I'm just O______O over the whole "YOU BELONG TO ME" thing. Because gah, that was damn creepy. If they just stuck to Kagura being all dere and whatnot I wouldn't have any problems, but the possessiveness and the preview had abusive overtones liek whoa. I hope the writers are aware of that...
Well maybe the writers were trying to portray that...It's like saying you have a choice but if you don't pick this one you'll regret it (actually that's more subtle...maybe it's more like 'you'll feel severe pain' lol). Either she'll put herself through pain or Kagura will inflict the pain lol It's his carnal instincts coming into play. Now that he has told Mikono who she is and blah blah...he expects her to come to him willingly (but there is still a hint of doubt evident).
Also, his power is way, WAAAAAY too strong. It was nice that Amata could finally power up enough to deflect it to a degree, but with this power the fights are completely unbalanced.
It may be due to the urgency of the situation? Kagura is trying to keep hold of Mikono for as long as possible till Mykage teleports Kagura and Mikono to Altair ( well that's the way I interpret it) but Mykage is too busy playing with his once red flower turned purple (is this symbolic for Mikono? LOL) Anyways, that would probably explain why his powers seemed greater. Kagura has no mech, no gate way and is pretty much up against the majority of Neo Deava so obviously his strong power had to come from somewhere. And remember Amata had just been reborn as well in this episode. He also had to search within himself to gain that deflect so maybe this is just the beginning of Amata's true powers awakening...I mean you have to start from somewhere right?
Spoiler for Re: Zessica:
I suppose she did do some research, but where and when? And from what book, isn't the Book of Twin Stars still lost? Or she just watched the movie and had an epiphany? But then why doesn't Amata know about it? ^^;; Yet again, the writing problems raise their ugly heads...
Well that was more or less a speculation of mine (I'll have to wait till the subs come out to get a more definite insight)...but I think someone said in this forum that Zessica could be the Book of Twin Stars...something referring to Zen talking about a book that you wont be able to read with your eyes closed??? (correct me if im wrong lol)
BUT anyways, I just hope that Amata doesn't get bashed around again I mean that was pretty damn harsh for them to do to the main character guy even if he is getting bashed by his other half (speculation)....sigh** I just want this over and done (hurry and give us our answers!!!!)
kuromitsu: I had a pretty similar reaction. I don't like Kagura as a character, and that aside he's just behaving in ways that're uncomfortable for me (they take a bit of the fun air out of the show, perhaps unintentionally).
Spoilertime:
Spoiler for details:
I think we're getting into bad writing territory, honestly, as far as Kagura's concerned. The only way I can make Kagura's lines make sense is if he's actually 100% truthful all the time (which'd have Mikono, us, etc., just choosing to believe "oh, he can't really mean that", but the joke's on us...)...but it's just bad writing / inconsistent (it's hard to make that sometimes-reverso-sometimes-not thing work, probably shouldn't have tried).
About Zessica: I was thrilled with her this episode, to a point...I was thrilled to see her be so outspoken with Amata. Not so much out of admiration per se, but because it seemed like it'd move the plot quickly...but yeah, she sure knows an awful lot, doesn't she? About the only way I can make it make sense is if she's another (real) reincarnation -- and I do think that groundwork's been laid -- but yeah, one step forward two steps back.
Additionally, Zessica's gotten all negative now, sort-of the way Mikono used to be. I'm honestly unsure as to whether or not the writers grasp the significance of that.
That being said, I actually think this episode gave me some decent insight into where things are going to go, but I've been wrong before...so I'll just bide my time for now.
In other news: looks like we'll have some car chases in the next macross series? And looks like Sazanka and Malloy will start getting their chance to shine soon?
Well maybe the writers were trying to portray that...It's like saying you have a choice but if you don't pick this one you'll regret it (actually that's more subtle...maybe it's more like 'you'll feel severe pain' lol). Either she'll put herself through pain or Kagura will inflict the pain lol It's his carnal instincts coming into play. Now that he has told Mikono who she is and blah blah...he expects her to come to him willingly (but there is still a hint of doubt evident).
It may be due to the urgency of the situation? Kagura is trying to keep hold of Mikono for as long as possible till Mykage teleports Kagura and Mikono to Altair ( well that's the way I interpret it) but Mykage is too busy playing with his once red flower turned purple (is this symbolic for Mikono? LOL) Anyways, that would probably explain why his powers seemed greater.
Well, he was already pretty damn hax when he crashed the movie night, it required a group gattai to fight him off, and the way I saw that only worked because they managed to surprise then overwhelm him (and because he wasn't thinking straight, but I think it's already established that Kagura is not very smart ^^;; ). But that was OK, at least it was a nice fight.
Spoiler for ep 15:
But reversing punches? Reversing the gear? That's just ridiculous. This power is just too strong, and too convenient. I mean, if he had the brains to think up tricks he could've just reversed say, Cayenne's thought processes, and have him shoot Amata.
Btw good catch about the purple rose, I wonder if it has any significance or if it just goes well with Mykage's colors. XD
Quote:
Originally Posted by Winged_Memories
And remember Amata had just been reborn as well in this episode. He also had to search within himself to gain that deflect so maybe this is just the beginning of Amata's true powers awakening...I mean you have to start from somewhere right?
Spoiler for :
Well, that's pretty much exactly what happened - Amata did a powerup by renouncing the past and all attachments... as in, "those who have no attachments will not be led astray by anything" (by Fudou). Which I suppose is right, but it doesn't sound good for Amata at all, though I guess it makes for a nice drama. (Unless in the next ep he decides he'll "detach" himself from all earthy vanities, retreat into the mountains and die a virgin. )
Quote:
Originally Posted by Winged_Memories
something referring to Zen talking about a book that you wont be able to read with your eyes closed??? (correct me if im wrong lol)
I think that was more along the lines of "it can't be seen for those who can see" by which I think he meant that it will only open to someone whose eyes are "pure" and can't "see" the truth. (I think Crea was on a search to find the book, and this would be a good explanation as to why she couldn't find it.)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Winged_Memories
BUT anyways, I just hope that Amata doesn't get bashed around again
Yeah, well, poor Amata. The universe still hates him. ^^;;
Quote:
Originally Posted by Winged_Memories
Well maybe the writers were trying to portray that...It's like saying you have a choice but if you don't pick this one you'll regret it (actually that's more subtle...maybe it's more like 'you'll feel severe pain' lol).
But that doesn't make it any better. I mean it's basically a threat. "This is your fate. Don't fight it or you'll regret it."
>miketyson
Yeah, it's pretty damn uncomfortable, and I'm not quite sure it's intentional. (The preview made me think it might be because that's pretty much an open threat... but maybe I'm just being hopeful. We'll learn more in next week's ep.)
Spoiler for :
I mean, his behavior in that tower(?) aside, even if we believe that he wouldn't hurt Mikono, he's already hurt and killed people just to get her, he almost crushed her once, in this episode he crashed the car she was riding in, and in the meanwhile he can't stop going on about how she belongs to him and only him... this doesn't give me warm & fuzzy feelings at all, quite the reverse. *zing*
Re: reverse talk, yeah, I think they really didn't think it through. And apparently he also understands things in reverse? Like, when Mikono told him to just kill her right there he obviously got the opposite meaning (that is, what he means when he says that) because he got all embarrassed. It's pretty confusing and as far as I can tell, inconsistent. (Then again, it puts his "Can I kill you?" question to Amata and Shrade in a new light... XD)
As for Zessica, it was nice that she finally opened up to Amata (though she didn't get through to him, perhaps due to the distraction). And while she's trying to prevent Amata from hurting himself she doesn't hide the fact that Amata giving up on Mikono would be very convenient for her. I really wonder what they're planning with her. It would be seriously bad writing to have Amata fall out of love with Mikono at this point, and in love with Zessica. And it would be pretty sad if Zessica got the boy she loved because he couldn't get the girl he wanted...
Hey Kagura, you forgot to reverse the bullet that went through your shoulder bud =)
and about damn time Amata gets some new powers, the reverse power of everything was starting to get annoying. Can't wait for Subs to know exactly what Zen Fudo and Amata are saying before and during his new power awakening, might give more clues.
I know the writers are trying to balance things but as far as I'm concerned this show is still revolved around Amata while developing everyone else around him. (maybe Kagura and Mikono too but we don't nearly know as much information about them as we do Amata). And as far as I'm concerned Kagura is the enemy for siding with Mykage (his so called master) and killing students just so he can get his long lost love (speculation).
I don't like the new ending, looks like it was created in half a day (too much green). Gives no speculation, No new scenes or greater insight to the end (good song though). But like Zen Fudo, a magician should never reveal their secrets I guess. I doubt the Series will become centered around disappearing girl, this seems more for the fans.
mikono got her power up last episode and amata this one. zessica didn't get a power up but atleast cleared her mind of the vision and her worries from being buried last episode. i don't think she needs a power up either
kuromitsu: yeah, I don't get the sense the staff are seeing the creepiness in Kagura. It seems more to start and stop at the level of "lol, isn't it hilarious how much of a single-minded beast he is!".
For reversal it goes so far as
Spoiler for REVERSAL:
Kagura didn't actually blush until Mikono was like "uso!" at him...(IIRC: why don't you just kill me here then? (aka: bow-chicka-wow-wow)...weird reaction..uso! (aka: I mean it!)...*then* the big blush...). That little detail was actually pretty funny...
If it wasn't for the blush I'd be able to advocate the "he's 100% serious, and its just that some of his starry-eyed fangirls and fanboys are thinking he's different" theory, but sadly I can't.
For Zessica, it was precisely her not hiding that fact that I got excited about, because for better or worse if she is open about that then things *ought* to happen quicker than would otherwise be the case...but then on the flipside it was weird for her to finally bring up the black wedding, but (unless I missed it) neither of them making the connection to their present situation seemed a bit off.
Especially Cayenne...sigh. I figured we'd sooner or later have the two of them team up to protect Mikono for her own good (which, in turn, might alienate her a bit, and understandably so), but we *still* haven't seen him have more than one-to-two lines with his sister.
I'm just rambling...will we ever know why Kagura can turn into beastwolf?
Well, all in all I enjoyed this episode (even if I understood probably 15% of the dialogues ) Anyways, it was expected in a way, surely Mikono's behavior seems contrived, but on the other hand it should enforce her role as a fated one.
I lol'ed to Amata being beaten up by Kagura, I mean, stealing the girl and even beating him up? It is a bit too much, isn't it? Apparently it wasn't, because the icing on the cake was still waiting: Mikono protecting/saving Kagura.
/shipping goggle on This enforce my opinion that someone is trying trolling hard /shipping goggle off
I hope that Amata won't be just all sad, but he'll give her the cold shoulders for a while.
It was sure odd, or at least writing-handy, that both Amata and Mikono got the story explained at the same time.
By the way, how cute Mikono was in this episode, they put a lot of efforts on her this time.
ETA:
I don't think that Kagura lines had to make sense word by word or that the writers are using some real full logic to it. Or so it seems to me. But who knows, we should try to hear his speech in reverse to find any backward messages: I'm trolling all of youuu. *runs*
__________________
The meaning of things lies not in the things themselves, but in our attitude towards them.
I think Zessica made the connection, in as much as "Kagura + Mikono = destined lovers" which ties into Cayenne's vision as well.
As for the reverse speech, Kagura told Mikono that he only "lied" to her which I thought was meant to convey that he's only "reverse" when it concerns her... but that's inconsistent with a number of his other lines and overall behavior. And of course it just doesn't make sense if one stops to think about it. (It would be funny if he was permanently stuck in reverse, though. "I'LL KILL YOU! I'LL KILL YOU! AGAIN AND AGAIN!" *blushes heavily* XDDD)
Quote:
Originally Posted by miketyson
I'm just rambling...will we ever know why Kagura can turn into beastwolf?
They'd better explain. >_> I've already given up on the cat mystery, I don't want this go unexplained, too...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arya
Spoiler:
It was sure odd, or at least writing-handy, that both Amata and Mikono got the story explained at the same time.
Spoiler:
By three different people. XD Kagura to Mikono, Zessica to Amata, and Mykage directly to the viewer. ;;
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arya
Spoiler:
Anyways, it was expected in a way, surely Mikono's behavior seems contrived, but on the other hand it should enforce her role as a fated one.
Spoiler:
As for Mikono defending Kagura I could see her not wanting them to kill him, what I'm wondering about is her asking Amata to forgive Kagura. That word was just way too dramatic not to have a deeper meaning (like when she said she must apologize to Kagura in ep 6).
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arya
By the way, how cute Mikono was in this episode, they put a lot of efforts on her this time.
Except for that horrible outfit... ;__; OK it's a mourning dress, it shouldn't be too flashy, but it makes her look like an OL or a maid or something.
But yeah, aside of the creeper vibes, the confusing reverse speech and the fight scene in the first half it was a good episode - and at least Amata got a powerup, though we're yet to see at what price.
Yeah, I caught the "I only lie to you" and it doesn't seem consistent (ergo: maybe it's true, and a lie! ouch, my head ). But he does seem to interpret what she says backwards, at least when it's convenient. So it's just inconsistent.
I don't think Zessica really made the connection that strongly, but can agree to disagree...iirc the flow is Amata asking her "where're you getting this 'destined partner' stuff from" => "I saw it in the vision, and it was connected to Cayenne's vision, which you also saw..." (I think), and to me it'd be weird to point that out and not think about how your present scenario is lifted straight out of Cayenne's vision. But that's a pretty minor point.
All in a fun episode in some ways, but feels one step forward, two steps back in many other ways. *Next* week should be a more interesting episode, I think.
I'll be honest, I don't really understand the issue with Kagura's speech or personality. He is a creeper, so to speak, in that he has a one-track mind and is obsessive. We've known this for a long time so seeing his obsessions actually reach their goal was a good moment to develop his character and, I think, they did fine with it. He's an awkward individual, expected, and he's quite the bucket of red roses: thorny but still endearing. His speech being completely strange and getting called out on it, really does make it a point that his eagerness makes him rather short-sighted and stupid; there's no better way to really explain the reaction he has with Mikono. He reverses his speech out of a childish giddy/nervousness and, when called out on it, he shrinks back and apologizes, saying he didn't mean it. It's exactly the actions and reactions of children playing...
... And that's what Kagura is, a naive kid wearing his heart on his sleeve. Hell, they're all kids as no one in this cast is as old they seem to be acting on a general basis. I don't even think his speech mannerism have to make sense on a broad basis (though I wouldn't say they don't, his *I lied* was, like I said, his getting called out on his way of talking). It's a character trait to some degree for his speech to be strange, stupid, and childish. I honestly feel like the speech is being analyzed to a point where the meaning of it is being lost... I had no trouble following it this episode and it made other episodes make more sense when concerning Mikono. I also thought it was pretty clear that when he finally admitted to his shenanigans that he was actually telling truth and, because of it, blushing. Long story short? He masks his speech because he's a tsundere. His speech with everyone else has been consistently the same and I don't see any rise of confusion from it, or why it would need to be reversed... or why we would think it would need to be reversed.
Now, his power is pretty much over the top and crazy-stupid. But he's also never won any battles, ever. No matter how strong he gets, he's always beaten back by Amata and co..
The episode itself...
Spoiler for Is it really a mystery anymore?:
Mikono had the exact same glimpse of the scene as Kagura did when Mykage was torturing him. The overlap with Apollon was just added for affect but I'm pretty sure they've made it pretty clear cut. Of course they could change it but there's really no ground work to point anywhere else.
Honestly, I thought Kagura was shot dead when he was about to power up. The way the scene was choreographed really made me think that he was shot in the gut or the heart. His expression at the end was like a victors smile or like a kid who'd finally found what he was looking for... then collapsed and disappeared.
Zessica finally admitted, somewhat surprisingly, that she was glad about Mikono picking someone else and saying aloud her liking for Amata even if the latter didn't really understand. (Give her props for just saying either thing, honestly, even if she muttered it by the end.) They continued pushing the angle of her worrying tirelessly about Amata's well being... and that last expression was one of pure dejectedness. I cannot help but root for her...
Amata... someone in the fate department really hates you but now you've got a power-up but with the worst name attached.
I have a feeling Mykage's goal was to reunite Mikono and Kagura as well as to introduce a fracture on the side of Neo-Daeva, hence why he didn't help Kagura. Now, what his overall purpose for this... I'm not sure. I don't quite think he's after Amata, since he's known of him for the longest time but done nothing with it, but he is after something on that side. If he wanted Amata to come to him, say because Fudo was protecting him, then he'd have helped Kagura take Mikono but that's not the case. So, I really don't think its Amata.
It's funny and maybe I'm wrong, but Amata's power up is the only one who get an Aquarion "achievement" shot. As far as I can recall, those shots with weird tittles were always for Aquarion "new registrations". And this time we have golden wings on top, no less.
By three different people. XD Kagura to Mikono, Zessica to Amata, and Mykage directly to the viewer. ;;
Spoiler for spoiler:
I didn't get the Mykage part, but well they surely are pushing it hard to make us know that they are Apollon and Sylvie did Mykage used these name too?
Quote:
Originally Posted by kuromitsu
Spoiler:
As for Mikono defending Kagura I could see her not wanting them to kill him, what I'm wondering about is her asking Amata to forgive Kagura. That word was just way too dramatic not to have a deeper meaning (like when she said she must apologize to Kagura in ep 6).
Spoiler for spoiler:
I missed that too (I missed a lot of the episode, usually I don't watch raws ) So I'll wait the subs to get a better understanding. Surely it is odd enough, could imply more that the three are connected in some ways or that Amata needs to forgive his bad half side before reuniting with it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kuromitsu
Except for that horrible outfit... ;__; OK it's a mourning dress, it shouldn't be too flashy, but it makes her look like an OL or a maid or something.
But yeah, aside of the creeper vibes, the confusing reverse speech and the fight scene in the first half it was a good episode - and at least Amata got a powerup, though we're yet to see at what price.
About all that detachment thing it could imply some unexpected twists even if I can't see writers switching Amata character too much and Amata giving up on Mikono either.
__________________
The meaning of things lies not in the things themselves, but in our attitude towards them.
It annoys me how this whole episode when Amato is getting his ass beat reminds me of some WWE match. Mikono is like the referee and Amata basically gets his ass kicked by Kagura for 1/4 of the episode, Mikono not even in sight to see amata almost dieing to Kagura. Doesn't even get thanked but when she comes up to stop Amata from shooting Kagura it makes him look like a dirty cheater.
I'm tired and annoyed with Mikono's ignorance towards everything. I'm already looking forward to everyone else realizing that Amata has the Solar Wings. Kagura is just jelly because he can't fly so he has to take his anger out on Amata, it's been obvious since episode 2, Amata doesn't even hate Kagura but knows he has to keep mikono away from Kagura (for selfish and instinct reasons). I can't wait to see Amata in the last few episodes shine on with his wings and save the world(s) with a few other peeps.
Vena: it's the tone really, the way he's presented has a glibness to it that doesn't sit right with everyone (e.g.: I don't care for it)...though to a point it's a matter of taste.
kuromitsu, Arya:
Spoiler for apologies?:
Didn't Kagura criticize Mikono for being on Vega? That's the one line that made me feel like I was getting a better sense of where we're going.
To build a castle on the sand: it makes me think that the natural order of things is supposed to be that each planet is supposed to have an incomplete set of "reincarnation pieces" -- maybe Altair gets 1/2 of each, and Vega gets the other halves -- but now that Mykage's stolen Altair's women Altair is now missing one of its allotted pieces (perhaps: whatever Mikono's carrying?). So the thing to apologize for is being born on the wrong planet?
...which is probably wrong in the details but I'd like to think is at least roughly on the right track for the big picture. It'd explain Mikono's mysterious need to apologize to Kagura, but not why she'd want everyone else to apologize to him. Not sure if bad writing or she doesn't get it either, but I'm looking forward to episode 16 to find out.
On Amata:
Spoiler for :
I'd like to think his wings are the wings that will overcome fate, still, but that being said there certainly are lots and lots of ways to overcome one's fate, .
Vena: it's the tone really, the way he's presented has a glibness to it that doesn't sit right with everyone (e.g.: I don't care for it)...though to a point it's a matter of taste.
Well, I'm not in your head so I'll take your word for what it is you don't like.
Quote:
Originally Posted by miketyson
Spoiler for apologies?:
Didn't Kagura criticize Mikono for being on Vega? That's the one line that made me feel like I was getting a better sense of where we're going.
I was under the impression that he was criticizing her for not being with him as she's supposed to be, hence he's critical of her having remained on Vega all this time while he's been looking for her. So its not so much a castle in the sand or twin reincarnations per planet (as I think that goes beyond the idea of the general Vega/Altair symbolism of lovers that seems to be underpinning the plot (and was central for our departed Romeo)). He's angry, so to speak, that she didn't come to him.
Quote:
Originally Posted by miketyson
On Amata:
Spoiler for :
I'd like to think his wings are the wings that will overcome fate, still, but that being said there certainly are lots and lots of ways to overcome one's fate, .
Which destiny, indeed? The doomed to sadness destiny of Apollo(nius) and Sylphie(Celianne)? I think it was rather important that Zessica said he wasn't the hero, and that Amata's power up was detachment. And, of course, we continue with dualities: Zessica worries for Amata, Mikono worries for Kagura.
I never trust the official English names for the moves, because on average anime English isn't that good. So FWIW, "Detachment Wing" is an interesting gloss they've chosen. The first part is "無執", which as far as I know is a pretty good match for (philosophy-style) "detachment". But 不惑 is more like "righteous" or "the right path" (cf: 知者不惑, which is where I know it from...*that's* a phrase you can easily get sick of hearing).
So based on that, I'm expecting Amata to become more of that guy who just does the right thing no matter what...at least until Mykage gets involved. But, on the other hand, the staff does know enough English that it's possible they that their choice to gloss it as "Detachment Wing" might actually be what they wanted.
Vena: also, in re: destiny:
Spoiler for Destinies:
In terms of being born on the wrong side of the tracks, etc., there's definitely not enough in this episode to support that theory, and not having seen the original there might be issues I'm overlooking. That said, I do think something like what I sketched will pan out -- Mykage wants something on Vega, so he disappears Altair's women, thereby motivating Altair to "make contact" () with Vega, while potentially forcing the reincarnations through a "bottleneck" of sots...some mix of that with the "components of people reincarnating independently" is my theory for now, so I'll wait and see.
Zessica saying he's not the hero stood out to me more as a weird line from her, she's seemingly turned into the "negative" woman she used to criticize Mikono for being.
there is one thing to be obsessed with the reincarnation cycle but another to just be obsessed with love/feelings.
Spoiler:
kagura is stuck in his i am apollo and you are my silvie stuff. mikono is pretty much clueless about reincarnations but has feelings for amata and kagura. amata is just concerned(i think he is obsessed) about mikono way too much. they just met for gawd's sake.
but a lot of it has to do with his abandonment issues which i really do think is part of reincarnation cycle specifically that of celiane's and silvia's. zessica is obsessed about amata getting left behind or not chosen. while she does have romantic feelings she doesn't want amata to get hurt. but even that is weird because we don't really know why zessica started liking him other than they make a good team. i suppose some sort of reincarnation worry for her as well.
so right now there is a square of kagura/mikono/amata/zessica just like in first series with apollo/silvia/sirius/reika. though the latter triangle was much easier to understand.
So in the end Kagura died?????
Amata will be the Wing of the Sun since Mykage planning to do something with him by making him more suffer as Mikono now thinking about Kagura is even more then ever and hardly pay attention to Amata nor his feeling to her.....
Kagura's reverse language:
I hate you - I love/like you
I want to kill you - ????? What the opposite for this one???
Smell good - awful smell
In terms of being born on the wrong side of the tracks, etc., there's definitely not enough in this episode to support that theory, and not having seen the original there might be issues I'm overlooking. That said, I do think something like what I sketched will pan out -- Mykage wants something on Vega, so he disappears Altair's women, thereby motivating Altair to "make contact" () with Vega, while potentially forcing the reincarnations through a "bottleneck" of sots...some mix of that with the "components of people reincarnating independently" is my theory for now, so I'll wait and see.
Zessica saying he's not the hero stood out to me more as a weird line from her, she's seemingly turned into the "negative" woman she used to criticize Mikono for being.
Cards aside.
Spoiler for Simpler:
I think its simpler to say that he removed the women to give himself an excuse to look for the reincarnation that he needed on Vega. Not that there were some sorts of split pairs between the planets. Like I said, there's a recurring theme of Altair/Vega man/woman: Jin/Yunoha, Kagura/Mikono, and I still think Amata's Dad/Alicia.
To fit the role of the destined lovers they need to be separated from start, so what better way for the universe to be a dick than to put them on two different planets where, without external forces, they'd never meet? Remember, they are the destined pair of heartbreak. And, as I said, Mikono saw the same *image* as Kagura had before, so I really don't think its vague anymore.
As for Zess, I think that line was a point of concern as in "You're not the hero of a story, don't push yourself!", it matches well with her panicked state over his getting his ass handed to him later. I honestly don't see negativity in her, she's taken large steps forward this episode with spilling the beans, so to speak, and trying to support Amata. In her position, you'd have little choice but to be sad when the person you care for is on a path (quite literally this episode) of self destruction for a girl that (as far as you as Zessi know) is going to abandon him. That's a lot of depression.
)
;;
(I missed a lot of the episode, usually I don't watch raws 
