, but rather this was a duel.

Lastly, Illyailya wasn't serious at all inn her battle with him.

Edit: One post late. Kanae was also pushing back said horsewoman(?) back even before she contracted with her diva. Your being what exactly? They may be the Imperial Guard, bu that does not make them any more skilled than Kanae. Also, enchant aura, like all other general magic, is driven by emotion and training. The other beings you have mentioned(Illyailya and such) have not spent all their time and effort to max out their enchant. The only only other one who, in my opinion come close to her level of enchant control is Beatrix, and she emphasizes strength over speed.

[TXBPNTVN]

I do not argue that kazuki should be stronger than kanae in swordskill.i have repeated that as a King he should be able to win against her without zekorbini.its not a matter of "if he could win without zekorbibi",its the minimum requirement for a king,at least imo.
The godlike beings that i said are divas which are thor and susanoo in the case of beatrix and ikousai.beatrix and ikoudai's reenforcement magic does not originate from them.it is supplied by said gods.Magic derived from kanae who is a human shouldnt be conparable to magic created by gods

[bakapervert]

Originally Posted by TXBPNTVN

@bakapervert : I don't think we can apply rakudai's logic to this series.Yes she is the best swordman in Japan but Kazuzi is the strongest Magika stigma in Japan.Arthur could push back 7 strongest magika stigma of china,not 7 strongest swordmen but 7 strongest magika stigma,while severely holding back.As Arthur's peer,I find it hardly acceptable that Kazuki couldn't defeat 1 strongest swordman without using zekorbini.
@Liuen : No matter how much she trained her general magic,it is still magic that is generated by a human.It can never compare with the reinforcement magic generated by godlike beings.
Level 1 magic is still effective against Kanae in term of destructive power,it just couldn't hit her.But "After that Kazuki attempted low level magic three times",judging from the context he could only cast level 1 magic at that time but it was also crushed by Kanae."Crushed" could mean that it failed to hit her or she disrupt them all.

As you said that Arthur is pushing back seven strongest magika stigma of China, using the f**ing Excalibur and one time use only item. Besides those people are Magika Stigma, with really famous Diva, that even their leader with Sun Wukong as Diva has no martial arts whatsoever because his Diva is just that powerful. It's not like they are reall freakishly strong as opponent. Kanae's technique alone is really a nightmare as long as it succeed and that's exactly what happened to Kazuki. Besides this fight happened befor Kazuki got his hands on the three sacred treasure. Now that he have those, with some training he will be able to do the same thing like Arthur.

As for Kanae's speed, she is not only using pure speed, but also skill. Like.moving to blind spot, sharp turn, or whatever. She is a swordsman that constantly train her body to move i great speed, compared to magika stigma who might train their movement only a few tens of minutes a day as long as their summoning magic hold.

[GrrDraxin]

Originally Posted by charasu

that only a card playing by loki and china, but legally, yamato already lose, ikousai as yamto rep already imprisoned and by international magic contry standar, kazuki is the king.

BUT, has the remaining Japanese myth divas accepted the outcome of Kazuki ruling over them, other than Susano/Ikousai?