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Old 2016-09-15, 13:10   Link #1561
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Spain
Strangely, I find it very interesting. I usually agree with you when a spokon becomes just tournament after tournament, but the latests arcs of Chihayafuru have been just very exciting Although I give that in a monthly series the pacing is a bit difficult to follow
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Old 2016-09-15, 15:13   Link #1562
Guardian Enzo
Seishu's Ace
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Kobe, Japan
The last tournament that had me really vested was
Spoiler for Just in case:
Everything every that has been diminishing returns.
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Old 2017-05-23, 04:11   Link #1563
Verso Sciolto
Join Date: Nov 2015
Sentai announced September 12, 2017 release date for season one -Japanese with English subtitles, premium box set currently available for pre-order:
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Old 2017-08-04, 19:41   Link #1564
Verso Sciolto
Join Date: Nov 2015
ANN reports: Chihayafuru English Dub Stars Luci Christian, Adam Gibbs, Blake Shepard, relaying the news from Sentai Filmworks.

No indication how the reading of poetry will be dealt with during karuta matches in that clip / scene.

Since we've turned a page a while ago and given the lingering uncertainty that comes with the announcement above, I'm embedding the following video here too.

Last edited by Verso Sciolto; 2017-08-04 at 20:01.
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Old 2017-08-26, 02:22   Link #1565
Verso Sciolto
Join Date: Nov 2015
There may be an opportunity to see and hear something longer than the clip posted above, before the disks with English dub are released. Only just saw that ANN relayed news from streaming provider HIDIVE. A company completely unfamiliar to me but which has teamed up with Sentai Filmworks for this series.

[edit Aug. 30]First things first, belatedly - Unfamiliar with HIDIVE and only just saw that the company is based in Houston, Texas. Hopefully their staff -and premises- weathered the storm. (Not sure if Harvey prevented this and other series from going out as previously planned.)[/edit]

The press release on the HIDIVE site includes this line:
August 29th at 12 PM CDT, HIDIVE members will be able to stream new episodes of Chihayafuru every Tuesday exclusively on HIDIVE’s anime streaming service.
HiDIVE acquires streaming rights to Chihayafuru English Dub. (Not sure if Harvey prevented this and other series from going out as previously scheduled)

According to their FAQ they stream in/to different countries and they offer a free seven day trial period for subscribers. After signing up it will become visible which series are available in each location. Checking their terms and conditions next...

Edit to add ANN link: HIDIVE Streams Chihayafuru Anime's English Dub.

Edit to strike:
Didn't see info/confirmation on streaming with subs.

"Didn't see" is not the same as "isn't there". I overlooked something regarding confirmation of subs. Not only is it mentioned by ANN but in the “read more” section below the "Chihayafuru Official English Dub Clip" on Sentai’s YouTube channel it also says:

Maybe it is also made clear on the linked page on the HIDIVE site itself but I can’t see most of that website due to geo-blocking and therefore can’t read their documentation for Chihayafuru either, unfortunately. It looks like a subbed stream will be provided and perhaps that means newly translated subtitles as well ... ?

Edit to add:
* The shortened url: is for: but clicking those links will redirect if region is not supported. The actual page has been saved with the Wayback Machine so those outside the supported regions can get an an idea what HIDIVE's Chihayafuru web pages look like. The first season with subtitles appears to have premiered on June 15, 2017, based on this: Webarchive url

That does perhaps also give an indication about the way the poetry is handled, going by the English Episode titles as listed there. Good to know at least.
The episode titles are different than in previous English translations.

The archived pages also show that all the episode summaries are about Karuta and that was a relief to find out because it pretty much takes care of some of my main concerns about the focus of the presentation and promotion for the series as expressed elsewhere ...

Another edit:
I've been informed that "Chihayafuru" now appears in the HIDIVE thumbnail catalogue with a "Dubbed" tag over the image. On the series' page, "Poem 1: This flower has Bloomed at last" -as the first episode is apparently titled in English for this localization- is now listed with these options in a drop down menu:
- Japanese with English Subtitles
- English Dubbed
- English Dubbed with English captions

Last edited by Verso Sciolto; 2017-08-30 at 03:33.
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Old 2017-09-24, 23:45   Link #1566
Verso Sciolto
Join Date: Nov 2015
Semi-transparent, a small stack of papers was recently posted on the twitter feed for the live action films. Three “Musubi” scripts for post-production voice recordings. Scenarios for Sumire, Harada and Kana. Revealing little more than that. There will soon (2018) be more than tantalising cover pages for another vision on this story and its conclusion in that medium.

When asked, here, about the way poetry readings were dealt with in Sentai's newly released English dub for the animated series, SpecsKingdra clarified with an example from Season one, Episode one (S1, E1), based on the HIDIVE stream. Indicating that two lines of text appear on screen each time a Japanese voice recites a poem. The example provided:
Nagaraeba …
As I grow older …
One line is a transliteration, replicating the sound in romaji. The other a translation into English, an interpretation of a poem’s possible meaning.

There can be variations in both when comparing each line with the work done by other translators. They are all approximations. The spoken Japanese language has changed since the poems were originally composed. Writing systems and conventions have changed as well. In part because of these poets and their compositions.

In S1, E1 (2009), the captioned poem was read, it was played from tape, in the Wataya home in Tokyo during the first match between Chihaya and Arata. This poem wasn’t changed for the animated TV series. Some cards were substituted for other poems, as part of the adaptation process from manga into anime. Without explanation I'm aware of.

In the first chapter of the Japanese manga, (2008) it says:ながらえば, in a text bubble for the corresponding scene. In the bilingual edition (2011) it says: Nagaraeba, inside the bubble and ながらへば in the margin below the panel. The same poem but spelled a different way. The two bilingual books have a translation of the hundred poems in the back. Fifty poems each. Translated into 21st century Japanese and into English this poem is listed as number 84 in the Ogura Hyakunin Isshu collection and attributed to Fujiwarara no Kiyosuke. In the Digital Edition (2017) of the manga only the alphabet is used in the text bubbles but the same English translation was added directly into those speech bubbles, within the panel itself. There it says: Nagaraebaー (The grief filled days of long ago), according to the online preview.

All these lines from the Sentai version and the published manga can be compared with other subtitles running under the same scene and we may find that each translated line in turn may be slightly different depending on the translator. They are slightly different and that can be useful to know because it is possible to spell out and translate each poem in a slightly different way.

The cards themselves were not altered for the English localisations. Writing in Hiragana is used on the cards, with few exceptions, throughout the live action films, in the animated series and in the manga as well. Hiragana is a great starting point for learning Japanese and the karuta fuda are still often used for teaching that syllabary.

If the example had not been about a recited poem, not been about spoken but about written language, there would have been two other options when trying to identify which poem was referenced because there is more than one poem with nagaraeba in its text. Nagaraeba was also used in the kokoro ni mo (68) poem and in tama no o yo (89) as well. If we had not known it was a first line read out loud this time, the text in the subtitles / captions could also have referred to another card visible on the floor in the same match as depicted in the anime.

We can do a comparison with the nicknames of characters too and see a difference in nuance, a difference in tone, and therefore a difference in the approach each scriptwriter and interpreter adopted when giving their view on Yuki Suetsugu’s Chihayafuru. We can also note that the old Japanese texts Suetsugu in turn weaves into her manga are based on her own interpretations of those older poems. Interpreted for the purpose of telling her story. Based on older commentary and on her perspective. Based on what she now considers the thought processes and temperaments of the characters she created.

ながらへば. Nagaraeba. If I should live long. Transliteration in hiragana. Transliteration in romaji. Translation into English. From the University of Virginia (UVa) website. A site frequently referenced when talking about Chihayafuru where this particular poem is attributed to Fujiwara no Kiyosuke as well.

Nagaraheba. If I live any longer. Transliteration and translation, from Joshua Mostow’s “Pictures of the Heart” (1996), a reference book often cited in these conversations about Chihayafuru. The poem is attributed to Fujiwara no Kiyosuke here too. A poet for whom Mostow gives a brief biography in which he notes that Kiyosuke (1104- 1177) is known for writing commentary as well as for composing poetry. The short bio followed by Mostow’s own commentary on this poem. Commentary in a book written to encourage further exploration.

I think Suetsugu operates in the same vein. Based on her work and commentary she too encourages exploration and she frequently gives the impression of not favouring one single perspective as a story teller. Favouring difference of opinion and re-interpreation of her own story as well. It has been a bit surprising how little commentary there has been here on the newly released dub and subs from Sentai.

It is necessary to choose only because we can’t watch more than one translation at the same time but for those interested enough to consider re-watching Chihayafuru or buying this new set of discs it may be illuminating to watch a different version of the same series the second or third time around. Read the manga from the start because something does change, in adaption and in translation too. Chihayafuru is a great series because there is always more to discover. Some of the poets used words for which there is no present day equivalent. Their meaning is lost in time. Knowing that can be both an obstacle to understanding and an imagination stimulating reality. In nearly all cases it is possible to be wrong when attempting a translation. It is also possible to be right but not capture the whole picture. Each subsequent translation can augment. In my most optimistic look at this industry I suggest that it was not created to replace but exist alongside - to further elucidate and to present a different perspective.

This was written, in part, because of a follow up question in another interesting Reddit topic posted a few days ago. It does make sense to consider the quality of the various subtitles on offer and it is also reasonable to question the expertise of the expert to consult. Besides aiming to entertain and amuse, that’s probably the message (1776) of the 千早振る, Chihayafuru, Rakugo story's writer. Tatsuta-gawa was not a sumo wrestler, of that we can be fairly certain, but don’t take my word for it.

Last edited by Verso Sciolto; 2017-09-25 at 09:13.
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