[Game] Umineko no Naku Koro ni Chiru - Ep. 5 End of the golden witch

[Oliver]

Originally Posted by rogerpepitone

Doesn't Shannon say she has a decent amount saved up?

Do you believe her? In a scene where she receives the engagement ring that Battler never gets to see himself, ever? I'm not sure. It's all so neatly assumed and so full of holes...

[Metaler]

Originally Posted by Oliver

Do you believe her? In a scene where she receives the engagement ring that Battler never gets to see himself, ever? I'm not sure. It's all so neatly assumed and so full of holes...

Well, I do believe that she's paid. I mean, I don't think she lives in Rokkenjima, so she must be able to afford a house in one way or another. And besides, knowing how Shannon has that furniture complex, I don't think she spends a lot of money, which explains why she's been saving so much.
Although, if she really is paid, I assume that her sallary is pretty damn good. xD

[Oliver]

Originally Posted by Metaler

Well, I do believe that she's paid. I mean, I don't think she lives in Rokkenjima, so she must be able to afford a house in one way or another. And besides, knowing how Shannon has that furniture complex, I don't think she spends a lot of money, which explains why she's been saving so much.
Although, if she really is paid, I assume that her sallary is pretty damn good. xD

Basically the only servant of the set who is definitely known to have a life off the island is Kumasawa. Genji would basically have to be a live-in butler, but no dwelling for him is mentioned. Gohda has a history of living off the island given in his own release of TIPS, but his current living arrangements are not described. But Shannon and Kanon are a complete blank.

We assume they all have those things, but there's nothing clear about it and assumptions may go very wildly off the mark and conflict with other assumptions. After all, if Shannon "wants to leave the island", what's the problem? She can go vacation all the way out at Okinawa, can't she?

[Kylon99]

Originally Posted by Oliver

We assume they all have those things, but there's nothing clear about it and assumptions may go very wildly off the mark and conflict with other assumptions. After all, if Shannon "wants to leave the island", what's the problem? She can go vacation all the way out at Okinawa, can't she?

Ok, Lack-of-Sleep-Theory time!

Shannon has been shown going off the island so she is not disbarred from leaving the island by authority.

So... simplest other answer is... She has a self-enforced obligation to stay. Same with Kanon and Genji, I think. And so maybe the obligation is, or used to have something to do with Kinzo.

[Renall]

If she had an actual legal or moral obligation to act in some manner, and acting in that manner could cause her other difficulties, then there would be problems with leaving permanently but also problems with that obligation. Neither of which prohibits her from taking a vacation or leaving the island temporarily. As we've always observed, there's no real physical obstacle to it.

[winter 923]

i think it was stated in the very early Episodes that servants get paid very well so these Orphans work some years and after that got enough to start a live, thats why it is not strange to see often new faces and it is "strange" (its not if you know the reason) that Shannon is working so long for them.

ofc this does not count for Genji and Kuwasama who are longtime servants and friends to Kinzo.

[Oliver]

Originally Posted by winter 923

i think it was stated in the very early Episodes that servants get paid very well so these Orphans work some years and after that got enough to start a live, thats why it is not strange to see often new faces and it is "strange" (its not if you know the reason) that Shannon is working so long for them.

The only two sources on that are Battler's narration in Ep1 (problematic on it's own because at this stage Battler assumes way too much himself and is often known to be wrong) and the George confession scene.

This is nowhere as simple as some would like to believe.

[winter 923]

uhm, in EP5 it is known that Genji, Kumasawa, Nanjo, Shannon and Kanon are getting paid (i do not remember correctly anymore but i think it is) twice as much as any other Servant to keep their mouth shut and also a onetime (yearly?) bonus. This only happend 2-3 years ago so still could be questioned. But i rather see her as someone who stays on this island because of someone instead of beeing forced or poor.

ofc nothing of all this is red so everything is open to interpretation and questioning if it is true at all.

Also the reason for Shannon not leaving

Spoiler for extra TIPS and EP6:

She knows very much about Battler from 7+ years ago and also asked Rudolf every year about Battler, it is also believed that she is the one asking Battler how his perfect girl should be like. She loves George and is near an engagement

i do totaly agree with Genji and Kuwasama

[Judoh]

Originally Posted by Oliver

Do you believe her? In a scene where she receives the engagement ring that Battler never gets to see himself, ever? I'm not sure. It's all so neatly assumed and so full of holes...

I don't know if it was when Battler was around, but doesn't Shannon or somebody imply she doesn't spend a lot of money on one occasion?

It wasn't during the engagement scene I know that much...

[Oliver]

Originally Posted by Judoh

I don't know if it was when Battler was around, but doesn't Shannon or somebody imply she doesn't spend a lot of money on one occasion?

It wasn't during the engagement scene I know that much...

It was.

`"I wonder...`@` It's not like there's anything in particular I'd like to buy...`@` I think about a few million yen, which isn't enough to live off of for the rest of my life..."`¥

Mind you, she also says "I have nowhere to go outside of this mansion." in this scene. If she has any off-island lodgings, how would that be exactly?

[Metaler]

Originally Posted by Oliver

Mind you, she also says "I have nowhere to go outside of this mansion." in this scene. If she has any off-island lodgings, how would that be exactly?

Huh... does that mean she works like 24/7 on the mansion? o___O

[Judoh]

Originally Posted by Metaler

Huh... does that mean she works like 24/7 on the mansion? o___O

Well she is a clean freak... But of course she gets sleep and breaks and all that.

[Metaler]

Originally Posted by Judoh

Well she is a clean freak... But of course she gets sleep and breaks and all that.

True, but even someone like Shannon or Kanon probably take a break for a few days... And if they do, where do they stay at? XDDD

[Judoh]

Originally Posted by Metaler

True, but even someone like Shannon or Kanon probably take a break for a few days... And if they do, where do they stay at? XDDD

The servants rooms? They have beds there you know... It's really not that strange.

[luckyssol]

Originally Posted by Judoh

The servants rooms? They have beds there you know... It's really not that strange.

I assume that they beds in there too but does it ever specifically say where Shannon sleeps?

Spoiler for EP6:

By the way, Shannon works about 3 days per week.

[Judoh]

Originally Posted by Ssol

I assume that they beds in there too but does it ever specifically say where Shannon sleeps?

Actually no I don't think they tell us that. It's things like this that are probably meant to be assumed though.

[Metaler]

Originally Posted by Judoh

The servants rooms? They have beds there you know... It's really not that strange.

Well yeah, but it's not like there are rooms for each individual servants, and I assume there are actually quite a lot... Or not, I don't know. >___>

[Leafsnail]

The whole point of breaks are to give them a chance to go home... although if they don't have anywhere else, I guess they just loaf around the mansion during their breaks?

Although the character sheet ("Just happened to be on duty") seems to imply otherwise. Hmm.

[Oliver]

The question of servant living arrangements, both off duty and on duty, and their personal lives is very important... and very muddled.

From memory, the list of rooms in the mansion is like this:

Dining hall, parlor, kitchen, entrance hall, guestrooms (unspecified number), VIP guest room, servant room, servant waiting room, Krauss study, Kinzo study, Natsuhi's room, Jessica' room, boiler room, underground storage room.

Nothing that looks even remotely like a permanent dwelling for any servant, even Genji, who is basically so important for the operation of the household that he can't be replaced. Historically, in Victorian households which the Ushiromiya mansion is patterned on, live-in servants usually would have rooms of their own or shared with other servants, generally small and hidden out of the way, like in the attic, and would hang out within easy signalling distance (phones, bells, whatever available) while on duty. The servant waiting room is obviously such a hangout location, but it does not look like anyone's permanent dwelling.

So -- we still don't know where do they normally live, normally sleep, what do they occupy their time with off duty and where.

In particular for Shannon, Kanon and the hypothetical Sayo/Shkanon this is a question of paramount importance, because if they have a life off island, nothing stops them from pursuing Battler outside it (Didn't Shannon meet George at an aquarium after acquiring the brooch?) and if they don't have a life off island, their living arrangements on the island remain undefined. (Didn't Shannon start working at six years? She describes herself as "middle schooler" later, did she actually attend school? Where did she live? Which school was it? How exactly does this work?)

[Jan-Poo]

There are at least two servant waiting rooms. One at the first floor and one at the third.
Then obviously there must be Krauss' bedroom even if it was never mentioned. Plus Krauss' secret room with the ingot (unless you believe it was a fake scene).

Shannon should have attended school, or at least that's what everyone should believe. Hiring a six year old girl as a servant is criminal as it is, preventing her from going to school at all is even more criminal.
I can't believe that Natsuhi, who takes so much pride in the Ushiromiya good name, wouldn't care at all about such a shameful thing.

But yeah... clearly there's something amiss here...