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Old 2019-07-15, 23:41   Link #41
Ichinotachi
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Originally Posted by Applehell View Post
Personally I felt that Mamako is waay too much like a mom (what it is perceived to be one role) than actual character who happens to be one if you ask me. Hopefully she expand instead of just partially being a running gag.

I can totally get where Ma-kun is coming from including going a bit too far and saying something you don't mean to your parent out of frustration at that age. I can't think of many teenagers who play these kind of games with their parents, especially since the point is to escape from everything in their IRL, your nagging and overbearing parents most of all.
Finally someone with common sense that understand what's the deal with the series.

Mamako is literally the best example of a mom that's always on top of her kids, taking care of them, asking about everything without understanding that maybe giving them some space would be a good idea. Masato's reaction in this first episode is understandable, especially at his age and of course Mamako didn't deserved that but at least both of them managed to fix the problem in a pretty good way. Is quite sad to see that some people are completely unable to graps these ideas.
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Old 2019-07-16, 04:26   Link #42
rladls2121
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Very relatable.
And Mamako, she is going to start with Masato's wife towards the girls right off the bat, skipping the starting from friends and lovely couple steps.
With this, her villainous villainous plans already set in motion.
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Old 2019-07-19, 11:46   Link #43
Ichinotachi
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Ahh the good old fanservice episode, Wise's pantyshots and Mamako vs the slime were pure gold. Not gonna lie that was pretty fun, a very relaxed episode but I feel like Wise is going to be the origin of many problems here.

Now as for the adaptation, I'm suprised that JC Staff slowed down the pacing a lot, which leads to the question, why they rushed episode 1 so hard? I hope the next episode keeps this same pacing, if they do that volume 1 will be done in the first 3 or 4 episodes which is good.
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Old 2019-07-19, 12:46   Link #44
BWTraveller
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Went kind of old-school there for a bit. When he described his prediction of Wise's personality I expected a certain loli with an eyepatch to show up, not Lina.

Also, I wonder why they cut out Porter's mother situation. I've only read up to the interviews, but I recall Mamako was supposed to ask where her mother was, and she responds that her mom was too busy to participate and made her play alone, which the admins somehow allowed despite the clear conditions. Kind of makes sense: a guy whose problem is his mother's too doting and annoying working with a girl who hates her mother and a girl whose mother doesn't have time for her. Three very different mother-child relationships, and each may be able to help one another.
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Old 2019-07-19, 12:49   Link #45
Ichinotachi
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This one was a nice touch.

Spoiler for ss:
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Old 2019-07-19, 13:00   Link #46
Kazu-kun
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Originally Posted by BWTraveller View Post
Also, I wonder why they cut out Porter's mother situation.
They probably cut it because Parta's family situation doesn't get focus until later on in the novels. It might no be covered in the show.
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Old 2019-07-19, 14:57   Link #47
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This episode was successful in some ways. It did leave me thinking "I should just be rewatching Slayers instead of this."

It's an odd setup to be sure. The devs seem very incompetent in a lot of ways. They let someone enter the game that can't possibly ever clear it, keeping people trapped that can't get along with their parents, and at least in this case make the mother so overpowered that conflict is bound to arise between parent and child.

Although I guess there isn't much worry of that right now. Already had a confrontation between parent and child in the first episode. Probably take a bit before the MC is so tired of his mother being able to easily deal with everything that he doesn't even bother pulling out his weapon anymore.
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Old 2019-07-19, 15:40   Link #48
Kazu-kun
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It's an odd setup to be sure. The devs seem very incompetent in a lot of ways. They let someone enter the game that can't possibly ever clear it, keeping people trapped that can't get along with their parents, and at least in this case make the mother so overpowered that conflict is bound to arise between parent and child.
It makes sense in some ways. They probably wanted parents and their children to get closer while keeping the power dynamic intact (parents rule), which is why they made the parents stronger than the kids. Things went south for Wise because her mother was particularly fucked up from the start. I doubt the government knew about that.

For Mamako and Masato, things are working just fine, I think. Sure his pride has taken a beating, but he's getting over it just fine.
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Last edited by Kazu-kun; 2019-07-19 at 16:51.
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Old 2019-07-19, 16:18   Link #49
arkhangelsk
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Originally Posted by Kazu-kun View Post
It makes sense in some ways. They probably wanted parents and their children to get closer while keeping the power dynamic intact (parents rule), which is why they made the parents stronger than the kids.
What is this 1950s theory about what should be a parent-child relationship. Does explain the allocations, though...

This seems to almost encourage child abuse and unquestioned deference to authority. The mentality of the maker is apparent...

And Mamako as is annoying as ever this episode...
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Old 2019-07-19, 16:20   Link #50
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This was funny, but I despise that white light, this ruined most of the chapter for me. I like the fact that test player came with their mothers.
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Old 2019-07-19, 16:31   Link #51
Ichinotachi
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Originally Posted by arkhangelsk View Post
What is this 1950s theory about what should be a parent-child relationship. Does explain the allocations, though...

This seems to almost encourage child abuse and unquestioned deference to authority. The mentality of the maker is apparent...

And Mamako as is annoying as ever this episode...
How disconnected from real life are you? you're entirely missing the point of what he said and the idea behind this story.

The fact that Masato is trying to understand her mother and how Mamako is trying to understand her son shows that they're on equal terms, improving their relationship one step at a time without breaking the basis of a parent/child connection, which is what Kazu-kun mentioned on his post. This is something that happens on every family, is not so hard to understand.
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Old 2019-07-19, 16:44   Link #52
arkhangelsk
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Let me say I'm more of a 21st century type that thinks a parental-child relationship, especially at the same when they are playing MMORPGs, should not be based around the parent holding all the physical power. Heck, even real parents are not >100 times more capable than their kids (ref stats from Ep1).

If anything, given the recent spate of child abuse cases, perhaps a better program would be to force the parents to be weaker than their kids, so they will learn to find another way to maintain their leadership.

The author can of course rule that somehow this worked out. How reasonable this ruling is is another matter.
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Old 2019-07-19, 16:44   Link #53
Kazu-kun
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And Mamako as is annoying as ever this episode...
She's okay. She's just trying to have a proper relationship with his son. Masato's a bit of a tsundere but deep down he loves his mother. He's just got to be more honest. Sure she's a little over enthusiastic about it. She's not perfect. But I'm pretty sure that's gonna change over time too.
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Old 2019-07-19, 16:45   Link #54
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Originally Posted by arkhangelsk View Post
What is this 1950s theory about what should be a parent-child relationship. Does explain the allocations, though...

This seems to almost encourage child abuse and unquestioned deference to authority. The mentality of the maker is apparent...

And Mamako as is annoying as ever this episode...
It's kind of messed up if you think a kid deferring to his parent should somehow equate to child abuse. Of course children should defer to those older than them, particularly their parents. Naturally, this isn't universal. If a parent commits severe or frequent violence, or tries to do things that make them really uncomfortable or make them do things they believe are morally wrong, then yes they should speak up and resist. But that hardly means that kids shouldn't have to listen to and in most cases defer to their parents (while they're still children), or that anything occurring or being encouraged in this show so far is "child abuse". There's no evidence that the game or maker wants kids to blindly follow or that abusive relationships are OK. It's a game for TWO people, teaching BOTH to maintain a more appropriate and deeper bond. Kids learn to respect, understand, love and yes obey better while parents learn to pay more attention, to care more and listen more and remain close without being smothering. It hasn't happened yet but I'm willing to bet that eventually Mama's excessive doting behavior is going to be recognized as one issue that needs to be resolved.
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Old 2019-07-19, 16:59   Link #55
Ichinotachi
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Originally Posted by arkhangelsk View Post
Let me say I'm more of a 21st century type that thinks a parental-child relationship, especially at the same when they are playing MMORPGs, should not be based around the parent holding all the physical power. Heck, even real parents are not >100 times more capable than their kids (ref stats from Ep1).

If anything, given the recent spate of child abuse cases, perhaps a better program would be to force the parents to be weaker than their kids, so they will learn to find another way to maintain their leadership.

The author can of course rule that somehow this worked out. How reasonable this ruling is is another matter.
A 21st century type of parent would never think that a game that's supposed to help to improve the relationship between a mother and her only son is the same as child abuse just because she's OP. Is pretty fucked up that you can see something like that here, even worse, bringing a terrible incident that has nothing to do with this adaptation and mix that up with that messed up point of view you have there.
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Old 2019-07-19, 16:59   Link #56
arkhangelsk
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Originally Posted by Kazu-kun View Post
She's okay. She's just trying to have a proper relationship with his son. Masato's a bit of a tsundere but deep down he loves his mother. He's just got to be more honest about it. Sure she's a little over enthusiastic about it. She's not perfect. But I'm pretty sure that's gonna change over time too.
She was kind of OK during the interview. She was kind of OK right up until the part where the game permitted her to just find the kid and send a tornado up their butts. It is played for laughs, but I'm not laughing, and you shouldn't be unless you like the idea of mom being able to just intrude into your privacy and conversations in that manner.

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It's kind of messed up if you think a kid deferring to his parent should somehow equate to child abuse.
I didn't say that. I did say that the power allocation structurally encourages abuse, and if things actually go well it will be in spite of rather than facilitated by the design.

BTW, I'm not sure how you define "defer", but to me "defer" implies following a decision despite it being against your own judgment due to an assumption (not knowledge!!!) the other guy knows better. If it was genuinely good to you, you could simply "agree".

Especially since we are talking about adolescent-parent relations here, call me an idealist but I don't think children should "defer" to their parents. Parents should be able to pitch their reasoning so that the adolescent can agree with the decision on the merits.
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Old 2019-07-19, 17:05   Link #57
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Deferring to a parent in a parent-child relationship makes sense IRL outside the most extreme cases such as abuse. But in a game where players are supposed to be equal in choice it's absurd notion that natural just make of the younger players feel oppressed. Even in a party where their is a clear leader at least that upto players follow that person or simply leave the group because the power dynamics lack the emotional familial connection that parent to child does.

The if the goal of the game is to bring a child closer to their parents in than at least in this context the later should not be dictating all of their actions together especially playing games in the first place to escape constraints and meet other in fairest play ground possible. So the issue here isn't just on Masato's side but Mamako's who has to learn there are times such as these where she needs to let him breathe.

Last edited by Applehell; 2019-07-19 at 17:29.
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Old 2019-07-19, 17:10   Link #58
Kazu-kun
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I'm not laughing, and you shouldn't be unless you like the idea of mom being able to just intrude into your privacy and conversations in that manner.
Interrupting their conversation was merely incidental. She didn't mean to do that. She just wanted to find his location.

Quote:
I didn't say that. I did say that the power allocation structurally encourages abuse, and if things actually go well it will be in spite of rather than facilitated by the design.
No, it just mirrors real life. Without that, most kids would just leave their parents behind and do whatever they want inside the game. Making the parents stronger allow the parents to keep being the adults to whom the kids must defer to. That's all there is to it. Wise's mother was fucked up in the real world and just kept being fucked up inside the game. The game didn't change anything.
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Last edited by Kazu-kun; 2019-07-19 at 17:24.
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Old 2019-07-19, 17:18   Link #59
BWTraveller
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Originally Posted by arkhangelsk View Post
I didn't say that. I did say that the power allocation structurally encourages abuse, and if things actually go well it will be in spite of rather than facilitated by the design.

BTW, I'm not sure how you define "defer", but to me "defer" implies following a decision despite it being against your own judgment due to an assumption (not knowledge!!!) the other guy knows better. If it was genuinely good to you, you could simply "agree".

Especially since we are talking about adolescent-parent relations here, call me an idealist but I don't think children should "defer" to their parents. Parents should be able to pitch their reasoning so that the adolescent can agree with the decision on the merits.
Defer in my book means accepting someone else's judgment, following a decision regardless of one's own wishes. And yes, I'd say kids SHOULD in most cases defer to their parents and adults in their life. Kids honestly don't know half as much as they think they do and in many cases the things they'd disobey their parents about are things their parents know to be a really bad idea. Your ideal would only work if kids were completely reasonable and rational, mature, and experienced/knowledgeable. Sadly kids don't have that much experience or knowledge, they're frankly not anywhere near mature (frankly even college students are terribly immature in a lot of cases), and they operate far more on emotion, desire and impulse than on rationality and reason. The child should obviously be free to and even encouraged to voice his/her misgivings, but they should still defer to their parents when they can't agree in most cases.

And I don't see how giving parents some additional power is going to encourage them to abuse their kids. We haven't seen that much of an imbalance so far. The mother's massive power was caused by her getting lucky on the draw and stupidly not understanding that she was only supposed to draw one sword. Similarly, Masato is only weak relative to his mother because he unknowingly drew the weakest of the three blades. That's not a built-in allocation, it's a fluke.

Heck, we don't even know if the few powers the mother has received won't be available for the kids as well. They were granted as a result of the parent expressing concern and strong feelings about her child. For all we know, if Masato were to express a similar concern toward his mother he might also gain some sort of bonus skill.
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Old 2019-07-19, 17:34   Link #60
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Assertion that parent authority is or should be based on difference in power is totally wrong. That's why giving parent preferential treatment in game world especially doesn't do any good and is likely only escalate any issue they might have. I wouldn't go that far to say it would support abusive relationship, but offspring would certainly have good reasons to feel mistreated and project that onto relationship with their parent.

If it's game there is no point sticking with traditional hierarchy in first place. It's wasted opportunity to flip things around and have children show their better side instead
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