Madan no Ou to Vanadis [Light Novel]

[Insane]

Speculations:
1. Durandal merges with his black bow, forming a bowgun.
2. Durandal becomes his "main arrow" for finishing move (kinda ridiculous but, meh.....)
3. Tigre meets someone whom he can entrust the sword with (I hope it's female. More harem!)
4. Ganlon (or some powerful figures from behind the curtains) steals the sword.

My overall opinion, instead of making Durandal his, Tigre should master his black bow first.

[willx]

^ Pretty sure it'll be #3, but boy.. I hope it's not a woman. It's a HUGE sword, it'd be awfully unrealistic (then again this is a fantasy light novel setting..).

I have to admit whenever I played RPGs like Baldur's Gate and you could create a protagonist, I would always create a swordsman or a hybrid mage/knight. Sitting back as an archer never felt heroic enough.. And now this story is smacking me in the face with it.. And I don't mind

[Insane]

Originally Posted by willx

^ Pretty sure it'll be #3, but boy.. I hope it's not a woman. It's a HUGE sword, it'd be awfully unrealistic (then again this is a fantasy light novel setting..).

I have to admit whenever I played RPGs like Baldur's Gate and you could create a protagonist, I would always create a swordsman or a hybrid mage/knight. Sitting back as an archer never felt heroic enough.. And now this story is smacking me in the face with it.. And I don't mind

Kinda agree with you. Somehow, looking at Tigre who can only shoot his enemies from afar is quite a letdown for me. But meh, he still have his superpowered brain that even surpass his archery.

Just looking at spoilers on JCafe24. Man, the action scenes in this series is very cool and detailed (and every character have their own shining moments, unlike DxD that goes Fight - Strike - Kill - Finish, often just being described by Issei when a character's fight is already over), but political intrigues in this series make my brain kinda messy.

[willx]

^ Well my point was that this story has turned my premise/prejudice on its head and .. I admit that I was wrong!

[whsie]

Originally Posted by Insane

Really!? Probably i should get back to JCafe24 for awhile (no clue there's such spoilers). For now, i think i would refrain myself from asking too many questions there since those guys on JCafe24 rather sensitive about questions regarding spoilers and summaries. Aaaah, if only i knew Erhjegel from the start, i would dump all of my questions towards him (Many thanks, Erhjegel!)

I mentioned it a while back in regards to the "side quest" the group takes.

Spoiler for Small addition:

the little goddess also congratulated Tigre on truly activating the power of the bow by himself for the first time.

[bones]

Just want to ask if it's specifically stated that only those of Tigre's line can use the bow? If so, I wonder does the duke who's wary of it's power ever try to assassinate Tigre in order to get rid of this threat like he did for Roland.

[Drkz]

...why are people so obessed with main characters using a sword? Come on. Robin Hood never used a sword and people never went anal over that. ... I'm pretty sure with how the author is. TIGRE WILL NEVER USE A SWORD. Neither will the bow magically manifest into something else not happening. A person can't be a good tactician and use a legendary sword at the same time. It'd make them a complete broken existence something that won't exist in this series.

[XFire]

Originally Posted by Drkz

...why are people so obessed with main characters using a sword? Come on. Robin Hood never used a sword and people never went anal over that. ... I'm pretty sure with how the author is. TIGRE WILL NEVER USE A SWORD. Neither will the bow magically manifest into something else not happening. A person can't be a good tactician and use a legendary sword at the same time. It'd make them a complete broken existence something that won't exist in this series.

Isn't that what the Vanadis do? The tactician and sword thing, I mean.

About why people want a sword-using hero, take a look at Heroes Prefer Swords on Tv Tropes. It gives a pretty good explanation in the second paragraph.

[blackwhite67]

Alright:
1. Swords are cool. Picking off someone with an arrow is a bit anti-climatic, but Madan no Ou Vanadis makes it work.
2. People! For the last time, Tigre is not going to wield Durandal! He is an archer for long range in a country that places emphasis on swords and the glory of CQC. This is what makes him the main character and gives him his edge. CQC can be left to his harem and he sucks at CQC anyway.

Spoiler for Speculation:

Strange that the Black bow summoned a black dragon when it was said that a black dragon in human form granted the Vanadis their Viralts. The bow was granted by Tir Na Fa, the goddess of death. If I apply the knowledge from Campione!'s Athena, then dragons have a deep connection with the goddess of death.

BTW, whatever happened to the black dragon Tigre summoned? Did it magically vanish or something?

[Insane]

Originally Posted by Drkz

...why are people so obessed with main characters using a sword? Come on. Robin Hood never used a sword and people never went anal over that. ... I'm pretty sure with how the author is. TIGRE WILL NEVER USE A SWORD. Neither will the bow magically manifest into something else not happening. A person can't be a good tactician and use a legendary sword at the same time. It'd make them a complete broken existence something that won't exist in this series.

Probably some people just too obsessed with certain RPG's where the main character capable of using sword and bow at the same time.

[Drkz]

Originally Posted by Insane

Probably some people just too obsessed with certain RPG's where the main character capable of using sword and bow at the same time.

Sadly the novel isn't close to a rpg. If anything its more similar to a rts. Even in RPGs people stick to their classes. You don't see mages use swords do you?

[Kleeyook]

Originally Posted by Drkz

Sadly the novel isn't close to a rpg. If anything its more similar to a rts. Even in RPGs people stick to their classes. You don't see mages use swords do you?

Archer from Fate/Stay Nights uses swords as his main weapon. Of course he's an amazing archer too. It's not uncommon for someone to be able to master many martial arts (even Buddha masters 18 arts of wielding weapon). It's just that Tigre's talent is solely for archery.

Berserker from the same series on the other hand, have the noble phantasm for shooting the arrow, but his own reflex is too slow to use so it's useless... only for Shirou to copy it.

[Drkz]

Originally Posted by Kleeyook

Archer from Fate/Stay Nights uses swords as his main weapon. Of course he's an amazing archer too. It's not uncommon for someone to be able to master many martial arts (even Buddha masters 18 arts of wielding weapon). It's just that Tigre's talent is solely for archery.

Berserker from the same series on the other hand, have the noble phantasm for shooting the arrow, but his own reflex is too slow to use so it's useless... only for Shirou to copy it.

FSN isn't a rpg its a eroge. Archer's talent isn't archery.

Berserker has the potential to be in any class other than caster.

Where are you going with this? How does this relate to vanadis?

[Kleeyook]

Originally Posted by Drkz

FSN isn't a rpg its a eroge. Archer's talent isn't archery.

Berserker has the potential to be in any class other than caster.

Where are you going with this? How does this relate to vanadis?

Umm. Well, I talked off-topic a bit. Eroge is definitely no RPG, but the class system in FSN is exactly like one.

But Emiya Shirou is very good at archery, just to remind you. It's just that dual wielding is way cooler...

Berserker's own noble phantasm that he can't use is just like how Tigre has Durandal but sucks at fencing...

I didn't talk about the vanadis, I talked about Tigre.

[Insane]

Originally Posted by Kleeyook

Archer from Fate/Stay Nights uses swords as his main weapon. Of course he's an amazing archer too. It's not uncommon for someone to be able to master many martial arts (even Buddha masters 18 arts of wielding weapon). It's just that Tigre's talent is solely for archery.

Isn't it because he have multiple hands that enabling him to wields multiple weapons at once? (sorry for getting off topic)

Speaking about Tigre, i wanna see him get wounded from close combat at least once, recover, and gaining new power-up during recovery (since most shounen series tend to use such pattern). Perhaps his black bow will materialize itself into more powerful version.

[whsie]

I wouldn't hold on to the hope of Tigre using a sword. The author specifically stated in the afterwords of volume 1 that he's writing about a mc who wields the bow with a huge emphasis on the last part.

[Insane]

Originally Posted by whsie

I wouldn't hold on to the hope of Tigre using a sword. The author specifically stated in the afterwords of volume 1 that he's writing about a mc who wields the bow with a huge emphasis on the last part.

But isn't it creating very fatal flaw for him? With just bow and his specialization in long range attack, he has no way to defend from CQC attack, making him extremely vulnerable. It feels rather forced if he have to relying on his harem to making cover for him so that he can taking down his enemies from afar all the time.

[blackwhite67]

That's how main characters with harems work. Just look at Campione. Not all series are about the main character powering up and defeating opponents by themselves. They rely on others to make up for their shortcomings like Megaman.

[Athena]

Originally Posted by Insane

Probably some people just too obsessed with certain RPG's where the main character capable of using sword and bow at the same time.

And if Tigre ever gets those two, someone will ask why doesn't he use guns too.

Originally Posted by blackwhite67

That's how main characters with harems work. Just look at Campione. Not all series are about the main character powering up and defeating opponents by themselves. They rely on others to make up for their shortcomings like Megaman.

Many of the LNs have become like this. Blade Dance and CSR are also examples. I'm sure Ellun (or whatever it's spelled) will end up covering for Tigre, and vice-versa. Or else, it's gonna end up into the "Actually, this is not my true strength. Take that!" or "I need to get--STRONGER *levels up*".

[Hemisphere]

Rushing down the strongest Knight of Knights out of Brune (who strikes fear into everyone including the Vanadis) and barely dodging a slash from Durandal in order to save a beaten Vanadis isn't brave? I beg to differ. Just because Tigre is an archer doesn't mean that he is heroic, considering that he charges into the fray many, many times in order to quickly turn the tide of battle and save as many of his soldiers as he possibly can.

Originally Posted by XFire

Isn't that what the Vanadis do? The tactician and sword thing, I mean.

About why people want a sword-using hero, take a look at Heroes Prefer Swords on Tv Tropes. It gives a pretty good explanation in the second paragraph.

The Vanadis are all capable warriors, generals and politicians, but they only stick to their Viralts. They only fight with one weapon, and they are more than very proficient with what they use. Same with Tigre.

So I don't see why Tigre has to suddenly use a sword, when all the Vanadis stick to what they all do best. Why does the main character suddenly have to live up to a new standard just for the sake of being cool and cripple everything that made him good in the process?

Originally Posted by bones

Just want to ask if it's specifically stated that only those of Tigre's line can use the bow? If so, I wonder does the duke who's wary of it's power ever try to assassinate Tigre in order to get rid of this threat like he did for Roland.

Tigre closely resembles the ancestor who received the Black Bow from Tir na Fa, according to the goddess herself. It's heavily implied that not only his line can use the Black Bow, but that Tigre himself was the one the bow was waiting for.

Voljenoi went to pay Tigre and Lyudmila a "visit", but in the end he got pushed away by Tigre using the power of the Black Bow in tandem with Lyudmila's Viralt. If you put it in RPG terms, Voljenoi's visit ended up triggering an event battle from which Tigre levelled up and gained a bit more affinity with the bow. Ganlon made the wise choice; to leave Tigre as he is (and not send any enemies which might end up forcing Tigre to gain more affinity with the Black Bow's power) up to Tenaldie where he knew that they would just end up fighting with just their armies and not rely on the power of the bow. Little did Ganlon know about what would happen later...

Ganlon only managed to assassinate Roland because he did not have Durandal with him at the time during his visit to the palace. Ganlon saw his opportunity to be completely inhumanely horrible and he took it.

PS. Again, this isn't shounen. *groans*