Magical Girl Lyrical Nanoha ViVid - Anime General Discussion Thread

[Alastoryagami]

There are many factors when grading an anime's quality. Character design and animation is one of those factors. It's also the only real factor until we see more than just a promotional video. So when an anime has designs that turn you off it will factor into hurting the overall experience. Another problem is that there is nothing deep or profound about Vivid in the first place and it's mostly fanservice and a tournament arc. The fanservice heavily relies on the quality of character designs and the tournament relies heavily on the animation. If both are a bust Vivid watchers are going to be in for a rocky ride.

[FlamingMangos]

I don't get how a character design can ruin your overall experience. It still makes no sense whatsoever. I just never seen anyone talk about an art style ruining their overall experience or seen it in reviews nor has it affected me badly in any way in my entire life. Its not a picture here and the art style for Vivid isn't even bad at all. You say that it relies on the quality of character designs but has there ever a bad character design for any fanservice show? Please name me one show. This one isn't bad at all. Theres no such thing as bad character design. They're unique in their own way..

[APNki]

[Alastoryagami]

Originally Posted by FlamingMangos

I don't get how a character design can ruin your overall experience. It still makes no sense whatsoever. I just never seen anyone talk about an art style ruining their overall experience or seen it in reviews nor has it affected me badly in any way in my entire life. Its not a picture here and the art style for Vivid isn't even bad at all. You say that it relies on the quality of character designs but has there ever a bad character design for any fanservice show? Please name me one show. This one isn't bad at all. Theres no such thing as bad character design. They're unique in their own way..

Not everyone is the same but series such as K-ON for me were at least partly ruined by the character designs. I have a harder time coming up with fanservice series with good character designs. They're mostly generic because they don't need to try very hard to pander to their intended audience. Also "bad" is subjective, I am more inclined to call character designs generic. That is how I feel about Nanoha Vivids design.


There is such a thing as bad character design, how could their not be. I could draw a stick figure and animate it, would you approve of it? Anime is a form of art, the quality of the designs matter. They don't exclusively matter, but they do matter. Especially for series that rely heavily on eye candy.

Let's compare images.

The most recent Nanoha art


Past Nanoha art:


In the first image, Nanoha doesn't even look like an adult, she's more akin to Vivio's sister. She lacks curves and her eyes are taking up a lot of room on her face even for Nanoha design standards. Meanwhile, Vivio looks seven kinds of derpy. Their chins also look more like a pointed object than an actual chin.

The second image. Look at those curves! That ass, those hips, that bust. Truly a titillating image. The faces are also very cute and well proportioned.

One is good art, the other is generic art. I understand that while both images are official, they're not the exact character designs used in the anime. But it is a compare and contrast between high quality art and average art.

[Akiyoshi]

Art style while not a deciding factor can be quite influential to how the audience perceive a show. I for example had always found the storylines of One Piece quite interesting but cannot into reading the manga because the art style is so very distracting to my eyes. It prevents me from fully enjoying the story. Doesn't mean it's a bad design, it's famous and lots of people enjoy it but it simply doesn't cut it for me.

ViVid design is not bad but it feels different. If that's good or bad I'll find out while watching it. Although my main beef is with the narrative and pacing. I hope thus anime keeps some of the Nanoha spirit and doesn't try to be another Kaleid Prisma Ilya (god I hate that series).

[LoweGear]

Originally Posted by Alastoryagami

Let's compare images.

You do realize that using promotional art to compare the anime art style isn't really a good method of comparison, since most of the time the promotional artwork is much, much better than the anime's?

Yes, the selected promotional art for Vivid in this comparison is a bit simplistic compared to the selected StrikerS artstyle, however this is only indicative of the art between the promotional arts themselves, and not the anime.

[Alastoryagami]

Originally Posted by FlamingMangos

I don't get how a character design can ruin your overall experience. It still makes no sense whatsoever. I just never seen anyone talk about an art style ruining their overall experience or seen it in reviews nor has it affected me badly in any way in my entire life. Its not a picture here and the art style for Vivid isn't even bad at all. You say that it relies on the quality of character designs but has there ever a bad character design for any fanservice show? Please name me one show. This one isn't bad at all. Theres no such thing as bad character design. They're unique in their own way..

Originally Posted by LoweGear

You do realize that using promotional art to compare the anime art style isn't really a good method of comparison, since most of the time the promotional artwork is much, much better than the anime's?

Yes, the selected promotional art for Vivid in this comparison is a bit simplistic compared to the selected StrikerS artstyle, however this is only indicative of the art between the promotional arts themselves, and not the anime.

__________________________

Originally Posted by Alastoryagami

One is good art, the other is generic art. I understand that while both images are official, they're not the exact character designs used in the anime. But it is a compare and contrast between high quality art and average art.

I did mention that. The debate was character designs and animation matter, not which anime has better character designs and animation. That being said, it's not a good sign when the promotional art for Vivid has been inferior to StrikerS promotional art in every instance. StrikerS has had a few QUALITY promotional art but it's pretty uncommon. The Nanoha movie art has also been really good.

As far as the anime itself goes, Vivid may have more consistent animation because it's newer and has a bigger (Probably?) budget,but I still think the character designs are far weaker than A's/StrikerS. Nanoha has always had really good character designs, what they lacked was consistency while animating them.

[FlamingMangos]

Originally Posted by Alastoryagami

__________________________



I did mention that. The debate was character designs and animation matter, not which anime has better character designs and animation. That being said, it's not a good sign when the promotional art for Vivid has been inferior to StrikerS promotional art in every instance. StrikerS has had a few QUALITY promotional art but it's pretty uncommon. The Nanoha movie art has also been really good.

As far as the anime itself goes, Vivid may have more consistent animation because it's newer and has a bigger (Probably?) budget,but I still think the character designs are far weaker than A's/StrikerS. Nanoha has always had really good character designs, what they lacked was consistency while animating them.

Wow, you guys are just proving my point even more. The art style is the only thing u guys are talking about. Also, I don't know why you keep saying that its a bad sign when the character design for Vivid is inferior like its a fact. Its clearly subjective and your own opinion. You can't possibly compare two art style because they have their own appeal and they're different. I still don't understand whats you guys mean by generic art....

[Alastoryagami]

Originally Posted by FlamingMangos

Wow, you guys are just proving my point even more. The art style is the only thing u guys are talking about. Also, I don't know why you keep saying that its a bad sign when the character design for Vivid is inferior like its a fact. Its clearly subjective and your own opinion. You can't possibly compare two art style because they have their own appeal and they're different. I still don't understand whats you guys mean by generic art....

The artstyle/Character designs is the only thing we can talk about. It's the only thing of relevance going by what we've seen so far from the anime. A bunch of still shots with a tiny bit of animation thrown in.


Warning, opinion alert below this line!
_________________________________________

You can call it an opinion, but you asked what our problem is with the character designs, and we told you. Some people think K-ON designs are good, I personally think they're an abomination and are the reason a lot of modern anime have stooped to their level. I also think it's the reason Kyoani has went to crap over the past years. They were so much better back with Clannad and Kanon. Their most recent series aren't even a shadow of their former glory...And I feel the new art they use is part of the problem. Generic is when something is unoriginal to a large extent. Most artists have their own unique style, yet lately studios have been trying to mimic each other trying to make designs that sell. The Nanoha series has designs I couldn't find in any other series, yet Nanoha Vivid designs look like something PA staff or even Kyoani has done in the past.

[Keroko]

Originally Posted by Alastoryagami

In the first image, Nanoha doesn't even look like an adult, she's more akin to Vivio's sister. She lacks curves and her eyes are taking up a lot of room on her face even for Nanoha design standards. Meanwhile, Vivio looks seven kinds of derpy. Their chins also look more like a pointed object than an actual chin.

The Nanoha cast has always suffered from looking like kids heads planted on adult bodies since StrikerS. It's an artifact born from the attempt to keep the character designs while making the girls look like they grew up, but it ended up making them look out of place with the rest of the cast. The new style changed the overall design, which as a side effect means the trio looks less out of place.

Originally Posted by Alastoryagami

The second image. Look at those curves! That ass, those hips, that bust. Truly a titillating image. The faces are also very cute and well proportioned.

Well, yes. That's because the second image is going for sexy, while the first is going for cute. Of course the second is going to look more titillating.

[Alastoryagami]

Originally Posted by Keroko

The Nanoha cast has always suffered from looking like kids heads planted on adult bodies since StrikerS. It's an artifact born from the attempt to keep the character designs while making the girls look like they grew up, but it ended up making them look out of place with the rest of the cast. The new style changed the overall design, which as a side effect means the trio looks less out of place.

I don't agree with that. They looked good to me in StrikerS. They're only nineteen, they don't look "old" but they certainly don't look like children, either. Their facial structure is also quit a bit different if you compare their child selves with their adult selves. I'd need some kind of image reference for what you're referring to, because I don't remember that at all.

The new design does not make them look any older, and Vivid takes place four years after StrikerS. It just makes them look like entirely different people. Certainly not a good thing when you've becomes accustomed to characters looking a certain way for over ten years.

Well, yes. That's because the second image is going for sexy, while the first is going for cute. Of course the second is going to look more titillating.

The second image is both cute and sexy to me. The first image is neither. Poorly drawn is the first word I came up with when I first saw it.

[ramlaen]

Originally Posted by Alastoryagami

Let's compare images.

The old art is the epitome of generic, have some tits and ass just don't mind the awful faces. Perfect for horny teenagers, which some of us were when Nanoha first aired.

[Alastoryagami]

Originally Posted by ramlaen

The old art is the epitome of generic, have some tits and ass just don't mind the awful faces. Perfect for horny teenagers, which some of us were when Nanoha first aired.

*snip*

Have you even watched the Nanoha series, or did you just come to troll? Or perhaps it's because you're salty that I remarked how I dislike Kyoani in its former state. Either way, I understand people exist who think K-ON is a work of art, but it's very disheartening that 7arcs is putting this series in the hands of A-1. They already made the characters look like completely different people. I suppose altering their personalities is what comes next.

With that out of the way...

You do realize Nanoha Vivid is more related to tits and ass than any other Nanoha series, right? The original series has a lot more than tits and ass going for it, and I can't really say the same thing about Nanoha Vivid. And here lies the problem. A-1 chose the moeblob route over the sex appeal route for a series that predominantly relies on fanservice. Quite frankly, I would be embarrassed to recommend Nanoha Vivid to someone in its current form. If it at least went the sex appeal route I could lure in the horny teenagers! Hey, they're people too.

Edit: Aw shit, I forgot about all the naked lolis. I guess that explains everything.

[rladls2121]

Too bad Yuuno might not going to appear much.
He could have been the highest possibility of becoming Vivio's father, and Nanoha's husband but...

Vivio's narration, it makes me laugh too much.
I guess I was too used to Nanoha's narration.
Now it is Vivio that finally earned her peaceful daily life since StirkerS, she gets to start her own story.

The casting voice was too obvious for me to hear.

[CrowKenobi]

Let's move away from discussing the art style of the upcoming series since it seems to ruffle the feathers of some people the wrong way. When the series begins, art style discussion can resume in a calm and civil matter.

[ramlaen]

I am curious how they will (re)introduce Ixy, given that the TV watching audience cannot be expected to have listened to SSX.

[relentlessflame]

Originally Posted by CrowKenobi

Let's move away from discussing the art style of the upcoming series since it seems to ruffle the feathers of some people the wrong way. When the series begins, art style discussion can resume in a calm and civil matter.

But this aside, I would also like to point out: this anime is an adaptation of the Nanoha ViVid manga, and the promotional art is doing its best to reflect the art style of the manga, which has a different character designer (and an overall "cuter look") than the original anime. There's no sense chastising the anime in particular for being truer to the source material in this case. Preferences are fine, but please adjust your expectations accordingly.

[NiwaDaisuke]

Originally Posted by rladls2121

Too bad Yuuno might not going to appear much.
He could have been the highest possibility of becoming Vivio's father, and Nanoha's husband but...

Masaki Tsuzuki doesn't have the balls to take that role away from Fate.

[b33g]

BTW, something about signboards.

http://nanoha-vivid.tv/news/index.html#news34114

[Alastoryagami]

Seems they're putting up signboards for Vivid up in Tokyo. Not uncommon for anime promotion.