Fullmetal Alchemist: Brotherhood - Episode 30 Discussion/Poll

[GaimeGuy]

Originally Posted by Kanish

Naah! I'm fine with simply mocking the manga at every turn.

Let's put it this way:

The episode started at the beginning of chapter 58.

It ended midway through chapter 62.

There were about 180 pages of manga panels from the start of chapter 58 through the middle of chapter 62.

Scar's backstory, which they covered back in episode 21, was also a part of these chapters.

they just blew through an entire volume of manga in about 20 minutes. (after subtracting the time for the OP and ED).

[Vlyse]

Originally Posted by GaimeGuy

they just blew through an entire volume of manga in about 20 minutes. (after subtracting the time for the OP and ED).

Not necessarily.

Some pieces (like the Scar portion you mentioned, and Roy/Hughes in ep 10) have already been shown. It's possible they will have more flashbacks (but of course not all of it) at appropriate times.

Should just wait out for the series to be done before complaining about certain things that might pop up later being cut for good. (Although it's okay to complain, I suppose, if you don't like how the material is arranged.)

[GaimeGuy]

they REPEATED the roy/hughes scene (and left out the most important part once again)

[Kanish]

Originally Posted by GaimeGuy

Let's put it this way:
The episode started at the beginning of chapter 58.
It ended midway through chapter 62.
There were about 180 pages of manga panels from the start of chapter 58 through the middle of chapter 62.
Scar's backstory, which they covered back in episode 21, was also a part of these chapters.
they just blew through an entire volume of manga in about 20 minutes. (after subtracting the time for the OP and ED).

Didn't know that. Now I'm even more glad that they've split it up the way they have. Bunching it all together would've made it lose it's appeal by making it appear long-drawn-out. It's better that they decided to intersperse it within other elements of the anime thereby giving each new scene it's own special charm and uniqueness and makeing them seem like bits and pieces of a massive puzzle that is the Ishvalan war. Also, as Vlyse mentioned, they might bring up other important parts later on as the series proceeds.

[codeRED]

Originally Posted by Maxtro

Whine whine whine. As an anime only watcher that's all I see on this thread.

I liked what I saw and I expected and expected to read similar thoughts from other posters. But the only thing here are whining manga fanboys complaining how the episode sucked because it wasn't exactly like the manga

You guys ruin the episode discussion threads. I really think there should be a separate thread for the weekly episode discussion where the manga readers can go post.

I came back here to see if its actually an episode discussion but it seems things havent changed at all and it never will. Even though these are episode discussion threads it always degenerate into crying and moaning about what got cut out or changed from the manga by butthurt manga readers.

So what if I missed out on scenes taken out from the manga, as long as the anime is enjoyable to watch.

[Kirarakim]

You know what I am getting tired of people complaining about manga fans complaining. You are happy with the episode that's perfectly fine but I have just as much right to say I am not happy with the episode because of the cuts. Why because some of those scenes that were cut were important to me. And many of them will probably not be put in the series again. Not to mention even if they are that screws up the order of things. Arakawa wrote the story in a certain order to begin with so messing up the order changes the impact of certain scenes. So enjoy the episodes all you want, in fact I am happy you enjoy the storyline. But some of us know it can be even better. Why should I be satisfied with less?

And on another note what are the manga readers supposed to say in these threads. You forget we already know everything that is going to happen. At the most we can comment on what was changed, cut, or how a scene played out. And while I have complained about cuts I have also praised the anime when they made a change I liked (such as Ed pushing open the doors of truth again to say he will come back for Al) So please stop acting like it's been nothing but complaints from manga fans.

[OkamiNoKaze]

I liked the episode, Riza's Tattoo was cool, and unexpected, I'm guessing that has something to do with her father's research. The Ishval scenes as expected were heart wrenching to watch, anyone else reminded of star wars, when they said the what the order number was.

[GaimeGuy]

Okami:

it IS her father's research. remember that her father said he left all of his research with his daughter. Riza decided she could trust Mustang with his research at the funeral, during their discussion in front of her father's grave. Roy decoded the tattoo and became the flame alchemist.

[Kanish]

Originally Posted by GaimeGuy

it IS her father's research. remember that her father said he left all of his research with his daughter. Riza decided she could trust Mustang with his research at the funeral, during their discussion in front of her father's grave. Roy decoded the tattoo and became the flame alchemist.

Well, I'm glad someone cleared that up. I just assumed his flame alchemy was incomplete as of now and there was a chance for a totally bad-ass upgrade later on.

Awww...man. Then why didn't they show that scene yet. Watching Roy studying the research from Riza's back while she was topless would've been nosebleed inducing.

[GaimeGuy]

well, tbh, we don't know how much or how little of roy's flame alchemy is from hawkeye's research and how much it is from roy's continued research. Nor do we know how much or how little of the tatoo roy actually decoded.

what we do know is thatat least the foundations of roy's alchemy were developed and encoded in research by master hawkeye, that roy was skilled enough to become a state alchemist in his late teens or VERY early twenties (no later than 21 or 22, as the scenes from Ishval occur when Roy is 23, during the end stages of the war), that roy was smart enough to decode Hawkeye's research and to derive further conclusions from the research, and that the ideas used to develop flame alchemy have been expanded upon by Roy to non-flame applications.

to clarify upon that last point: Roy's alchemy isn't actually flame alchemy. It's actually air alchemy... he can manipulate the composition of the air around him (ESPECIALLY the oxygen composition). What he does is create a flame/spark, then manipulate the air composition around the flame to make the flames travel where he wants and to grow to the size he wants them to. He also seems to be able to displace the energy directly, since he can create a spark using his gloves but maake an explosive pillar of fire appear 100 yards away, completely detached from the originating spark (if he could only manipulate the flow of the energy, the trail of the flames would always start at his hands, where the fire originated.)

Basically, roy's alchemy is about manipulating the air. It has nothing to do with fire.

Roy could probably use his alchemy to create an air bubble around himself and submerge himself to the bottom of the sea, or to create large gale force winds to conjure up a sandstorm. (in one of the omake chapters, he reveals that he regularly uses his alchemy to score dates, by manipulating the oxygen content around a beautiful woman, causing her to feel dizzy, then catching her as she falls over, leading into them going out for dinner )

[Haladflire65]

Originally Posted by GaimeGuy

to clarify upon that last point: Roy's alchemy isn't actually flame alchemy. It's actually air alchemy... he can manipulate the composition of the air around him (ESPECIALLY the oxygen composition). What he does is create a flame/spark, then manipulate the air composition around the flame to make the flames travel where he wants and to grow to the size he wants them to. He also seems to be able to displace the energy directly, since he can create a spark using his gloves but maake an explosive pillar of fire appear 100 yards away, completely detached from the originating spark (if he could only manipulate the flow of the energy, the trail of the flames would always start at his hands, where the fire originated.)

Basically, roy's alchemy is about manipulating the air. It has nothing to do with fire.

Roy could probably use his alchemy to create an air bubble around himself and submerge himself to the bottom of the sea, or to create large gale force winds to conjure up a sandstorm. (in one of the omake chapters, he reveals that he regularly uses his alchemy to score dates, by manipulating the oxygen content around a beautiful woman, causing her to feel dizzy, then catching her as she falls over, leading into them going out for dinner )

Yeah, but calling him 'the air alchemist' wouldn't have been nearly as cool, would it? I read that omake a while ago - I remember I was laughing like crazy when I first saw it. Ah, Roy. I love it when he shows his silly, womanizing side.

[Sol Falling]

After catching up on 30-31 a couple days ago and then watching 32, I just wanted to say that this ep (30) was terrible. I should note that even though I have indeed read the manga, I hardly remember the earlier details so the anime is basically playing recap for me--my statement that this ep is a failure is based not just on its quality as an adaptation, but as a standalone narrative as well.

People said 'the Armstrong scene was well done' or 'the Roy-Liza romance was interesting', but for me, who has forgotten the emotional background/context the manga gave those scenes, they were complete failures. Given the way this episode was set up, the principle question it was supposed to address was 'what happened in Ishbal?'. More specifically--given the way practically any supporting character who was involved with it has reacted to it--'what exactly was so terrible/traumatizing about it?' That was the point to get across.

However, all the episode actually tries to tell me is 'we massecred a lot of innocent/helpless people'. What the anime completely fails to get across is: if it feels so terrible to kill those civilians, why did you do it? Why are you all traumatized and 'I am a sinner' and 'my hands are covered in blood' now (however many years in the future), when you willingly took part in the first place? What exactly is powerful about Armstrong's scene? He erected a wall to trap fleeing civilians into the city, and subsequently looked traumatized over doing it. lolwut? Isn't that just stupidity? Hypocrisy? I know that isn't really true because of other events I vaguely remember from the manga, but that's all the anime scene gets across to me. Similarly with the Roy-Liza scene. 'I give you permission to shoot me in the back if I turn into a criminal' or whatever. lolwut? What exactly is so touching about that? Aren't you a criminal now, going out there and blowing civilians up 'with the eyes of a killer'? Am I supposed to get some kind of 'we've done evil and stuff, but so long as we stay together, we can continue striving to do good' vibe from that scene or something? So far as I can see, all that scene conveys was a ridiculous delusion that they aren't already monsters. (I don't remember disliking RoyxLiza in the manga.)

This episode makes the entire military staff look like humongous hypocrites. 'Ishbal was so terrible!--But I willingly took part in it! I followed my orders like a good little dog and let my resistance amount to vague, determined-sounding words and intentions.' lol. And these guys are telling Ed/Al/Scar about this, what, as a confession/expecting sympathy? Like hell, asshats! You willingly took part, gained those 'eyes of a killer' of your own volition, so it's too late to carry that past around like a personal trauma now. By all rights Ed should have condemned Liza right there. No way in hell would Scar not have killed Marcoh either, let alone escape with him. The anime's failure in portraying the military cast's characters completely derails the rest of the protagonists as well. This episode was just an abysmal failure in directing/adapting/writing/planning/whatever. Utterly worthless.

My (irrelevant, but the energy of this rant demands it) conclusion: this anime is a mediocre piece of shit on its own. I'm only following it as a recap of the manga. Bones can do alright action/animation, but they routinely fail with the actual narrative. (lol okay this last paragraph might be a stretch. I'm ~75% it's actually justified though.)

[White Manju Bun]

Ok reading the last few pages I have to say Im a bit disappointed with everyone in this thread.

To anime-only watchers (I include myself in this). Manga readers may voice what they dont like about the episode its their right as manga readers, trust me its done in other threads as well. If you don't like what theyre saying fine its your right to disagree but there will be no name calling, no trolling, NOTHING offensive. It is very possible to have a conversation and not troll.

To Manga readers: Bare in mind us anime-only watchers don't know what has been cut out, when all I see if people complaining on what BONES didnt do it brings down the thread. Again it is possible to make a good argument to what BONES left out without making the entire episode sound like the worst thing ever. You may state your opinion but don't make anime-only watchers feel inferior for not knowing whats going on (not saying anyone has but Im asking you not too in the future.)

If you see someone trolling/baiting/ whatever report it, remember dont feed the trolls.

Ok my opinion, episode dragged a bit but considering we got tons of info on the war, why it was done and everyone's reactions to the war it gave nice personal insight on the characters, epsc Riza since we've always seen her as this rock of a person. Her tattoo shocked me! Was not expecting it at all. Also Hughes <3 Anything with Hughes (or Kimblee ) Im fine with.

[Guido]

People were complaining the difference between anime and manga for the second series of FMA, and since the very last post before this one of mine was made by a MOD, then I have to be very careful and analytical on what I'm reviewing for this episode thread.

Spoiler for Background Characters:

I believe that if Riza's father died in shock was because he knows that the world remains unchanging, or people like his student, Mustang, are not unwilling or unknowing to mature enough to handle and deal with the bigger truth behind all truths.

I'm complacent that not only do I see Marcoh and Kimbley, but even Liza Hawkeye stepping into the bigger frame of the storyline as characters playing important contributions to keep the series from diverting of its plot nature.

Kimbley's nature and way of doing things are not of an irrational arsonist. He goes by the rule of fitting.

I hate to admit it, but from a cold point of view giving enough pondering, life in itself can be consider a war; a struggle to survive and to make a living for oneself.

However, life's purpose for all living things can be narrowed down into two simple choices: Live to survive or Survive in order to live.

The background about Ishbal's extermination I felt it to be in a compacted form, since they took off quite several scenes to accentuate the trauma that the players experienced, but that's my personal opinion.