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View Poll Results: Mobile Suit Gundam 00 Second Season - Episode 7 Rating | |||
Perfect 10 | 115 | 52.27% | |
9 out of 10 : Excellent | 39 | 17.73% | |
8 out of 10 : Very Good | 36 | 16.36% | |
7 out of 10 : Good | 9 | 4.09% | |
6 out of 10 : Average | 8 | 3.64% | |
5 out of 10 : Below Average | 7 | 3.18% | |
4 out of 10 : Poor | 1 | 0.45% | |
3 out of 10 : Bad | 0 | 0% | |
2 out of 10 : Very Bad | 0 | 0% | |
1 out of 10 : Painful | 5 | 2.27% | |
Voters: 220. You may not vote on this poll |
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2008-11-22, 16:35 | Link #581 |
Licensed Hunter-a-holic
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 35
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The funny part about all of this is that neither Marie nor Soma was ever involved in killing any one until the second season.
As Marie, she didn't have a moving body at all, and had a gentle nature, so there is no question that she couldn't manage to kill anyone. As Soma, she was only involved in the fight against the Gundams as Sergei shielded her from going into other battles at the time, which helped her develop from the brainwashed-obey-orders (not blood thirsty) solider faux personality into someone who dislikes fighting. Heck, when she was at the mission to exterminate Katharon at their base, she basically froze and was pretty distracted during the whole thing. And now, she is pretty much the same person as Marie and Soma, as she said that she still retains her memories of Soma and part of her personality, so unless she develops another one (unlikely) we won’t see this battle crazy Soma anytime soon. Yes, but being brainwashed in acting as a weapon and being someone who loves killing and is blood thirsty are two different things.
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2008-11-22, 19:14 | Link #584 | |
Logician and Romantic
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Within my mind
Age: 43
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She understands what happened better than any of us, it is her right to decide how Al was to be judged. The rest of us are just outsiders throwing opinions around. What was it called again? "Judged by your peers"?
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2008-11-22, 19:56 | Link #585 | |
I disagree with you all.
Join Date: Dec 2005
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And who is she to forgive him, really? Was she friends with the kids that got killed? And even if she was - let's say Al kills a family. Just for kicks. Let's say a survivor of that family forgives him. Does that make him less of a murderer? I'm all for forgiveness. I'm even willing to grant that his upbringing made him crazy and therefore not wholly responsible. Let's even say, against all evidence (he's still fighting for the CBs. The guys who, instead of putting him in therapy, gave him a giant robot and told him "OK" when he announced he wanted to slaughter a few dozen kids.), let's say he won't do it again. If only because there aren't any super soldiers left to kill. I'm still vastly uncomfortable with saying that what he did was nothing, or even comparable to firing at an armed enemy combatant. |
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2008-11-22, 20:22 | Link #587 | |
Logician and Romantic
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Within my mind
Age: 43
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If Al truly felt what he did was nothing major, he wouldn't have brought it up at all.
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2008-11-22, 20:30 | Link #589 | |
Logician and Romantic
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Within my mind
Age: 43
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This reminded me of the Discworld Novels. In the Discworld, there is an "organization for equal heights", essentially a pressure group against dwarf discrimination. The weird part is that the Dwarves were never really discriminated against in Discworld, and that the organization members are all humans only... Marie decided, from what she understood of the super soldier program, why Al had to do what he did. You can't say she wasn't qualified to judge. She was the ONLY person qualified to judge. Otherwise you would just sound like a human trying to defend a non-existent Dwarf discrimination...
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2008-11-22, 20:44 | Link #590 |
I disagree with you all.
Join Date: Dec 2005
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Super soldiers are people too, and unlike your dwarfs not asking any special treatment, I think they did mind getting killed. In fact, I find your argument pretty dangerous too. "Super soldiers aren't real human beings anyway. Let's leave them settle it between themselves."
I agree there wasn't much Marie could do. But she could have refrained from trying to justify it with some kind of "it's the same as shooting enemy combatants." |
2008-11-22, 20:53 | Link #591 | |
Logician and Romantic
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Within my mind
Age: 43
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If you care so much about what the super soldiers feel about the incident, then you shouldn't disregard Marie's opinions as that of a homicidal maniac. She IS the person you are trying to defend, not your opponent.
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2008-11-22, 21:01 | Link #592 |
I disagree with you all.
Join Date: Dec 2005
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OK, so if a black man kills a few other black men, should I only care about what black people have to say about it? And if I find a black girl to tell me it was OK, then it was, and nobody needs to go to jail?
And no, Marie isn't the one I'm trying to defend. She's not the one who got murdered. She just happens to have a background similar to theirs. You want to talk about Super-Soldiers' feelings? How about that of the kid saying "Allelujah, I don't want to die"? How about the feelings of the screaming children dying a fiery death? |
2008-11-22, 21:09 | Link #593 | |
Logician and Romantic
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Within my mind
Age: 43
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She knows better than you or me, at least. And A-Laws was certainly not interested in the dead kids. So no one is going to throw Al into jail because like it or not, the only people who cared about those kids in the entire world is Al and Marie. (And using your example, if black people believe the death of one of their own was somehow justified, there must have been a REASON. It certainly would not be because the people you talked to were psychos, it would just mean they know more than you do in what happened.)
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2008-11-23, 06:32 | Link #594 |
Secret Society BLANKET
Graphic Designer
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: 3 times the passion of normal flamenco
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Marie/Soma herself states that she's thankful to Sergei for putting her only on Anti-Gundam operations. Given that Soma seems to have no prior record of being in combat before being assigned to Sergei, and since you don't kill people during training, it's a fair bet that she's never actually killed another person in combat before. There's also her comment in episode 5 about "this is a real battlefield" after the Katharon base raid...
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2008-11-23, 06:54 | Link #595 | |||
I disagree with you all.
Join Date: Dec 2005
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And I don't see why you take it on faith that the person saying the murder of children was justified isn't crazy. |
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2008-11-23, 06:59 | Link #596 | |
Logician and Romantic
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Within my mind
Age: 43
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You are trying to speak for the super soldiers, while disregarding the opinion of super soldiers. Just because Marie disagree with you doesn't make her wrong. She knows the situation better than you, so claiming you are better informed than her is outragous.
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2008-11-23, 07:53 | Link #597 |
Secret Society BLANKET
Graphic Designer
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: 3 times the passion of normal flamenco
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This isn't Sparta though, this is the HRL, where economics matter. They'd want each and every supersoldier to survive so they can have more of them, hence make all of them strong rather than have them go out in a survival of the fittest bout. Only the ones with the irreversable defects would be thrown out, such as Al.
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2008-11-23, 08:09 | Link #598 | |||
I disagree with you all.
Join Date: Dec 2005
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I also find it funny you claim Marie knows so much about it, when she only heard a few on-screen phrases from Allelujah. We, as spectators, saw how he decided to do it, and saw his victims die. I won't say I know more than Marie about the Super-Soldier program, but I don't see why I should blindly trust her judgment either. Quote:
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2008-11-23, 13:02 | Link #600 |
Aboard Kallen's Bandwagon
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: California
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Ok well I posted this awhile back but apparently a heated discussion was going on.
Did anyone notice what sumeragi said after allelujiah was found that she "didn't lose her reason for fighting". Could this mean there could be some deep relationship going on between them?? or at least from sumeragi's perspective?
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