2012-01-18, 08:11 | Link #922 | |
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But I think the entire team crying after the match was a bit much. I love the series and the characters but a little subtlety with the emotions would not hurt.
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2012-01-18, 09:26 | Link #923 |
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Well its understandable to a point if you cry because something that you love dearly or have a real passion for is lost. But it does try to get a little too emotional at certain parts.
However its a little surprising as the role of the main rival to Chihaya has changed from Arata to Shinobu, perhaps the long period of time of not sparring with Arata has an effect on Chihaya? |
2012-01-18, 12:34 | Link #925 |
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I think Shinobu used to play with others at a young age but once she started to over come everyone, people most likely started to avoid her. In the end it is better to play by yourself than always get side glances and giving up in the middle of a game.
Looks like she got someone to worry about especially since Chihaya is female, Queen title can be taken away. By the way does anyone know if there will be season 2 or it will be an anime original ending? Because going by manga series seem to be only 1/4 past. Not even half.
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2012-01-18, 15:24 | Link #927 | |
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2012-01-18, 23:49 | Link #929 | ||
cho~ kakkoii
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2012-01-19, 07:52 | Link #930 |
2D > 3D
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Interesting interview with the director Morio Asaka (via @crazynabe). Second interview with Atsuko Ishizuka (storyboard of episode 2) will be up next week.
Nice to see Madhouse caring for overseas & translating their columns.
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2012-01-19, 08:27 | Link #931 |
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Madhouse has been pretty close to U.S. as far as market goes for a long time since the days of Ninja Scroll. Not to mention the collaboration they had with Marvel last year.
Favorite part of interview, Arata is a Gap Moe which by definition so is Shinobu.
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2012-01-19, 09:22 | Link #932 | |
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------------ Counting cards on Taichi's match: when Chihaya comes in, Taichi is up by 3 cards. He then eventually loses by 3 cards, taking 8 cards to his opponent's 14. Taichi loses in a come-from-behind victory by his opponent. I think this helps explain why everyone on the Mizusawa team took the loss so keenly. It certainly underlines his later point to the team that they need to work on their stamina in their matches. Odd--this takes us back to that argument he had with Chihaya about pushing the newbies too hard: while he was right that she was overdoing it, he needed to have been listening to her point that they needed to develop the stamina to compete for hours on end. Better late than never...
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Last edited by hyperborealis; 2012-01-19 at 12:32. |
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2012-01-19, 13:23 | Link #933 | |
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So yeah, if both are playing at their best the gap is considerable, and Chihaya knows it. Shinobu's interest in knowing who Chihaya was has to do with something else though...
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2012-01-19, 15:17 | Link #934 | ||
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Remember that Shinobu plays defensive karuta. That means the foremost element of her playing style is maintaining control of her own side. Offensive karuta is the style whereby one aggressively focuses on taking cards from the opponent's space; thus the difference "by the numbers" between Chihaya and Sudou's performances can be inferred to be due to the mismatch of Chihaya's style against Shinobu's greatest strength; but at the same time that Chihaya managed to take that many cards from inside Shinobu's territory at all explains her terrible reaction. We can infer from Sudou's performance against Shinobu that he is indeed more skilled than Chihaya defensively. All 13 of the cards he took, I suspect, he obtained by successfully defending them on his own side. However, all that this makes Sudou is perhaps a weaker version of Shinobu; that Chihaya's offensive prowess managed to defeat Sudou, but not Shinobu, reinforces the difference in skill revealed by Shinobu's win over Sudou by 12 cards. Incidentally, speaking of offensive and defensive space, I guess I think I've stumbled across something here in terms of how karuta players must deal with memorization. Defensive space, the area you must control, is easier to protect because you are more familiar with it. On your side of the field, the cards are placed at your own convenience; because you can gradually develop successful habits and order them by your own preferences, memorization of your own side of the field probably eventually becomes trivial. The greater challenge, then, and purpose of the 15 minutes memorization time, is imprinting and becoming familiar with the opponent's playing field. When they talk about Chihaya's lack of memory, and her offensive karuta style becoming stronger in the game's late stages, this is probably what they are referring to. Chihaya's strength at offensive karuta seems to come from her ability to apply intense, singled-minded focus. When the cards on Chihaya's opponent's side are few, this becomes much easier. Moreover because, when one takes a card from the opponents field in karuta, you then send one of your own cards over, when Chihaya gets into that groove it can become something like a chain. If Chihaya's opponents' specialty is not offensive karuta, then even without incredible skill in defensive karuta she can probably maintain control of her own side of the field. With her opponent's field reduced to a size that she can apply her full focus to, comparatively, Chihaya can keep on taking cards from their area aggressively to persistently reduce the size of her own hand. |
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2012-01-20, 02:05 | Link #935 | ||
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Join Date: Mar 2010
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And even after Shinobu gets fired up in response, Chihaya is still able to take cards from her. Shinobu takes two cards, and smirks, thinking she is back in control, and then Chihaya takes still another card from her. At this point the animation stops showing us the actual sequence of play, but we know from the card count that Chihaya will take two more cards and Shinobu will take 5 to close out the match. As you point out, Sol, Shinobu's style of play is predicated on a logic of control. Chihaya's capacity to take cards--even when Shinobu is playing all out--means Shinobu is not in control, and that is psychologically shattering to her. Shinobu's behavior after the match is quite telling: the standing in thought at the door, her hands in fists; the fast walk to the scorer's table; ignoring the official; leaning over the table with her face inches from the surface; her manic repetition of Chihaya's name; and especially the mad look on her face, which stuns the official--all of this tells us that Shinobu is either on the verge of or at the very point of a psychological break. All of this is just to add illustration to Sol's point, but I consider that a privilege. Quote:
Again, we come back to the question of control. Number of cards taken or given don't measure this. Even if Sudou scores better against Shinobu that Chihaya does, we know from their conversation after the match, where Shinobu toys with his feelings, that she was completely in control all the way through. That is why I think you are probably right to think he does play defensively against her, but only because she compels him to, as a measure of her control, of her ability to force him to play her game, rather than his own. So this is the key difference between the two matches: right through the end, Chihaya is still playing her game of offensive karuta, notwithstanding Shinobu's best efforts otherwise. Unlike Sudou, who can only envisage winning if Shinobu lets him, Chihaya is still, as the spectator remarks, "playing to win." I don't think it's accidental that Chihaya starts thinking at this point how she can become more "free:" the freedom of movement she envisages for herself, and which she equates with playing strength, is also that which allows her to set at naught other players' efforts to control her.
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2012-01-20, 02:23 | Link #936 |
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So, the conclusion is Chihaya is not too far behind Sudo. However, Chihaya's ability is rather unstable. First of all, she's stunned by Shinobu-chan's speed. To win, she is also willing to take the risk. Sometimes, it works in her favor. Sometimes, it works against her. She could lose the weaker opponent in that fashion. When she gap with the current Queen, she takes the chance to to make the change. She needs a lot of time to catch up.
Chihaya has her advantages. To summarize: Precision: Shinobu-chan > Chihaya-chan Accuracy: Shinobu-chan > Chihaya-chan Speed: Shinobu-chan > Chihaya-chan Tactics: Shinobu-chan > Chihaya-chan Hearing: Chihaya-chan > Shinobu-chan Intuition: Chihaya-chan > Shinobu-chan
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2012-01-20, 02:25 | Link #937 |
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lol, that was just for comedy effects. You're taking that scene way too seriously. I wouldn't assume too much about Shinobu's behaviour or her strong reaction to Chihaya during the match at this point. Everything is going to be explained in due time (well, depending how far the anime will go...)
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2012-01-20, 11:20 | Link #939 |
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The manga is irrelevant to the anime. The anime stands on its own. The responsibility of the anime scriptwriters is not to reproduce the manga, but to use it as a basis to create a complete, self-sustaining story. To that end, we have already seen the anime diverge in significant ways from the manga: in the form of retelling the elementary school days as a flashback, and in completely rewriting the process by which Nishida joins the karuta club. Given the limited amount of time the animators still have to work with, the anime might even conclude with an anime-specific ending. That is not illegitimate--that is just the prerogative of the anime creators to tell a complete story, which is finally their own story.
So, to interpret the anime in terms of the manga is a misinterpretation of the anime. It is an assumption that the anime has to follow, in detail, in theme, in concept, in plot the model of the manga. This assumption is false. The reason there are separate threads for the manga and the anime is not simply to prevent spoilers. It is also to prevent just this kind of misinterpretation. To be specific: Kazu-kun, you are flat-out wrong to interpret Shinobu's reaction as "comedy effects." This is not a matter of my opinion versus your opinion. There is no evidence within the anime itself that this moment is to be understood comically. Your only evidence is something you read further on in the manga, and not anything at all within the anime itself. Consequently, that material is irrelevant to the anime. It will only ever become relevant should the anime choose to incorporate it, and then that will be since the anime made that decision, and not due to any extrinsic authority or standing the manga has in relation to the anime. At this point the anime has not brought that later material in (and I strongly doubt it will, given the care and detail and focus given to the animation of Shinobu's distress). So that later material from the manga is at this point absolutely irrelevant. Now, it is interesting to compare the anime and the manga. You can learn more about each of them if you do so. But that is only to bring out each of the version's own distinct character and qualities, which includes even the degree the one follows the other. The two remain distinct. To repeat: the manga is irrelevant to the anime. The anime stands on its own. I urge everyone to watch the anime for its own sake, and in its own terms.
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2012-01-20, 11:42 | Link #940 | |
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josei, karuta, madhouse |
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