2008-06-09, 23:38 | Link #81 | |
Urusai~Urusai~Urusai~
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Location
Age: 31
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Quote:
The whole change in "teacher-guiding-your-hand" didn't really affect me since I came from a country where the teachers (even elementary teachers) would not hesitate to call you stupid or whack you with a stick. One thing that it affected, though, is my willingness to work. Considering how easy elementary and middle schools were, I just kept getting lazier--way too lazy for the courses of high school and in the sense of not wanting to do homework at all. I think that same thing also affects a whole bunch of people. Furthermore, don't underestimate the foreign schools and the ESL level classes, but they actually teach more grammar crunching. Now that I'm in a normal English class this year, I find it just teaches me more about some stories that some ancient, classical, Renaissance, Elisabethian, or "et" cetera guys wrote, in addition to some literary devices and terms, rather than being able to learn some useful grammars much (although I did learn some more new grammars). It took be several years--four years already--to up my grammar to an "okay" level, so I consider it something that students have to keep repeating to get it stuck to their head. They may have already learned grammars back in elementary school and middle school, but it doesn't help considering the difficulty on those levels and how forgetful we tend to be... So I'm blaming the school, basically. Don't bash me, though, if I'm ignorant about the school system here. I also do think that the Internet speak starts to go on because some feels that it's "necessary" to do them once they are on the Internet. Back then, I thought that it was pretty cool, and started to use them for a while--only on the Internet, of course--until I decided to stop somewhere along the line (although I couldn't really use them very well anyway). Plus, when you are in a pack of people who do the same thing, it starts to become something natural to do. I suggest putting a comma in the middle to create a more "advancely grammatical" title.
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2008-06-09, 23:48 | Link #82 |
Starcraft Wizard
Join Date: Jun 2008
Age: 34
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The problem is people who type in stereotypically insertinsulthere fashions are likely to be insertinsulthere. So its an obstacle to overcome that stereotype, and you should go about tackling that obstacle by making good quality posts.
I'm sorry that some not very nice people have made this so, but this is the way things are. |
2008-06-10, 00:00 | Link #83 | |
Bittersweet Distractor
Join Date: Nov 2007
Age: 32
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Quote:
The man ran to the room. The man decided not to go in this room, his coin was probably not there. The man ran to the football stadium, but his lost coin wasn't there either. The man decided to go back home, but after a couple minutes he changed his mind and ran back to the room and found his coin. Would that actually be harder to understand since I used "ran" several times? Maybe I just can't that see that. Well you are certainly correct about James Joyce, but you got my point . I don't mind the nudge
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2008-06-10, 00:20 | Link #84 | |
~Shoop~Da~Whoop~
Join Date: Jun 2008
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Quote:
It can be a problem sometimes whit typing, not only in English, but other languages as well. In highschool we used to communicate through Yahoo! Messenger, MSN, MySpace and other. My schoolmates did their homework using internet, we generaly talked properly at first. But by time passing, we start burrowing the internet slang. All it's alright at first, untill we transfer the internet language at school, expecially when having an exam. But it starts to get worse, cause sometimes the teachers begin to have the same habbit as well, which can start a ruckus among the school concerning the corectitude in teaching and examining. |
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2008-06-10, 00:48 | Link #85 | ||
Urusai~Urusai~Urusai~
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Location
Age: 31
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Quote:
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If it was my English teacher, there would probably be a whole bunch of "Word Choice" marks on your paper. For your information, "word choice" is what my English teacher tends to say, and it has became a playful term that my friends and I like to pass around.
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2008-06-10, 00:54 | Link #86 | |
Gregory House
IT Support
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Quote:
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2008-06-10, 01:03 | Link #87 | |
Ha ha ha ha ha...
Graphic Designer
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Right behind you.
Age: 35
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Quote:
In my opinion, however, people should try to watch their spelling/etc anyway, because posts filled with errors (of various sorts) tend to denote either a lack of intelligence or a lack of caring. I can understand if English is not your first language, but since we're using computers with auto-correction programs, that shouldn't be an excuse, either.
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2008-06-10, 01:07 | Link #88 | |
Bittersweet Distractor
Join Date: Nov 2007
Age: 32
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Quote:
Yes, when you write a book or essay for people to read you want others to be kept interested with how you articulate sentences as reading the same words over and over again gets boring. My point is why do we look down on those that choose not to write so flowery, when it comes to an internet post such as this? Ideas are first born in the mind, if people can express those ideas clearly, what is wrong with that? I myself don't even want to put the effort to jot down this post in such a manner, but for people such as you to even consider my thoughts seriously, it is almost like a requirement.
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2008-06-10, 01:10 | Link #89 | |
Gregory House
IT Support
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Quote:
Of course, they can be misused, but keep in mind that if they weren't useful, pronouns wouldn't have even been born. (In Spanish, where full subject elision is encouraged, it's even more noticeable. Since you know Spanish, try translating that phrase and see how awkward it reads).
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Last edited by WanderingKnight; 2008-06-10 at 01:37. |
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2008-06-10, 01:19 | Link #90 |
Senior Member
Author
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Philippines
Age: 47
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My two cents on the matter:
In the past five years since cellphone text messaging became popular in my country, a huge percentage of anyone wound up using "TXTspeak" grammar anywhere (Friendster, Multiply, most forums, chatrooms, etc.) to the point of incoherence. At the same time period the quality of education seemed to have dropped, with the glaring lack of support for public libraries and language teachers. True, I also use "txtspeak" but that form should be best left to the cellphone and I intend not to carry it over to my daily Internet usage. They think it's super-cool cutting down sentences into shortcuts, or playing with uppercase and lowercase letters, or using very ornate font styles other than necessary, or imitating anything in the style of 4chan, so that they strut around their forum to proclaim they're leet and they're promoting their own brand of coolness... when, in my opinion, I hate trying to decipher the retarded crap they're posting. It's like a devolution of language coherence for one generation, so it's going to be my stand to go against this flow of devolution by typing this way.
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2008-06-10, 01:25 | Link #91 |
stuck in a harem genre
Artist
Join Date: Feb 2008
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Hmmm...
I think there is a level between keyboard retardism and just common mistakes. I can't imagine why today's teenagers would have problems with grammar, being that half the time doing homework is on the computer, hence or it should make you retain proper grammar skills. The only pet peeve I have with peope is when they excessively use "shortcut" words, it just doens't feel right, and it makes the person seem as though they are about 10 years of age. "Y don't u feel like being rly kewl?" It's an exageration, but whatever. Spelling mistakes, everyone makes spelling mistakes; especially if your on the keyboard; typing at light speed and whatnot. It's rare for people to seriously type 1337 all the time, like "h3y" Only time I've ever seen 1337 is when people are making fun of nerds or trying to be funny. Meh... I never criticize anyways. It's only irritating when a person creates a thread looking for help like, "Where can I find these kinds of animes..." Then when you look to read the rest of the thread, it's like mumble english that goes like this; "Ok, I ams looking what for kewl fighting like anime/manga but I don't want no kilinlg or big lots blood because I don't liking lost of bolod. I awlays watns smeo other type too..." ㅡ.ㅡ;;;;; |
2008-06-10, 01:30 | Link #92 |
Ha ha ha ha ha...
Graphic Designer
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Right behind you.
Age: 35
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@soulassassin547: That's interesting, and sadly true. I always knew it as "1337speak", though, which shows how nerdy I really am.
The de-evolution of the language is, as you said, from the shortcuts people take to save space on their texts, and it has made its way to the internet, quite easily really. I think it's largely in part due to gaming, where PC gamers have to type for communication. I do understand that "u" is easier to type than "you", but outside of gaming and texting (where speed is of the essence), you might as well spell out the whole word.
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2008-06-10, 01:38 | Link #93 |
ISML Technical Staff
Graphic Designer
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I think the difference is leetspeak is purposely encrypting what you mean, and txtspeak is shortening what you mean.
Txtspeak: sup i no u luv me 2. leetspeak: \/\/|-|4T'5 |_|P!!! 1 |<|\|()\/\/ Y()|_| |_()\/3 |\/|3 T()().
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2008-06-10, 01:38 | Link #94 | |
Good-Natured Asshole.
Join Date: May 2007
Age: 34
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Quote:
However, I also know a few more excuses. For one, sometimes the people who write badly online also suck at typing. They can't justify spending that amount of time to make a post pretty by capitalizing and punctuating everything when they, like everyone, have places to go and other people to talk to. If you recall back when you couldn't type, you'll realize how long it actually takes them to type my post right here. This also applies to IMing. IMing is relatively fast-paced, and given the way we youngsters now multitask, we'd like to get from one typing space to another as quickly as possible, because time is finite and things need to be said. I myself lower my own writing expectations when IMing, and sometimes people would just carry that level of writing over to posts too. It all boils down to people being lazy. I actually half-expect the most coherent people here to be perfectionists (that includes me), and we are the kind who would never go down to the level of "you know what I mean". Relatively, we'd consider txtspeakers to be terribly lazy, and we'd be right - yes, they don't see the effort to make their posts look like mine here as justified. They also probably don't consider their views terribly important (hence the reduced quality in IM messages and Facebook - they're pretty casual), because if they do they'd step up the effort to make themselves look better. Which brings back full circle: If a post looks terribly written, its content probably isn't important enough. I'd let it go unless I have another reason to read it. |
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2008-06-10, 01:54 | Link #95 |
Senior Member
Author
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Philippines
Age: 47
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A strange thought struck me: the way I type is like the way I dress up for work or casual Fridays.
So I'll have some ground rules to lay out for myself when posting or replying something: * In a forum or a blog, when I reply, I prefer to be fully coherent and typing it in clear and plain English. * With a cellphone, I may use txtspeak but if I really need to be understood, then I use full words. * In a chatroom, since I tend to type very fast, I'll settle on "normal" English.
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2008-06-10, 02:05 | Link #96 | |
Urusai~Urusai~Urusai~
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Location
Age: 31
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Quote:
I would imagine that someone who does leetspeak would use variations to haunt you even more.
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2008-06-10, 02:11 | Link #97 |
Sup
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I personally ignore posts that slaughter English. If you choose to type poorly, that's your thing, but you should be willing to accept the consequences of doing so, the same way you choose to accept the consequences if you decide to get tattoos in real life.
Sorry, but the internet, as crazy as it is, is not your personal playground. You make posts to convey yourself, and if the way you choose to do so gets in the way of readers, then it's no one's fault but your own! And, I know it's been said to death here, but indeed, non-native speakers are quickly overtaking native speakers online. |
2008-06-10, 10:28 | Link #98 | |
Imouto-Chan♥
Graphic Designer
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: England
Age: 30
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Quote:
I hate it when people criticize the way I type, like if i make a mistake and they have a go at you.
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2008-06-10, 16:18 | Link #99 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
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Does it really take that much effort to press the 'shift' and 'period' buttons?
I mean, when someone's message looks like this: heyy lets go 2 da park aftaaa It makes me think they're an idiot. I know smart people who type like that and they seem like morons just because of it. |
2008-06-10, 17:50 | Link #100 |
it's animal, unbelievable
Graphic Designer
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: U.S.A
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I personally prefer when people use correct grammar, punctuation, spelling, etc. However, I can't stand excessive chat speak and typos. Dropping capitalization and punctuation is fine, but there comes a point where it goes to far. Excessive chat speak and typos makes the typist look rather idiotic as well. That's why you use spellcheck and word if you're unsure about your spelling or grammar.
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