Mechs, Weapons, and Technology of Code Geass

[Dann of Thursday]

Originally Posted by Strettger

Just want to point out how this is standing out and saying RahXephon ending to me.

If you havent seen it, its a bit like Eva. It ends with the protagonist remaking the universe, with himself married to one of the female leads and..... the other born sometime later as his own child.

If Kallen has baby C.C - you know what I will do.

Chinese.
Chainsaw.
Scriptwriters own room.
You know the rest......

I envisioned something like that as well, but I doubt they would make it so similar. If they pulled something like that though.......I would be very angry. It could certainly fit with some aspects of the show such as what C.C.'s wish is. Still, it would just be such a letdown if they repeated something like that. Aspects of it would feel like such a cop out.

[Blue_Mercy]

Rollo used a few weapons we haven't seen yet. Anyone have any information on those? One looked like a type of shockwave weapon, while the other was two MVS forming into a lance or was that something new?

[KrimzonStriker]

Double-sided swords aren't exactly a new concept, though this is the first time we are seeing them in Code Geass. And yes he does have a pulse blaster of some sort built into his elbow.

[ashlay]

Originally Posted by KrimzonStriker

Double-sided swords aren't exactly a new concept, though this is the first time we are seeing them in Code Geass. And yes he does have a pulse blaster of some sort built into his elbow.

that's pile driver Krimzon.

and it has one in both elbows, right? you can see them in the back shot of the art.

[squaresphere]

Actually I think it's a refined version of the radiation burst that the Gurren mk2 uses (when it fires it uses the same sound bite) . Instead of a huge burst that explodes the whole machine it's a focused shot meant to kill the pilot and also overcomes one of the Lancelot's weakness of not having built in weapons.

[dom33]

@squareshpehre I doubt that since as far we know rakshata is the only one with the specs for the radiation burst thing.

[Renegade334]

Originally Posted by squaresphere

Actually I think it's a refined version of the radiation burst that the Gurren mk2 uses (when it fires it uses the same sound bite) . Instead of a huge burst that explodes the whole machine it's a focused shot meant to kill the pilot and also overcomes one of the Lancelot's weakness of not having built in weapons.

I'd like to humbly amend that - the energy flare produced by the elbow pile driver seems to have a different color than that of the Guren's Radiant Surge system, more like blue-green hues than the reddish glow associated with oscillation/microwave pulse. Moreover, the energy buildup and release seem to be much faster than the RS' slower onslaught of radiation (granted, it could merely be attributed to the amount of power distributed and the fact that the discharge could last longer, thanks to the energy cartridge). Rather, it feels like it's a variation of the MSV maser shield (IIRC they called it 'Blaze Luminous' in the Lancelot Air Cavalry model kit), directed at assault rather than defence.

Whether it can act as a makeshift shield, however, is left to speculation. Were it to be a genuine microwave emitter, the Gekka's sword (I'm referring to the OP sequence involving Toudou's mech and the mass production Vincent) might not hold its ground indefinitely, as the Guren did, after all, disable the Lancelot's MVS in Narita...and there wouldn't be a reason why a non-MVS model could withstand such power without breaking apart due to the energy buildup.

One looked like a type of shockwave weapon, while the other was two MVS forming into a lance or was that something new?

The dual sword is not new - but in the CG universe it might very well be a new trendy concept for Britannian engineers - as the Tristan has some sort of double-pronged dual scythe itself. However, it seems I can't find any lineart that foretold this brand new attack feature, so, yes, you might say it's a surprise for us the audience.

[squaresphere]

Originally Posted by dom33

@squareshpehre I doubt that since as far we know rakshata is the only one with the specs for the radiation burst thing.

Well Lloyd would probably be aware of the theory behind it, not to mention the Mk2 lost it's arm during the last stages of rebellion. The Empire would have easily recovered it. (though i'll admit right now i've completely forgotten how she lost the arm to begin with )

I wouldn't be surprised if Nina had a hand in developing it as she seems to have taken to studying radiation (her conversation with Lloyd)

[JMvS]

Originally Posted by squaresphere

I wouldn't be surprised if Nina had a hand in developing it as she seems to have taken to studying radiation (her conversation with Lloyd)

I would be surprised, as Nina was annouced to be working for Schneizel on nuclear fission, while Lloyd & Cecil would be in the Camelot unit, under Suzaku's command: a KoR, "above" a royal like Schneizel in the chain of command.

Plus the Radiation Wave seems more like a microwave or IR weapon, which is something different from nuclear fission (radiation doesn't mean automatically nuclear technology).

[gameboy5432]

After reading the posts and the scientific arguments give with in this forum i can clearly say that in real life knightmare the size depicted in Code geass are ineffective against real life tanks

However in my opinion the concept of body armor is much more suited

What im trying to say is take every knightmare in code geass and scale in down to two meters turning it from mecha to body armor,then and only then in my opinion would it be as efective(controls fire power ,tactical capability's) as depicted in Code Geass

Sow take the Burai take the gekka the guren scale it to two meters and you have the most powerfull weapon alive(the human body) taken to the next level.

Let's not forget an ordinary infantryman can take down tanks and helicopters by himself ,by giveing him body armor with the potential of a code geass knightmare and you have something that dominates the batlefield

[Dann of Thursday]

In anime, mechs and giant robots are the most powerful weapons you can have. It doesn't make much sense scientifically in many cases, but that is how things are.

Why does everyone like mechs and giant robots so much anyway?

[DeotoxSlayer]

Originally Posted by squaresphere

Well Lloyd would probably be aware of the theory behind it, not to mention the Mk2 lost it's arm during the last stages of rebellion. The Empire would have easily recovered it. (though i'll admit right now i've completely forgotten how she lost the arm to begin with )

I wouldn't be surprised if Nina had a hand in developing it as she seems to have taken to studying radiation (her conversation with Lloyd)

The radiation arm wasn't blown off the Guren it was destroyed by the Varis(it disintergrated) Aslo I don't beleve Lloyud woul know the theory, he seems to bes tudying stuff that are more like the Hadron Cannon's the Flight system, and the Varis, which are quite different from the Radiation arm.

Originally Posted by Dann of Thursday

In anime, mechs and giant robots are the most powerful weapons you can have. It doesn't make much sense scientifically in many cases, but that is how things are.

Why does everyone like mechs and giant robots so much anyway?

because they look cool

[Onizuka-GTO]

Originally Posted by gameboy5432

After reading the posts and the scientific arguments give with in this forum i can clearly say that in real life knightmare the size depicted in Code geass are ineffective against real life tanks

However in my opinion the concept of body armor is much more suited

What im trying to say is take every knightmare in code geass and scale in down to two meters turning it from mecha to body armor,then and only then in my opinion would it be as efective(controls fire power ,tactical capability's) as depicted in Code Geass

Sow take the Burai take the gekka the guren scale it to two meters and you have the most powerfull weapon alive(the human body) taken to the next level.

Let's not forget an ordinary infantryman can take down tanks and helicopters by himself ,by giveing him body armor with the potential of a code geass knightmare and you have something that dominates the batlefield

its the speed, if tanks can go at the impossible speed these knightmares can go, then they would never of bothered with them.

Agility is the major advantage in the CG universe, granted the armour on them aren't that good, but at the slow tracking speed the tanks in CG are, all they got is just heavy armour when faced with them.


as for the question of why we like big robots, its because they resemble a human, something that powerful yet looks human, strokes our ego and make us envy with greed that something like that can be yours.

[4Tran]

Originally Posted by gameboy5432

What im trying to say is take every knightmare in code geass and scale in down to two meters turning it from mecha to body armor,then and only then in my opinion would it be as efective(controls fire power ,tactical capability's) as depicted in Code Geass

Sow take the Burai take the gekka the guren scale it to two meters and you have the most powerfull weapon alive(the human body) taken to the next level.

Let's not forget an ordinary infantryman can take down tanks and helicopters by himself ,by giveing him body armor with the potential of a code geass knightmare and you have something that dominates the batlefield

Knightmare armor isn't all that impressive to begin with, and if you scale it down and put in on your infantry, you're just giving them a lot of extra mass in exchange for a modicum of protection. Unless you can increase their mobility and give them heavier weapons as well, they'll still be bait to the same weapons that kill infantry on modern battlefields.

By the way, it isn't ordinary infantry who can take down tanks and helicopters - it's either specialized heavy weapons teams or hunter-killer teams that do so. By itself, the human body isn't even close to being optimized for combat.

Originally Posted by Dann of Thursday

Why does everyone like mechs and giant robots so much anyway?

Because they look cool and they can make cool poses.

Originally Posted by Onizuka-GTO

its the speed, if tanks can go at the impossible speed these knightmares can go, then they would never of bothered with them.

Agility is the major advantage in the CG universe, granted the armour on them aren't that good, but at the slow tracking speed the tanks in CG are, all they got is just heavy armour when faced with them.

Actually, knightmares defeat tanks because the creators gave them +10 against tanks. They all but said so when they talked about how Japan's tanks were dominated in the Britannian invasion. In a more realistic environment, no matter how fast knightmares were, they wouldn't be able to outrun APFSDS rounds, and their relatively light weapons would have a very hard time killing tanks.

And it's not as if knightmares are all that much smaller than tanks to begin with. Here's a comparison between a Sutherland and a T-72 at 40px to 1m scale:

[SoldierOfDarkness]

During the invasion it seemed that the tanks' turrets were too slow to track the Glascow's movements and hence were outflanked.

As for their heavy weapons it seems their bazookas pack enough punch for anti-armor roles.

Other than that tanks are still in use by the Britannian Empire.

[KrimzonStriker]

Tanks function more as a mobile artillery platform though, or as infantry clean-up on rare occasions like shooting down civilians to help out the Knightmares, at least from what we've seen of them in combat anyway. Even now they're still relatively useless against Knightmares thanks to there lack of maneuverability and fexibility >_>

[4Tran]

Originally Posted by SoldierOfDarkness

During the invasion it seemed that the tanks' turrets were too slow to track the Glascow's movements and hence were outflanked.

As for their heavy weapons it seems their bazookas pack enough punch for anti-armor roles.

That's the +10 vs. tanks attribute in action . Modern tanks typically have a turret traverse rate of 20°-35° per second; and that's more than sufficient to take out the targets at 1+km the way they're designed to. Likewise, bazookas have very poor accuracy at range, which would put the knightmares at an even greater disadvantage. It's only when creators conveniently put the knightmares at ridiculously close ranges do they stand a shred of a chance.

In any case, the lightness of the knightmares means that they can mount only very thin armor, and their main enemy shouldn't even be the main battle tank - it'd be the mobile anti-aircraft vehicle and other light armor with guns of 25mm - 76mm calibre. These guys are generally capable of firing at hundreds of rounds per minute, and they'd chew up knightmares the same way machine guns chew up infantry.

Originally Posted by KrimzonStriker

Tanks function more as a mobile artillery platform though, or as infantry clean-up on rare occasions like shooting down civilians to help out the Knightmares, at least from what we've seen of them in combat anyway. Even now they're still relatively useless against Knightmares thanks to there lack of maneuverability and fexibility >_>

Real tanks don't function as artillery platforms, nor do they suffer from a lack of maneuverability and flexibility. These are simply more of the myths perpetuated by anime.

[Dann of Thursday]

So in short, giant robots and mechs would suck in real life.

[Meteor No.23]

Advantage of Knightmare Frame:

1.Speed - While it can't outrun shells, thay can outrun tanks and turret easily.
2.Ease and speed of deployment - They can deploy from dropship en masse withousy hassle of combat jet and have the power that rival tank.
3.Weapins - Slash harken seem to able pierce just about anything.
4.Number - I think it said in wilipedia that the reason Britania win because the large number of Glasgow that overwhelming Japanese Defense Force.

[4Tran]

Originally Posted by Dann of Thursday

So in short, giant robots and mechs would suck in real life.

Pretty much. However, the 4m tall knightmares are still way better than the 18m Gundams in just about every way imaginable. In fact, I think that it's barely possible to conceive of an actual combat role for such mecha. In order to do so, it would have to meet the following criteria:

1. Occupy a combat niche that isn't fulfilled by anything more efficient.
2. Be inexpensive enough that it can be fielded in vast numbers without sacrificing the other arms.
3. Work in concert in combined arms units to cover for its weaknesses.
4. Use cover to make up for weakness in armor.

They will never zip about dominating the battlefield the way anime tend to depict them, but smaller-sized mecha aren't completely unworkable (only mostly unworkable ). Of all the fictional depictions of such war machines, the one that feels the most true are Dreampod 9's Heavy Gears, and knightmares bear a certain resemblance to them (yes, I know that both are actually based on VOTOMs, but the depiction of VOTOMs isn't as well thought out).