Danganronpa - Episode 8 Discussion / Poll

[orion]

Originally Posted by codeRED

Suicide based on what? The first trial shows anyone is capable of trying to commit murder even if it seems as if they are incapable of doin it as in the case of Maizono.
What is the motive and purpose to kill herself? Where does the evidence indicate that its a definitive suicide according to you. Maybe the killer poisoned her and bash her head as red herrings to create a diversion. Locked room means that the murderer is trying to create an alibi and not become a suspect. Its give the illusion that no way he can be in there and commit murder since there is no means to lock the place from the outside. So how does a locked room scenario which would indicate a murderer trying to create an alibi all of a sudden becomes a definitive scene of a suicide. Im kinda suspicious on how you came up with the idea of suicide.

People who are fighting to live do not die with a smile on their faces. Smile indicates acceptance for what has happened and release. Room locked from the inside. Place only has broken bottles and blood. If there was a true fight, I expect more stuff to be broken and the loser (anyone but her) to also be dead. She should also have more injuries. This girl's got muscles. She not going to go easy. There isn't any other evidence of blood so far but her's. And...she was the one who pointed the poison and wanted to "end this". As I said above, if she suicides and they guess wrong, it's game over. She's "ended it". The locked room is "her alibi" since a locked room scenario assumes someone else did it.

And...a killer would have cleaned the room a bit more also. There's still dust on her shoe. It wouldn't be on her shoe if she was fighting. She took her dose seated on an empty stomach as the bloody vomit didn't contain food particles.

Every one else is pretty low on the list.

Also, cyanide is a quite popular way to go.

[~Yami~]

yes... I must guess Aoi is the one who did it... why? to bring more despair
smiling face indicates something about suicide since the motive already clear.... since who the heck can hit her twice in the head and make her drink a poison???!!!
but it's interesting to see how the three person will show their alibi...

about the lock, I think it's good that anime showed it is locked...
if it's only hindered by chair, Naegi will be easily opened it by slamming his body to the door
since it's locked, it makes sense that he should break the glass first (I don't think it's considered as part of the door... really)

Blushing Kirigiri.... egh.... *fainted*
must have the pic

[Qilin]

Well, I don't have much to add except that the nicest character just died. This is already building itself up as the most tragic case we've had so far.

It really is disappointing how the adaptation messed up the locked door, but I guess it isn't that big of a plot hole if you interpret "breaking down locked doors" as breaking the locks or the doors themselves. Even if such isn't the case, it's probably better to think of it that way.

Anyway, no matter how bad everything gets or how many people end up dead in this series, the fact that Togami will always be the same condescending jerk allows me to have some peace of mind.

[Calca]

My theory, Sakura drank the poison herself, Aoi tried to end her suffering by hitting her with something, couldn't kill her and Sakura had her leave the room and put the chair there herself.

People don't die with content smiles

[White Manju Bun]

Although it does seem genuine, something about Aoi's reaction bothers me but I can't pinpoint what. The fact she wanted to gather everyone so fast doesnt still well with me.

[broken270]

Maybe because it sounded forced? Aoi was on the verge of breaking down the last case, and cried when she saw the deaths of the last two victims. You may have thought that Aoi would just completely lose her willpower when her best friend died, but moved on without tearing up.

[Marina2]

Originally Posted by orion

People who are fighting to live do not die with a smile on their faces. Smile indicates acceptance for what has happened and release. Room locked from the inside. Place only has broken bottles and blood. If there was a true fight, I expect more stuff to be broken and the loser (anyone but her) to also be dead. She should also have more injuries. This girl's got muscles. She not going to go easy. There isn't any other evidence of blood so far but her's. And...she was the one who pointed the poison and wanted to "end this". As I said above, if she suicides and they guess wrong, it's game over. She's "ended it". The locked room is "her alibi" since a locked room scenario assumes someone else did it.

And...a killer would have cleaned the room a bit more also. There's still dust on her shoe. It wouldn't be on her shoe if she was fighting. She took her dose seated on an empty stomach as the bloody vomit didn't contain food particles.

Every one else is pretty low on the list.

Also, cyanide is a quite popular way to go.

So, you are saying that Sakura also want to "kill" Aoi if everyone guess wrong? Why?

[frodonk]

I never suspected sakura as the mole. heh I even thought it was celes. just goes to show how i trusted her character.

one thing I've learned, if anybody makes an accusation, it always turns out not to be true.

mizono's case: everyone suspected naegi, wrong!
chihiro's case: everyone suspected a girl, wrong!
third case: everyone suspected hagakure or kirigiri, wrong!
now: aoi suspects 3 other people, wrong!

which only leaves us with aoi. now, if anybody could've killed sakura without using force, and with a smile on her face, it would have been aoi.

most people already pointed out aoi's "abnormal" reaction, so it is not a stretch to conclude that aoi already knew sakura's dead, that, or aoi wasn't expecting sakura to go down that easily.

from my point of view this couldn't be a suicide, so what could it be? most likely a confrontation between aoi and sakura. I'll guess that aoi is the last person who saw sakura alive.

the poison for the blood vomit has already been pointed out by the episode itself, and it is impossible for anybody to have fought sakura and defeat her. I'm guessing it was supposed to be protein shake, but had poison mixed with it.

she then realized that she's been poisoned, the couch blocking the door was done by sakura herself, the way i see it. the upside down magazine, with blood near it, meant she was waiting for her death by that point. why else could she have done this but to protect aoi.

my best guess is that sakura called the 3 other students over, they left, aoi, for some reason, caused the head injuries, sakura told aoi she isn't that weak to be killed by blunt objects to the head, already had poison in her system, set up the locked room scenario, read some magazines, sat there and died content.

I'm no longer waiting for the investigation phase next episode, it almost never happens, most of their deductions are done in the classroom trials anyway, and they only show the things they find as a flashback to support their arguments.

as for baseless speculation, there must've been a touching story between sakura and aoi before she died. maybe its about their friendship and how sakura felt she betrayed aoi by not telling her about being the mole, something of that sort.

[Haiprbim]

Once again, a very entertaining episode.
Although the death and the cause are pretty straightforward, I'm looking forward to the trial.

Originally Posted by Calca

My theory, Sakura drank the poison herself, Aoi tried to end her suffering by hitting her with something, couldn't kill her and Sakura had her leave the room and put the chair there herself.

That would explain the two hits with some sort of an object on her head.

[Calca]

Originally Posted by Haiprbim

Once again, a very entertaining episode.
Although the death and the cause are pretty straightforward, I'm looking forward to the trial.



That would explain the two hits with some sort of an object on her head.

I am an anime only watcher so I don't know how this will go and I am not looking up spoilers on purpose.

As long as the cause of death was not the two blows to the head, then Aoi should not be found guilty of murder and executed. Aoi is one of the characters I've grown quite fond of so her simply being the one who killed Sakura due to being the one who accused the other 3 of murder is quite strange to me.

[Solitaired]

Guys as mentioned in the very first posts, the investigation is incomplete, some evidence in this episode is useless as there are no explanations. This isn't like the second one where there are no evidence towards Mondo, or the previous one which although the investigations are also left out, the entire drama sequence is shown to you thus deductions can still be made. Missing evidences can definitely cement your theories. I could make a list of evidences if you all need to prepare for the next episode (which most likely will jump straight into the trial 5-10 minutes in)


Edit: Here's the evidences in case you are all right with it. Remove this post if its unnecessary.

Spoiler for Evidences for this case:

Investigation at Rec Room:

1) Death Report:
Time of death is 12pm. Corpse was found in the recreation room on the third floor. Victim seems to have been struck over the head with a great force. No other external wounds. Also, the victim has vomited a large volume of blood.

2) Categories of sealed rooms:
- Constructed externally post-crime using some form of trick
- Constructed before the crime, victim was killed remotely
- Culprit was hiding inside the sealed room before it is broken
- It is not even a sealed room in the beginning

3) Asahina's statement:
Sakura requested a meeting with Togami, Fukawa, and Hagakure before lunch through a note slipped through the door of their rooms

4) Togami's testimony:
He threw the note away and did not make any contact with Sakura

5) No locks on the door, no sign of any contraption locking the door besides the chair wedging the doorknob

6) A candy wrapper was found on the floor besides Sakura. Given by Asahina after the infirmary incident. Asahina found a box of candies in the school's storeroom and took all of it away so not one can have them.

7) Red glass shards found on the floor, which originally belongs to a glass bottle. A Monokuma figure is found beside it.

8) 4 red glass bottles with a Monokuma figure in them on a cabinet was spotted. There seem to be a pattern to the bottles

9) Pool of blood in front of the magazine rack. But the magazine rack was away from Sakura's body

10) A locker behind Sakura was left open. Handprints are found inside the locker

11) A plastic container was found on the floor in front of the rec room door. It appears to be Sakura's protein bottle but is empty. Label on it states Chem Lab A-2. There are glass shards beneath the bottle.

12) Fukawa's statement (not Genocider):
She did not go to the rec room after seeing the note due to the fear of Sakura.

13) Hagakure's statement
Sakura personally passed the note to him, telling him she asked to meet Togami and Fukawa as well. He did not go to the rec room thereafter and never saw her again. When asked for the note, he said it was missing while a candy wrapper fell out from his pocket.


Investigation at Chemistry Lab:
*Togami was doing his own investigation inside as well

14) Yellow powder was spilled in front of the cabinets. Broken bottle with label Chem Lab C-4 beside it. Togami stopped by the chem lab in the morning but the powder was not present.

15) Footprints was left on the powder in front of the left cabinet. It did not fit Naegi's shoe size

16) Bottles in the "A" cabinet on the left contain nutrients and supplements. A bottle Chem Lab C-9 was found in the "A" cabinet.

17) "B" cabinet in the middle contain bottles of chemical reagents used for experiments

18) "C" cabinet on the right contains bottles of poison


Investigation at Rec Room Part 2:

19) A magazine is placed upside-down in the magazine rack that was spotted by Kirigiri. Inside the magazine was a word "Fukawa" written with blood using a finger

20) Yellow powder was found on Oogami's shoe by Kirigiri

21) Kirigiri noticed that Sakura was struck on the head twice. Also, her fingernails are perfectly clean with no traces of blood

22) Kirigiri picked up a Monokuma bottle from the cabinet, and Naegi collected all the broken bottle pieces and Monokuma figure. Placing two unbroken bottles on a balancing scale, they are balanced. Replacing with the broken fragments on one side, the fragments weigh more.

[Triple_R]

The suicide argument is interesting. I do see orion's points there, and I myself have a hard time finding a believable murder culprit.

The thing with suicide is that this typically doesn't result in a trial in real life if people know that it's a suicide. Having a trial to reach a suicide verdict is a bit strange. It also frankly strikes me as Monobear playing a bit fast and loose with his rules.

But still, suicide is a viable possibility here.

[frodonk]

Originally Posted by Solitaired

Guys as mentioned in the very few posts, the investigation is incomplete, some evidence in this episode is useless as there are no explanations. This isn't like the second one where there are no evidence towards Mondo, or the previous one which although the investigations are also left out, the entire drama sequence is shown to you thus deductions can still be made. Missing evidences can definitely cement your theories. I could make a list of evidences if you all need to prepare for the next episode (which most likely will jump straight into the trial 5-10 minutes in)


Edit: Here's the evidences in case you are all right. Gotta go out. Remove this post if its unnecessary.

Spoiler for Evidences for this case:

14) Yellow powder was spilled in front of the cabinets. Broken bottle with label Chem Lab C-4 beside it. Togami stopped by the chem lab in the morning but the powder was not present.

Spoiler for question:

what color is the c-4 bottle?

[jeroz]

If its indeed suicide, would Sakura chan not notify to other people in a note or some sort? I find it hard to believe that if she wanted to die she would be the type of person to drag everyone else down with her. At the moment her death just creates confusion and finger pointing amongst the group, probably making her "noble suicide" fairly useless if thats indeed the case. Also there's no reason anyone would want to hide the note either since it would mean certain death to them all.

If you think about it, it just seems unlikely. Unless, it's a spur of the moment type of decision. Then again, I feel even poison can't kill her soon enough to not write down anything. Highly doubt she died from banging her head twice IMO.

[Haiprbim]

Originally Posted by frodonk

Spoiler for question:

what color is the c-4 bottle?

Spoiler for Answer:

I'm sure that is not the case here, but the Bottle of C-4 is a bottle than contains explosive powder. In this case, they were most likely focusing on some sort of poison instead.

[orion]

Originally Posted by Marina2

So, you are saying that Sakura also want to "kill" Aoi if everyone guess wrong? Why?

Clueless. Perhaps it has to do with info regarding what happens if it's a suicide in the rules. The others should be able to figure this one out.

Just think about all the isolation she is going thru. Moles aren't really going to be loved in this scenario. That's why Monobear outed her so that someone would want to kill her.

[frodonk]

Originally Posted by Haiprbim

Spoiler for Answer:

I'm sure that is not the case here, but the Bottle of C-4 is a bottle than contains explosive powder. In this case, they were most likely focusing on some sort of poison instead.

Spoiler:

are you talking about the real life C-4 explosive? I was asking for the color of the bottle of "chem lab c-4". if it turned out that it was taken out of the lab, then somehow parts of it, if they are of the same color as the monobear display bottle, got mixed with the monobear bottle shards, it might explain the weight increase as pointed out in no. 22.

[Solitaired]

Originally Posted by frodonk

Spoiler:

are you talking about the real life C-4 explosive? I was asking for the color of the bottle of "chem lab c-4". if it turned out that it was taken out of the lab, then somehow parts of it, if they are of the same color as the monobear display bottle, got mixed with the monobear bottle shards, it might explain the weight increase as pointed out in no. 22.

Spoiler for answer:

The bottle was red. Bottle C-4 was broken on the ground in the Chemistry Lab beside the split yellow powder. Please look at the amends I made for point 8 and 19. Up to you if they are relevant

[Dengar]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

The thing with suicide is that this typically doesn't result in a trial in real life if people know that it's a suicide. Having a trial to reach a suicide verdict is a bit strange. It also frankly strikes me as Monobear playing a bit fast and loose with his rules.

That's because REAL trials aren't meant to find the culprit of a murder. A lot of people might be a bit thrown off by the word "Trial" here, but EVERYTHING about the trial is already unusual. Seeing how there's no defendant, no defense, no judge, no jury, not even a prosecutor.

[frodonk]

hmm there are clues that are not shown yet that might be material, looks like I still need to wait for the next episode.

as for the suicide angle, it is highly unlikely, but that's just my opinion.