Code Geass R2 - Episode 19 Discussion / Poll

[Orga777]

Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant

And why would he care for the evidence if BK had just betrayed him?

Why can't it be taken as a coup? It isn't like they got Japan back yet so technically they haven't betrayed the UNF yet or dropped out of the war. We don't know what they are going to do yet, and who is to say that Sing-Ke WOULDN'T buy that evidence?

As far as Li's concerned, BK is causing far more problems for him right now than Zero ever did.

Not if he thinks he was manipulated into helping him he won't. Just saying.

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

Originally Posted by Orga777

Why can't it be taken as a coup? It isn't like they got Japan back yet so technically they haven't betrayed the UNF yet or dropped out of the war. We don't know what they are going to do yet, and who is to say that Sing-Ke WOULDN'T buy that evidence?



Not if he thinks he was manipulated into helping him he won't. Just saying.

So you are saying Li think he doesn't believe Britannia is a threat?

The Geass argument can only go so far. Britannia has been a threat to China for YEARS. Nothing changed that.

I know you believe Britannia is somehow a GOOD country, for some reason, but saying China has no reason to defend itself against it is ridiculous.

And as long as BK still want to catch Zero, it means they still want to keep the deal on the table with Britannia. And if they do that, they have betrayed China.

[demon_god04]

Originally Posted by Orga777

Why can't it be taken as a coup? It isn't like they got Japan back yet so technically they haven't betrayed the UNF yet or dropped out of the war. We don't know what they are going to do yet, and who is to say that Sing-Ke WOULDN'T buy that evidence?

Not if he thinks he was manipulated into helping him he won't. Just saying.

They made and accepted a deal with Britannia that only benefited the Japanese that in itself can be viewed as betrayal.

I think Li is smarter then that, if he was manipulated by geass then he wouldn't be doubting Zero would he? And they joined the UFN willingly because they needed them to survive against Britannia. Li's loyalties is still first and foremost to Tianzi and he will go with whichever option will benefit them more. Which at this point might be just see how it all plays out with the deal with Schneizel.

[Orga777]

Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant

So you are saying Li think he doesn't believe Britannia is a threat?

Did I say that? He can break away from the BKs. But that doesn't mean he will be loyal to Zero. That is all I am saying. He can still fight.

I know you believe Britannia is somehow a GOOD country, for some reason, but saying China has no reason to defend itself against it is ridiculous.

Did I say that? No? Didn't think so. They can fight, but just because they still fight, doesn't mean they will trust or accept Zero.

[kramerica]

I think he's gonna see that the BKs made a deal with Britannia, and he'll cut them off. And he's got the guts to kill a Chinese eunuch in front of other people (episode 4 or 5 I think), AND pretty much kill all of them one finding out they betrayed China for Britannia. He may not trust Zero at all, but I believe he's more focused on the war more than hunting down Zero should he find out about this.

[Diedrupo]

Originally Posted by morbosfist

If anything, Suzaku's going to be pushed closer to the Britannians, not away from them. As for Lulu, I doubt it. He may be set on dying now, but he'll get talked out of it.

Please, if you think the series is going to end on a Britannians vs rest of the world note, you're sorely mistaken. The series is headed in the general progression of the war ending between the two sides as they square off against a common enemy (Charles? Lelouch? Schneizel? Who knows).

Saying Suzaku is "being pushed closer to the Britannians" is a bit silly, because that implies there will still be two distinct sides when this whole thing is over.

And why would he care for the evidence if BK had just betrayed him?

As far as Li's concerned, BK is causing far more problems for him right now than Zero ever did.

Sometimes I have no idea how you come up with your assumptions. Who says that the BK have betrayed Xingke? He is a COMMANDER of the BK, why would he feel betrayed if they decided to get rid of Zero? Their mission hasn't changed.

The only reason China fought against Britannia in the first place is because of Zero, and with him out of the question, there is likely going to be a truce between the two sides. Lest you forget, Britannia and the CF (when it was ruled by the Eunuchs) were allies until Zero foiled the Tianzi-Odysseus marriage. If you think Xingke is going to want to keep fighting Britannia out of misguided vengeance despite the rest of the world wanting peace, you're out of your mind.

Something people seem to forget is that other than excursions into the EU for the sake of finding geass sites, the world was not at war with Britannia until the UFN was formed by Zero. With Zero gone, there is no more will to fight a pointless war that he started.

[wingdarkness]

Originally Posted by Var

To you it is a clear inconsistency, to me it is not. Schneizel asked for Lelouch to be turned over before Ougi threw in another condition to the trade.

If you just follow the breadcrumbs you’ll have one hell of a snack…

1)Dude says can you hand over my brother, could you hand him over to me
2)Ougi immediately following this says if I’m gonna betray a comrade I want Japan
3)Black Knights surround Zero with guns blazing READY TO EXECUTE HIM if Kallen isn’t there

What are you missing? There never is a discussion of unilaterally killing him, not even a hint of this…If you are arguing strictly speculation, then it’s pure conjecture…Please give me the timecode in this episode where anything suggests (leading up to the firing squad scene) that the Black Knights are just gonna kill Zero on sight after meeting with Schnizzle?

For all you know, Schneizel had been planning on executing Lelouch the moment he acquired him but did not press it onto the Black Knights because, simply, they may have hesitated to kill the man who brought them miracles

Then simply where is your evidence? Where is the even slightest hint from this episode that suggests this...Hell I’d give you a cookie if Schnizzle even does one of those Dullindal smirks after Ougi asks him for Japan…

You keep saying that Schnizzle didn’t say anything to Lulu because he had set all of this up as his final chessmove, and that was enuff to him, so I ask you again what evidence do you have showing this? Even if I were willing to believe that the scene wasn’t OOC, you are totally ignoring the lack of any evidence that shows how Schnizzle goes from asking them to hand him over to the Black Knights with guns blazing ready to kill Zero on sight…You are skipping an entire element of this argument…So I guess in a way you are correct…Correct right to my point that is because they created this scene for dramatic effect (shock factor) and to set-up Rolo’s rescue…There is no other explanation, especially if the crux of your point here is Schnizel wanted to see Lulu die at the hands of his own army…Where is the one shred of evidence in this ep that supports that…You don’t have it…Pretty sad if that was his master chessmove and the audience doesn’t even get an ambiguous smirk as evidence here…We go straight from negotiations where none of this is mentioned in the slightest right to the BK’s unilateral firing squad…I’m sorry but it’s hard for me not to believe I’ve won this point…

You wanna bring up previous episodes, because most of them solidify the point that Schnizel at the very least doesn't want to JUST KILL HIM, period, end of sentence...

Further, there were KMFs aiming their guns at Lelouch. Had he used his Geass there is still a perfect fail safe in the KMFs just shooting him upon trying.

Upon trying what? Again you assume Schnizzle knows how Lulu uses the geass. And if this is your assumption, then where is the tidbit of evidence that he would have let Lulu be killed in that way? Again it was the Black Knights surrounding Zero with guns not Brittania, so when Kallen moves out of the way, why not just have a KMF mall his a$$ and be done with it? He’s seen his men betraying him for chessmatch drama, so kill him Schnielzel, kill him…

Other than loving to passionately debate, I’m really not mad here, because CG does this ALL THE TIME…To pull plot twists outta you’re a$$ every episode, you have to deprive the audience of certain things as not to give away the twist…There have been times where this has worked great (Lulu fooling V.V. when he was in the desert for instance) and there have been times when it’s been beyond absurd (Million Zero-no-jutsu episode)…Here it was neither great nor out of bounds, but to me it was definitely OOC and weird…You’re asking me to believe on faith something happened offscreen that checker-jumps from simply handing Zero over to HIS OWN MEN killing him in cold blood on sight…I mean dude, I’m always ready to concede if a point exists that’s greater than my own, but I just don’t see one here…This was one of the countless scenes in CG that are used to set-up the plethora of endless plot twists…

[demon_god04]

Originally Posted by Diedrupo

Sometimes I have no idea how you come up with your assumptions. Who says that the BK have betrayed Xingke? He is a COMMANDER of the BK, why would he feel betrayed if they decided to get rid of Zero? Their mission hasn't changed.

The only reason China fought against Britannia in the first place is because of Zero, and with him out of the question, there is likely going to be a truce between the two sides. Lest you forget, Britannia and the CF (when it was ruled by the Eunuchs) were allies until Zero foiled the Tianzi-Odysseus marriage. If you think Xingke is going to want to keep fighting Britannia out of misguided vengeance despite the rest of the world wanting peace, you're out of your mind.

Something people seem to forget is that other than excursions into the EU for the sake of finding geass sites, the world was not at war with Britannia until the UFN was formed by Zero. With Zero gone, there is no more will to fight a pointless war that he started.

I could say the same for you. Right, Xingke is the comander in chief of the Black Knights who was not informed or consulted regarding a deal that only served to benefit the Japanese with the enemy they are fighting.

No, the reason China fought against Britannia was that the Eunuchs tried to sell their country to Britannia but failed due to Xingke and Zero and Britannia was going to invade them in retaliation. They joined the UFN and fought Britannia because that was the only way they could survive as a nation. Xingke's coup started it and Zero just rewrote the scenario abit.

[Var]

Originally Posted by wingdarkness

If you just follow the breadcrumbs you’ll have one hell of a snack…

1)Dude says can you hand over my brother, could you hand him over to me
2)Ougi immediately following this says if I’m gonna betray a comrade I want Japan
3)Black Knights surround Zero with guns blazing READY TO EXECUTE HIM if Kallen isn’t there

What are you missing? There never is a discussion of unilaterally killing him, not even a hint of this…If you are arguing strictly speculation, then it’s pure conjecture…Please give me the timecode in this episode where anything suggests (leading up to the firing squad scene) that the Black Knights are just gonna kill Zero on sight after meeting with Schnizzle?

There are two simple rebuttals, one he never said he wanted Lelouch alive. Two, how are the Order to bring him in if he can hypnotize them without killing him? They are afraid of his power, which is why they turned so quickly, and people who normally are being goaded around by their fears are either trigger happy or extremely paranoid. In either case, the usual conclusion is 'kill'. Therein, Schneizel who never explicitly stated he wanted Lelouch alive, just turned over, can easily lead to the Order going ahead and killing Lelouch out of fear of his power.

They also never discussed handing him over unscathed, so really, we're both arguing strictly speculation. Not to mention that, after the Shinkuro escapes, Schneizel seems perfectly content with sending the Mordred, a heavy weapons unit, to 'capture' the mech. To which Anya replies, 'If you want me to destroy it...'. There is enough post negotiation to say that Schneizel did not give a rats ass as to how Lelouch was removed or turned over. You cannot just pick and chose parts of the whole.

Originally Posted by wingdarkness

Then simply where is your evidence? Where is the even slightest hint from this episode that suggests this...Hell I’d give you a cookie if Schnizzle even does one of those Dullindal smirks after Ougi asks him for Japan…

No, he did not smirk, he was surprised. Surprise can lead to a change of plans.

Originally Posted by wingdarkness

You keep saying that Schnizzle didn’t say anything to Lulu because he had set all of this up as his final chessmove, and that was enuff to him, so I ask you again what evidence do you have showing this? Even if I were willing to believe that the scene wasn’t OOC, you are totally ignoring the lack of any evidence that shows how Schnizzle goes from asking them to hand him over to the Black Knights with guns blazing ready to kill Zero on sight…You are skipping an entire element of this argument…So I guess in a way you are correct…Correct right to my point that is because they created this scene for dramatic effect (shock factor) and to set-up Rolo’s rescue…There is no other explanation, especially if the crux of your point here is Schnizel wanted to see Lulu die at the hands of his own army…Where is the one shred of evidence in this ep that supports that…You don’t have it…Pretty sad if that was his master chessmove and the audience doesn’t even get an ambiguous smirk as evidence here…We go straight from negotiations where none of this is mentioned in the slightest right to the BK’s unilateral firing squad…I’m sorry but it’s hard for me not to believe I’ve won this point…

I did not disagree that the scene was set up for dramatic factor, what I disagree with is that they went OOC for Schneizel. As I said above, he only asked for Lelouch to be turned over. He did not specify alive, in one piece, or anything. Just to have him turned over. A group now being goaded by their fears can easily become trigger happy if not told specifically to keep him alive, which Schneizel did not do.

As for evidence to say that it was enough to fit into Schneizel's 'I'm better than you' retort to Lelouch. It was noted by Lelouch as being a check. Heck, if you look at the scene, its a mirror of their chess game. Schneizel, the white king, marched into the Black Kings layer and the same exact thing happened.

The audience did not get a smirk, they got a surprised reaction and then a calm Schneizel calming down Cornelia. More followed that scene, just as a smirk would imply, so too would outright shock and his reaction.

Originally Posted by wingdarkness

You wanna bring up previous episodes, because most of them solidify the point that Schnizel at the very least doesn't want to JUST KILL HIM, period, end of sentence...

Assumption. He himself said flat out that Lelouch is the person that he fears and loves the most. There is enough for one to say that he wanted him alive, there is also enough to argue that he wanted him dead.

Originally Posted by wingdarkness

Upon trying what? Again you assume Schnizzle knows how Lulu uses the geass. And if this is your assumption, then where is the tidbit of evidence that he would have let Lulu be killed in that way? Again it was the Black Knights surrounding Zero with guns not Brittania, so when Kallen moves out of the way, why not just have a KMF mall his a$$ and be done with it? He’s seen his men betraying him for chessmatch drama, so kill him Schnielzel, kill him…

Cornelia and Suzaku know, and therein Schneizel was likely informed otherwise how would he have been able to know its a form of 'hypnotism'. Hypnosis involves the eyes, suggesting, full well, that Schneizel knew enough about Lelouch's Geass.

When Kallen moved out of the way the Order was ready to shoot, it would have been the same end as just sending a KMF to run him over. So the result is the same, if anything shooting him is faster and more certain than a KMF trying to run him over.

Originally Posted by wingdarkness

Other than loving to passionately debate, I’m really not mad here, because CG does this ALL THE TIME…To pull plot twists outta you’re a$$ every episode, you have to deprive the audience of certain things as not to give away the twist…There have been times where this has worked great (Lulu fooling V.V. when he was in the desert for instance) and there have been times when it’s been beyond absurd (Million Zero-no-jutsu episode)…Here it was neither great nor out of bounds, but to me it was definitely OOC and weird…You’re asking me to believe on faith something happened offscreen that checker-jumps from simply handing Zero over to HIS OWN MEN killing him in cold blood on sight…I mean dude, I’m always ready to concede if a point exists that’s greater than my own, but I just don’t see one here…This was one of the countless scenes in CG that are used to set-up the plethora of endless plot twists…

I'm enjoying this.

You have to understand that people who are being driven by their fears and paranoia do not act rationally. You are trying to add rationalized thought to it when, quite clearly they showed they had none when Kallen tried to interject for Lelouch. She had a level head, all they did was dismiss her attempt to defend him as a part of the Geass. It is clear that they are incredibly paranoid and fearful at that point. Therein, applying rationality to them is wasted and a fallacy.

[Utau]

Originally Posted by mechalord

One weird thing about Nunnally's death is the way it happens. Every death in Code Geass has to be somewhat graphic, specially for someone close to Lelouch. The production staff takes great care in showing them disintegrated, bleeding to death, etc.

We don't see Nunnally disintegrating. The staff could have made her death scene really stick to you and made it drawn out... Imagine Nunnally slowly de-atomized as she wishes for her brother to live on. They could have gone for mega tears but instead it's anti-climactic.

Look at Shirley, she had to deliver a monologue. It took Euphie like 2-3 hours to die from her wounds and she got to say goodbye to Suzaku. Clovis took a slug to the face and died a bloody mess after being interrogated. VV had to have his heart to heart with CC while having gallons of blood pouring out of his head. Mao got to deliver tons of monologues before he bit it and it took forever to take him down.

How the hell does Nunnally get an empty as hell death while lesser characters get drawn out melodramatic death scenes?

I do agree. The deaths of those who are close and holds a place in Lelouch's heart so far has had strong emotional scenes up to ep.18 whereas it gives a certain exclamation to a character that he/she is dead, really dead. Take Rolo's death arc for example, he had a climatic ending to the point that some if not most of the Rolo-haters came to like him because of his somewhat redeeming end. He as a character close to Lulu has not have any build-up (plot-wise) until now and the killing Shirley stuff and then all of a sudden he gets a honorable death in which in comparison to Nunnally's death was more like he was an important of a character than her. His only prior reason as to why he wanted to take Britania down is because of her, his sister that he holds dear. Her death is not something that can be just that like 'ah okay she has to die in the next episode she isn't important anyways' seriously, people has speculated before on how things wil turn out for noth of them when Lelouch found out that his sister is the new Governor in his enemy's side. One thought of a worst-case scenario ending for her or one of them and it's not this

Further more, from what I can remember from Nunnaly's knowledge her brother is missing and still is, the phone call to her that Suzaku made to find out if Lulu regained his memories from episode I forgot doesn't help at all. Okay maybe it did but my point is, she hasn't seen his brother face-to-face since S1 and only had a hunch on who Zero's true identity is when Zero shouted her name. The only hope that i'am still holding to before I snap and think of her as really dead in the show is that, she can't die yet because she hasn't seen his brother atleast once in this season. There are still some unfinished business for them to do like telling her the whole Zero thing, geass, Euphy, Shirley, C.C., how he wanted her the best and Charles etc.., after all he did mention to her that she's the only person he couldn't lie to and dying without knowing what his brother has been up to is just.. Although I admit that having listed on the official site that she and Sayoko are marked as dead has a rather high possibility, one cannot lose hope until the end of the series. For all we know, Sayoko might have performed her miracle juutsu and somehow, incredible with lightning speed she manage to save Nunnaly in the nick of time. Where in I know is crazy and violates the boundary of the whole ninja-fiction thing

Anyway, just saying.

[bladeofdarkness]

You have to understand that people who are being driven by their fears and paranoia do not act rationally. You are trying to add rationalized thought to it when, quite clearly they showed they had none when Kallen tried to interject for Lelouch. She had a level head, all they did was dismiss her attempt to defend him as a part of the Geass. It is clear that they are incredibly paranoid and fearful at that point. Therein, applying rationality to them is wasted and a fallacy.

rationality (or lack there of) had nothing to do with it
they already sold him out to britannia
kallen belived it was an irational behavier coused by fear of the geass and his past lies becouse she didnt know that shnizel was behind it
but lulu knew the truth once he spoted shnizel
debating it and arguing with it would have been pointless at that point (which is what lulu figured once he saw that shnizel was there)
so he gave up on any attempet to right then and there (to save what he can)

[rpgman1]

The Order was paranoid alright, but not stupid enough to be taken over by Lelouch after what he had done to their allies and friends. Both sides don't know that Lelouch's Geass only works once and fear has taken them over, so the only course of action is to kill him on sight. "Fear the unknown." They don't know the full extent of Geass since they don't know what it does. The miracles of Zero are along the lines of "expect the unexpected". The Britannian royal family fears Lelheouch, but they fear Charles even more since they are clueless as to what he does. I wonder why Schneizel wondered what his father was doing in Area 11 waiting and didn't issue any orders to investigate or report to Charles. See the search team out to look for Lelouch near the end, he's a dangerous criminal and a wanted fugitive so it's DOA.

[Kaioshin Sama]

I think we should also consider that Schneizel has already tried the whole capture instead of kill thing before with Lelouch and that didn't work out so well. If he didn't move to stop the Black Knights from killing Lelouch its probably simply because they made things easier on him by making his eventual surprise escape less likely. Of course then you have that he escaped yet again anyway, but you know at least he was close to being rid of his nemesis for good.

[rpgman1]

Originally Posted by Kaioshin Sama

I think we should also consider that Schneizel has already tried the whole capture instead of kill thing before with Lelouch and that didn't work out so well. If he didn't move to stop the Black Knights from killing Lelouch its probably simply because they made things easier on him by making his eventual surprise escape less likely. Of course then you have that he escaped yet again anyway, but you know at least he was close to being rid of his nemesis for good.

Have to agree with you on this. If it wasn't for Rolo, Lelouch would've died on the spot and Schneizel should've won against the sole person responsible for thwarting his plans.

[dr_patz]

Spoiler for Episode 20:

Lelouch, pursued by the Black Knights, heads to Kaminejima for a final showdown with the Emperor. Schneizel, believing his father to be unfit to be Emperor, orders Suzaku to assassinate him.

Spoiler for Episode 22, where Lelouch will start his comeback.:

Lelouch uses the balance between the forces that separates the world into two: the UFN and Britannia. The stage in his consideration is the place which was made into the neutral zone of the two countries, and a place of his memories.

[wingdarkness]

Originally Posted by Var

The audience did not get a smirk, they got a surprised reaction and then a calm Schneizel calming down Cornelia. More followed that scene, just as a smirk would imply, so too would outright shock and his reaction.

Iyiyi…If the surprise reaction was going to instill some type of notification to the audience then it would have been Schnizel-centric…The surprise was on the face of Cornelia and the Prince’s assistant in-addition to Schnizel…In any literary work where you want to give some type of foreshadowing as it were you wouldn’t put the focus on 3 characters, just on the one…Which this scene clearly doesn’t do...In-addition even if you were right that this surprised reaction meant kill Zero in cold blood, it still didn’t achieve that in a literary sense…Moreover Schnizel calms down Cornelia either after or before the surprise scene in question (Can’t remember which came first, I think it was before though) because she is in dispute with Ougi’s gall at thinking he has the right to ask for anything…Again, this is no evidence of anything involving the BK’s killing Zero in cold blood after he exits the elevator…We just skip to that being the intended framework for Rolo’s rescue…

They also never discussed handing him over unscathed, so really, we're both arguing strictly speculation

No I’m arguing or making speculation based on what is shown, while you are speculating a bevy of scenarios based on what could have happened offscreen…There is a huge difference here…Additionally wouldn’t you think killing the main character is something a bit too important to leave up to the audiences guess with not even a subtle indication? We all knew Lulu wasn’t going to die here…That’s why the scene was set-up just for the Rolaid rescue…Why can’t you see this? There is a clear detachment between the set-up and the reasoning behind it, and that’s because it would have interfered with subsequent plot-twist…I didn’t even think as I saw this unfold, it was so evident…

You have to understand that people who are being driven by their fears and paranoia do not act rationally. You are trying to add rationalized thought to it when, quite clearly they showed they had none when Kallen tried to interject for Lelouch. She had a level head, all they did was dismiss her attempt to defend him as a part of the Geass. It is clear that they are incredibly paranoid and fearful at that point. Therein, applying rationality to them is wasted and a fallacy

The only fallacy here is you seriously trying to prove A+B = D without the use of C… This scene was of people pi$$ed off an upset, betrayed, not a scene of a bunch of paranoid scardy-cats (Are we watching the same show—That’s another reason to my point about it being OOC and a dramatic effect scene)…You totally misread that scene which is why you are willing to skip over the missing link…If they were incredibly paranoid and fearful they would have all come out with sunglasses on or some type of blinders, or anything that stopped the geass from being used (Assuming they even knew how the geass is used)…Kallen probably even getting shot wouldn’t be too absurd if they were crazy people who had lost all of there wits…Here stands Diethard with a video camera getting his Steven Speilberg on trading verbal barbs instead of acting your skewed definition of “irrational” (geasspower be damned I guess)…Do you see how off-base all of this sounds? You are stretching too lazily to make this point…If they were indeed paranoid and fearful as you suggested this would have been the last episode of the show because they would have blasted him with Kallen there or seconds after she moved (which they still didn’t do until Rolo actually shows up)..These people wanted to get feelings off of there chests and unilaterally murder Zero all at the same time which is why it was OOC based on the lack of content in the episode linking this course of action….

As for Schnizzle’s interest in killing Lulu…,Atleast on my side of the debate I have him saying atleast twice that he doesn’t have any desire to kill his brother, while you have nothing more than a skip-to-my-lou scenario where this just had to be the case since the scene ends up being the case (Again with no hints, or even subtle indications to this extend)…I mean I’m enjoying myself too, but it’s really kinda easy to argue this...

Can’t believe I’m doing this at work right now …
I have so much $hit to do^^...

[soto]

Does anyone else think it's odd that Schniezel and Cornelia were surprised by Ougi's request to give back Japan? When considering how the black knights are mostly composed of japanese who wish to liberate japan, I would think that it's common sense that they would make such a request, especially when they'll have to lose Zero and are too scared of Freija to make any type of retaliation.

[Revolutionist]

One thing I haven't seen mentioned regarding Xingke, is that he didn't join Zero because he was geassed. He joined Zero out of his own free will because of what Zero told the Tianzi. I personally think that Ougi's decision is going to backfire as Xingke will most likely be angered about their selling out their leader at a time of war. He's no idiot like the other black knights, he'll probably reason why if Zero can control minds did he allow his subordinates to betray him? Obviously he did not use geass on them...

[EternalMelody]

Originally Posted by Jestersage

Something tells me they purposely did that to show Lelouch is different from Light, and thus, Geass =/= deathnote. If it was Light, he would have try to geass someone to get out of teh situation, or even hold Kallen hostage. Instead, Lelouch merely make himself a villian by admitting everything, get Kallen away from him so he can be killed by himself.

Ironically, light ended up getting killed while Lelouch survive.

How is LELOUCH, as physically weak as he is, going to hold Kallen hostage?

[Jestersage]

Originally Posted by EternalMelody

How is LELOUCH, as physically weak as he is, going to hold Kallen hostage?

a) If kallen pretned to be captured, then it would have work... especially since she is willing to die for her anyway.
b) I never say it will have to succeed. look what Light ended up as.