Good Ending (GE)

[-Sho-]

Author wants more drama on Utsumi !

Chap 28 :

Shou's bf cheats on her . Yep , that was predictable .
Now , Utsumi will play the role of "cheer up" .
And i think that Yuki will see Utsumi and Shou together then misunderstanding situation , drama , etc...

[Cinocard]

Originally Posted by Darknemo2000

Spoiler for Sp 29:

He looks more like desperate than violent. Look at his face when he talks to Keito while grabbing him - he looks desperate and grabbing him rather than a real angry.

So I would not call him manning up at this point. If he hits Keito into the face then yeah - I will have to take my words back because he would really show he has strength when it is needed (though I think in Ryou's case it was needed as well and the guilt feeling is just total stupidity). But grabbing by collar is not an action of strength - it is intimidating with suitable body language, but again Utsu looks more desperate than angry in the panel, but even if he was intimidation is not an act of strength - it depends on how Kieto will react. He can easily brush off Utsu like a dog that barks but doesn't not bite', specially because Utsu's facial expression doesnt look that angry/intimidating.

I have to say it again that Utsumi didn't punch Ryou not because of any "feel of guilt," but simply because he didn't need to, and didn't feel angry over being punched. It's just: "I don't need to sweat over an action coming from a misunderstanding. I will forgive it."

Spoiler for 29:

His head is filled with sadness for his senpai instead of anger for the jerk that caused the sorrow. That explains his face.

And I actually like that he feels sad first instead of angry, because it fits his character. It emphasizes his kindness before any desire for vengeance. "Manning up" isn't necessarily punching and kicking. Heck, what can violence in this case solve? Delivering punishment of justice? Maybe the last case you can argue that it prevent Ryou from pushing Utsumi around in the future. But this time violence means nothing but letting anger take over you, when punching him may even sadden Shou, based on her personality.

If he does punch, it should chiefly be because his sorrow is too overwhelming he needs a place to let it out (like how people break things when they are stress), not of his anger.

How do you like male characters to only exercise their muscles and show off their "wildness" and "coolness." Men with mindset of "You shit me one, I will shit you ten" is cool and all, but definitely not the best kind of man out there. That said, I don't think Utsumi is any good either.

[Darknemo2000]

Originally Posted by Cinocard

I have to say it again that Utsumi didn't punch Ryou not because of any "feel of guilt," but simply because he didn't need to, and didn't feel angry over being punched. It's just: "I don't need to sweat over an action coming from a misunderstanding. I will forgive it."

Spoiler for 29:

His head is filled with sadness for his senpai instead of anger for the jerk that caused the sorrow. That explains his face.

And I actually like that he feels sad first instead of angry, because it fits his character. It emphasizes his kindness before any desire for vengeance. "Manning up" isn't necessarily punching and kicking. Heck, what can violence in this case solve? Delivering punishment of justice? Maybe the last case you can argue that it prevent Ryou from pushing Utsumi around in the future. But this time violence means nothing but letting anger take over you, when punching him may even sadden Shou, based on her personality.

If he does punch, it should chiefly be because his sorrow is too overwhelming he needs a place to let it out (like how people break things when they are stress), not of his anger.

How do you like male characters to only exercise their muscles and show off their "wildness" and "coolness." Men with mindset of "You shit me one, I will shit you ten" is cool and all, but definitely not the best kind of man out there. That said, I don't think Utsumi is any good either.

Well the main argument was that he did not real man-up which your comment illustrates whatever the reason. And sometimes you need to flex your muscles just to tell that you won't allow everyone to clean their shoes off your face.

[aliasxn]

Originally Posted by Cinocard

Spoiler for 29:

That said, I don't think Utsumi is any good either.

Doesn't sound like it.

[Arturro]

@Cinocard, @Darknemo2000 - I'd like to remind you that mangaka is a woman, and she is creating a story with male protagonist. Most male authors are unable to create a realistic female character as well as most of female authors are unable to create realistic male characters. IMHO mangaka is trying to show Utsumi as a maturing, trying to be responsible, young boy. It's possible her way of thinking about Utsumi reasoning is similar to yours Cinocard. For most of male readers Utsumi is a sissy, and their opinion about Utsumi is similar to Darknemo2000, at best some of us are more forgiving He acts like a tomboy, a girl pretending to be a boy, not like a boy of his age should.

Cinocrad - I think you're implying that Darknemo2000 (or me, in some previous posts) is suggesting that Utsumi should beat the crap of Ryou. He is not. Utsumi, as a boy, should at least consider such option, and more importantly he should show that, if necessary, he will use violence. So far Utsumi is showing that he is a easy target for bullying.

[Darknemo2000]

Originally Posted by Arturro

Utsumi, as a boy, should at least consider such option, and more importantly he should show that, if necessary, he will use violence. So far Utsumi is showing that he is a easy target for bullying.

I couldn't say it better myself. I know that some will respond that he is showing his maturity, but again you also should see the line between maturity and passiveness when the activeness is needed and in

Spoiler for in:

Kieto's situation the typical excuse - 'he is not worth it' just do not work knowing all teh trash he talks and did. He really deserves one good punch/shove here. You have to understand that being bullied and putting up with it all the doenst really mean you are mature. It can as well mean you are weak. We will see how Utsu will react but he should really try to act more actively rather than clutching the guy's shirt and showing a pathetic expression on his face.

[Flight012]

Originally Posted by Cinocard

I have to say it again that Utsumi didn't punch Ryou not because of any "feel of guilt," but simply because he didn't need to, and didn't feel angry over being punched. It's just: "I don't need to sweat over an action coming from a misunderstanding. I will forgive it."

Spoiler for 29:

His head is filled with sadness for his senpai instead of anger for the jerk that caused the sorrow. That explains his face.

And I actually like that he feels sad first instead of angry, because it fits his character. It emphasizes his kindness before any desire for vengeance. "Manning up" isn't necessarily punching and kicking. Heck, what can violence in this case solve? Delivering punishment of justice? Maybe the last case you can argue that it prevent Ryou from pushing Utsumi around in the future. But this time violence means nothing but letting anger take over you, when punching him may even sadden Shou, based on her personality.

If he does punch, it should chiefly be because his sorrow is too overwhelming he needs a place to let it out (like how people break things when they are stress), not of his anger.

How do you like male characters to only exercise their muscles and show off their "wildness" and "coolness." Men with mindset of "You shit me one, I will shit you ten" is cool and all, but definitely not the best kind of man out there. That said, I don't think Utsumi is any good either.

Spoiler for :

You looking it at the wrong direction totaly, punching such people doesnt prove u are cool or coz u are angry it has only one meaning, Scum like that need a punching and a hardone so he will learn hes leston, seriously dont know how u can say violence is wrong against this shity bastard.

[Pentacle]

Why does everyone seem to think that they only way for Utsumi to show his "manliness" is to try and punch someone who's larger and stronger than he is?

He's an adolescent boy. An insecure one at that. It would be out of character for him to suddenly start punching people out of anger. Especially someone who looks like he could easily kick Utsumi's ass.

[Darknemo2000]

Spoiler for j:

If that someone pretty much spits into your and your friends face I think even the most cautious adolescent boy would break unless he is a total coward or has no human emotions whatsover.

Besides you have to remember that the contra-argument was that Utsu was really mature, by selecting not to go physical, however, if he does not consider physical as an option to begin with then it is not a mature choice - it is just trying to pick some dignity to cover your own helplessness.

[babohtea]

This is the most violent discussion I've ever seen over a manga. Even battle-manga don't have this much anger. I am amused. Imagine putting the people in here face to face in a room. I can tell you right now that half of the people in the room are going to punch the people they don't agree with.

[MikiMata]

Yeah, whatever you think of this manga, you have to hand it to the author for creating a series that inspires such strong feelings. She must be doing something right!

[Cinocard]

Originally Posted by Flight012

Spoiler for :

You looking it at the wrong direction totaly, punching such people doesnt prove u are cool or coz u are angry it has only one meaning, Scum like that need a punching and a hardone so he will learn hes leston, seriously dont know how u can say violence is wrong against this shity bastard.

If people like that were someone that can be fixed by punching them once or twice, there would be world peace. I have said clearly, punching in that situation solves nothing, you punch because you hate someone and LIKE to punch him, that's all. It may actually make the situation more convoluted and sadden Shou also.

Once you get violent, even though the aftermath effect may actually be good, when you do violence, it's because of your emotion. Your justification sounds nice indeed, but how many percent of world's population actually think hard before punching? Certainly not an adolescent boy.

And as how Utsumi is, if he thought about making Keito a better person before about comforting Shou...

Originally Posted by Arturro

Cinocrad - I think you're implying that Darknemo2000 (or me, in some previous posts) is suggesting that Utsumi should beat the crap of Ryou. He is not. Utsumi, as a boy, should at least consider such option, and more importantly he should show that, if necessary, he will use violence. So far Utsumi is showing that he is a easy target for bullying.

I never disagree with anything you say...I just wanted to prove that what Utsumi did is BETTER than punching.

And how do you know Utsumi never considers violence as an option either? Maybe he has considered it and thought it's not the best way out? From the way Utsumi looked straight at Ryou eyes, I think he was saying he wouldn't back down further than that.

[Darknemo2000]

We are showed of Utsu's thoughts. If he did consider then it would be showed there as well. Specially in situations like these, thats why he says he does not consider - they are not showed and because Utsu's thoughts and significant ones are showed to us.

Cinocard, but it does help. When you are bullied and start to fight off - it really does help. There are way too many examples for that. On the other hand, being mature and keeping your head up while everyone pisses on your head - much more rarely helps.

It doenst fix the bad guys but it makes them look for someone else, weaker who would cause less problems because this one just would not let walk all over him.

Originally Posted by MikiMata

Yeah, whatever you think of this manga, you have to hand it to the author for creating a series that inspires such strong feelings. She must be doing something right!

There were a few insulting pictures and very insulting articles about Gay, Muslims and Jews in one of lithuanian newspaper. Boy it caused so many strong feelings.... Does that mean that the author was doing right thing too? Hardly. Not to mention that it doesn't seem to help to sell GE series all that much.

[MikiMata]

Originally Posted by Darknemo2000

There were a few insulting pictures and very insulting articles about Gay, Muslims and Jews in one of lithuanian newspaper. Boy it caused so many strong feelings.... Does that mean that the author was doing right thing too? Hardly. Not to mention that it doesn't seem to help to sell GE series all that much.

Nice reductio ad absurdum there. Are you arguing that GE as a series is immoral? What I meant was, if the author's goal is to write a story that has high readership, it is good to make people care about it. Obviously, the people on this board are still reading the series, whatever they may think of its quality. So, on that level, the author is doing something right.

[Kleeyook]

Punching someone isn't gonna do peace. Utsumi's solution is what's most suitable. It's not worth fighting over some stupid misunderstanding.
But if someone tell me I'm a **** and punch me while acting cocky then that unfortunate person is not going to live long.

[Arturro]

Originally Posted by Kleeyook

Punching someone isn't gonna do peace. Utsumi's solution is what's most suitable. It's not worth fighting over some stupid misunderstanding.
But if someone tell me I'm a **** and punch me while acting cocky then that unfortunate person is not going to live long.

What Darknemo2000 and me is trying to say is that Utsumi should react well... like you. Starting fight in rage is not the best option, but acting like bullied kid excusing for being alive is the worst one. He has show those two bastards that he is a weak guy, an easy target for bullies. In real life there would be only one effect of his "suitable" actions - he will be bullied more.

[Darknemo2000]

Kleeyook, tell me have you been bullied or have seen someone bullied from close up? I mean physically bullied not just calling names which is very common...

It is not a good sight. And you know what is worse? If the guy/girl keeps acting 'most suitable' they will just get bullied more.

Usually standing up (really standing up) is good enough for bullies to start searching for easier accessible victims. The only way it doesn't help is because you have been bullied for so long that the one stand up won't really help much because in bullies mind your image is already that of weak. But if you do stand up early enough it does help.

Ryou is very close to physical bullie who finds it best to let his knuckles do the talking. He trashes and punches Utsu around and won't stop until Utsu proves he is worthy. Sadly, 'suitable' acts will never impress Ryou who will be blind to these actions, the only way he can notice them if he sees yours strength and then when you pull back he will understand it as pullback rather than helplessness or weakness.

Keita is different case - he

Spoiler for he:

bullies emotionally - trash talks Shou and Utsu spitting into their feelings. When you think about it - hitting him won't change much, but who knows... It is worth a try, maybe one punch would make him reconsider his acts, or at leasts top opening his mouth w=this widely and making fun of others and hurting them more.

[Flight012]

Originally Posted by Cinocard

If people like that were someone that can be fixed by punching them once or twice, there would be world peace. I have said clearly, punching in that situation solves nothing, you punch because you hate someone and LIKE to punch him, that's all. It may actually make the situation more convoluted and sadden Shou also.

Once you get violent, even though the aftermath effect may actually be good, when you do violence, it's because of your emotion. Your justification sounds nice indeed, but how many percent of world's population actually think hard before punching? Certainly not an adolescent boy.

And as how Utsumi is, if he thought about making Keito a better person before about comforting Shou...



I never disagree with anything you say...I just wanted to prove that what Utsumi did is BETTER than punching.

And how do you know Utsumi never considers violence as an option either? Maybe he has considered it and thought it's not the best way out? From the way Utsumi looked straight at Ryou eyes, I think he was saying he wouldn't back down further than that.

So you just sit around and watch quaietly how scum like that goes around and do what he please? thats so wrong because talking wont solve anything either.

[Darknemo2000]

Originally Posted by MikiMata

Nice reductio ad absurdum there. Are you arguing that GE as a series is immoral? What I meant was, if the author's goal is to write a story that has high readership, it is good to make people care about it. Obviously, the people on this board are still reading the series, whatever they may think of its quality. So, on that level, the author is doing something right.

Lol, what?

I never said nor implied anything like that. It seems like your imagination is overly active in this one mate.

I am just saying that controversy doesn't really mean that the author is doing something good. Yeah, there are good examples like Evangelion where it works but I am really not convinced taht GE is one of those.

[Flight012]

Originally Posted by Darknemo2000

Kleeyook, tell me have you been bullied or have seen someone bullied from close up? I mean physically bullied not just calling names which is very common...

It is not a good sight. And you know what is worse? If the guy/girl keeps acting 'most suitable' they will just get bullied more.

Usually standing up (really standing up) is good enough for bullies to start searching for easier accessible victims. The only way it doesn't help is because you have been bullied for so long that the one stand up won't really help much because in bullies mind your image is already that of weak. But if you do stand up early enough it does help.

Ryou is very close to physical bullie who finds it best to let his knuckles do the talking. He trashes and punches Utsu around and won't stop until Utsu proves he is worthy. Sadly, 'suitable' acts will never impress Ryou who will be blind to these actions, the only way he can notice them if he sees yours strength and then when you pull back he will understand it as pullback rather than helplessness or weakness.

Keita is different case - he

Spoiler for he:

bullies emotionally - trash talks Shou and Utsu spitting into their feelings. When you think about it - hitting him won't change much, but who knows... It is worth a try, maybe one punch would make him reconsider his acts, or at leasts top opening his mouth w=this widely and making fun of others and hurting them more.

Totaly agree with u