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Dean_the_Young · 2008-05-05, 14:13

And even the decorative title of Euphie, I might remind, was enough to reverse years of policy and put the SAZ into effect. As long as she has the position, even as a puppet, Nunaly is going to be able to have some influence on and for the Elevens.

blitz1/2 · 2008-05-05, 15:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by greyhawk

After giving it some thought, I've come to the conclusion that Suzaku is deliberately using Nunally to suppress Lelouch's will to fight (technically she'll just be another decorative governor like Euphie, though I wonder whether she's recognized as a Britannian princess now, pretty sure someone has to remember her), lol @ Lelouch who originally intended to make Suzaku her knight, how ironic. So it looks like not only Lelouch knows the technique of hostage-taking.
It was a very wise move by Suzaku. Making Nunally the new governor, asking 2 other Knights of Rounds for help ("more than enough military strength"<-- Lelouch had difficulty dealing with one KoR before, now there are 3 of them, so we may have to rely on Rolo now, though his Geass apparently has some weakness, damn Suzaku clearly has the upper hand ATM). Suzaku has no one to protect with all his life, while Lelouch does. But knowing the series, Lelouch WILL and WILL defeat Suzaku's great plot, he has the power to accomplish the impossible, I'm definitely looking forward to the next ep.
Hmm, assuming Suzaku becomes the Knight of One and he chooses Japan, what'll happen after he dies? (probably assassinated, executed, or simply in his bed) Still, if someone has to win the war, it'd better be Lelouch (he'll put an end to Britannia, the root of all evil and colonialism, no more fake independence or the need to use a privilege granted by the Emperor)

Suzaku could assassinate both Emperor and Lulu if he wants. Then empire is crushed and Nunnaly as queen.

Methuselah · 2008-05-05, 15:31

I think the speculation of treason could well be placed on Suzaku's head because of his racial background. No matter how popular he is - at One position - people will still have doubts. And with the Japan territory that he has been granted, will again go towards war with the 3/4 of the world's army - Britannnia, which they will lose and be controlled again. XD Oh jeez, history repeats itself.

I guess Suzaku could always type in: PowerOverwhelming to beat the remaining empire if that happens. ^^ Then we can all laugh and curse him for all his hypocrisies of how he wanted to change from within and such when he is fighting *Lelouch-style against the empire.

hero147 · 2008-05-05, 15:40

Actually the plan of showing Nunnally to Lelouch was actually pretty stupid, now Lelouch knows Nunnally is fine, so there is no more unknowns, if Lelouch gets passed this, he'll be better off than he was before.

Dann of Thursday · 2008-05-05, 21:14

Ah, but if Nunnally is safe and happy where she is then Lelouch loses his reason to fight hence Zero not being needed anymore.

orangejuicetang · 2008-05-05, 21:41

But then we would get 20+ episodes of peace with no Lelouch genius battle strategies that involves collapsing floors

. And who would want to watch people achieving their goals through peaceful means when revolution is so much more exciting to watch?

Dann of Thursday · 2008-05-05, 21:45

Of course, the plan isn't going to work. The idea is clever, that is all I'm saying.

blitz1/2 · 2008-05-05, 21:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Methuselah

I think the speculation of treason could well be placed on Suzaku's head because of his racial background. No matter how popular he is - at One position - people will still have doubts. And with the Japan territory that he has been granted, will again go towards war with the 3/4 of the world's army - Britannnia, which they will lose and be controlled again. XD Oh jeez, history repeats itself.

I guess Suzaku could always type in: PowerOverwhelming to beat the remaining empire if that happens. ^^ Then we can all laugh and curse him for all his hypocrisies of how he wanted to change from within and such when he is fighting *Lelouch-style against the empire.

I laughed at your second paragraph.

RM-FAN · 2008-05-05, 23:09

I remember that i sayed that Susaku is hungry of power, and after of watch the episode 5 i confirm my idea...

he wanna be the Knight # 1 for so be the governor of Japan, and...¿what will be the next target? BE THE EMPEROR OF BRITANNIA!!!!

He will found the way of kill to the Emperor, Scheizel and the other heirs to the throne...

Suzaku is a F...KING AMBCIOUS AND SICK OF POWER

Berserker V · 2008-05-05, 23:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by hero147

Actually the plan of showing Nunnally to Lelouch was actually pretty stupid, now Lelouch knows Nunnally is fine, so there is no more unknowns, if Lelouch gets passed this, he'll be better off than he was before.

I think your forgetting what Suzaku said before calling Nunally. Inevitably his move is genius. Lelouch is not supposed to have any memories of Nunally. If he shows any inclination that he remembers who she is then hes lost and Suzaku can assume hes regained his memories. If he doesn't and pretends to not know Nunally who just called him brother then he'll be hurting the one he loves dearly and fights for. As well Lelouch cant get rid of the Governor general if its Nunally and the only other way to remove her from power would be to admit to her who he is and therein admitting he has regained his memories. As well, Nunally the puritanic person she is, would never agree with what Lelouch is doing and would take away his reason to fight.Finally, If Lelouch refuses to kill Nunally he shows to his knights his true motivation; that he cares only about Nunally and his own ambitions not Japan itslef and would therefore lose support within the Black Knights.

Like I said Suzaku's little call was genius.

Stretch5920 · 2008-05-05, 23:36

Lelouch is just going to try and kidnap Nunnally next ep.

ashlay · 2008-05-05, 23:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stretch5920

Lelouch is just going to try and kidnap Nunnally next ep.

And as we can clearly tell from his lines in the government building and the next episode preview, Suzaku will be waiting for him. >_>

Sol Falling · 2008-05-06, 08:49

Hahaha wow. I think Suzaku is an 'angel'? I'm being accused of blind fanboyism? This is a first. All I am is someone who isn't so righteous to call anybody 'wrong' (and don't try to go all meta on me, I obviously have much more context to empathise with a fictional character than some random internet poster).

(the following is a reply to koshimizu, although I'm aware that this is also the position you have taken up, Ashlay?)

I think it's a bit one-sided to declare Suzaku's actions 'evil'. The thing is, putting Nunally on the phone doesn't automatically mean that Nunally is going to get hurt. Despite how it looks, despite maybe what Lelouch has decided for himself, Lelouch does have a choice. What Suzaku did was provide a plausible alternative path to Japan's happiness to Lelouch, and follow it up by showing him that opposing it would be opposing his raison d'etre. In the end, the only reason Lelouch could have for refusing this offer is selfishness (his reaction is similar to his initial response to Euphie: "don't push your worthless kindness onto me! I am the messiah, the hero of this story; It is for me to achieve everything, not you."). And there's nothing wrong with that, as Suzaku is being just as selfish in the end, but the fact of the matter is, the one who will hurt Nunally this evening (Code Geass time) is Lelouch, not Suzaku.

What you could accuse Suzaku's action of being is 'selfish'. He's telling Lelouch to back down and to let him handle everything. Lelouch's response will probably be selfish in kind, but it's still a choice and if that's his decision then it'll be he who hurts Nunally, not Suzaku.

aurr · 2008-05-06, 09:52

He could allways think a way bypass the fact of Nunally being a governor, and just do another plan to make progress not involving her.

Sol Falling · 2008-05-06, 10:31

lol, I can just imagine it:

"Yes Nunally, it's me, Lelou--*gurk*" :P

Contrary to popular opinion, I don't think Suzaku actually hates Lelouch. He only hates Zero. If Lelouch were to admit to being Zero right there, right then, and agree to stop for the sake of Nunally, I'm sure Suzaku would let him go. He'd probably even help Lelouch get in contact with her again. It's been a long time since Euphie's death, and Suzaku gave up his vengeance the moment Zero's mask fell apart anyway.

Dann of Thursday · 2008-05-06, 10:34

I don't think he would believe Lelouch to be honest. Maybe if he had real proof he would stop, but even then I somewhat doubt. Given his comments in 2 though, I suppose he considered that Lelouch to be Zero and hated him.

Sol Falling · 2008-05-06, 10:56

Well, Lelouch admitting to being Zero would pretty much be putting himself a Suzaku's mercy, wouldn't it? After all, Britannia still has Nunally, so if he continued his activities as Zero, Suzaku would be able to tell them it was him and he'd be screwed. So Suzaku can afford to believe him, since he has that backup card.

Even if Suzaku could never be Lelouch's friend again, I think he still cares for Nunally, so he would let him live for her sake. Just as long as Lelouch isn't threatening the kind world Suzaku is trying to create.

Aquaman OS · 2008-05-06, 12:11

That whole conversation seemed like a subtle way of Suzaku telling Lelouch to give up being Zero and leave things to him and Nunnally. If Suzaku really wanted Lelouch dead he would have done so by now. There's really no point in him using Nunnally confirm anything since he already knows Lelouch has his memories back. He knew Zero was back minutes after Lelouch's memory returned so the Emperor probably already knows and told him. He's just telling Lelouch the stakes here probably so Lelouch doesn't accidentally wind up killing his own sister by attacking the new govenor enroute.

ashlay · 2008-05-06, 13:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aquaman OS

He knew Zero was back minutes after Lelouch's memory returned so the Emperor probably already knows and told him.

that was just a slight of hand. The scene at the end of turn 1 actually doesn't occur until some point in turn 3. >_>

Dann of Thursday · 2008-05-06, 16:44

I wish they hadn't done that scene. It made things sort of confusing.

2008-05-05, 21:14	Link #905
Dann of Thursday WHERE'S...MY...COW???? Join Date: Dec 2007 Age: 34	Ah, but if Nunnally is safe and happy where she is then Lelouch loses his reason to fight hence Zero not being needed anymore. __________________ By the pricking of my thumbs, something wicked this way comes. "Nearly all men can stand adversity, if you want to test a man's character give him power." - Abraham Lincoln

2008-05-05, 21:45	Link #907
Dann of Thursday WHERE'S...MY...COW???? Join Date: Dec 2007 Age: 34	Of course, the plan isn't going to work. The idea is clever, that is all I'm saying. __________________ By the pricking of my thumbs, something wicked this way comes. "Nearly all men can stand adversity, if you want to test a man's character give him power." - Abraham Lincoln

2008-05-06, 08:49	Link #913
Sol Falling Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Age: 35	Hahaha wow. I think Suzaku is an 'angel'? I'm being accused of blind fanboyism? This is a first. All I am is someone who isn't so righteous to call anybody 'wrong' (and don't try to go all meta on me, I obviously have much more context to empathise with a fictional character than some random internet poster). (the following is a reply to koshimizu, although I'm aware that this is also the position you have taken up, Ashlay?) I think it's a bit one-sided to declare Suzaku's actions 'evil'. The thing is, putting Nunally on the phone doesn't automatically mean that Nunally is going to get hurt. Despite how it looks, despite maybe what Lelouch has decided for himself, Lelouch does have a choice. What Suzaku did was provide a plausible alternative path to Japan's happiness to Lelouch, and follow it up by showing him that opposing it would be opposing his raison d'etre. In the end, the only reason Lelouch could have for refusing this offer is selfishness (his reaction is similar to his initial response to Euphie: "don't push your worthless kindness onto me! I am the messiah, the hero of this story; It is for me to achieve everything, not you."). And there's nothing wrong with that, as Suzaku is being just as selfish in the end, but the fact of the matter is, the one who will hurt Nunally this evening (Code Geass time) is Lelouch, not Suzaku. What you could accuse Suzaku's action of being is 'selfish'. He's telling Lelouch to back down and to let him handle everything. Lelouch's response will probably be selfish in kind, but it's still a choice and if that's his decision then it'll be he who hurts Nunally, not Suzaku. Last edited by Sol Falling; 2008-05-06 at 10:19.

2008-05-06, 10:34	Link #916
Dann of Thursday WHERE'S...MY...COW???? Join Date: Dec 2007 Age: 34	I don't think he would believe Lelouch to be honest. Maybe if he had real proof he would stop, but even then I somewhat doubt. Given his comments in 2 though, I suppose he considered that Lelouch to be Zero and hated him. __________________ By the pricking of my thumbs, something wicked this way comes. "Nearly all men can stand adversity, if you want to test a man's character give him power." - Abraham Lincoln

2008-05-06, 16:44	Link #920
Dann of Thursday WHERE'S...MY...COW???? Join Date: Dec 2007 Age: 34	I wish they hadn't done that scene. It made things sort of confusing. __________________ By the pricking of my thumbs, something wicked this way comes. "Nearly all men can stand adversity, if you want to test a man's character give him power." - Abraham Lincoln

2008-05-05, 14:13	Link #901
Dean_the_Young Has a life IRL Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Somewhere in the Anglo-Saxon Sphere	And even the decorative title of Euphie, I might remind, was enough to reverse years of policy and put the SAZ into effect. As long as she has the position, even as a puppet, Nunaly is going to be able to have some influence on and for the Elevens.

2008-05-05, 15:31	Link #903
Methuselah Payback is a b*t#8, huh? Join Date: May 2007	I think the speculation of treason could well be placed on Suzaku's head because of his racial background. No matter how popular he is - at One position - people will still have doubts. And with the Japan territory that he has been granted, will again go towards war with the 3/4 of the world's army - Britannnia, which they will lose and be controlled again. XD Oh jeez, history repeats itself. I guess Suzaku could always type in: PowerOverwhelming to beat the remaining empire if that happens. ^^ Then we can all laugh and curse him for all his hypocrisies of how he wanted to change from within and such when he is fighting *Lelouch-style against the empire.

2008-05-05, 15:40	Link #904
hero147 Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2008	Actually the plan of showing Nunnally to Lelouch was actually pretty stupid, now Lelouch knows Nunnally is fine, so there is no more unknowns, if Lelouch gets passed this, he'll be better off than he was before.

2008-05-05, 21:41	Link #906
orangejuicetang Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Age: 32	But then we would get 20+ episodes of peace with no Lelouch genius battle strategies that involves collapsing floors . And who would want to watch people achieving their goals through peaceful means when revolution is so much more exciting to watch?

2008-05-05, 23:09	Link #909
RM-FAN Anti-Nina Einstein Join Date: May 2006 Location: In a N-Field named "Mexico" Age: 44	I remember that i sayed that Susaku is hungry of power, and after of watch the episode 5 i confirm my idea... he wanna be the Knight # 1 for so be the governor of Japan, and...¿what will be the next target? BE THE EMPEROR OF BRITANNIA!!!! He will found the way of kill to the Emperor, Scheizel and the other heirs to the throne... Suzaku is a F...KING AMBCIOUS AND SICK OF POWER

2008-05-05, 23:36	Link #911
Stretch5920 Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2007	Lelouch is just going to try and kidnap Nunnally next ep.

2008-05-06, 09:52	Link #914
aurr Kalulu sorceress - lvl 4 Join Date: Nov 2007	He could allways think a way bypass the fact of Nunally being a governor, and just do another plan to make progress not involving her.

2008-05-06, 10:31	Link #915
Sol Falling Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Age: 35	lol, I can just imagine it: "Yes Nunally, it's me, Lelou--gurk" :P Contrary to popular opinion, I don't think Suzaku actually hates Lelouch. He only hates Zero. If Lelouch were to admit to being Zero right there, right then, and agree to stop for the sake of Nunally, I'm sure Suzaku would let him go. He'd probably even help Lelouch get in contact with her again. It's been a long time since Euphie's death, and Suzaku gave up his vengeance the moment Zero's mask fell apart anyway.

2008-05-06, 10:56	Link #917
Sol Falling Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Age: 35	Well, Lelouch admitting to being Zero would pretty much be putting himself a Suzaku's mercy, wouldn't it? After all, Britannia still has Nunally, so if he continued his activities as Zero, Suzaku would be able to tell them it was him and he'd be screwed. So Suzaku can afford to believe him, since he has that backup card. Even if Suzaku could never be Lelouch's friend again, I think he still cares for Nunally, so he would let him live for her sake. Just as long as Lelouch isn't threatening the kind world Suzaku is trying to create.

2008-05-06, 12:11	Link #918
Aquaman OS Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2008	That whole conversation seemed like a subtle way of Suzaku telling Lelouch to give up being Zero and leave things to him and Nunnally. If Suzaku really wanted Lelouch dead he would have done so by now. There's really no point in him using Nunnally confirm anything since he already knows Lelouch has his memories back. He knew Zero was back minutes after Lelouch's memory returned so the Emperor probably already knows and told him. He's just telling Lelouch the stakes here probably so Lelouch doesn't accidentally wind up killing his own sister by attacking the new govenor enroute.