(L) Eureka Seven: Astral Ocean

[ChocoBar9]

Originally Posted by Xagzan

Well now, sure, there are a lot of complaints about how people "feel" about the show, based on connections to the original, but I've plenty also say they simply don't like the direction it's been heading the past several episodes. As for me, as I said in the beginning, I'm not a fan of the MotW format being used. I think the monsters themselves have proven generic and generally dull in design, and I also feel that their prominence in every recent episode robs us of time better spent on exploring the characters themselves, or even the main plot. There, that's a criticism of the direction being taken.

That's something I can get behind. IMO AO it's a lot more focused on the plot this time around. Except we don't know what is going on with the plot. Imagine we're watching Evangelion right now - we have plenty of crapt going on in the background but nothing has been explained or really shown to us. At all. But it's there.

Originally Posted by Xagzan

On a different note, I do wish people would stop using "that's what happens in real life" to defend things such as Renton and Eureka not being together, as if it's a blanket defense for any problem people might have with the series. This is not real life. This is a fictional story, a narrative, and these often have rules, conventions, etc that are different from reality - ones that can and should be played with, bent and broken on occasion, but others that it's generally a better idea to adhere to. And just saying "it's just what happens in real life, deal with it" doesn't necessarily excuse the breaking of certain of these conventions. I won't get into that more since it's a different subject, but as it applies to this show (even though it's still too early to know what the writers have done with this, so take this as a hypothetical), I can perfectly understand why people would be upset at Renton and Eureka having had their happy ending undone, if that is what happened.

I think people are going off the handle with that like "RENTON AND EUREKA ARE NOT ALLOWED TO BE SEPARATED!" without actually understanding the circumstances that led to it, it's one thing to be emotionally invested in the characters it's a whole another to act irrationally about it

Originally Posted by Xagzan

You see, you may not want emotionally-based criticism, but this is a TV anime, not, say, a college dissertation. People are going to, as they well should, have complaints about how a sequel "feels," especially if they had an emotional connection to the original. Don't automatically disparage that. As far as I'm concerned, breaking up Eurenton would be/is a very bad move. Many people became, or at least it was clearly the original show's intention for them to become, highly invested in that relationship: we watched them go through a ton of hard and painful times together, as well as some good ones, and that's what the eventual payoff of their happy ending feel so well-earned and satisfying.

That's really not a justifiable reason at all especially since like I stated we don't really know anything regards to what happened or whether or not they chose to separate themselves (the manga is alluding to this). This goes back to my claim that fans wanted Eureka Seven Destiny rather than something that had a new and different story to tell that may infact expand the E7 verse, infact once Renton appears I'm pretty sure everyone will turn coat and say how "good" the series is now that he's back.

Originally Posted by Xagzan

To take that conclusion, with all the time and care and buildup it took, and just casually decide to discard that, and offscreen for that matter, I find quite disrespectful. And in a way, it's a bigger 4th wall breaker than Elena could ever be, since it makes it seem like the writers are saying "We don't have any other ideas for this but we want money so we'll just go for the cheap drama of splitting up the main pair who got together in the last installment" (this is something Hollywood sequels have always been disappointingly fond of, as well).

No offense but a sequel involving Renton and Eureka's marriage life wouldn't be entertaining

Originally Posted by Xagzan

Well, reading over this I think this post makes me sound a lot more upset than I am I don't mean to sound that harsh on AO. I still look forward to it every week, and do enjoy it for the most part. I was pretty bummed about the seeming splitting of Eurenton at the beginning, but I've had time to cope and now I'm mostly just not digging the direction these past few episodes have taken, while waiting and having faith that it'll get better for me. Although, if Renton and Eureka really were apart, and don't get back together by the end of AO and thus re-establish their happy ending, then I'll be really annoyed.

That's obviously not gonna happen

[Xagzan]

Originally Posted by ChocoBar9

That's something I can get behind. IMO AO it's a lot more focused on the plot this time around. Except we don't know what is going on with the plot. Imagine we're watching Evangelion right now - we have plenty of crapt going on in the background but nothing has been explained or really shown to us. At all. But it's there.

I'm all for future episodes to retroactively explain how all these somewhat repetitive Secret battles are significant to the main plot. It's something I'm waiting and hoping for.

I think people are going off the handle with that like "RENTON AND EUREKA ARE NOT ALLOWED TO BE SEPARATED!" without actually understanding the circumstances that led to it, it's one thing to be emotionally invested in the characters it's a whole another to act irrationally about it

Oh I know, that's why I'm waiting to see both the circumstances and the resolution before I have my final opinion.

That's really not a justifiable reason at all especially since like I stated we don't really know anything regards to what happened or whether or not they chose to separate themselves (the manga is alluding to this). This goes back to my claim that fans wanted Eureka Seven Destiny rather than something that had a new and different story to tell that may infact expand the E7 verse, infact once Renton appears I'm pretty sure everyone will turn coat and say how "good" the series is now that he's back.

Again I'll say, oh I know, hence my "take this as a hypothetical."

I'm not reading the manga, but it's interesting if that's what it's alluding to. Since we've gotten no such allusions in the anime, I'm curious about whether the anime and manga might once again end up different.

No offense but a sequel involving Renton and Eureka's marriage life wouldn't be entertaining

No of course not, but there are other, better ways to create drama besides resorting to the lazy "let's just break them up offscreen."

That's obviously not gonna happen

Sorry, what's obviously not going to happen? Them getting back together? I'm not sure why you say it's obvious, since we've gotten almost no information on Eureka so far, and even less on Renton

[ChocoBar9]

Originally Posted by Xagzan

Sorry, what's obviously not going to happen? Them getting back together? I'm not sure why you say it's obvious, since we've gotten almost no information on Eureka so far, and even less on Renton

The inception that they won't be reunited. I damn well know Kyoda wouldn't do something so cruel to longtime fans of the series. Hell Ao alluding to giving his old man a punch when he sees them should be an obvious enough clue to it

[Alchemist007]

Considering Renton's childhood, he might just be punching himself daily for it.

[kuroishinigami]

Originally Posted by Xagzan

On a different note, I do wish people would stop using "that's what happens in real life" to defend things such as Renton and Eureka not being together, as if it's a blanket defense for any problem people might have with the series. This is not real life. This is a fictional story, a narrative, and these often have rules, conventions, etc that are different from reality - ones that can and should be played with, bent and broken on occasion, but others that it's generally a better idea to adhere to. And just saying "it's just what happens in real life, deal with it" doesn't necessarily excuse the breaking of certain of these conventions. I won't get into that more since it's a different subject, but as it applies to this show (even though it's still too early to know what the writers have done with this, so take this as a hypothetical), I can perfectly understand why people would be upset at Renton and Eureka having had their happy ending undone, if that is what happened.

You see, you may not want emotionally-based criticism, but this is a TV anime, not, say, a college dissertation. People are going to, as they well should, have complaints about how a sequel "feels," especially if they had an emotional connection to the original. Don't automatically disparage that. As far as I'm concerned, breaking up Eurenton would be/is a very bad move. Many people became, or at least it was clearly the original show's intention for them to become, highly invested in that relationship: we watched them go through a ton of hard and painful times together, as well as some good ones, and that's what the eventual payoff of their happy ending feel so well-earned and satisfying.

To take that conclusion, with all the time and care and buildup it took, and just casually decide to discard that, and offscreen for that matter, I find quite disrespectful. And in a way, it's a bigger 4th wall breaker than Elena could ever be, since it makes it seem like the writers are saying "We don't have any other ideas for this but we want money so we'll just go for the cheap drama of splitting up the main pair who got together in the last installment" (this is something Hollywood sequels have always been disappointingly fond of, as well).

The thing is, the story never explicitly shown that renton and eureka live happily ever after, it's a conclusion drawn by the viewer themselves. I get what you mean if the writer explicitly tells that eureka and renton lives happily ever afte and then retconned it in the sequel, but the writer himself never did that. This is like someone saying "I don't accept return of the jedi because luke doesn't end up with leia" or "I don't accept the sequel to xmen because cyclops died even though he looks like the main hero in the original xmen". It's okay to reject something as a sequel if the author is inconsistent, as in retconning what he himself stated in the original, but to say a sequel is bad only from a conclusion that the fans draw or like you said, "feel", themselves that is not officially confirmed by the original author themselves is wrong IMO.

If we're talking about difference in tone between the original and Ao, it happens with a lot other series too, even during the middle of the run. Just to name a few, fate stay night and zero, even if it's technically a prequel, gundam zz and char counterattack, arguably gurenn lagann first haf and 2d half, and it also don't make them bad sequel(in fact, fate zero and cca is generally regarded the better one title).

[Xagzan]

Originally Posted by ChocoBar9

The inception that they won't be reunited. I damn well know Kyoda wouldn't do something so cruel to longtime fans of the series. Hell Ao alluding to giving his old man a punch when he sees them should be an obvious enough clue to it

Whoops! I mistook you to mean the opposite thing. Yeah, that's what I was thinking as well, which is why I thought it would be strange for you to say the signs pointed to them not reuniting.

Originally Posted by kuroishinigami

The thing is, the story never explicitly shown that renton and eureka live happily ever after, it's a conclusion drawn by the viewer themselves. I get what you mean if the writer explicitly tells that eureka and renton lives happily ever afte and then retconned it in the sequel, but the writer himself never did that. This is like someone saying "I don't accept return of the jedi because luke doesn't end up with leia" or "I don't accept the sequel to xmen because cyclops died even though he looks like the main hero in the original xmen". It's okay to reject something as a sequel if the author is inconsistent, as in retconning what he himself stated in the original, but to say a sequel is bad only from a conclusion that the fans draw or like you said, "feel", themselves that is not officially confirmed by the original author themselves is wrong IMO.

Don't say it's drawn by the viewer as if it's not grounded in what the show actually portrayed. Renton and Eureka just saved the universe with the Power of Love, finally had their kiss, wrote their names on the moon, added her and the 3 kids to the Thurston family register as his wife and children, and Axel and the kids were eagerly awaiting their return as a couple. all while triumphant music played in the background. I'd say that's a pretty explicit "happily ever after." Just because you don't see what happens afterwards doesn't mean it's merely an inference that was drawn: it's clearly what the show was going for.

Your analogies are off though. Return of the Jedi is a continuation of the Star Wars story, not a sequel, and things were still in flux as the story had not been settled. Luke, for instance, was not together with Leia in one film and just not in the next, so that's an issue of waiting for something you hope will happen, rather than something that had already been settled, like Renton and Eureka. And X-men: The Last Stand...well, that's not exactly a film I'd say other works should aspire to

[MeisterBabylon]

To everyone in general: Beware of what you wish for. Eureka and Renton may get reunited, and then get killed off in the same 3 minutes like a certain super robot anime...

Considering that a director filmed an entire movie just to kill Kirk, I can see an anime being made solely to hand the torch to the next generation.

And notice how BONES like to mess it up then make up for it (FMA) or make a hit then mess it up (everything else)...

The tarot are saying bad things.

[kuroishinigami]

Originally Posted by Xagzan

Don't say it's drawn by the viewer as if it's not grounded in what the show actually portrayed. Renton and Eureka just saved the universe with the Power of Love, finally had their kiss, wrote their names on the moon, added her and the 3 kids to the Thurston family register as his wife and children, and Axel and the kids were eagerly awaiting their return as a couple. all while triumphant music played in the background. I'd say that's a pretty explicit "happily ever after." Just because you don't see what happens afterwards doesn't mean it's merely an inference that was drawn: it's clearly what the show was going for.

Your analogies are off though. Return of the Jedi is a continuation of the Star Wars story, not a sequel, and things were still in flux as the story had not been settled. Luke, for instance, was not together with Leia in one film and just not in the next, so that's an issue of waiting for something you hope will happen, rather than something that had already been settled, like Renton and Eureka. And X-men: The Last Stand...well, that's not exactly a film I'd say other works should aspire to

Well, grounded or not, it's still something that's drawn by the viewer themselves, not an official statement by the director or staff. For instance, from all the points you made as basis, a cynical viewer who like bittersweet ending can also draw the conclusion that even though the live happily for a while, the happiness don't last long because of eureka's corellian nature which either cause eureka to die early(common trope for lover where one of the member is not human) or being chased by a new faction due to her correlian nature(history always repeat themselves, common trope in robot anime), or even renton might die first due to some accident and renton/eureka will have to live with only the three kids with the happy memory of their time together. Again, tonal change between sequel is not something uncommon, and might end up better sometimes.

No matter how many hint given by the writer, whether the author decides to realize the hint or not is up to the author since it's just hints, and it doesn't make the continuation good/bad because of that reason. After all, a couple that get teasing moment a lot during the story that makes the audience thinks"just get together already" might not end up together, and the story might still be great even when that happened. It's like saying, "I saw a blind man running toward a cliff, so he must have fallen on the cliff.". You disregard the chance that someone saves him from the cliff, or the blind man suddenly realizing there's a cliff ahead and stop running. Just because all the evidence suggest something doesn't mean that a completely opposite things happening is impossible, unless the thing being suggested already happened.

Yea, I agree that rotj is bad analogy since I can't think of anything else lol. How about gurrenn lagann ending which I won't spoil here? It's quite similar in that the ending's tone is very different in tone with all the hint they drop during the show, but it hapenn during the ending in gurenn lagann while it hapen in a time skip here(which might also be elaborated in future episodes)

[Flawfinder]

Originally Posted by ChocoBar9

It doesn't matter. There's always gonna be haters or people who prefer the original regardless of the actual quality.

Yeah, but I didn't expect the backlash to be that bad. Then again, I wasn't aware of the Last Exile sequel backlash.

And I think some people got the wrong idea with my blog and some of my earlier posts. I wasn't a fan of the first series, but I think it's fine. It's just really flawed.

[CrowKenobi]

Once again, if the discussion is going to go off-topic and discuss what makes a "good" sequel, then make a thread in the General Chat forum and move it there.

[kuroishinigami]

Originally Posted by CrowKenobi

Once again, if the discussion is going to go off-topic and discuss what makes a "good" sequel, then make a thread in the General Chat forum and move it there.

I thought we're still discussing whether eureka 7 is a bad sequel or not, but if the mod thinks that way, I guess I'll just drop this discussion.

[Daniel Lind]

To everyone in general: Beware of what you wish for. Eureka and Renton may get reunited, and then get killed off in the same 3 minutes like a certain super robot anime...
Considering that a director filmed an entire movie just to kill Kirk, I can see an anime being made solely to hand the torch to the next generation.

You don't need forced drama for the "passing the torch" story.
What you say would just end up being bad writing. Even more bad writing.

Well, grounded or not, it's still something that's drawn by the viewer themselves, not an official statement by the director or staff. For instance, from all the points you made as basis, a cynical viewer who like bittersweet ending can also draw the conclusion that even though the live happily for a while, the happiness don't last long <...>

Well if it wasn't for AO, that would just be a particular viewer's imagination, right? I'm not saying it's a retcon. I'm saying it undermining the achievements of the characters in the original show especially in the light of how they were portrayed.
And once a work has been made public, how it's viewed does not belong exclusively to author anymore.
And no, this isn't off topic, this is directly related to AO. Come on, mods.

I damn well know Kyoda wouldn't do something so cruel to longtime fans of the series.

Pocketful of Rainbows says hi. He didn't mind making Anemone into an old woman for no reason and making Eureka into a brainless retard for no reason.

IMO AO it's a lot more focused on the plot this time around. Except we don't know what is going on with the plot.

That's awesome. It's focused on the plot, but we don't know anything about the plot. How is it focused then? The exact reason we do not understand anything is because it's too unfocused! There's too little about too much at once, that's pretty unfocused. You've read the ANN review, so I won't repeat what they said there about how the narrative is cluttered with so much it doesn't manage to say anything. Right now, the only thing that supports the narrative is Ao's piloting Nirvash on daily missions. Because how Fukai said to him "If you pilot it, something will happen. Maybe. I'm not sure." This is the most flimsy plot device ever.

This goes back to my claim that fans wanted Eureka Seven Destiny rather than something that had a new and different story to tell that may infact expand the E7 verse

You keep using this argument, but there is a huge variety of different things between older cast hijacking a new show to please fans and a new and different story. Could a different story be told about Eureka and Renton? Sure, the E7 movie as horrible as it was is a proof of that. What, if Ao was in fact featuring Eureka and Renton as a married couple, would it absolutely have to focus on their marriage life? No, of course not.

And even then all of this is a strawman fighting against the problems you think people have with Ao.
In my eyes, the disconnect with the source material is just another part of confusing and not well-consturcted narrative of the show.
I would've put up with a lot in Ao if it didn't bore me to tears. And hey, first 3 or 4 episodes didn't!

So far most of the complaints I've seen are baseless and don't really go into the technical and writing issues

And this is just a lie and a perfect demagogy on your part.

[kuroishinigami]

Originally Posted by Daniel Lind

Well if it wasn't for AO, that would just be a particular viewer's imagination, right? I'm not saying it's a retcon. I'm saying it undermining the achievements of the characters in the original show especially in the light of how they were portrayed.
And once a work has been made public, how it's viewed does not belong exclusively to author anymore.
And no, this isn't off topic, this is directly related to AO. Come on, mods.

I'm sorry, but I completely disagree with this. Assume there's no Ao, the do you mean to say that viewer who take the ending of eureka as happily ever after is more "right" than the one taking it as the beginning of a new trial that end up breaking their bond without confirmation from the original author? What decide a particular conclusion is more "right" and better than the others when all that's given by the author are just hints? Majority vote? IMO, in the end, only the original author has the right to decide which author is "right" and other interpretration is just in the realm of fanfic, although the fanfic might be a good one. It's like saying "the return of sherlock holmes" is stupid when holmes comes back from the death even though most reader thinks holmes died against moriarty from all the hint given by Sir Doyle.

If we're talking about directing and narrative of Ao being worse than E7, or how there's no tangible relation to E7(although I personally feel the existence of Eureka and scub coral is enough tangible relation for me) although I personally disagree with that, I can concede with that since it's an extremely subjective matter, but attacking Ao just because Renton and Eureka doesn't end up like what you and some other people think they should(without any official confirmation from the author) is just something I can't agree with.

[Daniel Lind]

Well for one we can't even really speak of a singular "author" when it comes to E7.
The two shows are written and produced by different people.
And while they share some of the staff, we know what that some of the staff can do when left alone - again I direct you at Kyoda's own brainchild.
It's basically another writer coming over and doing whatever with mind product of other people.
Don't mind if I do judge it.

[ChocoBar9]

Originally Posted by Daniel Lind

Pocketful of Rainbows says hi. He didn't mind making Anemone into an old woman for no reason and making Eureka into a brainless retard for no reason.

PoR is not canon so I really have no idea why you keep bringing it up since it's more detrimental to the first series

Originally Posted by Daniel Lind

That's awesome. It's focused on the plot, but we don't know anything about the plot. How is it focused then? The exact reason we do not understand anything is because it's too unfocused! There's too little about too much at once, that's pretty unfocused.

That's actually not the case at all. The plot is focused but we're getting information bits by bits. Are you saying you fully need to comprehend an anime's plot within six episodes? Or if an anime doesn't spoonfed you with info dumps it's unfocused?

Originally Posted by Daniel Lind

You've read the ANN review, so I won't repeat what they said there about how the narrative is cluttered with so much it doesn't manage to say anything. Right now, the only thing that supports the narrative is Ao's piloting Nirvash on daily missions. Because how Fukai said to him "If you pilot it, something will happen. Maybe. I'm not sure." This is the most flimsy plot device ever.

I'm not sure what's sadder. The fact that you take ANN reviews to heart or the fact that you let it dictate what you think. I already wrote up why I thought the review didn't make sense and considering it was the first six episodes he reviewed that makes it even sillier. The narrative is surrounding by several different points (as pointed out in episode 7) not just Ao piloting the Nirvash, it's the basis for his motivation it doesn't run the plot itself.

Originally Posted by Daniel Lind

You keep using this argument, but there is a huge variety of different things between older cast hijacking a new show to please fans and a new and different story.

Not it all. By the end it really comes down to you whinning about not getting what you want from a sequel but as I stated with Flawnalyst there will always be haters and people who disapprove with this sequel whether it be too different or too similar, it's a lost cause..

Originally Posted by Daniel Lind

And even then all of this is a strawman fighting against the problems you think people have with Ao.
In my eyes, the disconnect with the source material is just another part of confusing and not well-consturcted narrative of the show.
I would've put up with a lot in Ao if it didn't bore me to tears. And hey, first 3 or 4 episodes didn't!

And that's really a baseless claim based on you own personal dogma and not the show itself. What disconnect? All the pieces are being thrown at you and you refuse to except it. The reason why you adore 3 and 4 is because there was barely any plot or development surrounding them at all what's funny is that the last few episode had similar writers involved with them. Again maybe this show is too complicated for you

Originally Posted by Daniel Lind

And this is just a lie and a perfect demagogy on your part.

You and Reckoner are a testament to what I'm talking about, neither of your arguments come off as constructive criticism just baseless whining about how the show isn't what you wanted to the point where you actually question it's legitimacy as a sequel no less.

[Silenthillnight]

Sequel or not, even if we look at AO as a series by itself, I believe it is severely lacking in a cohesive sense. There really is no discernible reason for actions that certain characters take and the introduction of Truth has done nothing but cause even more confusion to the point where the show is almost unwatchable.

[morbosfist]

What actions have no discernible reason behind them? Truth may be chaos incarnate, but that's his thing. The other characters have seemed perfectly reasonable thus far.

There's nothing incoherent about it, either. It is confusing, but that's because we don't know the motivations behind certain characters. Why is Truth a psycho? Where is the Scub coming from (which is fairly obvious but as yet unaddressed)? They're not going to be answered all at once. As it moves on, more questions are answered. This kind of storytelling is nothing new, not to E7 or to any form of media.

[Reckoner]

Originally Posted by ChocoBar9

You and Reckoner are a testament to what I'm talking about, neither of your arguments come off as constructive criticism just baseless whining about how the show isn't what you wanted to the point where you actually question it's legitimacy as a sequel no less.

Much of what I said of course is just a feeling I got about this show and how it's not grabbing me due to various reason. I compared it to the original to contrast how that grabbed me compared to this one, and I talked about the fact that this isn't benefiting at all so far in my POV from it being a sequel since much of what has transpired so far isn't really related to it in a tangible sense.

However, this doesn't absolve it from my other criticisms which are based solely on this work alone. The reason I haven't talked about this as much is because E7 was also a flawed show when it came down to it, but it was what I felt about it that made it special to me and that's why I have only talked about that. So on top of these issues I have which are mostly just feelings, here's what I feel Eureka 7 Ao has done wrong (And much more egregious errors than the first series in the beginning stages IMO).

Uninspiring execution of monster of the week format

Most of the story so far is contingent on battling these "g-monsters." The first one we saw in this story wreaked havoc on Ao's island and was the reason he started piloting. He piloted, despite the natives distreatment of him, to protect the island from the havoc the destruction around them. So far so good.

However, after these initial scenes each g monster has progressively looked less threatening. They all look exactly the same, and aren't human so there is no real dramatic tension in the sense that there isn't any sort of war being fought with other humans. There isn't a battle of ideals or anything, it's just protecting humanity from a bunch of block monsters floating around and destroying crap, but never causing lasting damage to the main cast even psychologically.

Furthermore, the entire plot basically revolves around Ao protecting people from these G-monsters who aren't menacing so the story as a result just feels lacking. NGE was another monster of the week show, but it was a post apocalyptic scenario and there were deep introspective issues going on to balance out the plot and provide very interesting things outside the fights. There was real tension and horror. The execution comparatively in Eureka 7 Ao just doesn't compare. Ao isn't going through deep introspective issues or the like which could provide intellectual satisfaction, nor are the monsters menacing enough to warrant any real sense of tension or urgency in the plot. It's just a bit a generic and not very gripping.

Character Development... Where?

I like Ao himself. Sure great. He's gotten some development and that's good. I find Fleur herself OK as well, she's gotten the second most development, fine. Who has Ao really interacted with that much at generation Bleu besides Fleur? Oh... No one.

This show has hardly provided much meaningful character interaction with Ao between other members of generation Bleu besides Fleur. Sure maybe the show likes to show a lot of these g monsters and politics on the side with some conspiracies, a bit more focused on some plot, but it's heavily forgetting the human side of the story by not giving that much great character interaction. I'm just not terribly attached to them because they don't slow down and give us more episodes like episode 8 (Where you actually get character exposition but that again only between Fleur and Ao).

Plot is great, but if you can't give a damn about the characters in it, it doesn't really work IMO.

The Truth is just retarded

Sorry this guy is just dragging the shown down for me. His manner of speech and dialogue just feels cheesy. His introduction to the show felt completely random and jarring. He hasn't really added anything worth caring about in the plot except for his decision to kidnap Naru so I guess Ao has a reason to fight him. His method of fighting is ridiculous, a guy who can blow things up with the snap of a finger in a show like this seems overly silly. I am just not feeling him. He may have a more clear purpose later down the line, I expect this and will wait for it, but his introduction and characterization were pretty random and cheesy. The fact that he's a major force in the movement of the plot of this show now is a bit disheartening to me.

---

Anyways those are things I specifically have issue with this show and are the reasons I felt it's been declining fast since episode 3 (first 3 episodes I thought were excellent).

[Destined_Fate]

Well, the latest episode gave us more hints on what Secrets are. They immediatly knew that the Scrub Coral was a fake and in retaliation it started attacking the Japanese who were dumbfounded by its sudden change in prorities. Since before they always went after Scrub Corals and usually ignored humans unless they got in the zone. This thing didn't even care about the zone stuff and went straight after them, guess it was severely ticked off over being tricked with a fake even if the Japanese thought it was the real deal.

Guess they aren't going to push for a love triangle in this. Fluer seems to have gotten over that pretty fast and even teases him over wanting to save his "not" girlfriend without any ulterior motive or hidden feelings.

[MeisterBabylon]

I had enough of love triangles in mecha pilots for once. Sure it adds drama, but it doesn't happen that often. A team functions much better when there aren't as many emotional tangles to navigate through.

Besides, Fleur has eyes for the leader of the 3 Stooges. I give kudos to anime direction for not forgetting the guys in the background!