Character Discussion - Shirley

[incorrupts]

Originally Posted by darthfury78

There was a time when people used to talk about Milly as much as Kallen and Shirley. Now all there is are just the Shirley x Kallen fans who want to discard Milly x Lelouch.

I certainly would love to see a redo of Code Geass R2 that would return to its season one roots.

Ok, done this, moved on, seen better days.
Want a Milly thread? Feel free to request it, but stop dancing around a delusional-tango-canon? about Milly, in Shirley's thread. Honest.

[Nobodyman9]

Okay yes, what Kid Ying, RD and sky said. This ain't the Milly thread. If we want to continue this discussion it would probably be best left for the Generic Discussion thread.

[Sol Falling]

Originally Posted by morbosfist

She's not that kind of important to him, get over it.

Hahaha, I would totally be on with this putting down of nonsense about Milly if everybody else wasn't doing such a great job of it already. As it is, though...

Her help wouldn't be enough. Lelouch couldn't just lift her from school without raising suspicion, so she'd still be removed from him, and where it mattered he couldn't turn to anyone.

Aside from the phone call option, I think another consideration is 'raising suspicion from who?' Lelouch had control of the intelligence division stationed as Ashford, and was on the verge of taking on the Geass Cult anyway (giving up any pretense of claiming not to be Zero). The only actual issue for some time already had been singly Suzaku, who was just about certain about Lelouch's identity also (especially given Shirley's last comments to him!) and, more importantly, whom Shirley had already begun working on towards reconciliation (bringing Suzaku back to Lelouch's side was probably nearly as important to Shirley as retreiving Nunally, as his friendship was after all an integral part of Lelouch's happiness).

[morbosfist]

Originally Posted by Sol Falling

Aside from the phone call option, I think another consideration is 'raising suspicion from who?' Lelouch had control of the intelligence division stationed as Ashford, and was on the verge of taking on the Geass Cult anyway (giving up any pretense of claiming not to be Zero). The only actual issue for some time already had been singly Suzaku, who was just about certain about Lelouch's identity also (especially given Shirley's last comments to him!) and, more importantly, whom Shirley had already begun working on towards reconciliation (bringing Suzaku back to Lelouch's side was probably nearly as important to Shirley as retreiving Nunally, as his friendship was after all an integral part of Lelouch's happiness).

It's one thing to have the intelligence division report him as being normal. Taking Shirley away is an entirely different set of problems. Her friends would wonder where she is, as would her mother. Unlike Lelouch, there'd be no stand-in that looks just like her. Sure, her mother could be Geassed to not notice or provide a good excuse, but people would ask a lot of questions.

[Rising Dragon]

Originally Posted by morbosfist

It's one thing to have the intelligence division report him as being normal. Taking Shirley away is an entirely different set of problems. Her friends would wonder where she is, as would her mother. Unlike Lelouch, there'd be no stand-in that looks just like her. Sure, her mother could be Geassed to not notice or provide a good excuse, but people would ask a lot of questions.

Actually, it wouldn't be too hard to find a stand-in for her. After all, that mask of Sayoko's was pretty convincing. And I daresay Lelouch would find a better stand-in for Shirley, after seeing what a mistake Sayoko was.

[Nobodyman9]

Originally Posted by Sol Falling

Aside from the phone call option, I think another consideration is 'raising suspicion from who?' Lelouch had control of the intelligence division stationed as Ashford, and was on the verge of taking on the Geass Cult anyway (giving up any pretense of claiming not to be Zero). The only actual issue for some time already had been singly Suzaku, who was just about certain about Lelouch's identity also (especially given Shirley's last comments to him!) and, more importantly, whom Shirley had already begun working on towards reconciliation (bringing Suzaku back to Lelouch's side was probably nearly as important to Shirley as retreiving Nunally, as his friendship was after all an integral part of Lelouch's happiness).

Well, the way I see it is, if Lelouch and Kallen can get away with so much class time and no one's the wiser, I don't see why Shirley can't.

Anyway, a quick response to your post back on page 11. You continue to make very valid points about Lelouch's lack of faith in the world and how Shirley's love for him worked. Frankly this whole way of thinking is totally new to me, I would never have thought of this on my own. I'd like to contemplate it a bit more and figure out exactly where I stand. But I'm sure there's still some things we disagree (as well as agree) on.

[morbosfist]

Originally Posted by Rising Dragon

Actually, it wouldn't be too hard to find a stand-in for her. After all, that mask of Sayoko's was pretty convincing. And I daresay Lelouch would find a better stand-in for Shirley, after seeing what a mistake Sayoko was.

It's more than the mask, though. Similar height, build, etc is needed. It's not like Lelouch had people on hand for that.

[Rising Dragon]

Originally Posted by morbosfist

It's more than the mask, though. Similar height, build, etc is needed. It's not like Lelouch had people on hand for that.

Still wouldn't be too difficult for that. He has a large pool of human resource at his disposal.

[bladeofdarkness]

you forget that sheirly has a mother
lelouch doesnt
and kallen's in jail
neither would be missed by anyone of importance to them
i dare say that sheirly's mother would be bothered by her daugther disapearing

[Rising Dragon]

Originally Posted by bladeofdarkness

you forget that sheirly has a mother
lelouch doesnt
and kallen's in jail
neither would be missed by anyone of importance to them
i dare say that sheirly's mother would be bothered by her daugther disapearing

As was pointed out earlier, she can be Geass'd. Not that ethical, but ethics are rather flexible in Lelouch's case. Besides, its not like they have to completely cut off Shirley's contact with her. I doubt that's something Shirley would really go for.

[morbosfist]

Originally Posted by Rising Dragon

Still wouldn't be too difficult for that. He has a large pool of human resource at his disposal.

Who? The intelligence officers? They were geassed to do one thing. He didn't have many willing people to do the job, and fewer still who knew Shirley well enough to play the part.

[bladeofdarkness]

so he'd geass sheirlys mother just to take her with him somewhere where she doesnt belong among people who would distrust her as a britannian at best and treat her as zero's toy at worst ?

[Rising Dragon]

Originally Posted by morbosfist

Who? The intelligence officers? They were geassed to do one thing. He didn't have many willing people to do the job, and fewer still who knew Shirley well enough to play the part.

I wasn't actually referring to that. I was referring more to the Black Knights. Furthermore, the Intelligence Division can be used by them to study how Shirley acts and responds to everything, so it'd be simple enough for them to be taught Shirley's mannerisms. Sayoko was a failure because Lelouch probably assumed she knew him well enough to know his mannerisms due to her occupation. He had no idea she had extremely skewed perceptions of his daily life.

So I doubt he'd make a mistake in letting people assume how Shirley would act. He'd just need them to actually study how Shirley is in school.

Originally Posted by bladeofdarkness

so he'd geass sheirlys mother just to take her with him somewhere where she doesnt belong among people who would distrust her as a britannian at best and treat her as zero's toy at worst ?

C'mon, pay attention at least. The former mentioning of Geassing her mother was having her Geass'd into not questioning Shirley's activities and the like, not enslaving her into the Black Knights.

[bladeofdarkness]

Originally Posted by Rising Dragon

I wasn't actually referring to that. I was referring more to the Black Knights. Furthermore, the Intelligence Division can be used by them to study how Shirley acts and responds to everything, so it'd be simple enough for them to be taught Shirley's mannerisms. Sayoko was a failure because Lelouch probably assumed she knew him well enough to know his mannerisms due to her occupation. He had no idea she had extremely skewed perceptions of his daily life.

So I doubt he'd make a mistake in letting people assume how Shirley would act. He'd just need them to actually study how Shirley is in school.



C'mon, pay attention at least. The former mentioning of Geassing her mother was having her Geass'd into not questioning Shirley's activities and the like, not enslaving her into the Black Knights.

NOT HER MOTHER
i ment sheirly

[morbosfist]

Originally Posted by Rising Dragon

I wasn't actually referring to that. I was referring more to the Black Knights. Furthermore, the Intelligence Division can be used by them to study how Shirley acts and responds to everything, so it'd be simple enough for them to be taught Shirley's mannerisms. Sayoko was a failure because Lelouch probably assumed she knew him well enough to know his mannerisms due to her occupation. He had no idea she had extremely skewed perceptions of his daily life.

So I doubt he'd make a mistake in letting people assume how Shirley would act. He'd just need them to actually study how Shirley is in school.

"I need you to pose as this high school for me, don't ask why." I don't think that would go over too well.

[Rising Dragon]

Originally Posted by morbosfist

"I need you to pose as this high school for me, don't ask why." I don't think that would go over too well.

Yes, because Lelouch is so terrible with words and persuasion.

[morbosfist]

Originally Posted by Rising Dragon

Yes, because Lelouch is so terrible with words and persuasion.

When it's military, sure, but I think they might question the validity of being planted in a high school as a replacement when there's no apparent strategic value to it. he'd have to assign some sort of secondary task.

[Sol Falling]

The way Shirley was acting that final episode, I don't think school was all that important anymore. Shirley did have her mother, and Rivalz did remain at the Student Council, but by that point, I think Shirley had truly made her choice. As such, there's no way she would let small things like her mother's confusion (if she truly would have opposed Shirley going off to do something which was obviously very important) hold her back. Like Rivalz did when Lelouch and Rolo disappeared, it isn't impossible that they could have simply waited, and trusted her not to disappear forever (an easier task if the person you're waiting for doesn't have a death wish).

Honestly, the only notable difference between Shirley and Lelouch's school situations was the fact that she still had her mother. To raise so much of a fuss over something so irrelevant as parental concern in a story like Code Geass is I think pretty ridiculous. It simply wouldn't have been an obstacle; Shirley would have found some way to accomplish what she needed to.

[bladeofdarkness]

why would lelouch even WANT to take sheirly with him when his one wish was to eventually return to ashford
sheirly has no actual use in the OOBK
he would be putting her at risk for no reason

P.S
did Sky just get banned
why ?

[Sol Falling]

Originally Posted by bladeofdarkness

why would lelouch even WANT to take sheirly with him when his one wish was to eventually return to ashford
sheirly has no actual use in the OOBK
he would be putting her at risk for no reason

I don't really think what Lelouch wanted had anything to do with it. Shirley was determined to actively pursue Lelouch's happiness, and there's no way he would have used geass again to stop her, so she would have gotten along. It really would have just been in his best interest to accept it (in more ways than one), so again Lelouch's unwillingness or lack of support would not have been an obstacle.

P.S
did Sky just get banned
why ?

If this actually happened, then that is completely baffling and wrong. Wut?