MY computer pawned me.. HARD

[toru310]

Oh no! A new problem has emerged when I'm turning off my pc "saving files....windows shutting down.." and suddenly the pc crashed and restarted weird problem...is there any logical explanation for this it happened twice....


I turned it of and then it restarted weird.....

[Jinto]

Well, there may be many logical explanations. But you problem description is very vague. So giving a specific answer is quiet hard.
Again your best chance to uncover the cause for the failures, is to look up the error in the event viewer.
Do you have antivirus software installed? You could test if you got infected with a virus.

When you shut the PC down, certain things are written back from (RAM) memory to the system files. E.g. the registry or other intermediately RAM cached data. Should erros occur in this crucial period of the system shutdown, then things like the registry can be severely damaged. Windows tries to restore such files with older backups in the next startup (the windows restore files thing). However, the backup files are likely out of date. So there will be very likely a sever rollback of the system (means many changes, made in several windows sessions, can be lost).
When Windows shuts down, and a blue screen of death occurs, then it will restart instead of finalising the shut down. The behaviour triggered by the BSOD will always override your normal system behaviour (even when shutting down).

[toru310]

Originally Posted by Jinto Lin

Well, there may be many logical explanations. But you problem description is very vague. So giving a specific answer is quiet hard.
Again your best chance to uncover the cause for the failures, is to look up the error in the event viewer.
Do you have antivirus software installed? You could test if you got infected with a virus.

When you shut the PC down, certain things are written back from (RAM) memory to the system files. E.g. the registry or other intermediately RAM cached data. Should erros occur in this crucial period of the system shutdown, then things like the registry can be severely damaged. Windows tries to restore such files with older backups in the next startup (the windows restore files thing). However, the backup files are likely out of date. So there will be very likely a sever rollback of the system (means many changes, made in several windows sessions, can be lost).
When Windows shuts down, and a blue screen of death occurs, then it will restart instead of finalising the shut down. The behaviour triggered by the BSOD will always override your normal system behaviour (even when shutting down).

Do you think updating windows is a good thing for the problem?

[Jinto]

Actually I considered your Windows up to date (if it is not, I'ld suggest you update it )

[tritoch]

That doesn't always help. If there is constant use of the hdds, they will malfunction very soon. The usual desktop hard drives are often not even build to handle 3 hours of sustained reading/writing from/to disk. I'ld suggest using as much RAM buffer as possible for torrent applications (minimizing disk access).

Wouldl it matter if it was an external hard drive? I was abusing my external hd. It was running for nearly 4 months of straight disk writing. Also, there are no file fragments on the external hd. whoopeee

I think my internal hd failed on me because I defragged it like 8 times that day and might have strained itself in the process. [the effects was quite good too. my old computer was running almost 70% faster. shame]

don't understand that part. When I download bittorrent I use 800Mbyte RAM cache and disk space preallocation (utorrent).

I can configure how much ram I use, but would it still matter when I am using an external hd dedicated for downloads? I have crappy virtual memory less than 800 mb so it sucks T__T

[Sides]

Maybe check your memory with memtest(86).
It could be a memory failure.

[Jinto]

Originally Posted by tritoch

Wouldl it matter if it was an external hard drive? I was abusing my external hd. It was running for nearly 4 months of straight disk writing. Also, there are no file fragments on the external hd. whoopeee

I think my internal hd failed on me because I defragged it like 8 times that day and might have strained itself in the process. [the effects was quite good too. my old computer was running almost 70% faster. shame]



I can configure how much ram I use, but would it still matter when I am using an external hd dedicated for downloads? I have crappy virtual memory less than 800 mb so it sucks T__T

Well using preallocation and caching (even small caches like 15Mbyte can help significantly), reduce random writing very much. So this doesn't stress the hdds too much.

...8 times defragmented. That sounds a little bit like overkill to me. Nah I don't do disk defragmenting. (Well I use a lazy defragmenting heh, I copy all files on a free secondary hdd, beginning with the Windows system directory stuff. After this I change the drives in the PC. Finally some recovery console fixboot/fixmbr, and the thing runs like new. If everything runs fine, I format the "old" drive (copying... writes files sequential)).

But storing you torrentr to an external disk is a good way to outsource it from the system drives.
Btw. is your external hdd USB1.x or USB2.0? If it is 1.x I would not be very concerned about stressing the hdd, USB 1.x usually is too slow to really stress a hdd. With USB 2.0 things are different.

[tritoch]

USB 2.0. Blazing fast. I play the downloads from there.. I have no problems accessing the files from the external just that with an ailing laptop some of the bigger files.. like lets say a 1920x1080 res episode slows down significantly but thats because I dont have a proper graphic cards [integrated intel...].

...8 times defragmented. That sounds a little bit like overkill to me.

I kept running the windows defrag tool and it says that there are still some fragmented files so I defrag and defrag until I had 1.0 fragment ratio [which is no fragments]. Must have killed it then with the strain

I'll post my system specs.

From DirectX Diagnostic Tool
MS Windows XP Home Edition SP2
Intel Pentium M 1.50GHz
Memory 504MB RAM
Page file: 497MB used, 730MB available
---
Mobile Intel 915GM/GMS, 910GML Express Internal
96MB memory
Current display mode: 1920x1200 (32 bit) (75hz)
--
From MSinfo (System Information)
Total physical memory: 512MB
Available physical memory: 49.15MB
Total virtual memory: 2GB
Available virtual memory: 1.96GB [Im not running anything else other than mozilla/azureus for now]
Page file space: 1.20GB

I think I have way too much available virtual memory

Also I made a mistake when I reformatted my hard drive for a dual boot WinXp and Ubuntu. I have an 40gb internal and partitioned it into to.. One is 17gb, the other is 10gb. I am missing ~8gb, it shows in disk management but I can't assign a drive letter for it. It says healthy but unknown partition. oh well.

[toru310]

Originally Posted by Jinto Lin

Actually I considered your Windows up to date (if it is not, I'ld suggest you update it )

forgot to say thank you!

[toru310]

This is kinda annoying cause I think every day my pc will crash once Is this a sign or something??? Oh yeah haven't updated my windows still even if it's a original copy...
And the most scariest part here is that I think when your pc crash there's a small chance that your files might get corrupt..(is the rar files included in the corruption?)

Oh yeah my pc crash sometimes if I surf the net and sometimes when I shutdown pc and the most weirdest part when I restart my pc it crashes..and Im like WTF.. haha

[Ledgem]

Originally Posted by Migufuchi Fusutsu

This is kinda annoying cause I think every day my pc will crash once Is this a sign or something???

Unless there's somee sort of computer behavior or activity going on to give you a reason to believe that something is not working properly, you're just experiencing what one might call "trauma" from having your computer fail on you once before. It'll disappear with time or computer experience/confidence, whichever comes first.

Oh yeah haven't updated my windows still even if it's a original copy...

I hope you're applying your security updates. The argument against XP SP2 and some other updates is now a moot point; it doesn't cause incompatibility. I highly recommend upgrading to SP2 if you're not using it, and put on every security patch you can get (with the exception of WIndows Genuine Advantage). Make sure you have a good, properly-configured firewall (you can check its performance at places like http://www.grc.com - the Shields Up test) and a virus scanner. It doesn't hurt to run a full scan every once in a while, either. I run it about once a month, or if I visited a sketchy website/file, or if something seems to be acting up. Don't forget your spyware scanners, either.

Luckily, you can get all of that for free.

And the most scariest part here is that I think when your pc crash there's a small chance that your files might get corrupt..(is the rar files included in the corruption?)

If Windows itself blows up, your files will still be fine (in most cases, anyway - malware can mess your files up for you). If you have a hardware problem, that's when you have to start worrying.

[Jinto]

If the files were accessed read only while the crash occured no problem. Otherwise from corrupt MBR entry (for that file) to data alteration everything can happen. Usually files like the rar stuff are accessed read only. But many of the system files are accessed in read/write (modify). The same applies for some stuff you are working on in applications.
But usually the most affected files, are windows system files... and the executables you are currently running.

[WanderingKnight]

Don't forget your spyware scanners, either.

May I add a recommendation on this? Aside from the regular Lavasoft Ad-Aware (which seems to be one of the most popular spyware and adware scanners around) I highly recommend you getting Spyware Blaster. It sets up a passive protection on your browser (whether you're using IE or Firefox, I don't know about Opera though) that nearly nullifies all moderate to harsh spyware/adware threats that can be acquired while web browsing. Since it's passive, it doesn't consume system resources and does not need to be running to protect you. And the best of all, it's free.

[toru310]

Originally Posted by Ledgem

Unless there's somee sort of computer behavior or activity going on to give you a reason to believe that something is not working properly, you're just experiencing what one might call "trauma" from having your computer fail on you once before. It'll disappear with time or computer experience/confidence, whichever comes first.


I hope you're applying your security updates. The argument against XP SP2 and some other updates is now a moot point; it doesn't cause incompatibility. I highly recommend upgrading to SP2 if you're not using it, and put on every security patch you can get (with the exception of WIndows Genuine Advantage). Make sure you have a good, properly-configured firewall (you can check its performance at places like http://www.grc.com - the Shields Up test) and a virus scanner. It doesn't hurt to run a full scan every once in a while, either. I run it about once a month, or if I visited a sketchy website/file, or if something seems to be acting up. Don't forget your spyware scanners, either.

Luckily, you can get all of that for free.


If Windows itself blows up, your files will still be fine (in most cases, anyway - malware can mess your files up for you). If you have a hardware problem, that's when you have to start worrying.

Well the reason why I can't update yet is that the incident might happened again you know when you update your windows usually they install the stuff before shutting down so what if Im installing updates and boom suddenly the pc crashed thats the worse case scenario..

@Jinto Lin and WanderingKnight thanks for the info by the way...!

[toru310]

Originally Posted by WanderingKnight

May I add a recommendation on this? Aside from the regular Lavasoft Ad-Aware (which seems to be one of the most popular spyware and adware scanners around) I highly recommend you getting Spyware Blaster. It sets up a passive protection on your browser (whether you're using IE or Firefox, I don't know about Opera though) that nearly nullifies all moderate to harsh spyware/adware threats that can be acquired while web browsing. Since it's passive, it doesn't consume system resources and does not need to be running to protect you. And the best of all, it's free.

Excuse me, Aside from Lavasoft Ad-aware do you know any other software that can detect malware spyware??? that's a free software of course!

[WanderingKnight]

Lavasoft Ad-Aware is free

[SeijiSensei]

Try Spybot Search & Destroy.

[Ledgem]

I use Ad-Aware and Spybot. Spybot gives you a passive system-level protection called TeaTimer (I don't use that), and it also allows you to "immunize" your web browsers against known malicious content. It supports Opera, IE, and when I had FireFox installed I'm pretty sure it picked up on that, too.

Well the reason why I can't update yet is that the incident might happened again you know when you update your windows usually they install the stuff before shutting down so what if Im installing updates and boom suddenly the pc crashed thats the worse case scenario..

There's a chance that it could happen, but I wouldn't say that it's very large. And the harsh reality is that if you don't patch your system properly, your system has a pretty high likelihood of crashing due to malware. If you know what you're doing and have all of the proper layers of protection on, you don't need to worry as much. However, the way I see it, why take chances? The more exploits you patch, the safer you are.

You just restored your system, so I'd say that now is the perfect time to go through a big update process. If the update messes something up (and it shouldn't) then at least you won't lose too much in terms of customization. Your data should not be affected, as an error in the update process would just damage the operating system, and could require that you reinstall the OS. If you're really worried, back your data up. You have two hard drives, don't you? Unless they're both filled to the max, you should be able to do this pretty easily.

[toru310]

Originally Posted by Ledgem

I use Ad-Aware and Spybot. Spybot gives you a passive system-level protection called TeaTimer (I don't use that), and it also allows you to "immunize" your web browsers against known malicious content. It supports Opera, IE, and when I had FireFox installed I'm pretty sure it picked up on that, too.


There's a chance that it could happen, but I wouldn't say that it's very large. And the harsh reality is that if you don't patch your system properly, your system has a pretty high likelihood of crashing due to malware. If you know what you're doing and have all of the proper layers of protection on, you don't need to worry as much. However, the way I see it, why take chances? The more exploits you patch, the safer you are.

You just restored your system, so I'd say that now is the perfect time to go through a big update process. If the update messes something up (and it shouldn't) then at least you won't lose too much in terms of customization. Your data should not be affected, as an error in the update process would just damage the operating system, and could require that you reinstall the OS. If you're really worried, back your data up. You have two hard drives, don't you? Unless they're both filled to the max, you should be able to do this pretty easily.

I'll do it right away! Just have to backup all my files..... Oh yeah when I'm updating my windows how long will it take?


@SeijiSensei and WanderingKnight thanks again!!!

[Ledgem]

Originally Posted by Migufuchi Fusutsu

I'll do it right away! Just have to backup all my files..... Oh yeah when I'm updating my windows how long will it take?

Depends on your system and internet speed; your system will need to download all of the updates (it won't happen at anywhere near your max speed if you do it via Automatic Updates). HD speed and processor speed also count for a lot. If you need to install SP2 and a host of other updates, I'd think maybe 20-40 minutes.