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View Poll Results: High School DxD [LN/M] - Volume 25 Rating
Perfect 10 20 51.28%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 9 23.08%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 6 15.38%
7 out of 10 : Good 4 10.26%
6 out of 10 : Average 0 0%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 0 0%
4 out of 10 : Poor 0 0%
3 out of 10 : Bad 0 0%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 0 0%
1 out of 10 : Painful 0 0%
Voters: 39. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2018-09-20, 21:47   Link #3101
Palmito
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Originally Posted by XFire View Post
No, I'm not. Hence why I keep pointing out the fact that Ise and Rias responded politically and the Norse backed down. All I've been saying is that acting like an internet tough guy to the leader of one of your nation's biggest allies is a horrible political idea, which is why Issei didnt do it despite being pissed as hell at the situation.



Unless something has drastically changed about the general situation of the upper class after the past 24 volumes of them only having private lives in the human world, it's public.

And asking for this marriage is not shameful to the general public. Remember that Rose is not engaged to Issei and they haven't done anything to suggest they're in love in public either. As far as most are concerned this would be seen as an honor.
Huh no? I said that a simple "no" would not be something humiliating for the norse gods, then in your last post you said it would be, now you're saying that Rias and Issei said "no" and everything was okay? What about consistency? To begin with, who said they should act rudely?

An honor? LMAO. Head line - "Norse Chief God tries to force Oppai Dragon's servant to marry him." Yeah, public opinion would really think it would be an honor to be forced to marry a man you do not want to and who is the son of man who has left you behind by yourself in a foreign country. But what a good man, huh? Trying to steal one of the girls from our national hero, Oppai Dragon. People in the underworld and other factions will really think high of Vidar. It will not be shameful for him at all.

And if you want to make your own head canon and think that this incident is public then ok. So far nothing has been said about it.
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Old 2018-09-20, 21:54   Link #3102
Lucidrago
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Well one it was the Norse gods that decided for Rossweisse to be Vidar's bride, not Vidar himself. Vidar just went along with it. Like how Riser just went along with his engagement to Rias. This doesn't seem like something Vidar planned himself but something that he just simply went along with.

We have no idea if this is public or not. It's not like they have been officially engaged so why would it be?

But really it just seems like a forced plot point just for Rossweisse's volume. As there is no reason she can't refuse something as extreme as a marriage proposal. Yes it may embarrass the Norse faction and to deny a marriage proposal to a chief god is a major issue. But still it just seems very forced. Because while she did come from their world and they are in an alliance,

They're basically asking her to give her life away to a man she barely even knows and she can't say no? The Norse gods are in the wrong here, not Rossweisse. Rossweisse has no obligation or duty to even go along with it.

It just seems like a very weak plot point with little reasoning behind it to me. That's all I have to say.
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Old 2018-09-20, 22:16   Link #3103
Tbolt
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Political marriages fall in two easy categories, Lower class marries daughter to higher class to better there social status. Higher class marries lower class because he can, love has nothing to do with it but can have the same effect of raising the lower classes status. XFire is following the ideals of the story and I personally agree with his arguments. And Palmito don't try and put your ideals into the story, its just a story. Just saying.
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Old Yesterday, 00:27   Link #3104
Royalknightftw
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Originally Posted by Palmito View Post
Huh no? I said that a simple "no" would not be something humiliating for the norse gods, then in your last post you said it would be, now you're saying that Rias and Issei said "no" and everything was okay? What about consistency? To begin with, who said they should act rudely?

An honor? LMAO. Head line - "Norse Chief God tries to force Oppai Dragon's servant to marry him." Yeah, public opinion would really think it would be an honor to be forced to marry a man you do not want to and who is the son of man who has left you behind by yourself in a foreign country. But what a good man, huh? Trying to steal one of the girls from our national hero, Oppai Dragon. People in the underworld and other factions will really think high of Vidar. It will not be shameful for him at all.

And if you want to make your own head canon and think that this incident is public then ok. So far nothing has been said about it.
And what makes you think that the public knows that both Ross and Issei are in relationship? As far as they are concerned, Ross is just Issei's servant. That's all
It's just as Gondul Said. Had Ross already made a move with Issei, the proposal wouldn't have happened.
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Old Yesterday, 00:38   Link #3105
XFire
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Originally Posted by Palmito View Post
Huh no? I said that a simple "no" would not be something humiliating for the norse gods, then in your last post you said it would be, now you're saying that Rias and Issei said "no" and everything was okay? What about consistency? To begin with, who said they should act rudely?
Wut.

How is that the conclusion you came to regarding what I said?

I said outright refusing a political marriage with someone of a massively higher social status from another country would be seen as a slight, because common sense, that's how politics work. Image is everything.

You twisted that into me saying the devils had no choice but to kowtow to the Norse.

I pointed out that wasn't true, because they used political channels to protest the way the proposal was presented, causing it to be withdraw in favor of a marriage meeting. They did not refuse outright, hence the meeting taking place.

The posts are literally right above us, dude. Just scroll up.

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Originally Posted by Palmito View Post
An honor? LMAO. Head line - "Norse Chief God tries to force Oppai Dragon's servant to marry him." Yeah, public opinion would really think it would be an honor to be forced to marry a man you do not want to and who is the son of man who has left you behind by yourself in a foreign country. But what a good man, huh? Trying to steal one of the girls from our national hero, Oppai Dragon. People in the underworld and other factions will really think high of Vidar. It will not be shameful for him at all.
Except that....
  • the headline would be "Norse Chief God proposes to hero Valkyrie"
  • Rose is not one of Issei's girls in the view of the public
  • No one outside the situation would think she was being pressured into this

He's not kidnapping her like Elucid, he just proposed to her. A single woman originally from the Norse side who has recently become a renowned hero because of her contributions in the Evil Dragon War.

You realize literally no one outside the Gremory group and their closest friends would actually see this as troubling her at all, right?

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Originally Posted by Palmito View Post
And if you want to make your own head canon and think that this incident is public then ok. So far nothing has been said about it.
And you're just assuming that this specific incident out of literally everything else major figures do in this series manages to escape media attention. When Rias has said the only way she ever gets away from it is by going to the human world.

K.
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Old Yesterday, 04:24   Link #3106
Palmito
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Originally Posted by XFire View Post
Wut.

How is that the conclusion you came to regarding what I said?

I said outright refusing a political marriage with someone of a massively higher social status from another country would be seen as a slight, because common sense, that's how politics work. Image is everything.

You twisted that into me saying the devils had no choice but to kowtow to the Norse.

I pointed out that wasn't true, because they used political channels to protest the way the proposal was presented, causing it to be withdraw in favor of a marriage meeting. They did not refuse outright, hence the meeting taking place.

The posts are literally right above us, dude. Just scroll up.



Except that....
  • the headline would be "Norse Chief God proposes to hero Valkyrie"
  • Rose is not one of Issei's girls in the view of the public
  • No one outside the situation would think she was being pressured into this

He's not kidnapping her like Elucid, he just proposed to her. A single woman originally from the Norse side who has recently become a renowned hero because of her contributions in the Evil Dragon War.

You realize literally no one outside the Gremory group and their closest friends would actually see this as troubling her at all, right?



And you're just assuming that this specific incident out of literally everything else major figures do in this series manages to escape media attention. When Rias has said the only way she ever gets away from it is by going to the human world.

K.
"Image is everything" - "Screw you I'm going to marry my master" - Said Rose to Vidar the son of Odin who by the way dont think twice about doing perv things in front of other people, like for example staring to the breasts of the Maou Leviathan in a important meeting. Yeah image is realy everything in dxd world.

I do not think people really care about the image in DxD, Oppai Dragon you know? And you really think the norse gods are going to be so offended by a "no" (that's what they've received in a ruder way by a drunken Rose) and this will shake relations with the alliance. The same Norse gods who have had their land destroyed in war and is in need of allies more than anyone will depart from an alliance with all the greatest factions in the world. yeah....

1- Why are you assuming the media will not think that Rose is being forced when that is the truth?

2-Yes she is. Not a girlfriend. But a servant.

3- If a single rumor is spread by one of the 20 people at that meeting she is being forced this is sure to be the head line.

He's trying to force her to marry him. A woman his father left behind in Japan. And now that she has proved her worth and made a name for herself the nordic gods want her back.

You realize literally everyone who have a brain would actually see this as troubling her, right?

???What do you mean? Rias said that in the underworld it was that way so she came to the human world. You know the meeting was in the human world right? Again if you want to make your own head canon feel free.

Royalknightftw: She does not have to be his girlfriend, the simple fact that the public knows that he is trying to force one of Oppai Dragon's servants to marry him would destroy his public image.

Tbolt: ??? How am I trying to put my ideals into the story?

Last edited by Palmito; Yesterday at 05:57.
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Old Yesterday, 07:49   Link #3107
XFire
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Originally Posted by Palmito View Post
"Image is everything" - "Screw you I'm going to marry my master" - Said Rose to Vidar the son of Odin who by the way dont think twice about doing perv things in front of other people, like for example staring to the breasts of the Maou Leviathan in a important meeting. Yeah image is realy everything in dxd world.

I do not think people really care about the image in DxD, Oppai Dragon you know? And you really think the norse gods are going to be so offended by a "no" (that's what they've received in a ruder way by a drunken Rose) and this will shake relations with the alliance. The same Norse gods who have had their land destroyed in war and is in need of allies more than anyone will depart from an alliance with all the greatest factions in the world. yeah....

1- Why are you assuming the media will not think that Rose is being forced when that is the truth?

2-Yes she is. Not a girlfriend. But a servant.

3- If a single rumor is spread by one of the 20 people at that meeting she is being forced this is sure to be the head line.

He's trying to force her to marry him. A woman his father left behind in Japan. And now that she has proved her worth and made a name for herself the nordic gods want her back.

You realize literally everyone who have a brain would actually see this as troubling her, right?

???What do you mean? Rias said that in the underworld it was that way so she came to the human world. You know the meeting was in the human world right? Again if you want to make your own head canon feel free.

Royalknightftw: She does not have to be his girlfriend, the simple fact that the public knows that he is trying to force one of Oppai Dragon's servants to marry him would destroy his public image.

Tbolt: ??? How am I trying to put my ideals into the story?
Rose was drunk, and if you didnt notice people started freaking out when she said that. Vidar salvaged the situation, remember?

That "No" didnt actually go through, hence the duel. It never got past Vidar, who is effectively on their side here.

1 - Because they dont know about her situation. You're assuming they have the same information we do. Gondul stated if Issei and Rose were publicly lovers this would never have happened.

2 - which doesn't imply any limitations on her marriage prospects.

3 - None of those people are dumb enough to potentially blow it out of control

No he isn't. A bunch of pushy old men created an awkward situation. He himself had zero interest and only proposed the duel after seeing the situation personally.

No, they wouldn't. To an outsider it looks like a foreign king offering marriage to a lower-class hero. It'd be borderline fairy tail stuff if it weren't for the actual circumstances the general public isn't aware of.

The marriage meeting itself was in the human world, but you're assuming the official proposal of the Norse Chief God to a servant of the Hero of the Underworld went unnoticed by both sides news forces.

Again, no one is arguing the proposal itself wasn't a stupid idea. But just blowing it off with zero consideration is a horrible political move.
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Old Yesterday, 09:02   Link #3108
Palmito
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Rose was drunk, and if you didnt notice people started freaking out when she said that. Vidar salvaged the situation, remember?

That "No" didnt actually go through, hence the duel. It never got past Vidar, who is effectively on their side here.

1 - Because they dont know about her situation. You're assuming they have the same information we do. Gondul stated if Issei and Rose were publicly lovers this would never have happened.

2 - which doesn't imply any limitations on her marriage prospects.

3 - None of those people are dumb enough to potentially blow it out of control

No he isn't. A bunch of pushy old men created an awkward situation. He himself had zero interest and only proposed the duel after seeing the situation personally.

No, they wouldn't. To an outsider it looks like a foreign king offering marriage to a lower-class hero. It'd be borderline fairy tail stuff if it weren't for the actual circumstances the general public isn't aware of.

The marriage meeting itself was in the human world, but you're assuming the official proposal of the Norse Chief God to a servant of the Hero of the Underworld went unnoticed by both sides news forces.

Again, no one is arguing the proposal itself wasn't a stupid idea. But just blowing it off with zero consideration is a horrible political move.
And this completely validates your point that image is everything?

And that's why this plot does not make sense. They are forcing her, and this duel will not solve anything because in the end Rose will still refuse and there is nothing that can be done about it.

1- And you are assuming that they can not get the information.

2- not in a normal marriage, but when they try to force one of the hero's comrade into a marriage then yes.

3- If the Norse gods do not back down and try to say that Rose is dishonoring them then I do not see why no one there would not defend themselves if the media questioned them.

But that's how people will react. Everyone is going to say that the boss of the Norse gods is doing this.

And again you do not take into account that everyone would know the circumstance at the time that Rose publicly says that she does not want to marry Vidar and rather marry Issei. Everything would be solved by that. If the Norse gods did not back down basically everyone would see this as: "The chief norse god is trying to steal the bride of the Oppai dragon."

And you're imagining that this was made publicly. Until this moment this was not said in the novels man. Its just your opinion with no facts.

No, it's not. Just respectfully refuse the marriage proposal and later refuse the duel would be the most obvious and respectful way they could have done. The Norse gods would have no reason to feel humiliated and everything would be resolved quickly without drama.

This thread has already been closed once because of discussions like this so I'm going to stop here.
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Old Yesterday, 09:25   Link #3109
XFire
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And this completely validates your point that image is everything?
Yes? They met in the human world where the paparazzi isn't around and found a solution where neither side loses face.

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And that's why this plot does not make sense. They are forcing her, and this duel will not solve anything because in the end Rose will still refuse and there is nothing that can be done about it.
You denying that political and social pressures exist doesn't make them less real, especially in Japanese culture.

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1- And you are assuming that they can not get the information.

2- not in a normal marriage, but when they try to force one of the hero's comrade into a marriage then yes.

3- If the Norse gods do not back down and try to say that Rose is dishonoring them then I do not see why no one there would not defend themselves if the media questioned them.
1 - I'm not assuming anything, its outright stated nobody knew Rose was in love with Issei, which is why this happened at all

2 - They made a pushy proposal, which was rude, but Rose is only refusing because she's in love with Issei. It's not like the proposal itself is a bad thing.

3 - at that point it would already be out of control and both sides are actively avoiding this scenario

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But that's how people will react. Everyone is going to say that the boss of the Norse gods is doing this.
No outsider will think it was him "forcing" her, and the guy is literally playing wingman to her and Issei by both providing a way out of the situation and pushing them forward.

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Originally Posted by Palmito View Post
And again you do not take into account that everyone would know the circumstance at the time that Rose publicly says that she does not want to marry Vidar and rather marry Issei. Everything would be solved by that. If the Norss gods did not back down basically everyone would see this as: "The chief norse god is trying to steal the bride of the Oppai dragon."
That is literally exactly what the duel is for, dude. It's turning the potentially messy scenario into a big dramatic spectacle so neither side loses face.

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And you're imagining that this was made publicly. Until this moment this was not said in the novels man. Its just your opinion with no facts.
You're the one assuming that the paparazzi have suddenly ceased to work as they've been repeatedly stated to work in DxD. Occams Razor is on my side here. Unless proven otherwise things still work as stated earlier.

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No, it's not. Just respectfully refuse the marriage proposal and later refuse the duel would be the most obvious and respectful way they could have done. The Norse gods would have no reason to feel humiliated and everything would be resolved quickly without drama.

This thread has already been closed once because of discussions like this so I'm going to stop here.
No, because it would look like Rose just casually blew off a freaking Chief God. The whole purpose of the duel was to put the situation in a light where the public would see it as a big dramatic love story so everyone would accept the result.

It solves the problem of a refusal without either side looking bad and makes it so no one does something this dumb again.

Edit: the thread was closed because of an off-topic power level argument. We're talking about the latest translated part of the novel the thread is for. I'm pretty sure we're good, but I'll stop if you're done with it.
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Old Yesterday, 10:55   Link #3110
Lucidrago
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So do you think Roygun having access to info about the possible new Longinus is due to her ability 'Crack'? Like maybe it allows her to exploit gaps and openings allowing her to easy infiltrate barriers or techniques with her ability.

So it can allow her to easily infiltrate her way through certain techniques giving her access to certain info that no one else is able to get. And her peerage was specifically made for infiltration and information gathering.
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Old Yesterday, 11:28   Link #3111
TommyG
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I thought her ability let her "crack" or break apart mid to long range attacks.
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Old Yesterday, 11:53   Link #3112
yuiichi9
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What ability? Details, please.
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Old Yesterday, 12:01   Link #3113
TommyG
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A clan specific trait called Crack
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Old Yesterday, 12:58   Link #3114
XFire
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So do you think Roygun having access to info about the possible new Longinus is due to her ability 'Crack'? Like maybe it allows her to exploit gaps and openings allowing her to easy infiltrate barriers or techniques with her ability.

So it can allow her to easily infiltrate her way through certain techniques giving her access to certain info that no one else is able to get. And her peerage was specifically made for infiltration and information gathering.
Now there's a thought. Like she could see weakness in them or something like that?
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Old Yesterday, 13:30   Link #3115
Sauron12561
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if that is true, she would quickly become one of the most useful and versatile characters in the series, as that would also mean she could she the "crack" in the plans of opponents most likely
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Old Yesterday, 14:08   Link #3116
yuiichi9
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Where does it speak about that ability?
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Old Yesterday, 18:11   Link #3117
Lucidrago
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Well some spoilers did mention that Roygun did have an ability called 'Crack' which is the unique demonic power her house has. And it makes sense since Belphegor translates to 'Lord of the Gap.'

Like she could basically find, exploit, or even create openings in attacks, techniques, barriers, etc. That's just what I'm guessing.
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Old Yesterday, 22:38   Link #3118
S.Freedom
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That reminds me of a force ability http://starwars.wiki.com/wiki/Shatterpoint/legends not that I'd mind her imitating Mace Windu.

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