Code Geass R2 - Episode 14 Discussion / Poll

[Pink-chan]

Isn't Lelouch should be wary of if anyone in the Zero squad could have seen him? Not when C.C. is supervising them.

V.V. already had a way to capture C.C. What is the way is something we can ponder on.

[Var]

Originally Posted by Strettger

People probably expected the cult to consist of maybe 20 adults or so plus V.V, not a town full of people and children being in the crossfire. Its the fact that its children (I see no difference for women in this series, Cornelia, C.C, Kallen, they are some of the most dangerous people in the series) are being executed thats got people riled up. Could have sent C.C in, Geass dosen't work on her or asked for V.Vs surrender. Regardless of whether V.V would have complied is irrelevant, Lelouch did not give them a chance to surrender if they wanted to or not.

But Cornelia herself said they had to kill children before they could use their Geass. She had no problem throwing a knife through V.V.'s head without knowing he was immortal.

[Mr.Mo]

Can everyone in the Cult use Geass?

[Var]

Originally Posted by Mr.Mo

Can everyone in the Cult use Geass?

That is the assumption that Cornelia made and that is why she killed everyone that she saw unless confirmed otherwise.

[Strettger]

Originally Posted by Mr.Mo

Can everyone in the Cult use Geass?

Most likely, we have seen V.V use Geass and we know C.C had/probably still has based on an image of her.

[Nilie]

Originally Posted by Verist

Suzaku is just an idoit.. He can't figure out that Lelouch is Zero without resorting to drugging Kalllen? As I mentioned in another thread, I can't really see why it matters if Zero is Lelouch or not. Suzaku should just focus on catching Zero on the battlefield, which should be easy since Kallen is captured. Than when he removes his helmet, he knows. Basically there is only going to be Zero for the remaining episodes as there is no reason to go back to Ashford.

That my dear is becoz you don't seem to understand his character and the role he has in this fantastic plot. Plus there are plenty of political implications. I plan on posting a HUGE essay. We'll see if you stil hate him all that much after this. Besides, Lelouch is another shade of evil so stop being silly and hating him like that just coz you don't approve of his choice of actions.

As for Kallen, srsly, do you rly believe Suzaku would DO that? XD Granted, Lulu to the King with a ribbon attached was kinda WTF-inducing but remember who Suzaku is alright? And Shirley just got killed, he's the right to be angry. And do you HONESTLY believe Kallen would allow anything being done to her? Badass Mother remember? XD Neh, it's kinda a long way down where they're hanging from :P Vertigo for future brawl much? XD

Originally Posted by Tokkan

I'm wondering... who or what told Cornelia about the cult's headquarters and the existence of Geass? She must've learned these things from someone or somewhere.

Oh well, Bartley must have briefed her on it I assume. I don't want to think it could have been Schneizel, Charles did tell Suzaku that he didn't know about the floating heaven thingy place.

[demon_god04]

Originally Posted by Strettger

Most likely, we have seen V.V use Geass and we know C.C had/probably still has based on an image of her.

Even if only a portion of the people can use geass, the problem is differentiating them from the normal people. You won't know which one of those innocent looking people have the power to kill you just by looking at you.

[DarkLordOfkichiku]

Originally Posted by Nilie

As for Kallen, srsly, do you rly believe Suzaku would DO that?

I do, if he's determited/desperate enough. But I agree that it might all be just for show/a bluff by Suzaku to scare Kallen or the like...

Originally Posted by Nilie

And do you HONESTLY believe Kallen would allow anything being done to her? Badass Mother remember? ?

She's a prisoner right now and Suzaku has shown in previous encounters that in terms of brute force, he has the definite advantage...

[Verist]

Originally Posted by Nilie

That my dear is becoz you don't seem to understand his character and the role he has in this fantastic plot. Plus there are plenty of political implications. I plan on posting a HUGE essay. We'll see if you stil hate him all that much after this. Besides, Lelouch is another shade of evil so stop being silly and hating him like that just coz you don't approve of his choice of actions.

As for Kallen, srsly, do you rly believe Suzaku would DO that? XD Granted, Lulu to the King with a ribbon attached was kinda WTF-inducing but remember who Suzaku is alright? And Shirley just got killed, he's the right to be angry. And do you HONESTLY believe Kallen would allow anything being done to her? Badass Mother remember? XD Neh, it's kinda a long way down where they're hanging from :P Vertigo for future brawl much? XD

Just because I don't agree with Suzaku's methods does not mean I condone Lelouch's. I just hate to have to see Kallen suffer for something that is already obvious and really does not make a difference if Zero is caught, because he will have all the prof he needs.

[ChaosPaladin]

wow, i am starting to feel tt this season will end with bad endings for lulu and suzaku. they are going too extreme in wat they are doing and most likely something will mete out justice to both of them. maybe they will just KO each other

[Var]

Originally Posted by Verist

Just because I don't agree with Suzaku's methods does not mean I condone Lelouch's. I just hate to have to see Kallen suffer for something that is already obvious and really does not make a difference if Zero is caught, because he will have all the prof he needs.

If anything, Suzaku is doing this because he knows that she is important to Zero. He already suspects Lelouch and the Refrain will do nothing for getting him any real answers. If anything, he's becoming a Bond Villain just to get back at Lelouch.

[darthfury78]

Originally Posted by Var

You know, I'm a bit curious why Lulu raiding the Geass Cult is so adversely looked at when Cornelia was doing the exact same thing the episode prior. The only people caught in the cross fire who she may have spaired were the scientists but even they had blood on their hands... and I'm pretty sure she was killing them too.

Cornelia knows Lelouch better than anyone that he and Euphemia were very close. In fact, Cornelia was the only big sister(who cared about Lulu) to both of them. So she knows that Lelouch would never intentionally kill Euphemia unless something else was responsible for making her sister slaughter innocent people. I am certain that Euphemia would have forgiven him because the situation was an accident. She would not have approved of Suzaku's betrayal of Lelouch to the Emperior. Nor would she had approved of Nina's actions on her behalf. In fact, Euphemia would have been quite disturbed by Nina's lesbian lust for her.

She would have certainly kept Nina at arms length.

[Pink-chan]

Originally Posted by ChaosPaladin

wow, i am starting to feel tt this season will end with bad endings for lulu and suzaku. they are going too extreme in wat they are doing and most likely something will mete out justice to both of them. maybe they will just KO each other

Sounds good. That should be a satisfying ending for them when the others live happily ever after with these 2 gone .

[Verist]

Originally Posted by Var

If anything, Suzaku is doing this because he knows that she is important to Zero. He already suspects Lelouch and the Refrain will do nothing for getting him any real answers. If anything, he's becoming a Bond Villain just to get back at Lelouch.

I agree, so why the unified Suzaku defense from a number of people here?

[Nilie]

Originally Posted by darthfury78

Cornelia knows Lelouch better than anyone that he and Euphemia were very close. In fact, Cornelia was the only big sister(who cared about Lulu) to both of them. So she knows that Lelouch would never intentionally kill Euphemia unless something else was responsible for making her sister slaughter innocent people. I am certain that Euphemia would have forgiven him because the situation was an accident. She would not have approved of Suzaku's betrayal of Lelouch to the Emperior. Nor would she had approved of Nina's actions on her behalf. In fact, Euphemia would have been quite disturbed by Nina's lesbian lust for her.

She would have certainly kept Nina at arms length.

I know Nina is a freak but she's relief somehow in the show, I rly don't hate her.
And I don't think Cornelia would just have forgiven Lelouch but she might have understood, regardless she is still pretty much second princess of Britannia, I don't think she'd give up being Queen for anything.

[Stretch5920]

I don't think the drug will be used on Kallen. Either she gives in and admits Lelouch is Zero, or there is a struggle and Suzaku gets a taste of his own medicine. A few Euphie flashbacks.

[Var]

Originally Posted by Verist

I agree, so why the unified Suzaku defense from a number of people here?

Because humanity is biased? Cornelia and Lelouch are doing the exact same thing, only that Lelouch is doing it successfully. It is immoral, fine, but no one was chastising Cornelia for her methods in Ep.13. Yet, the moment Lelouch begins doing the same thing, all hell breaks lose.

For f***'s sake, they are even doing it on the same premise. Cornelia put it simply that they have to kill everything there because they do not know what kind of power anyone could have. With the knowledge from Bartley as well, the Cult was framed as the root of evil within the CG universe.

Originally Posted by Stretch5920

I don't think the drug will be used on Kallen. Either she gives in and admits Lelouch is Zero, or there is a struggle and Suzaku gets a taste of his own medicine. A few Euphie flashbacks.

Or someone walks in.

[demon_god04]

Originally Posted by Var

Because humanity is biased? Cornelia and Lelouch are doing the exact same thing, only that Lelouch is doing it successfully. It is immoral, fine, but no one was chastising Cornelia for her methods in Ep.13. Yet, the moment Lelouch begins doing the same thing, all hell breaks lose.

For f***'s sake, they are even doing it on the same premise. Cornelia put it simply that they have to kill everything there because they do not know what kind of power anyone could have. With the knowledge from Bartley as well, the Cult was framed as the root of evil within the CG universe.

Well the main difference is that Lelouch is doing it for vengeance but Cornelia was doing it to clear Euphie's name. And Cornelia wasn't looking to wipe the cult off the face of the earth, she was looking for evidence. She is just not squeamish about killing anyone that got in her way.

[kari-no-sugata]

Hmm, given how close Marianne and C.C were, I wonder if C.C originally intended for Marianne to be her successor or something instead of V.V? I get the feeling that from V.V's point of view, Marianne was in the way - he certainly doesn't like her. Seems highly likely to me now that C.C and Marianne had a contract - and Marianne was a Geass user (hardly new speculation, but seems increasingly likely to be the case in fact)

Anyway... looking ahead, I really doubt Suzaku is simply threatening Kallen with Refrain - I think he's going to shoot her up right there (unless someone comes in to stop him). Here's an interesting point though - V.V has just confirmed to Charles that Lelouch is Zero (again). So anyone want to bet that in the next ep or two, Suzaku manages to drug Kallen enough that he can confirm to his own satisfaction that Lelouch is Zero, goes to tell the Emperor this but before he gets the chance, Charles tells him this. So Suzaku will have drugged Kallen for nothing. By the end of the series, I certainly expect Kallen will shot down (possibly kill) Suzaku - she's certainly not going to be happy about being injected with Refrain after what happened to her mother.

[Stretch5920]

Originally Posted by demon_god04

Well the main difference is that Lelouch is doing it for vengeance but Cornelia was doing it to clear Euphie's name.

basically the same thing if you ask me. Cornelia obviously has no problems killing kids since she attacked V.V. Neither would I if I was in her position.