AnimeSuki Forums

Guido · 2004-06-01, 02:19

It is unlikely that this going to happen, but actually I was working with the following fanfic speculation: what if there's a possibility for Arakawa Hiromu to introduce new Homunculi aside from the already established seven in the manga?

My answer is both yes and no, and let me explain you why.

For this to happen, Arakawa-san should extend the plot from what he originally foretold in the manga. As it is important for him to explain the role and relation of this unknown Homunculi would regard to the preconception of the Philosopher's Stone and the Elrics.
However, the flaw on this relies that there's not enough time for the anime to do that. I mean we're just 18 episode from the finale, and that leaves neither time nor space to develop new characters aside from the multiple cast already settled.

Nonetheless, it is possible for Arakawa-san to introduce new characters this far, at least in the manga. Because he wants to continue working on with the manga, after the anime has ended.

The only possibility to work this fanfic theory for the anime is if the show should be extended at least 26 episodes from the already 51 budgeted. Something that won't happen due that Sony announced that FMA only will last for 51 episodes.

Another important aspect for this happening is that the introduction of said Homunculi should be done in any manner that will not disrupt the flow or progress of the plot whatsoever. In order to do that, these Homunculi should or must be hinted at.

What I mean is that if the crew would not like that new character's role and introduction seems farfetch'd to the audience, there has to been time and the right moment to give hints of them and give them fair treatment before introducing them. However, I say it again there's no time for the anime to do that unless the show is extended.

There's also the matter that the plot clearly has stated that only seven appear. However, the plot hints that all those seven were created from sins of people who transgressed the laws of alchemy: The Elrics, Izumi, Dante, and others to come. Thus, their names taken from the deadly sins.

Another possibility for this to happen relies in Pride. He/she/it has appeared neither in the anime nor in the manga. This leads to a nice plot twist in which I could speculate that Pride knows about the existence of other borned Homunculi which the other six may not know of. This said Homunculi could be either waiting on the other side or being summoned by Pride, because he/she/it could be aware that they play an essential role to the Philosopher's Stone preconception. There's also this fanfic theory proposed by me that could turn out in an awesome plot twist and lies if it was Pride himself/herself who created said Homunculi or born from him/her, with the help of an important Alchemist, (that you maybe aware of) of course.

However, I say it again, there has to be enough time for this to happen, so that these new characters can be developed at their full extent.

The Homunculi that I'm treating for this fanfic discussion, I put their names from the four signs of the Apocalypse (the riders).

Death
Plague / Pest
Famine
War

Joe Dalton · 2004-06-01, 02:26

ok... 2 uninteresting topics in less time than it takes the average person to say epistrimictristrisimitreyomino

Yebyosh · 2004-06-01, 04:12

The only thing I shall say is "Do not equate Arakawa-sensei to be involved in the anime." She has no involvement with its plot. The only part she has was being the creator & writer of the manga. The anime adapted the first half of its series from the manga. Any thing deviant from the manga is their own creation and involves none of Arakawa's decisions. She can only sit on the sidelines and keep her mouth shut or give insincere pleasantries on how the anime is going on.

Sonhex · 2004-06-01, 06:13

Pride does appear in the manga albeit in one panel...

I doubt there would be an 8th Sin in the anime or manga, I don't think Bones or the Arakawa Hiromu would reinvent that particular wheel. It is clear Pride and Wrath are different in the anime though.

So hypothetically if we're talking about suggestions for a 8th Sin (out of pure fun) I would think your suggestions of the Horsemen wouldn't work, they are afterall 'processes' that can result from Sin rather than abhorrent human traits that lead to evil and wrong doing.

For example - War can result from Greed and Wrath, Famine can result from Gluttony and Sloth, Death can result from any Sin (either self inflicted or as a victim). Plague is a natural process, indifferent to humanity, so I geuss it doesn't count..?

Here's some suggestions though...

- Murder - ability to steal lives without reason
- Selfishness - inability to think for others
- Corruption - ability to corrupt minds
- Taxation - fiscal absorption

Sonhex

Fei-san · 2004-06-01, 07:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sonhex

Pride does

- Murder - ability to steal lives without reason....Qué?
- Selfishness - inability to think for others...Greed
- Corruption - ability to corrupt minds...Greed
- Taxation - fiscal absorption

...Greed

Sonhex

All those are same as Greed
-

Sonhex · 2004-06-01, 08:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fei-san

All those are same as Greed
-

Well, yeah I geuss Greed is murderous, selfish and corrupt. But then so is Gluttony and Envy....

Sonhex

Yebyosh · 2004-06-01, 10:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sonhex

Pride does appear in the manga albeit in one panel...

Pride has not appeared in the manga at all.

Spoiler for Manga's Homunculus & Sins:

The manga concept for the Sins is different from the anime's concept (different people, different concept). But the goal for their implementation by both Arakawa-sensei, the mangaka (for the manga) and the anime crew (for the anime) is the same. Basing it on the Seven Cardinal Sins.

To suddenly create one new Sin out of nowhere without any basis is a cheapening of the concept and renders any mystique to it as a cheap parlour trick. You might as well as 50 cheapo-Sins at the end of the anime for Ed & his Scooby Gang to chakra their way through or something, one cheapo-Sin at a time with names like Dopey, Sleepy, Grumpy, etc.

Sonhex · 2004-06-01, 11:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yebyosh

Pride has not appeared in the manga at all...

I stand corrected, but I was sure...

Spoiler:

Sonhex

El Diablo · 2004-06-01, 11:55

Spoiler:

On a side note, why do you always add your name to the bottom of posts?

Sonhex · 2004-06-01, 11:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by El Diablo

Spoiler:

On a side note, why do you always add your name to the bottom of posts?

Damn yeah, you're right, I was well mixed up there...

Why do I add my name to my posts? Not sure, why?

Sonhex

zhoos · 2004-06-02, 00:07

Pride has always been in the manga and the anime.

He's King Bradley. For those who don't know who he is, he's the Furher, who's the big boss of the army, that Sloth follows around. He's the first homunculus who commands Envy, Sloth, Lust, and Gluttony. His homunculus tattoo is under his eye patch.

It's in volume 7 of the manga.

Yebyosh · 2004-06-02, 01:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by zhoos

Pride has always been in the manga and the anime.

<snipped, zhoos should have spoiler tagged it>

It's in volume 7 of the manga.

Very very very wrong. In the manga, there is no Pride as of the moment. The character referred is Wrath. Vol 7 doesn't even identify him except revealing what he is. Chapter 31 (i.e. Vol 8) identifies him.

zhoos · 2004-06-03, 12:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yebyosh

Very very very wrong. In the manga, there is no Pride as of the moment. The character referred is Wrath. Vol 7 doesn't even identify him except revealing what he is. Chapter 31 (i.e. Vol 8) identifies him.

The thing is, if in the anime Wrath is the boy who has Ed's arms and legs, Bradley should be the last Homunculi then - which is Pride. Am I not right?

It makes sense. He has an eyepatch, Sloth listens to him, he directs Huges to sloth to get him killed, etc... Otherwise how would he rise up to the ranks of being the King of the country anyways, being a mere non-alchemist?

Yebyosh · 2004-06-03, 13:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by zhoos

The thing is, if in the anime Wrath is the boy who has Ed's arms and legs, Bradley should be the last Homunculi then - which is Pride. Am I not right?

Nope there is the chance that anime Bradley is not a Homunculus.

Quote:

Originally Posted by zhoos

It makes sense. He has an eyepatch, Sloth listens to him, he directs Huges to sloth to get him killed, etc... Otherwise how would he rise up to the ranks of being the King of the country anyways, being a mere non-alchemist?

Lots of people wear eyepatches, just because he's the only one in the anime depicted as wearing one doesn't mean he's special. Does wearing Automail make Ed special?

Sloth is in the position of "The Secretary of the President/Fuhrer", of course she must listen to him. Does that mean a manager is not supposed to listen to his CEO?

There are a lot of non-alchemist Generals, e.g. General Hakuro as well the old fogey Mustang was playing chess with. So when Hughes was promoted to Brigadier General, does that mean he is an Alchemist? Can't Bradley rise to the position of Fuhrer/President through his own capability and good politicking? Not everyone in the high positions of power are Alchemists.

Your speculations are not solid proofs of King Bradley being something other than human.

The anime has deviated greatly from the path the manga has taken since episode 25. There can be no great reliance on manga material that has taken place beyond ep25 as absolute proof of what the anime will become. King Bradley can be a normal person in the anime.

Nice of you to try and twist the subject around. I was originially disputing your conclusion of someone in the manga being a certain identity and now you try to change that you are talking solely about the anime instead.

Guido · 2004-06-03, 13:58

I agree with Yebyosh that there's nothing suspicious with the Führer.

What I can theorize is that King Bradley is controlled by someone else. Reminiscent to King Theoden in LOTR: The Two Towers movie.

However, I'm not meaning that the Führer is mind controlled, but rather deceived or lied by someone within the military aside from 'Sloth' who likely acts as an agent for 'Pride'.
It's a possibility that the Führer has remained calm upon the disastrous events occured in the last five episodes without him knowing, maybe because he has been misinformed otherwise.

I probably suggest that 'Pride' placed agents, without the other Homunculi's knowledge, within the military system. In order for him/her to watch and track their movements maybe because he/she wants to divert their attention from gaining clues on him/her about the Philosopher's Stone, the Homunculi, and the need for the Elric's.

Spoiler:

Another fanfic theory which I propose is that 'Pride' maybe is being aided by an Alchemist (willingly?) who knows more about the Elric's than any other alchemist within the military.

Harkan · 2004-06-03, 15:17

MAybe somone like their dad you mean

zhoos · 2004-06-03, 15:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yebyosh

Nice of you to try and twist the subject around. I was originially disputing your conclusion of someone in the manga being a certain identity and now you try to change that you are talking solely about the anime instead.

Dang u sure are hostile. I was just providing an arguement based on my own perceptions, I'm not insisting that you must believe me.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yebyosh

Sloth is in the position of "The Secretary of the President/Fuhrer", of course she must listen to him. Does that mean a manager is not supposed to listen to his CEO?

Why just stop at Secretary? Envy could easily take the place of the Fuhrer, due to her shapechanging techniques. She/He did it once in the south HQ, but she/he might as well take over Bradley the whole time anyways.

Yebyosh · 2004-06-03, 22:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by zhoos

Dang u sure are hostile. I was just providing an arguement based on my own perceptions, I'm not insisting that you must believe me.

Hostile? You came in here and posted something spoilerish without using the spoiler tags and in a manner of language usage, insisted it was the truth when in fact it was wrong. Read your own first post again. In what manner did your language use suggest it was just a thought/possibility?

Next, you start to try to twist and worm your way out of your "conclusions". I'm not being hostile. I'm being factual about the events that had transpassed.

Quote:

Originally Posted by zhoos

Why just stop at Secretary? Envy could easily take the place of the Fuhrer, due to her shapechanging techniques. She/He did it once in the south HQ, but she/he might as well take over Bradley the whole time anyways.

Wow! I'm sure that explains how Envy can be talking to Sloth on the phone while walking into the room as Bradley at the same time! Well done! But what has this got to do with the Secretary of the Fuhrer having to listen to her superior?!

2004-06-01, 02:19	Link #1
Guido Snobby Gentleman Join Date: May 2004 Location: Monterrey, México Age: 43	Discussing Fanfic theory for new Homunculi It is unlikely that this going to happen, but actually I was working with the following fanfic speculation: what if there's a possibility for Arakawa Hiromu to introduce new Homunculi aside from the already established seven in the manga? My answer is both yes and no, and let me explain you why. For this to happen, Arakawa-san should extend the plot from what he originally foretold in the manga. As it is important for him to explain the role and relation of this unknown Homunculi would regard to the preconception of the Philosopher's Stone and the Elrics. However, the flaw on this relies that there's not enough time for the anime to do that. I mean we're just 18 episode from the finale, and that leaves neither time nor space to develop new characters aside from the multiple cast already settled. Nonetheless, it is possible for Arakawa-san to introduce new characters this far, at least in the manga. Because he wants to continue working on with the manga, after the anime has ended. The only possibility to work this fanfic theory for the anime is if the show should be extended at least 26 episodes from the already 51 budgeted. Something that won't happen due that Sony announced that FMA only will last for 51 episodes. Another important aspect for this happening is that the introduction of said Homunculi should be done in any manner that will not disrupt the flow or progress of the plot whatsoever. In order to do that, these Homunculi should or must be hinted at. What I mean is that if the crew would not like that new character's role and introduction seems farfetch'd to the audience, there has to been time and the right moment to give hints of them and give them fair treatment before introducing them. However, I say it again there's no time for the anime to do that unless the show is extended. There's also the matter that the plot clearly has stated that only seven appear. However, the plot hints that all those seven were created from sins of people who transgressed the laws of alchemy: The Elrics, Izumi, Dante, and others to come. Thus, their names taken from the deadly sins. Another possibility for this to happen relies in Pride. He/she/it has appeared neither in the anime nor in the manga. This leads to a nice plot twist in which I could speculate that Pride knows about the existence of other borned Homunculi which the other six may not know of. This said Homunculi could be either waiting on the other side or being summoned by Pride, because he/she/it could be aware that they play an essential role to the Philosopher's Stone preconception. There's also this fanfic theory proposed by me that could turn out in an awesome plot twist and lies if it was Pride himself/herself who created said Homunculi or born from him/her, with the help of an important Alchemist, (that you maybe aware of) of course. However, I say it again, there has to be enough time for this to happen, so that these new characters can be developed at their full extent. The Homunculi that I'm treating for this fanfic discussion, I put their names from the four signs of the Apocalypse (the riders). Death Plague / Pest Famine War

2004-06-01, 11:55	Link #9
El Diablo Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Age: 36	Spoiler: I'm pretty sure that was sloth On a side note, why do you always add your name to the bottom of posts?

2004-06-03, 13:58	Link #15
Guido Snobby Gentleman Join Date: May 2004 Location: Monterrey, México Age: 43	I agree with Yebyosh that there's nothing suspicious with the Führer. What I can theorize is that King Bradley is controlled by someone else. Reminiscent to King Theoden in LOTR: The Two Towers movie. However, I'm not meaning that the Führer is mind controlled, but rather deceived or lied by someone within the military aside from 'Sloth' who likely acts as an agent for 'Pride'. It's a possibility that the Führer has remained calm upon the disastrous events occured in the last five episodes without him knowing, maybe because he has been misinformed otherwise. I probably suggest that 'Pride' placed agents, without the other Homunculi's knowledge, within the military system. In order for him/her to watch and track their movements maybe because he/she wants to divert their attention from gaining clues on him/her about the Philosopher's Stone, the Homunculi, and the need for the Elric's. Spoiler: My theory, which for now has 0% credibility and will remain like that, is that maybe and just maybe Archer could be an agent working for 'Pride'. Another fanfic theory which I propose is that 'Pride' maybe is being aided by an Alchemist (willingly?) who knows more about the Elric's than any other alchemist within the military.

2004-06-01, 02:26	Link #2
Joe Dalton Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2003	ok... 2 uninteresting topics in less time than it takes the average person to say epistrimictristrisimitreyomino

2004-06-01, 04:12	Link #3
Yebyosh 冤枉的小狗 Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: South East Asia	The only thing I shall say is "Do not equate Arakawa-sensei to be involved in the anime." She has no involvement with its plot. The only part she has was being the creator & writer of the manga. The anime adapted the first half of its series from the manga. Any thing deviant from the manga is their own creation and involves none of Arakawa's decisions. She can only sit on the sidelines and keep her mouth shut or give insincere pleasantries on how the anime is going on.

2004-06-01, 06:13	Link #4
Sonhex Not dead. Yet. Graphic Designer Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: UK	Pride does appear in the manga albeit in one panel... I doubt there would be an 8th Sin in the anime or manga, I don't think Bones or the Arakawa Hiromu would reinvent that particular wheel. It is clear Pride and Wrath are different in the anime though. So hypothetically if we're talking about suggestions for a 8th Sin (out of pure fun) I would think your suggestions of the Horsemen wouldn't work, they are afterall 'processes' that can result from Sin rather than abhorrent human traits that lead to evil and wrong doing. For example - War can result from Greed and Wrath, Famine can result from Gluttony and Sloth, Death can result from any Sin (either self inflicted or as a victim). Plague is a natural process, indifferent to humanity, so I geuss it doesn't count..? Here's some suggestions though... - Murder - ability to steal lives without reason - Selfishness - inability to think for others - Corruption - ability to corrupt minds - Taxation - fiscal absorption Sonhex

2004-06-02, 00:07	Link #11
zhoos Junior Member Join Date: Jun 2004	Pride has always been in the manga and the anime. He's King Bradley. For those who don't know who he is, he's the Furher, who's the big boss of the army, that Sloth follows around. He's the first homunculus who commands Envy, Sloth, Lust, and Gluttony. His homunculus tattoo is under his eye patch. It's in volume 7 of the manga.

2004-06-03, 15:17	Link #16
Harkan Junior Member Join Date: May 2004	MAybe somone like their dad you mean