(L) Dragonball Kai: Dragonball Z's 20th Anniversary Recut!!

[Justin Kim]

Originally Posted by GuidoHunter_Toki

Spoiler:

Yes, he is a good character. He is basically the nice reincarnate of the completely evil kid buu. Goku made a wish before defeating kid buu which ultimately lead to kid buu not going to the otherworld as it would have been do dangerous for him to exist there and considering he had the ability to teleport through dimensions. So to prevent him from causing destruction again he was reincarnated as a human named Uub.

Why the heck does Uub look like a miniature version of Goku. but with a Mohawk? LOL.

[Vicious108]

Just watched episode 4 and it was quite enjoyable. Gotta love Piccolo's attitude handling baby Gohan.

"Hey kid wake up. Look, your father's dead, but if you so much as cry I'll break your neck, got it!?"

The beginning of a beautiful friendship indeed.

Originally Posted by Blackbeard D. Kuma

Only the stuff I mentioned in my previous post was filler material, which took up a fairly good portion of time. Besides that, it was a good informative episode with good pacing. I just don't like how Toei is omitting canon material in favor of retaining unnecessary filler. That is just wrong.

I've never read the manga, only have read a general description of what parts were filler, so I've no idea but would like to know, which canon scenes have they omitted so far? I do agree that it's pretty lame that they're doing so while labeling this as "Toryama's Cut"

[Blaat]

Originally Posted by Blackbeard D. Kuma

Episode 4 covered 2 chapters. What kind of irritated me was that they still kept in quite a bit of filler in this episode. Honestly, who cares about seeing ChiChi at home worrying sick about Goku and Gohan and wondering why they're not back yet? Then we get more time wasted by having Krillin show up at the door trying to explain the situation only to be invited to dinner by Ox King. A good few minutes was spent on this crappy material that could have been used to possibly cover a third chapter. The fact that Toei is selectively keeping in some filler while omitting scenes from the manga is starting to get ridiculous.

I agree, at first when I read the "You're going to eat him?" line wasn't included I pretty much assumed that if they cover three chapters then removing some 'minor' lines could be forgiven due to time constraint (let's be honest here dialogue intensive chapters take to longer to 'animate' then fight intensive chapters) But they've removed the line and included pointless filler (and flashback) was just an insult.

Having said that I'm guessing they've did this because they've wanted the entire Gohan going giant ape scenario in one episode.

Anyway as for the Buu saga discussion on the previous, I've always had a soft spot for Buu saga especially Majin Vegeta part because that's what got me into Dragonball Z.

[Vicious108]

So is this "You're going to eat him?" a true original line from the manga? Cause to me it sounds like the kind of stuff that the English dub would take the liberty to add.

Originally Posted by Shiroth

I loved Buu, especially his first form. I just love how his character design is nothing we ever expected to see after how much he was built up to be the strongest being in the series at that time.

Well the suprising character design of his first form was indeed effective, but he only got worse as he kept on changing, with Kid Buu ending up as one of the most shallow villains in the series. The endless regeneration was also really cheap and made things rather tedious. He could've been killed as soon as Dabura if not for it.

[Vegard Aune]

Originally Posted by Endless Twilight

So is this "You're going to eat him?" a true original line from the manga? Cause to me it sounds like the kind of stuff that the English dub would take the liberty to add.

Yes, it was in the manga.

[Waking_Dreamer]

Originally Posted by Blaat

Anyway as for the Buu saga discussion on the previous, I've always had a soft spot for Buu saga especially Majin Vegeta part because that's what got me into Dragonball Z.

Well personally I thought Dragonball Z would have ended perfectly with the defeat of Cell.

Spoiler for Cell Arc thoughts:

I mean its almost poetic how Goku actually dies and then decides not to be wished back - while Gohan has proven to be able to take up his fathers place as Earths hero. Also, it was the saga where all the Z Warriors actually played a part in saving the world - even Krillin. Of course the most epic moment in all of DBZ = One-handed kamehameha by SSJ2 Gohan with Goku's spirit by his side!

Spoiler for Buu arc thoughts:

The Buu Saga was just too all over the place for me and tosses the ending of the Cell arc out the window. In the end Goku comes back to Earth and has to save the universe with the spirit bomb - same thing we've seen before...just bigger... Also with the epilogue of fighting uub and just leaving his family to help fix his village and train him...not that poetic at all.

It has its moments dont get me wrong...Like the Majin Vegeta sacrifice... and the whole Vegeta vs Goku thing was great, but became a total cop out with the revelation of SSJ3. In the end I didnt find the arc as tight or meaningful.

[Justin Kim]

Originally Posted by Waking_Dreamer

Well personally I thought Dragonball Z would have ended perfectly with the defeat of Cell.

Spoiler for Cell Arc thoughts:

I mean its almost poetic how Goku actually dies and then decides not to be wished back - while Gohan has proven to be able to take up his fathers place as Earths hero. Also, it was the saga where all the Z Warriors actually played a part in saving the world - even Krillin. Of course the most epic moment in all of DBZ = One-handed kamehameha by SSJ2 Gohan with Goku's spirit by his side!

Spoiler for Buu arc thoughts:

The Buu Saga was just too all over the place for me and tosses the ending of the Cell arc out the window. In the end Goku comes back to Earth and has to save the universe with the spirit bomb - same thing we've seen before...just bigger... Also with the epilogue of fighting uub and just leaving his family to help fix his village and train him...not that poetic at all.

It has its moments dont get me wrong...Like the Majin Vegeta sacrifice... and the whole Vegeta vs Goku thing was great, but became a total cop out with the revelation of SSJ3. In the end I didnt find the arc as tight or meaningful.

Lol I remember watching Goku use a spirit bomb for the first time. I was thinking to myself, "whoever gets hit by this is going to get an epic spanking." In my opinion after watching Goku do it many times, and especially having annoying Hercules generate the power for it. I found it to be an overused power that was just way too overpowering and a lame way to usually finish an arc. I prefer Goku beating the crap out of his opponents then using kame .

[Vicious108]

Yeah, and the fact that the final "big fight" of DBZ was basically Vegeta getting his ass kicked by Kid Buu in order to stall for time made it all the more disappointing. There was no real competitive final showdown, which in a series as fight-centric as DBZ is not a good thing.

[Kirarakim]

Yeah I definitely think the Buu saga has the worst ending but I did really like

Spoiler:

Vegeta sacrificing himself for his family and also admitting Goku was better than him. Those were two of my favorite scenes in the series.

I also have a soft spot for Chibi Trunks and Goten (although I am not too fond of Gotenks)

[Blaat]

Originally Posted by Waking_Dreamer

Spoiler for Buu arc thoughts:

The Buu Saga was just too all over the place for me and tosses the ending of the Cell arc out the window. In the end Goku comes back to Earth and has to save the universe with the spirit bomb - same thing we've seen before...just bigger... Also with the epilogue of fighting uub and just leaving his family to help fix his village and train him...not that poetic at all.

Spoiler for reply:

Actually Goku has never saved the universe with the spirit bomb before Buu saga. It failed against Vegeta (and it was Krillin who used it) and it failed against Frieza. I do agree that both Cell and Frieze saga would make for a better ending (Goku being dead and having saved the universe) although I think I would have been annoyed with the (lack of) resolution with what happened to the other characters.

But yes I do agree with you Goku flying away with Uub was an underwhelming ending.

[Waking_Dreamer]

Also just to see if I can get a straight answer

SSJ2 Gohan (Cell Saga)
SSJ Brolly (Bulky muscles)
SP Cell
Bojack Transformed

For raw power whats the order?

[Michsi]

Originally Posted by Waking_Dreamer

Well personally I thought Dragonball Z would have ended perfectly with the defeat of Cell.

Spoiler for Cell Arc thoughts:

I mean its almost poetic how Goku actually dies and then decides not to be wished back - while Gohan has proven to be able to take up his fathers place as Earths hero. Also, it was the saga where all the Z Warriors actually played a part in saving the world - even Krillin. Of course the most epic moment in all of DBZ = One-handed kamehameha by SSJ2 Gohan with Goku's spirit by his side!

Spoiler:

You know I read somewhere once that originally Akira Toriyama wanted to end the story at the Freeza arc with Goku dying at the end, Vegeta staying dead and Gohan continuing his legacy on earth. It wouldn't have been as poetic because we never get to see if Gohan could fill his father shoes, unlike the cell saga where the handing over the hero duties to his son is obvious, 'cause Gohan gets to be the one to defeat the finals boss. This is how AT had planned to end the story, two times! Gohan's role as Goku's successor was completely ruined in the Buu saga. Not only is he shown having set aside fighting and training completely, but he fails to do anything usefull in the fight against Buu even after the mystic power up (or whatever it was called), which in comparisson to his performance against Cell together with all those moments previously in story that had been building up to THAT moment, is sorta a let down.

Originally Posted by Waking_Dreamer

Spoiler for Buu arc thoughts:

The Buu Saga was just too all over the place for me and tosses the ending of the Cell arc out the window. In the end Goku comes back to Earth and has to save the universe with the spirit bomb - same thing we've seen before...just bigger... Also with the epilogue of fighting uub and just leaving his family to help fix his village and train him...not that poetic at all.

It has its moments dont get me wrong...Like the Majin Vegeta sacrifice... and the whole Vegeta vs Goku thing was great, but became a total cop out with the revelation of SSJ3. In the end I didnt find the arc as tight or meaningful.

Spoiler for My Buu arc thoughts:

Definetely my least favorite saga. It has the worst art (I'm talking about the manga here), it's all about the saiyans,which may not be so bad for the saiyan fans, but if you're a Piccolo fan and see him being reduced to a comic relief character and not having fought ONCE in all 100 episodes is really saddening, the SSJ3 is ugly (and pointless), at the Uub takes up the role that was meant for Gohan

[SuperKnuckles]

People actually didn't like the way Buu saga ended? I think it ended the best way it could. By the time Buu came in, there really was no room for competitiveness sine Buu was either going to destroy the universe or he was going to be stopped. The competitiveness was there for a little while until everyone realized it simply had to end.

[Blackbeard D. Kuma]

Originally Posted by Endless Twilight

I've never read the manga, only have read a general description of what parts were filler, so I've no idea but would like to know, which canon scenes have they omitted so far? I do agree that it's pretty lame that they're doing so while labeling this as "Toryama's Cut"

Things are too detailed and elaborate for me to list here for you, so instead I will direct you to this website: http://www.kanzentai.com/index.php

Thorough reviews have been done for every episode of DB Kai that has aired so far, and there you will find material that was cut from the manga chapters corresponding to the episodes which they constitute. I hope this helps.

[Justin Kim]

Originally Posted by Blaat

Spoiler for reply:

Actually Goku has never saved the universe with the spirit bomb before Buu saga. It failed against Vegeta (and it was Krillin who used it) and it failed against Frieza. I do agree that both Cell and Frieze saga would make for a better ending (Goku being dead and having saved the universe) although I think I would have been annoyed with the (lack of) resolution with what happened to the other characters.

But yes I do agree with you Goku flying away with Uub was an underwhelming ending.

Lol I find it comical that Goku dies at times, and then is re-born haha. I just can't imagine a world like that.
"Hey I thought I just killed you 5 minutes ago...!"
"Yeah....I got a freaking halo around my head so wut?"

[GDB]

Originally Posted by Justin Kim

Lol I find it comical that Goku dies at times, and then is re-born haha. I just can't imagine a world like that.
"Hey I thought I just killed you 5 minutes ago...!"
"Yeah....I got a freaking halo around my head so wut?"

Reminds me of Elder Kai in Buu Saga.

*Paraphrasing*
Elder Kai collapses, Goku's halo disappears.
Goku - "Thank you, Elder Kai. Your sacrifice will not be in vain."
Elder Kai stands back up with a halo over his head
Elder Kai - "JUST GET GOING, YOU IDIOT!"

[justavisitor]

actually goku uses spirit bombs to defeat quite a few enemies --but only in the movie I remember he did that two times in the movie at least...

And @Waking_Dreamer

In terms of raw power...of course SSJ3 is the top one...and I don't know which way does your list go...(up or down XD) but Gohan in SSJ2 while in Cell saga should be stronger than Brolly at his best already...(or equal at least)

[Vicious108]

Originally Posted by Blackbeard D. Kuma

Things are too detailed and elaborate for me to list here for you, so instead I will direct you to this website: http://www.kanzentai.com/index.php

Thorough reviews have been done for every episode of DB Kai that has aired so far, and there you will find material that was cut from the manga chapters corresponding to the episodes which they constitute. I hope this helps.

Ah yes, that is quite helpful, thank you. *bookmarks*

Originally Posted by justavisitor

actually goku uses spirit bombs to defeat quite a few enemies --but only in the movie I remember he did that two times in the movie at least...

Yes and they even made up the Super Saiyan style Spirit Bomb, where he absorbed its power to himself. That was... well, strange to say the least.

The movies were quite predictable in that sense. Everyone always showed up just to get their asses kicked until good old Goku decided it was time for the movie to end and hogged the kill all to himself. Oh well, they were still mildly entertaining.

[Alchemist007]

Only thing I found strange about that was that he made it into the spirit bomb in the first place instead of keeping it inside. According to the early explanations of how it works, the spirit energy goes directly into your body and you have to push it out to make the bomb.

[Waking_Dreamer]

Originally Posted by justavisitor

In terms of raw power...of course SSJ3 is the top one...and I don't know which way does your list go...(up or down XD) but Gohan in SSJ2 while in Cell saga should be stronger than Brolly at his best already...(or equal at least)

Thast what I was thinking but wasnt there a part in a movie (Return of Brolly) where Gohan (Buu Saga) goes SSJ2 against Brolly but a direct punch to the face didnt even flinch him....?

Spoiler for Buu and Cell comparison:

Also whats the difference between Buu's regeneration and Cells regeneration? Cell was able to completely resurrect himself as long as one cell of his body remained, though a full power kamahameha from SSl2 Gohan was able to vaporize him out of existence.

Yet Majin Vegeta who was more powerful than an SSJ2 Gohan released all his power and life force in an energy explosion - but couldn't vaporize Buu...why? I mean it was shown that pieces were left of Buu and Piccolo and Krillin tried to destroy them after wards...but how on earth do pieces like that even exist after that explosion...!?