2010-11-03, 10:47 | Link #2163 | ||
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Hamburg, Germany
Age: 48
|
Quote:
Quote:
Pretty much my thought. The "challenge" loses a lot of power as soon as someone looks at the exact circumstances the three mains are in.
__________________
|
||
2010-11-03, 12:13 | Link #2164 | |||
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: New York, NY
|
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
|
|||
2010-11-10, 17:28 | Link #2165 | ||
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Munich, Germany
|
Quote:
My apologies if I sound rough. This is truly something I cannot understand and where I would willingly set my own life to protect the ones I love. At this point I am same opinion as Ozma. Quote:
I also do not believe that songs can prevent bulllet from piercing my body or prevent that I get cut into pieces. But I know that as a man I have to protect the ones I love even it it means at the cost of my life. Not more or less. If someone volunteers to fight at my side because she thinks she is special, she can do so but the responsibility I see it with some other persons rather than with a civilian even though she has magic mushrooms in her belly. But as Ranka is someone who is free to come and to go I cannot blame her if she rejects to sing. Another point why I can't take her into responsibility is because she is still an amateur who has been promoted as a pro but isn't. Edit: What loss are you considering? The ones where she rejectet to sing because she was spoiled after seeing Alto and Sheryl hugging? Yes, this was a scene where I say it was stupid but also I considering her condition as critical because she is not "at heart". After she has been slapped and where she forced herself to sing the original "Aimo" she reduced the casualties. That she felt the pain of being killed as well is not mentioned anywhere. After she left the fleet casualties on civilian side are only speculations as well as on the military side because we don't see it until they jumped to the vajra planet for the grande final.
__________________
|
||
2010-11-10, 18:17 | Link #2166 | ||
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Hamburg, Germany
Age: 48
|
Quote:
Quote:
__________________
|
||
2010-11-10, 19:33 | Link #2167 | ||
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Munich, Germany
|
Quote:
And Ozma has to save his butt or otherwise he would be dead for knowing the truth of the assassination. Quote:
Furthermore LAI has developed weapons but not on time. A Valkyrie with a light quantum beam still cannot kill a vajra flag ship. So the "loss" is at a minimum. The loss of MQ is another story but as most of the crew don't follow a traitor president, they count out to the "we-blame-Ranka-for-all-reason-of-fail" list. Another theory that Rankas decision to leave was correct is that she is no more a source to lure the Vajra as she has the highest fold wave level in the fleet. With her leave, most of Vajra will not be able to trace a source they want to "protect".
__________________
|
||
2010-11-11, 03:03 | Link #2168 | ||
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Hamburg, Germany
Age: 48
|
Quote:
Quote:
__________________
|
||
2010-11-11, 03:54 | Link #2173 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Hamburg, Germany
Age: 48
|
And my stance on that hasn't changed a bit. Making baseless statements of "She knew it all along!" when her actual statements don't corroborate this view at all is just baseless speculation.
__________________
|
2010-11-11, 04:23 | Link #2175 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Hamburg, Germany
Age: 48
|
Quote:
If her intention was to explain to Alto why she was leaving, you don't think she would have added "Oh and btw, I am certain that the Vajra are coming here only for me"? There is absolutely no rational reason for her not to mention this, especially in the context of her desperately wanting Alto to come with her on her journey or at least understand why she is leaving on a seeming suicide mission. Of course, if the argument is "Ranka is so fucking stupid and self-absorbed that she doesn't even think about giving hard arguments to Alto why she needs to leave on this dangerous mission and can only come up with "I think I may be this and that and I need to find it out. Oh, and bring Ai-kun back to his people, teehee!", then, fine, you can have your theory that she knew it all along. But not the one without the other. Because either you accept that the stated reasons were her reasons or your wild hypothesis must also accept the clear inference what that means for what she actually said to Alto.
__________________
|
|
2010-11-11, 04:44 | Link #2176 | |
Minmay Guard
Join Date: May 2009
|
Quote:
Do you want me to quote my earlier response to that, as well? 'Cause I can, but I'd rather not. First...communication failure IS one of the main themes of the show, is it not? As I said before, she's having a tough time trying to communicate as it is. She's terrified by what she has to do, and she doesn't know how to tell Alto, let alone how to convince him to come along with her. I believe most of us are familiar with being in a highly-charged, emotionally tense situation, trying to find exactly the right thing to say, and failing miserably. It's part of life. So yeah...Ranka is "fucking stupid," but so am I. And so are you. And so is pretty much everyone in the world.
__________________
|
|
2010-11-11, 04:52 | Link #2177 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Hamburg, Germany
Age: 48
|
Quote:
But in the end of course you will be going back to claiming "It was only a hypothesis, why are you so upset about it?", won't you? Well, I am upset, because apparently you want to have it both ways. You want this hypothesis to be recognized as something believable ( which it is not, unless you can bring some evidence ) and at the same time you want to be able to step back when people bring up your lack of evidence and go "I'm just saying!"
__________________
|
|
2010-11-11, 05:02 | Link #2179 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Munich, Germany
|
Quote:
But you are correct. She does not know how potential her fold wave level is. Only Grace and lateron Leon/Lucca are aware of it. I also did not say that she knew about this. I just said that her movement is a positive sideeffect to lure the Vajra away from the fleet because she is a potential fold wave beacon. The main reason she left is because she wants to know what her role was in the destruction of the 117th Science fleet and why she is only capable to communicate with the Vajra. (Unknown to her Sheryl had developed a latent Fold Wave communication due to her disease). Edit: Removing "and that the Vajra react to it". I remove this as she knows that they react to her song latest by episode 16. The problem she only has is to "communicate correct with the Vajra". Btw. As you mention she is on a suicide mission. Leons movement to the vajra planet is suicide as well. Sheryl self-sacrificing is suicide as well. Fighting the Vajra and the Galaxy is suicide as well. What a bunch of people we have who are willing to go suicide. I don't think it is a reason to discuss if it's suicide or not. More important was the message to make decisions of her own without asking others for their opinion.
__________________
Last edited by Father Hentai; 2010-11-11 at 05:26. |
|
2010-11-11, 05:52 | Link #2180 | |
Minmay Guard
Join Date: May 2009
|
Really? You've never screwed up under duress and said the wrong thing? Ever?
I'm sorry, I don't believe you. Quote:
But okay, I'll bite: I'm not trying to have it both ways, really. I'm sure you understand that there's a vast gulf between saying "Ranka doesn't know what she's doing" and "I believe Ranka doesn't know what she's doing." I make sure that my inferences and suppositions are phrased so that it is CLEAR that they are inferences and suppositions. I don't expect anyone to agree with them, really, but if you're going to say they're impossible, then tell me why. Preferably in a way that doesn't involve inferences and suppositions of your own. I can't counter your points definitively, because they're your opinion and reading of the situation. Likewise, you can't counter mine. Neither of us KNOWS what was going on in Ranka's head when she left. The difference is that I choose to give her the benefit of a doubt, and you choose to condemn her. So yes, my situations are hypothetical. So are yours. You've articulated a POSSIBLE reading of the situation, but by no means the ONLY reading. I've provided another. Opinion vs. opinion is all well and good, as long as both participants REALIZE that they are talking about opinion. Or, if you have a factual basis for your interpretation, let me know what it is.
__________________
|
|
|
|