AnimeSuki Forums

Mentar · 2012-09-10, 09:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by RRW

at this point it will simply become chain of revenge

...achieving exactly NOTHING productive other than killing people who don't really deserve to be killed. Right on.

That's exactly why I'm sure that this story is going to be about OVERCOMING this cycle of revenge. Anything else would devolve the storyline only into a particularly bloody and pointless mess. The Night Raid with their Taliban methods, and the Raiders protecting the scum of humanity.

So, for the time being, let's prepare a goodbye for Bors and Chelsea or Leone, have Seryuu descend even more into madness unnecessarily, and hopefully finally make Esdese realize that Tatsumi is with NR. One more bloody unproductive standoff. And then see how things develop from there.

Velsy · 2012-09-10, 10:05

Night Raid ahve done Wave a favour by knocking him out of the battle. He gets the safe card this round ^_^. I am interested to find out *who* is his savour and inspired him to enlist as a soldier. He even knows theres something wrong with the empire, but can only keep performing his role a soldier. If hes savour is on the Revolution army side. I hoping he will deflect. I feel he has a rightous heart like Tasumi, so for him to die a needless death under the empire is a waste.

Chelsea shouldnt die unless she screws up badly. Seryuu shouldnt die, because Tasumi will be the one to kill her (I hoping).

Soji · 2012-09-10, 10:34

The thing that I'm suprise is that you guys still talk like revenge would be pointless in this manga while we see that from ch 1 revenge was always one of the factor. Revenge + beliefs this 2 factor always play a big role in this story/manga .

Honestly we pretty much know that everyone will die be the end of this story.I'm suprise that people still think that Wawe and Esdes will change side when we already see that this manga not play this kind of card/route.
Hell a small part of me can even see the author kill Akame(like some one point out some time ago) of now to make Tatsumi take after her as stronger killer.
This is not like the other manga, so I doubt we will see someone alive after all this or a happy ending(after think all the thing that we know until now).

willx · 2012-09-10, 10:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Soji

The thing that I'm suprise is that you guys still talk like revenge would be pointless in this manga while we see that from ch 1 revenge was always one of the factor. Revenge + beliefs this 2 factor always play a big role in this story/manga

Yep.. The moment Bors was showcased with his family, it was obvious that he was going to die.

Bors is going to die in a sacrificial explosion that will allow Kurome to escape. Wave will go all revenge mode and take inspiration from Bors' death like Tatsumi did with Braht and eventually result in Chelsea's death.

Iron Maw · 2012-09-10, 11:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Soji

Honestly we pretty much know that everyone will die be the end of this story.I'm suprise that people still think that Wawe and Esdes will change side when we already see that this manga not play this kind of card/route.
Hell a small part of me can even see the author kill Akame(like some one point out some time ago) of now to make Tatsumi take after her as stronger killer.
This is not like the other manga, so I doubt we will see someone alive after all this or a happy ending(after think all the thing that we know until now).

I really don't think this scenario will happen especially since it wouldn't serve any purpose to story, character or themes the plot has. Some characters will die sure, but as a natural byproduct of war. The current confrontation was always foreshadowed to happen one day, afterall Jaeger's main purpose is to combat Nightraid. Doesn't necessarily mean everyone in both camps is going to die or each character will remain as enemies forever. A happy ending is very possible, it will probably come with some sacrifices though.

Soji · 2012-09-10, 12:23

^I try to look the big picture and I'm pretty sure(though i not mind to be wrong) that be the end of this story everyone will be death.

The only ending that i can see for this story is a bittersweet ending.

lightbringer · 2012-09-10, 12:58

Maybe not everyone, but it's fairly safe to say that a large number of main characters are very likely going to die. At least, I do not see a happy ending for this one.

NeutralZero · 2012-09-10, 13:46

Even if it has a tragedy tag, don't lose hope that this series would not have a somewhat happy end... unless the ending says so...
But what would happen to Bors' family after he die?
Hope his death would cause a positive change for Kurome and a somewhat negative for Wave...

Iron Maw · 2012-09-10, 14:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Soji

^I try to look the big picture and I'm pretty sure(though i not mind to be wrong) that be the end of this story everyone will be death.

The only ending that i can see for this story is a bittersweet ending.

Indeed that type of ending is possible, but hardly the only alternaitve.

It's because I'm looking at the bigger picture that I don't think everyone will die. This isn't a survival manga and it's not as if everyone has been dropping left and right. It certainly has it's harsh moments, but it's not that bleak. Tomino isn't writing this story guys.

NeutralZero · 2012-09-10, 14:26

That may have been the case but in some essence, this series has the same air/atmosphere as that of Tomino albeit fantasy...
It's true not everyone will die but its also true that a high numbers of them from both side will meet their end considering the nature of one will survive in a Teigu vs Teigu fight...

Iron Maw · 2012-09-10, 14:39

I'm not denying in that, I just think it's a little too early and hasty for such a declartion. So many things can happen from now till the end of the series, which is to murky make out at the moment.

zeniselv · 2012-09-10, 15:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Soji

The thing that I'm suprise is that you guys still talk like revenge would be pointless in this manga while we see that from ch 1 revenge was always one of the factor. Revenge + beliefs this 2 factor always play a big role in this story/manga .

Honestly we pretty much know that everyone will die be the end of this story.I'm suprise that people still think that Wawe and Esdes will change side when we already see that this manga not play this kind of card/route.
Hell a small part of me can even see the author kill Akame(like some one point out some time ago) of now to make Tatsumi take after her as stronger killer.
This is not like the other manga, so I doubt we will see someone alive after all this or a happy ending(after think all the thing that we know until now).

its not that i consoder revenge pointless, but people like tatsumi, leone and schere, who got initiated in this through revenge, already achieved that revenge, their motivation now is their will to change the empire, we can see how the others have different reasons, and how some of the jeagers have the soldier mentality, where they figth for their country/empire, its clear how you can see how some of them like bors and wave are aware of their actions, while seryuu has been indoctrinated with extremist beliefs of justice, and yeah clearly the characters have wanted to take revenge in some occasions but they have turned that into motivation in achieving their higher goal.

Soji · 2012-09-10, 15:53

Iron Maw@ I hope you and other are right about this ...but I can't shake this feeling that will end like that.

zeniselv@ Fair enough i agree with this.

Wait now that i recall something if Kurome sword make her puppet the one she kill how the hell she kill that big thing .

supermegasonic · 2012-09-10, 16:00

so at the very least, everyone agrees that no matter the outcome, good or bad ending, a bunch of important people will die, and it can go as far as edise or akane being killed

willx · 2012-09-10, 16:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by supermegasonic

so at the very least, everyone agrees that no matter the outcome, good or bad ending, a bunch of important people will die, and it can go as far as edise or akane being killed

I mostly agree, except that I think Akame has "plot-armor" cause her name is in the title.

zeniselv · 2012-09-10, 16:19

i can see a happy ending, what i dont see is a happy ending for all the characters.

Mentar · 2012-09-10, 19:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by supermegasonic

so at the very least, everyone agrees that no matter the outcome, good or bad ending, a bunch of important people will die, and it can go as far as edise or akane being killed

For me: Akame, Tatsumi and Esdese no. Kurome very unlikely (but possible).

Mentar · 2012-09-11, 09:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Soji

The thing that I'm suprise is that you guys still talk like revenge would be pointless in this manga while we see that from ch 1 revenge was always one of the factor. Revenge + beliefs this 2 factor always play a big role in this story/manga .

Sure it is a big factor, but is it a POSITIVE or NEGATIVE factor? What does the author want to tell us about it? I'll try to explain once more, then we'll have to agree to disagree.

When the story began, everyone (me included) was cheering when Night Raid executed the cruel inhuman bastards. Revenge at its best, they deserved what happened to them. Right? NR also lost people, so revenge came at a price, but it was displayed as something positive.

Then, over the course of the story, more elements are introduced. Tatsumi's idealized dream of a just, new empire. Can they be realized by revenge alone? Doubts arose for the first time.

Next, the Jaegers are introduced. And lo and behold: They are NOT horrible inhuman bastards like those they protect, some are clearly decent persons (Bors and especially Wave), yet they oppose NR. Both sides suffer losses in their fight for revenge. But now, it's not displayed as something noble and positive, but rather something increasingly tragic. People are dying who don't deserve to die, and their deaths hurt people who don't deserve to be hurt.

Look at Bors. He's a symbol for the "neutral soldier". He's not a particularly nice fellow, and he has killed countless people in the course of his duty. But he's shown to be a decent, caring guy, and I will mourn his death when it happens.

Look at Seryuu. She's the symbol of the "victim", bereaved by the conflict. If she had grown up in a different environment, I'm sure that she'd turned into a nice and sweet young girl. Hatred due to the losses of her loved ones WARPED her into the emotional wreck she now is. She's a clear victim of the cycle of revenge ongoing.

See the development? I'm convinced that Takahiro is trying to point out that revenge in itselves SOLVES NOTHING. It only causes death and loss on both sides unless it is eventually overcome somehow. The cycle of revenge needs to END for the "Happy End" to occur. And I expect Tatsumi and Esdese to eventually bring this change to fruitition.

Quote:

Honestly we pretty much know that everyone will die be the end of this story.

I'm most definitely not part of this "we". Yes, there will be more deaths in the future, but I fully expect Tatsumi, Akame to survive until the very end, and if Esdese should truly die, it will be to facilitate the happy ending - she won't die an antagonist.

Quote:

I'm suprise that people still think that Wawe and Esdes will change side when we already see that this manga not play this kind of card/route.

We have seen nothing of this sort yet. Just wait and see. I'm sure that Esdese will be very conflicted and torn after the next meeting.

Quote:

Hell a small part of me can even see the author kill Akame(like some one point out some time ago) of now to make Tatsumi take after her as stronger killer.

I don't see Takahiro as a guy who writes tragedies. Yes, it's possible, but very unlikely, based on all of his former works. What you describe would be a story devoid of happy endings, a train wreck that becomes worse all the time. However, the storytelling is going in a different direction.

Excorsism · 2012-09-11, 13:34

Aren't we forgetting about the Prime Minister's son (the Scar look-alike)? I get the feeling he might end up showing up at some point during the battle, if just to kill some of the members or something. Then again, there's also Ran's hidden agenda too. For these two things alone, I'm finding it difficult a lot of people are going to die in this battle. I'm hoping Kurome and Wave live to the end though (being delusional).

Mentar · 2012-09-11, 13:47

The way I see it, the PM's son will be the wedge that will drive Esdese and the Empire apart. He's clearly trying to usurp his father's position, and he's positioned as anti-Jaeger.

2012-09-10, 16:00	Link #1594
supermegasonic Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2012	so at the very least, everyone agrees that no matter the outcome, good or bad ending, a bunch of important people will die, and it can go as far as edise or akane being killed __________________ My-Anime-List

2012-09-10, 16:19	Link #1596
zeniselv Staring into your soul. Join Date: Oct 2010	i can see a happy ending, what i dont see is a happy ending for all the characters. __________________

2012-09-11, 13:34	Link #1599
Excorsism Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2005	Aren't we forgetting about the Prime Minister's son (the Scar look-alike)? I get the feeling he might end up showing up at some point during the battle, if just to kill some of the members or something. Then again, there's also Ran's hidden agenda too. For these two things alone, I'm finding it difficult a lot of people are going to die in this battle. I'm hoping Kurome and Wave live to the end though (being delusional). __________________

2012-09-10, 10:05	Link #1582
Velsy Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2008	Night Raid ahve done Wave a favour by knocking him out of the battle. He gets the safe card this round ^_^. I am interested to find out who is his savour and inspired him to enlist as a soldier. He even knows theres something wrong with the empire, but can only keep performing his role a soldier. If hes savour is on the Revolution army side. I hoping he will deflect. I feel he has a rightous heart like Tasumi, so for him to die a needless death under the empire is a waste. Chelsea shouldnt die unless she screws up badly. Seryuu shouldnt die, because Tasumi will be the one to kill her (I hoping).

2012-09-10, 10:34	Link #1583
Soji Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Europe	The thing that I'm suprise is that you guys still talk like revenge would be pointless in this manga while we see that from ch 1 revenge was always one of the factor. Revenge + beliefs this 2 factor always play a big role in this story/manga . Honestly we pretty much know that everyone will die be the end of this story.I'm suprise that people still think that Wawe and Esdes will change side when we already see that this manga not play this kind of card/route. Hell a small part of me can even see the author kill Akame(like some one point out some time ago) of now to make Tatsumi take after her as stronger killer. This is not like the other manga, so I doubt we will see someone alive after all this or a happy ending(after think all the thing that we know until now).

2012-09-10, 12:23	Link #1586
Soji Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Europe	^I try to look the big picture and I'm pretty sure(though i not mind to be wrong) that be the end of this story everyone will be death. The only ending that i can see for this story is a bittersweet ending.

2012-09-10, 12:58	Link #1587
lightbringer M9000 Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: SBC Gurokken	Maybe not everyone, but it's fairly safe to say that a large number of main characters are very likely going to die. At least, I do not see a happy ending for this one.

2012-09-10, 13:46	Link #1588
NeutralZero Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Earth	Even if it has a tragedy tag, don't lose hope that this series would not have a somewhat happy end... unless the ending says so... But what would happen to Bors' family after he die? Hope his death would cause a positive change for Kurome and a somewhat negative for Wave...

2012-09-10, 14:26	Link #1590
NeutralZero Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Earth	That may have been the case but in some essence, this series has the same air/atmosphere as that of Tomino albeit fantasy... It's true not everyone will die but its also true that a high numbers of them from both side will meet their end considering the nature of one will survive in a Teigu vs Teigu fight...

2012-09-10, 14:39	Link #1591
Iron Maw Banned Join Date: Feb 2006	I'm not denying in that, I just think it's a little too early and hasty for such a declartion. So many things can happen from now till the end of the series, which is to murky make out at the moment.

2012-09-10, 15:53	Link #1593
Soji Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Europe	Iron Maw@ I hope you and other are right about this ...but I can't shake this feeling that will end like that. zeniselv@ Fair enough i agree with this. Wait now that i recall something if Kurome sword make her puppet the one she kill how the hell she kill that big thing .

2012-09-11, 13:47	Link #1600
Mentar Banned Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Hamburg Age: 54	The way I see it, the PM's son will be the wedge that will drive Esdese and the Empire apart. He's clearly trying to usurp his father's position, and he's positioned as anti-Jaeger.