2011-09-18, 13:37 | Link #81 | ||||||||
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Join Date: Aug 2011
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Page 11 -- Raising Heart clearly says, "Emergency! The reaction of axeman disappeared!" Quote:
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Yuuno instantly executes a forced teleport on himself and Arf, but we don't know exactly how far they jumped or how much of a delay they experienced. Forced teleporting the Defense Program's Linker Core took a bit longer to execute, not to mention three people working on it together. By the time the Core arrived in orbit, it had already generated a new body. Consider how long it took to generate the FIRST body. Quote:
Given that the only two times he's teleported have started off-screen and unobserved, no one can make a definitive statement about how difficult his fast jumps are to start up. If it takes some time, his tactics make sense. Even if it doesn't take time, his tactics still make sense against Isis and Nanoha. His fight with Fate should have told us whether or not he could start a short-jump in the middle of a fight, but our observation of that fight is interrupted twice and we can't tell if anything actually happens between interruptions. Conclusions based on that fight are thus only speculative. Nevertheless, I'm also basing my speculation on the exchanges between him and Fate before Nanoha left them, and those facts seem to confirm my assumptions about their duel. Quote:
Are you still talking about Nightcrawler? Quote:
Using teleportation to attack an alert target who knows to keep moving, and whom can move very quickly, is an entirely different situation. I think if Deville had any confidence that he could do that against Fate, he would have tried it at least once before resorting to his Reaction. But we know for a fact that he didn't try that even once. Quote:
Deville reacted better than Nanoha because he's a melee fighter. Quote:
Between her wheel's grip on the ground, or her joints and bones as her body goes hurtling forward past her feet, SOMETHING has to break first. Wheels off the ground or body folded over her own legs... either way, Subaru's going for a painful tumble. It's actually better for her if the wheels let go first. It's probably a moot point though, as she probably wouldn't be going THAT fast. Still, the point remains that Magical Flight makes for better breaks than rollerblades. |
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2011-09-18, 13:57 | Link #82 | |
Beta by Accident
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Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Maine
Age: 52
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2011-09-18, 14:12 | Link #84 | ||||||||||||
The Flame Crussader
Join Date: Aug 2009
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Deville of Huckebein xD! Quote:
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Probably Deville have better knowledge of how to predict meele attacks and react to them, as Signum he must have really good timing to catch Fate's hits, still Fate is unscatched(if a bit tired) there can be various reasons for this aside of what you described, yet non of that can be confirmed xDU. Quote:
Joking aside, we're talking about speed, not breaks, Magical flight in closed spaces must be executed carefully as there's not enough space for sudden high-speed turns or complex aerial maneuvers, Mach Caliber's design and funcionts allow for a reliable grip on the ground and flexible mobility on surfaces which allow for more stable speed on that kind of places. I concede you that Subaru's cyborg body have something to do with her being faster but the "Rocket-Rollerblades" are still the pivotal tool to achieve said speed and control. I really doubt Subaru can be that fast just running on foot. Subaru abused Mach Caliber to the extreme and suffered various injuries/damage so she does have a limit for how fast she can be, still proven that, even if a bit reckless, she can be faster than Nanoha on closed corridors.
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2011-09-18, 16:42 | Link #85 | |||||||
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Join Date: Aug 2011
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I add that qualifier because I'm pretty sure he had to instantly teleport away from Fate to escape her, but he would probably have the Huckebein's ship to help him teleport back inside. Quote:
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Does it matter how you're flying if you still have to contest gravity and wind resistance? If Deville is teleporting by traversing subspace like mages do, he might have to deal with the same problems. But, I'll grant you, he might NOT. Quote:
Hang on, you're onto something without directly touching on it. Let's assume I'm right, and Deville actually executed TWO teleports just then. One to travel outside of Raising Heart's sensor range, and another get behind Nanoha. In between those two moments, he would need to scry for Nanoha's exact position and the direction she was facing -- or he would need to recieve such information from his allies. His entire window of disappearance was less than a minute. 1) Start first teleport 2) Arrive outside of range (or perhaps aboard the HB ship) 3) Scry or recieve information on Nanoha 4) Set coordinates, possibly wait a little for the best opportunity, start second teleport 5) Arrive behind Nanoha and attack. Of course, there's little or no way to figure out exactly how much time each step took. But it's CLEAR evidence that his short jumps cannot take longer than 20 seconds from start to finish. Still not clear enough evidence that he can use them in the middle of a fight, though. And yes, I'm firmly secure in the "two jumps" hypothesis. Because otherwise, he would need a method of knowing that Nanoha would still be in that one spot, facing that same direction, by the time he got there, or else some way to watch his target and adjust his destination and orientation to match. Or he's gambling that she'll stand absolutely still for nearly a whole minute, which is a sucker bet. Quote:
Because that's what the artist thought was cool enough to draw; Deville getting bigger and stronger, and smashing Fate away. It's rather like how we see Arnage using firepower rather than a battleaxe; because firepower is supposed to be her strong point. How was the short jump used? To justify how Deville can get into axe-range with someone, without making him a speed-freak like Fate. In other words, the short jump has only been used as a way to close range to melee-distance, and only as part of an ambush. He uses this way twice, and no other way is seen. And the artist would surely think that an instantly-teleporting monster-man-mountain would be interesting enough to draw in the few panels that he's giving to Deville and Fate's fight, right? Or even that an untransformed Deville using instant teleportation to fight Fate would be more interesting that showing Deville's transformation before an epic final encounter? Quote:
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Actually, where did ANY of these muthertrucking Huckebeins come from? Too much mystery, not enough history! There's WAY too much new and confusing shit going on to have this much background unexplained. If the Rollerblades are responsible for better speed than flight, Wing Road removes any of the problems with achieving "as the crow flies" speed. Which means Subaru becomes faster than Nanoha EVERYWHERE. And who said anything about footspeed? Don't be silly. |
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2011-09-18, 16:50 | Link #86 | |
Adeptus Animus
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Join Date: Jan 2007
Age: 36
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Though having said that... it is quite possible that Subaru outspeeds Nanoha. Nanoha has never been much of a speed user, after all. Unlike Subaru, who relies on it to get into melee combat. |
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2011-09-18, 18:28 | Link #88 | |
Labda Prakarsa Nirwikara
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Pekanbaru (UTC+07:00)
Age: 37
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Of course, that might explain why they're humanoid: to give them a friendlier image to the public (might need to ditch the helmet, thoug).
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2011-09-18, 20:48 | Link #89 | ||||
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Join Date: Jun 2011
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Oh man, I can’t believe I’m saying anything at all remotely complimentary about those Raptors. Damn you sugar right to hell, curses.
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…okay, I admit that I really loved Power Rangers in Space. Quote:
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2011-09-19, 02:06 | Link #92 |
Goat Herder
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Join Date: Jun 2008
Age: 36
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That's not a flurry of attacks, though. Just repeated dash-n-slash, up until Fate decided to play Number baseball with Tre. And frankly speaking, I've seen better choreographed high-speed combat; they didn't pull it off that well.
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2011-09-19, 08:02 | Link #95 | ||
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Join Date: Aug 2011
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Which just plain doesn't happen. Fate's fast attack speed is with a hit-and-run manuever, and the RUN part of that means that she can't follow up on the one strike, hit or miss. Also, it means that she has to turn around and make another pass to strike again, which "telegraphs" her next attack. That is, it makes it obvious she's going to attack, and gives a person at least a little time to respond before it happens. Quote:
1) Teana's showdown with three Numbers. Not the best animated, to my fuzzy memory, but it was probably the most complicated fight-coreography in a season of really, disappointingly, insultingly simple fights. (Dash and slash, dash and smash, dash and clash, oops, I lost...) 2) Subaru's berserker take down of the Numbers who had beaten her sister. Much better animation than I remember Teana's scene having, and while the correography wasn't complicated, it didn't need to be, and it was at least SATISFYING. But this is off-topic. |
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2011-09-19, 10:17 | Link #96 | |
The Flame Crussader
Join Date: Aug 2009
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You implied that by attributing her superior speed entirely to the fact she's a cyborg(reafirmed by your comment that said the flying numbers where faster than Subaru following that logic). Being a combat cyborg alone doesn't make up for her speed, it is Mach Caliber's achievement in great part.
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2011-09-19, 11:24 | Link #97 | ||
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Join Date: Jul 2008
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Fate doesn't do 5 hits too fast for the enemy to counter because She knocks them out in one hit. Making 5 Hits when one is enough is utterly stupid. Against Tre, *Tre herself was a speedster*. Fate 'doing another pass' is for the same reason Deville teleported to attack nanoha. Not for Speed, but in order to attack a blind spot. the main reason she sometimes does another pass is to get at one, not because needs one to attack. Quote:
Myself, i loaths "lots of strikes while being stationary' too. So in that at least i approved of how it went. |
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