AnimeSuki Forums

Kaijo · 2010-12-11, 15:02

The masses generally prefer mindless simple things. Thus stuff like One Piece, which doesn't have much of a plot and really has no end (seriously, the creator has pretty much said they'll never find one piece, and will probably follow the grand line forever). Naruto isn't too bad, but it's still a bit hokey and tons of filler really dampen it down. Also, the female heroines really don't have much role in the front lines, so it's man-territory. Similiar to Bleach, while it has some strong females, they don't get much of a strong role, and the plot is basically DBZ like, between training and 1-on-1 duels.

I guess that's why I prefer Fairy Tail, as battles aren't always one-on-one, the plot is slowly developed over the long term with an end in sight, and each arc flows well. Even though I speculated on what may happen, the truth is we don't really know; but the fact that I can speculate is because I'm noticing the little clues and signs that are being woven into the series. That kind of subtle foreshadowing you won't find in the other series, which are mostly made up as the author goes along.

In short, Fairy Tail is a story, while the other three are a series of fights. The difference between watching a well-written story versus a series of boxing or wrestling matches.

Shiroth · 2010-12-11, 15:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kaijo

Thus stuff like One Piece, which doesn't have much of a plot

Sorry i had to stop reading there. One Piece has a huge plot, i mean there's a reason why it's been going for over 10 years.

thundrakkon · 2010-12-11, 15:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kaijo

Thus stuff like One Piece, which doesn't have much of a plot and really has no end (seriously, the creator has pretty much said they'll never find one piece, and will probably follow the grand line forever).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shiroth

Sorry i had to stop reading there. One Piece has a huge plot, i mean there's a reason why it's been going for over 10 years.

I have to agree with Shiroth here. One Piece has a huge plot, where the creator said we are currently past the midway point. He essentially wrote the plot outline before he published the first manga chapter.

As for Fairy Tale, I love this story format as well. Will it really have an end in sight? Basically, I see them going from this world, then possibly entering different worlds, i.e. dragon, spirits, etc. So yeah, it could go on for a very, very long time if the mangaka wishes it.

Kaijo · 2010-12-11, 15:45

Do you have a link for that? Because from what I heard long ago, he had said that he has no plans for them to find One-Piece; just going from place to place fighting along the Grand Line.

Anyway, one piece is too similar to DBZ for my tastes. DBZ had a plot, too, though not a deep one, and it mainly consisted of fights lasting several episodes, with plenty of talking, explaining each ability, etc. No one watched DBZ for the plot, heh.

Nightengale · 2010-12-11, 21:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kaijo

Do you have a link for that? Because from what I heard long ago, he had said that he has no plans for them to find One-Piece; just going from place to place fighting along the Grand Line.

Whatever you read, you read wrong. Oda said a long time ago One Piece exist, will be discovered, and is something tangible. So nothing like One Piece is the adventure reaching here.

As for the plot... A chart is worth a thousand extra words.

Spoiler for One Piece Spoilers up till the latest manga:

tera_ha · 2010-12-11, 23:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shiroth

Sorry i had to stop reading there. One Piece has a huge plot, i mean there's a reason why it's been going for over 10 years.

I second that, one piece has no plot ? that's the most retarted comment i have heard, i guess you are a one piece hater. when compared to naruto or bleach, one piece excels both in plot and charachter development.

that said, i love fairy tail because of the charachters and comedy mostly. fighting, not so much ..

Eisdrache · 2010-12-12, 10:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by tera_ha

I second that, one piece has no plot ? that's the most retarted comment i have heard, i guess you are a one piece hater.

Oh boy you must have missed the Saimoe threads (JSaimoe, ISML, KBM).

kitten320 · 2010-12-12, 10:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by thundrakkon

I have to agree with Shiroth here. One Piece has a huge plot, where the creator said we are currently past the midway point.

Are you fucking seriouse?

There are like 600 chapters and it is only a half???!!!

thundrakkon · 2010-12-12, 17:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by kitten320

There are like 600 chapters and it is only a half???!!!

To be more accurate, it was at the halfway point about 3 years ago. Here is one of the translated interview articles: Interview Link

There is a lot of points to the story that needs to be answered and resolved, and each one of those resolutions would be a story in themselves. It is a huge world, and the story does not get boring.

Ok, back to Fairy Tail, in the preview, it looks like Grey is fighting Natsu. Although the possibility does exist that Grey's heart might be affected Nirvana, it could also be Angel doing her impersonation again, although unlikely.

Bern-san · 2010-12-12, 18:24

also it still needs lots of chapters to solve everything we still don't know (not even mentioning the one piece...) so it isn't a surprise it reaches a thousand chapters

tomorrow we'll finally see lucy vs angel, can't wait the appearance of some characters

Kaijo · 2010-12-12, 18:26

That it's gone on so long is kind of a clue. The X-Files built up many mysteries, too, and went on for 10 years. In the end, nothing came of it. (And if you have to write up a chart to keep things straight, it's a hint). Like DBZ, it's main selling point is the fights and the powerups leading to the fights. You don't need to justify it via other things; after all, I initially liked the DBZ fights, too, and I can see the appeal. But yeah, this isn't the one-piece thread.

Have to wonder about Grey and Natsu, and who else may be affected by Nirvana. So far, seems like Hot Eye and Sherry are the only ones.

kitten320 · 2010-12-12, 19:37

Erza might get affected by Nirvana because of her mixed feelings for Jellal...

Krono · 2010-12-13, 02:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Freakshow

Is Fairy Tail going to become a "long" anime like Naruto, Bleach, One peace Etc. ? It would be quite easy to keep it going since it has a lot of opportunities, like missions, or "background history" of the other FT members.

Anyone who knows?

It's currently unknown. It was originally supposed to be only 48 episodes, hence the rushed pacing near the end covering around three chapters per episode foreshadowing that was at the start of the festival arc in the manga moved to the end of episode 48, announcement of a second season, etc.

It's ratings were good enough to merit an extension, though a boost in sales of older volumes of the series probably played a role as well. So how long it'll run for now is entirely up in the air. It might be ongoing for as long as the ratings hold out, it might be just another 48 episodes.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shiroth

Sorry i had to stop reading there. One Piece has a huge plot, i mean there's a reason why it's been going for over 10 years.

While One Piece has a fairly respectable plot, I'm pretty sure the reason it's been going on for over 10 years is that Oda sucks at pacing, and the series makes to much money for his editors to have any incentive to improve the pacing. Not a One Piece exclusive problem, I think it's just the culture at Shouen Jump.

What Kaijo is probably noticing, is that Fairy Tail has a sense of progress. It's story arcs are relatively short, mostly self contained, and it doesn't leave plot threads and questions dangling in the background while adding tons of new ones. OP on the other hand has spent more than 40% of the series technically enroute to one island. The interruptions have been important, but it kills the sense of progress.

Clarste · 2010-12-13, 03:12

Oda has an outline for One Piece, but that's just an outline. He probably doesn't have everything planned out in detail and its pretty easy to get caught up in the things that didn't seem important at first or to let arcs take on their own life as they go on. Honestly, that doesn't seem too different from how Fairy Tail has been doing things. It's clear that there's something going on with Zeref and the dragons and Jellal (plus people with Jellal's face), but we're not really in any hurry to get there.

Ash Falls Town · 2010-12-13, 07:50

Spoiler for Episode 58:

Shiroth · 2010-12-13, 10:59

Spoiler for Episode 58:

FlareKnight · 2010-12-13, 11:54

Spoiler for Ep58:

larethian · 2010-12-13, 12:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kaijo

The masses generally prefer mindless simple things. Thus stuff like One Piece, which doesn't have much of a plot and really has no end (seriously, the creator has pretty much said they'll never find one piece, and will probably follow the grand line forever).

huh? have you really read one piece or just read plot summaries or comments off threads?? or do you really belong to the minority OP haters who have really read OP?? (since most of the haters I know have never really read it from beginning to latest and trolling all over the place). While nothing intricate One piece has way better plot than the rest of the manga I've read. Putting world originality and creativity aside, it'll be obvious if you've read it that everything is so well planned and the hooks pretty well placed and linked, especially at the macro-level. Granted that it might seemed like an adventure-based story with no central theme, but there is! that is if you look carefully, especially how all the arcs tie some things together, in a very subtle manner. and regarding the 'no end' thing, as what Nightengale mentioned. there are more to quote, but there's no point posting all those stuff on FT's thread. however I do agree the far-end could be a problem, since we all have a lifespan. Oda did mention the more he draws OP, the more he wants to draw OP. though speculative, I suspect Jump might have a hand in getting Oda to extend the story.

that said, while I love Fairy Tail, I'm sorry to say that Mashima's nowhere near Oda in story telling. That's not to say he sucks, for he's pretty good at the right places many times, and he touched my emotions a few. But still a thousand years behind Oda, is what I would say. just go through the FT manga thread (the old posts as well) on plot hole discussions and how he is stretching 'this' and 'that' (like Lis, you know what I mean, among others), where obvious pre-planning were lacking. and that's because he doesn't really plan that far ahead. he might have a general outline on how he's gonna set the pieces till the end, but he doesn't plan far. Nope, it's not my opinion, he said so himself. Quoted from the interview reposted here(http://manga.about.com/od/mangaartis...oMashima_2.htm) (since I can't find the original at the moment)

Q: How far in advance do you create your stories (before they're published in Shonen Magazine)?

Hiro Mashima: Generally speaking, I tend to think of the next episode as I'm creating the current one. Sometimes I get writers block. Sometimes inspiration just comes when you're sitting down at the toilet. I like to think of that as just an inspiration from heaven. (laughs)

Oda on the other hand plans a lot, even though he says he just think of the rough story, since it's pretty evident from his work. Similarly, Mashima's lack of care is evident from his work as well. Also take a look at One Piece's supplementary books on Oda's sketches, conceptualizations and drafts from years ago, just overwhelming for me on how much effort and thinking went in.

@Krono & Clarste, your views are fair based on what you know. Just to point out again the section of text of what Shiroth quoted and what I've quoted, that doesn't sound like fair opinions, eh?

kache · 2010-12-13, 12:02

58

Uff, I was really waiting to see Uranometria animated, but It wasn't even nearly as epic as in the manga.
Not only that, but the subs completely ruined my fun. Urano Meteoria? Wtf?

Kaijo · 2010-12-13, 12:38

I dunno, I liked seeing Uranometria animated. At least gave me a better idea of how it works (and it looks like it bombards the target with a ton of planets, heh). Also gives a hint to what Lucy is truly capable of. She should be able to double-summon eventually, as well as use that spell for real sometime.

And yes, One piece's pacing is horrid, much like DBZ's was. But that's to be expected, since Oda takes after Toriyama. 10 years to get halfway, means at leat a 20 year series; that's really too long, especially when the padding is mainly duels. And they both strive for that "manly" aspect, where the men do 95% of the fighting.

That's another reason I like Fairy Tail, because they have some kickass women who can fulfill plot aspects *and* kick ass when they need to. Case in point: Erza!

2010-12-12, 18:24	Link #2550
Bern-san Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2009	also it still needs lots of chapters to solve everything we still don't know (not even mentioning the one piece...) so it isn't a surprise it reaches a thousand chapters tomorrow we'll finally see lucy vs angel, can't wait the appearance of some characters __________________

2010-12-12, 19:37	Link #2552
kitten320 Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2007	Erza might get affected by Nirvana because of her mixed feelings for Jellal... __________________ My anime list

2010-12-13, 07:50	Link #2555
Ash Falls Town Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Adelaide Age: 36	Spoiler for Episode 58: What's with that unchisel like chisel... Well I was wrong about it being Ara. But I would have never guessed chisel. Well I was wrong about Natsu fighting Evil!Gray, he was being soundly beaten by Gemini!Gray. Speaking of Gemini it seems that that isn't a secondary power but just another spirit like I had previously thought. And god the scene where it changed back from Gray was creepy. I almost screamed in real life... Angel really is a bicoughg meanie. And she killed Karen... (maybe she absorbed all her those traits as well.) That was a pretty nice bit of continuity. And that made Hibiki grow on me. He must have been researching that spell for Karen. The Aries/Leo fight was very sad. I understand how Gemini couldn't kill Lucy. Stellar Spirit users must be kind. __________________ MAL Profile

2010-12-13, 10:59	Link #2556
Shiroth Beautiful fighter. Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: England, UK Age: 37	Spoiler for Episode 58: Lucy's boob scene was handled so well. I was laughing for quite a while. I've always said that Lucy has some of the best dialogue/speeches in this show, an that's shown yet again here. Plus new musical piece was absolutely perfect for the scene. Next weeks episode will be what quite a few anime only watchers will want to see. __________________ MyAnimeList Twitter

2010-12-13, 11:54	Link #2557
FlareKnight User of the "Fast Draw" Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Canada	Spoiler for Ep58: Now that was a good episode. Lucy had a rough time, but managed to get the win. It was thanks to her being that kind of person that Gemini couldn't finish her off and that Hibiki managed to avoid slipping into darkness. I was surprised with Aries. From that flashback didn't seem the type that would actually stand and fight in that kind of situation. Though maybe everything that's happened including the death of Karren changed her. A tough spot for Loke to be in. Of course he didn't want to fight Aries with all he'd done for her. But he also couldn't not fight to protect Lucy since she's also important to him. I'm sure Loke was still holding back in the fight and then gets hit by that cheap shot.... Nice job with the shirt lifting part . Now there's an effective battle tactic. Definitely got fooled with the fake Gray bit. Still goes to show there are much better ways to defeat Natsu than a straight up brawl. Just a good episode for Lucy. Going so far to free Aries just shows the kind of person she is. Will agree with Shiroth that she has great dialogue. __________________ Anime-Evo

2010-12-11, 15:02	Link #2541
Kaijo Banned Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Somewhere over the rainbow, in a house dropped on an ugly, old woman.	The masses generally prefer mindless simple things. Thus stuff like One Piece, which doesn't have much of a plot and really has no end (seriously, the creator has pretty much said they'll never find one piece, and will probably follow the grand line forever). Naruto isn't too bad, but it's still a bit hokey and tons of filler really dampen it down. Also, the female heroines really don't have much role in the front lines, so it's man-territory. Similiar to Bleach, while it has some strong females, they don't get much of a strong role, and the plot is basically DBZ like, between training and 1-on-1 duels. I guess that's why I prefer Fairy Tail, as battles aren't always one-on-one, the plot is slowly developed over the long term with an end in sight, and each arc flows well. Even though I speculated on what may happen, the truth is we don't really know; but the fact that I can speculate is because I'm noticing the little clues and signs that are being woven into the series. That kind of subtle foreshadowing you won't find in the other series, which are mostly made up as the author goes along. In short, Fairy Tail is a story, while the other three are a series of fights. The difference between watching a well-written story versus a series of boxing or wrestling matches.

2010-12-11, 15:45	Link #2544
Kaijo Banned Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Somewhere over the rainbow, in a house dropped on an ugly, old woman.	Do you have a link for that? Because from what I heard long ago, he had said that he has no plans for them to find One-Piece; just going from place to place fighting along the Grand Line. Anyway, one piece is too similar to DBZ for my tastes. DBZ had a plot, too, though not a deep one, and it mainly consisted of fights lasting several episodes, with plenty of talking, explaining each ability, etc. No one watched DBZ for the plot, heh.

2010-12-12, 18:26	Link #2551
Kaijo Banned Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Somewhere over the rainbow, in a house dropped on an ugly, old woman.	That it's gone on so long is kind of a clue. The X-Files built up many mysteries, too, and went on for 10 years. In the end, nothing came of it. (And if you have to write up a chart to keep things straight, it's a hint). Like DBZ, it's main selling point is the fights and the powerups leading to the fights. You don't need to justify it via other things; after all, I initially liked the DBZ fights, too, and I can see the appeal. But yeah, this isn't the one-piece thread. Have to wonder about Grey and Natsu, and who else may be affected by Nirvana. So far, seems like Hot Eye and Sherry are the only ones.

2010-12-13, 03:12	Link #2554
Clarste Human Join Date: Aug 2004 Age: 37	Oda has an outline for One Piece, but that's just an outline. He probably doesn't have everything planned out in detail and its pretty easy to get caught up in the things that didn't seem important at first or to let arcs take on their own life as they go on. Honestly, that doesn't seem too different from how Fairy Tail has been doing things. It's clear that there's something going on with Zeref and the dragons and Jellal (plus people with Jellal's face), but we're not really in any hurry to get there.

2010-12-13, 12:38	Link #2560
Kaijo Banned Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Somewhere over the rainbow, in a house dropped on an ugly, old woman.	I dunno, I liked seeing Uranometria animated. At least gave me a better idea of how it works (and it looks like it bombards the target with a ton of planets, heh). Also gives a hint to what Lucy is truly capable of. She should be able to double-summon eventually, as well as use that spell for real sometime. And yes, One piece's pacing is horrid, much like DBZ's was. But that's to be expected, since Oda takes after Toriyama. 10 years to get halfway, means at leat a 20 year series; that's really too long, especially when the padding is mainly duels. And they both strive for that "manly" aspect, where the men do 95% of the fighting. That's another reason I like Fairy Tail, because they have some kickass women who can fulfill plot aspects and kick ass when they need to. Case in point: Erza!