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[Ithekro]

I would point out that most of those aircraft used by the JMSFD are anti-submarine planes (P-3) and training aircraft (T-5)

The Japanese fleet, in terms of power projection (if armed with more offensive weapons rather than their usual defensive anti-air missiles) is basically 32 destroyers of various designs, including eventually four that are basically helicopter carriers, but called destroyers, and 16 diesel attack submarines.

[maplehurry]

Originally Posted by Jazzrat

I'm kinda with Japan re militarizing just to balance out China's growing influence in the Asia region although I'm curious if their economy and population would be able to sustain any significant grow in military power.

I think their finance minister was whining about all the old people wasting resources in hospitals last year, and that they should be "allowed" to die.

With their aging population, they will need to promote more women to work, and make babies at the same time.

[Xellos-_^]

Originally Posted by MrTerrorist

Hong Kong crowds rally for democracy

1. where were all these pro-democracy activist when the British refuse to let Hong Kong vote in British elections until the last years before the handover back to China?

2. what are these idiots think they are going to achieve?

3. how many of them actually thought about the worst case scenario of bloody crackdown by government military forces?

4. Do they really think the Western government will back them with anything but words?

[SeijiSensei]

Originally Posted by Xellos-_^

can't entirely fault Clinton for that one. lots of Senator and house Rep were against closing military base in their state and district. And Clinton to gets things need to do horse trading which include keeping open some of those bases.

My cricitisms have less to do with bases at home and more to do with bases overseas. Also Clinton failed to push hard for agreements to reduce our nuclear arsenal. I still see that period as full of missed opportunites.

Democratic presidents have rarely stood up to the military-industrial complex for fear of being called "soft" by Republicans. Obama took that line of criticism head on by his pursuit of Bin Laden, his support for surveillance, and his willingness to use drones. Now the Republicans are left having to argue for increased commitments of American forces in Iraq and Syria, two things the vast majority of Americans have no interest in doing.

[risingstar3110]

Well it's true that Japan don't have the populations to sustain large military presence. But they always can hire mercenary, train and get them to fight their war.


The government always can fund secret private military organisation to avoid public backslash, who then can draft soldiers from elsewhere and carry out government deeds. Afghanistan, for example is a good place to adopt kids and train them into military personnel forces. They also can send these kids in to live amongst Japan society, to make sure they hold personal attachment to the country, hence will be more willingly to sacrifice their life later.

Meanwhile Japan can utilise their advantage in technology to build personnel armour unit to increase the fighting capacity of these soldiers of fortunes. And focus their naval strike forces on nuclear submarine instead of standard carriers. This will help them more mobile if need to participate in oversea black op missions to support her ally. They can just call themselves with other non-Japanese name to distance them from JSDF involvement. Something like Mithril or Amalgam or whatever.

[KiraYamatoFan]

Originally Posted by risingstar3110

Well it's true that Japan don't have the populations to sustain large military presence. But they always can hire mercenary, train and get them to fight their war.

Or they can always try something different, but of which the concept has roots in history. One of the most famous concepts in modern history of hiring foreigners who end up serving a nation for a number of years even is France's Légion étrangère. I don't know how this would fit in Japanese society, but it would sure help boosting the numbers as well as to create elite forces of their own under Japanese command. Also, having the title of member of the Legion would be more honorable than being a mere mercenary.

[Ithekro]

If forced to actually start drafting soldiers from both their male and female population, Japan could field a military of about 40 million. There actual military is presently closer to having 300,000 in all branches.

The "Army" has basically 8 divisions of infantry and one tank division. With several additional more specialized brigades. About 150,000 soldiers and 230 tanks.

Their "Air Force" is decent with around 300 fighters, though no bombers. The fighters are presently a mix of the old F-4 Phanton II (being replaced), the Japanese F-2 (an enlarged F-16 Falcon) and the F-15 Eagle, with orders out for the F-35A to replace the F-4s. Japan is also looking into recon drones and a new advanced fighter they know as the F-3.

For their "Navy" there is talk of purchasing some F-35B fighters from time to time to operate off their newest helecopter carriers. No idea if that will go anywhere. It wouldn't be very many since those "carriers" aren't very big in modern terms.

[LoveYouSaber]

Originally Posted by Xellos-_^

1. where were all these pro-democracy activist when the British refuse to let Hong Kong vote in British elections until the last years before the handover back to China?

2. what are these idiots think they are going to achieve?

3. how many of them actually thought about the worst case scenario of bloody crackdown by government military forces?

4. Do they really think the Western government will back them with anything but words?

As someone who took part in that demonstration, maybe I could answer your questions.

1. I personally was too young then, but I agree with your view that you can fault them as being cynical. That however, doesn't mean that we shouldn't be asking for democracy now.

2. I, being an idiot, hopes that by coming out, we can voice our frustrations and urge for a real democracy. I agree that it's a very, very difficult task, but I would rather try than doing nothing. Plus, I watch too much anime, and I think most anime MCs tried to fight battles against tremendous odds.

3. I did think about it, and it's very unlikely. However, if it did come to this, it would be mutually-assured destruction. I am sure the Chinese government would come off much worse. For starters, it would end all hopes of reunification of Taiwan by peaceful means because the people would no way swallow Communist rule. It would lead to finger-pointing amongst party officials and faction in-fighting. They also have to care about international reputation, and if they cracked down on its people, I think that makes their claim that they are a "peaceful rising power" much less believable to other nations right?

4. We are not expecting international sanctions after a mere demonstration protest, so yes, I expected only words. But if the Chinese government were to do another Tiananmen V2 in Hong Kong, I have no doubt there would be serious economic sanctions, and that isn't a price that China right now can suffer.

[SaintessHeart]

Originally Posted by Ithekro

If forced to actually start drafting soldiers from both their male and female population, Japan could field a military of about 40 million. There actual military is presently closer to having 300,000 in all branches.

The "Army" has basically 8 divisions of infantry and one tank division. With several additional more specialized brigades. About 150,000 soldiers and 230 tanks.

Their "Air Force" is decent with around 300 fighters, though no bombers. The fighters are presently a mix of the old F-4 Phanton II (being replaced), the Japanese F-2 (an enlarged F-16 Falcon) and the F-15 Eagle, with orders out for the F-35A to replace the F-4s. Japan is also looking into recon drones and a new advanced fighter they know as the F-3.

For their "Navy" there is talk of purchasing some F-35B fighters from time to time to operate off their newest helecopter carriers. No idea if that will go anywhere. It wouldn't be very many since those "carriers" aren't very big in modern terms.

If Japan truly wants to make life difficult for China, they should continue investing in ASW and non-confrontational airspace denial capabilities. With China routinely sending aircraft and ships to test Japanese territories, Japan could do better not with enhanced air-interdiction, but rather "trolling" the planes with area-wide ship-based EW - jam their nav and comms, or even better, intercept and upload this into their comms everytime they attempt to listen in.

[Ithekro]

I look at the new "revision" of their military policy as a means of expanding there airspace denial and other tactics beyond their current limits. It also allows them to use their technological advancements to cover other countries' waters, should asked.

The main objector that is troublesome is South Korea. History is getting in the way of a more unified defense against North Korea and potentally China. Though the Koreans are capable to defense and offensive actions, they are presently pinned due to North Korea existing. Mutual defense via allowing the Japanese to actually help could better cover the area, with the debatably superior Japanese anti-missile systems.

[SaintessHeart]

Originally Posted by Ithekro

I look at the new "revision" of their military policy as a means of expanding there airspace denial and other tactics beyond their current limits. It also allows them to use their technological advancements to cover other countries' waters, should asked.

The main objector that is troublesome is South Korea. History is getting in the way of a more unified defense against North Korea and potentally China. Though the Koreans are capable to defense and offensive actions, they are presently pinned due to North Korea existing. Mutual defense via allowing the Japanese to actually help could better cover the area, with the debatably superior Japanese anti-missile systems.

Though there is a need to convince the Koreans that the Japanese come in peace. Both sides are treating each other like aliens when their cultures are so similar.

If it wasn't for the Yanks holding the yearly RIMPAC I seriously doubt both sides would have bothered to engage each other in diplomacy.

[Ithekro]

The Korean Navy has more ships than the Japanese Navy at present, thought the Japanese have more Blue-water capable ships as the Koreans have a larger number of patrol combatants and amphibious assault ships. The later is understandable since the Japanese are still not suppose to be able to take offensive actions, and assualt ships are used to invade territory with marine forces. The Japanese have a small number of LSTs (three, of the Oosumi class), but that is not all that much compared to the Koreans six.

Though recent anime may have increased recruitment for various services in Japan. Girls und Panzer likely increased amy enrollment due to tanks, and various naval related anime may increase rerollment in the Navy. Not sure about the Air Force.

[SaintessHeart]

Originally Posted by Ithekro

The Korean Navy has more ships than the Japanese Navy at present, thought the Japanese have more Blue-water capable ships as the Koreans have a larger number of patrol combatants and amphibious assault ships. The later is understandable since the Japanese are still not suppose to be able to take offensive actions, and assualt ships are used to invade territory with marine forces. The Japanese have a small number of LSTs (three, of the Oosumi class), but that is not all that much compared to the Koreans six.

Though recent anime may have increased recruitment for various services in Japan. Girls und Panzer likely increased amy enrollment due to tanks, and various naval related anime may increase rerollment in the Navy. Not sure about the Air Force.

That is pantsu Strike Witches domain. No wonder they are coming up with a new season.

[Fireminer]

I don't think Korean and Japanese won't patch up anytime soon. Not when something like Manga Kenkanryu could be a best-seller.

China doesn't have friend in this region, but her two biggest rivals couldn't come to an alliance. What a shame.

And don't forget Muv-Luv for the Air Force!

[Terrestrial Dream]

Originally Posted by SaintessHeart

Though there is a need to convince the Koreans that the Japanese come in peace. Both sides are treating each other like aliens when their cultures are so similar.

If it wasn't for the Yanks holding the yearly RIMPAC I seriously doubt both sides would have bothered to engage each other in diplomacy.

When a man like Abe is in charge, it is really hard to convince any Koreans.

I really feel iffy about the changes. On one hand, I do believe every country should have right to have its own military if they choose to do so. On the other hand, the change like this should be done with approval of the people.

Japan, please get rid of Abe. I truly believe cooperation between Japan and Korea is necessary for peace and stabilization in East Asia and would love to see it happen.

[GuZidi]

http://www.defensenews.com/article/2...-Grip-Military

BEIJING — The Chinese Communist Party’s dramatic expulsion of a former top general — the most senior figure to fall in President Xi Jinping’s anti-corruption campaign — is an assertion of political control over the powerful and wealthy military, analysts say.

Xu Caihou, former vice chairman of China’s Central Military Commission and until two years ago a member of the ruling party’s elite 25-strong Politburo, was stripped of his party membership on Monday and his case was handed over to prosecutors.

[maplehurry]

Originally Posted by Terrestrial Dream

When a man like Abe is in charge, it is really hard to convince any Koreans.

I really feel iffy about the changes. On one hand, I do believe every country should have right to have its own military if they choose to do so. On the other hand, the change like this should be done with approval of the people.

Japan, please get rid of Abe. I truly believe cooperation between Japan and Korea is necessary for peace and stabilization in East Asia and would love to see it happen.

I have couple issues with Abe, but I think he's "alright", for a conservative. Could've been worse.

[Cosmic Eagle]

Originally Posted by Ithekro

I would point out that most of those aircraft used by the JMSFD are anti-submarine planes (P-3) and training aircraft (T-5)

The Japanese fleet, in terms of power projection (if armed with more offensive weapons rather than their usual defensive anti-air missiles) is basically 32 destroyers of various designs, including eventually four that are basically helicopter carriers, but called destroyers, and 16 diesel attack submarines.

Which is still more of a navy than 75% of the rest of the world's fleets

[Ithekro]

Island nation and all that, especially its size, basically requires a fleet. That their economy can afford it makes it more logical. Places like Australia and New Zeeland have additional support from the Commonwealth while other island nations in Western Pacific just don't have the ecomony to support more than a few ships.

[Xellos-_^]

Originally Posted by LoveYouSaber

4. We are not expecting international sanctions after a mere demonstration protest, so yes, I expected only words. But if the Chinese government were to do another Tiananmen V2 in Hong Kong, I have no doubt there would be serious economic sanctions, and that isn't a price that China right now can suffer.

Russia just basically invaded a neighboring country and took a bite and i don't see any serious economic sanctions being put in place.