Macross Delta - Episode 1 Discussion / Poll

[Kazu-kun]

Originally Posted by Alhazred

The girl on the right is Mirage, the female pilot in Delta squadron and ostensibly the third leg in the traditional Macross love triangle. Mikumo is the "center" girl for the Walküre idol group. She makes a much stronger impression than Mirage does in this ep, IMHO, and it sorta makes me wonder if the event staff that produced that flier are trying to give us a no-so-subtle hint about their preferences.

No, it's confirmed that it was a typo.

Originally Posted by Fairy Water

Idol group is really a trend now huh? All the girls are designed to be Mikumo's background. Her design is totally on a whole new level. How would she fall for Hayate?

She wouldn't. She's a Roy Focker idol version. She's a mentor character, not a love interest. Let's just hope she won't have the same fate as Roy.

[kuromitsu]

Originally Posted by ReddyRedWolf

We already had Sivil for that in a moaning voice "Ecstasy!".

But IIRC Sivil and Basara didn't have out-of-clothes spiritual orgasm experiences. Hayate now came a step closer to that...

[wavehawk]

Originally Posted by Alhazred

Also note, the Immelmann turn, for which Hayate is probably named, is itself named after Max Immelmann.

Max Jenius
Max Immelmann
Hayate Immelmann

- You wouldn't think they'd troll us by revealing that Hayate is Max's illegitimate grandson...would they?

Originally Posted by Kazu-kun

She wouldn't. She's a Roy Focker idol version. She's a mentor character, not a love interest. Let's just hope she won't have the same fate as Roy.

- ...pineapple salad...pineapple salad...pineapple salad...pineapple salad...
catatonic

[ReddyRedWolf]

On the other hand Chuck better not leave unfinished steaks or talk about girls during a flight.

[Alhazred]

Originally Posted by Kazu-kun

No, it's confirmed that it was a typo.

A likely story. Until Mirage gets some more love i've got my eye on you, Macross events staff...

Originally Posted by Kazu-kun

She wouldn't. She's a Roy Focker idol version. She's a mentor character, not a love interest. Let's just hope she won't have the same fate as Roy.

She might be more complex than that. She could also be somehow connected to the controllers of the var syndrome or the hostiles from Windermere, especially if they keep throwing plausibly deniable shades of Macross II...

Originally Posted by wavehawk

- You wouldn't think they'd troll us by revealing that Hayate is Max's illegitimate grandson...would they?

Eh... i dunno, that wouldn't torpedo a romance for a Japanese audience, so it's not impossible, but it seems really unlikely. The day Max cheats on Milia is the day we find someone's body blasted to pieces with a Valk autocannon. Then again, with the cloning shenanigans that implicitly had to go on to create the colonization fleets, it's also possible that there is a Max clone somewhere in Hayate's ancestry.

[Tenzen12]

It's not like Max never had "illegitimate son" before though

[ReddyRedWolf]

Originally Posted by Tenzen12

It's not like Max never had "illegitimate son" before though

Dude that was a rumor proved false. On the other hand it is likely Max had clones. Shou Hayami voicing mad scientist that kinda looks like Max, Marge Guldoa, in Macross Plus.

[Tak]

Originally Posted by ReddyRedWolf

Dude that was a rumor proved false. On the other hand it is likely Max had clones. Shou Hayami voicing mad scientist that kinda looks like Max, Marge Guldoa, in Macross Plus.

If we could only dub Marge's voice with Okabe's from Stein's Gate...

- Tak

[Tenzen12]

Originally Posted by ReddyRedWolf

Dude that was a rumor proved false. On the other hand it is likely Max had clones. Shou Hayami voicing mad scientist that kinda looks like Max, Marge Guldoa, in Macross Plus.

Do you know purpose of quotation marks? For example there is big difference between illegitimate son and "illegitimate son"

[PonSquared]

I am a bit mixed on how I feel about Macross Delta. On one hand, I was foaming at the mouth with glee at watching Macross again. I like Hayate and Freyja does not annoy me too much. Seeing Valkyries in all their glory and the (useless as usual) ground defense mechs were a plus as well. Watching the Zentradi integrated into society (A fleet admiral is a full blooded zentradi!? Amazing!) was a natural progression of where the society of the original Macross would have evolved. Most the old battle pods were shown on the zentran side and there was even a meltran battle pod being piloted by a… zentran?

The fight scenes were, uggggggg, amazing. Macross missiles (tm) just never disappoint and never get old. The speed, the fluidity, and the gracefulness of ship to ship combat was a sight to behold. No one can do it like Macorss. Unparalleled.

As I was watching the first episode I kept thinking, “This is Macross! THIS is Macross!” What is Macross exactly? Macross is music saving the world. Did Macross Delta have music save the world? Yup! Crazy mind-warped zentradi being calmed by music is what the core of what Macross is. When that one magical girl techno-mind pushed music into the brain of that the berserk zertradi to calm him down and the zentradi goes ,"Oh! deculture!" YES! THIS IS MACROSS! I was really glad that Delta got it right where some of the other Macross series didn’t. Music is not just a part of what makes Macross what it is. It is not there to be used in the background as dramatic score. It is not something to be used as a prop. Macorss uses music as mankind’s most powerful weapon. Delta, indeed, got it right.

Did anyone else notice the parallel between the first episodes of Macross and Macross Delta? In the first episode of Macross an untrained Valkyrie pilot is forced into a Valkyrie and winds up saving a girl from certain death who will soon become an idol and mankind’s most powerful weapon. In the first episode of Macross Delta an untrained Valkyrie pilot commandeers a Valkyrie to save a girl who from certain death who is soon to become a magical girl idol and mankind’s most powerful weapon. What a throwback to the original series. I am digging where things are going.

And then we get to Walküre. So I am watching the episode and all is going swimmingly until there is a magical girl sequence. "WHAT - THE - HELL - IS - THIS?!?!" I thought. By the end of the episode I was kind of getting on board with the whole thing. What would the logical progression from Minmay be? Sharon Apple? That didn't work out so well. So why not a whole group of decultrue idols? The whole transforming thing I could live with out but I liked how they took the deculture to the battlefield and beat the zentradi over the head with it. Pared with their support Valkyries they make a pretty effective zentradi calming team. Again, music is a weapon, not a prop.

Overall I give the first episode a 9/10. I have watched the second half of the episode four times now and I like it more each time I see it. I might just be a Macross fanboy but I am proudly a Macross fanboy.

[PonSquared]

Originally Posted by Kazu-kun

She wouldn't. She's a Roy Focker idol version. She's a mentor character, not a love interest. Let's just hope she won't have the same fate as Roy.

Just keep her away from a pineapple salad and all will be okay. You see a pineapple anywhere near her and you can kiss her goodbye.

[magnuskn]

Eh, Ozma broke that curse through massive trolling via Kawamori.

[xeviouses]

Originally Posted by PonSquared

As I was watching the first episode I kept thinking, “This is Macross! THIS is Macross!” What is Macross exactly? Macross is music saving the world. Did Macross Delta have music save the world? Yup! Crazy mind-warped zentradi being calmed by music is what the core of what Macross is. When that one magical girl techno-mind pushed music into the brain of that the berserk zertradi to calm him down and the zentradi goes ,"Oh! deculture!" YES! THIS IS MACROSS! I was really glad that Delta got it right where some of the other Macross series didn’t. Music is not just a part of what makes Macross what it is. It is not there to be used in the background as dramatic score. It is not something to be used as a prop. Macorss uses music as mankind’s most powerful weapon. Delta, indeed, got it right.

Except it was not music that saved the earth, Zentran firepower did it.
The Zentrans themselves pointed it out, its not the song that surprised them, its the act singing itself. For a species that only knows war, the concept is completely alien to them. Heck once they got over the fact that humans have culture they went right back to stomping us flat.

Mankinds most powerful weapon is it's years of cultivated culture...alongside the big a$$ cannon mounted on the Battle ships.

Originally Posted by PonSquared

Did anyone else notice the parallel between the first episodes of Macross and Macross Delta? In the first episode of Macross an untrained Valkyrie pilot is forced into a Valkyrie and winds up saving a girl from certain death who will soon become an idol and mankind’s most powerful weapon. In the first episode of Macross Delta an untrained Valkyrie pilot commandeers a Valkyrie to save a girl who from certain death who is soon to become a magical girl idol and mankind’s most powerful weapon. What a throwback to the original series. I am digging where things are going.

Argh, Hikaru is not an 'untrained Valkyrie pilot' he is an aerobic flier he is hardly untrained, he can handle a Valk in fighter mode and to some extent gerwalk mode , at that time what he doesn't have is combat training and know-how in handling battroid mode.

Hayate is a civilian pilot of a Destroid. He performed really well in battroid mode but got shot down before we could what he could do in gerwalk.

My point is, its more contrast than parallel. Alto parallels Hikaru more than Hayate.

Originally Posted by PonSquared

And then we get to Walküre. So I am watching the episode and all is going swimmingly until there is a magical girl sequence. "WHAT - THE - HELL - IS - THIS?!?!" I thought. By the end of the episode I was kind of getting on board with the whole thing. What would the logical progression from Minmay be? Sharon Apple? That didn't work out so well. So why not a whole group of decultrue idols? The whole transforming thing I could live with out but I liked how they took the deculture to the battlefield and beat the zentradi over the head with it. Pared with their support Valkyries they make a pretty effective zentradi calming team. Again, music is a weapon, not a prop.

Overall I give the first episode a 9/10. I have watched the second half of the episode four times now and I like it more each time I see it. I might just be a Macross fanboy but I am proudly a Macross fanboy.

Music-Songs were almost always used as way of communication, a bridge between two species and in the case of Plus the connection between the three main leads. It was never a weapon, heck the only time it was used as such, was in Macross 7 and even then only against a specific enemy.

The logical progression of Minmay was Sheryl, while Walkure is for Basara.

[Tak]

Originally Posted by xeviouses

Mankinds most powerful weapon is it's years of cultivated culture...alongside the big a$$ cannon mounted on the Battle ships.

IIRC they only had one big @$$ cannon on one gunship and one big @$$ cannon on the surface of Earth.

Though Zentradi lost the First Space War not because of any technological inferiority, but because Boddole Zer had a hubris problem. After being snubbed by humans, Boddole Zer sought revenge. Not only that, he wanted vengeance through the most laborious method possible.

Did he need to have 5 million ships open fire on Earth's surface to prove a point? Nah, could have done it with 12. But he did it because he wanted to prove to humanity that superior technology and firepower is nothing before willpower and sheer numbers.

- Tak

[Triple_R]

Strange... I liked the preview airing significantly more than this Episode 1.

Things felt a little more rushed to me here than they did in the preview airing. And Freyja seemed more compelling and impressive to me in the preview airing.

It's still a good episode, but it certainly pales in comparison to how I felt about the preview airing.

It's hard to say what specifically accounts for the difference. I vaguely recall Freyja getting a cleaner moment of decisive victory in the preview episode, and I also recall Walkure as a whole seeming more impressive. It seems to me like this actual Episode 1 took away some highlight moments from the major female characters in order to give us more mecha action dominated by the major male characters. Am I just not remembering correctly here, or has there in fact been significant content changes made between the preview airing and this Episode 1?

[PonSquared]

Macross has always backed up deculture with big guns. That is exactly the reason why Macross works so well. Music and heavy weapons.

To underestimate the power of culture while overestimating the power of war is a recipe for the downfall of society.

[LoweGear]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

Strange... I liked the preview airing significantly more than this Episode 1.

Things felt a little more rushed to me here than they did in the preview airing. And Freyja seemed more compelling and impressive to me in the preview airing.

It's still a good episode, but it certainly pales in comparison to how I felt about the preview airing.

It's hard to say what specifically accounts for the difference. I vaguely recall Freyja getting a cleaner moment of decisive victory in the preview episode, and I also recall Walkure as a whole seeming more impressive. It seems to me like this actual Episode 1 took away some highlight moments from the major female characters in order to give us more mecha action dominated by the major male characters. Am I just not remembering correctly here, or has there in fact been significant content changes made between the preview airing and this Episode 1?

The only content cuts I've seen after watching both versions of the episode were:

1. The scene in space where Freyja looks out a window and sees Al-Shahal outside before she takes a bite out of her apple.
2. Some small scene cuts at the dock, such as Hayate putting down the freight container Freyja was in, some miscellaneous mechanical shots. Said scenes had no dialogue relevant to characterization, and thus cutting them out makes no difference whatsoever.
3. There's a scene in Al-Shahal City where Freyja is still running from her pursuers in a crowd, when she hears a "rainbow-colored song", which was being hummed by Mikumo nearby before the latter makes her report. This scene was also cut. A short 1-second scene involving a drone electrifying its taser was also cut.
4. The longest scene cut from the episode was Delta Squadron performing their "Walkure Wing" formation, which simply involved a flyby where Mirage launches flares that put holograms on buildings. This follows into Maki and Reina using drones to protect civilians against a missile barrage, and then having Mirage recharge the drones using her VF's remote recharging system. While the loss of showing some technical details is regrettable in the TV version, it didn't really affect the action's flow much.

Otherwise, they didn't cut anything much when it came to Freyja's characterization, and the scenes relevant to Walkure's performance weren't too adversely affected - all of Mikumo's action is intact for one.

[Triple_R]

Originally Posted by LoweGear

2. The longest scene cut from the episode was Delta Squadron performing their "Walkure Wing" formation, which simply involved a flyby of sorts, leading into Maki and Reina using drones to protect civilians against a missile barrage, and then having Mirage recharge the drones using her VF's remote recharging system. While the loss of showing some technical details is regrettable in the TV version, it didn't really affect the action's flow much.

Well, that probably explains why Walkure seemed less impressive to me here in the TV version than in the original.

Thanks for the info.

Edit: To be fair, the preview airing was a truly fantastic episode. I liked every scene in it. If they had to cut some of it out to fit the TV airing, then they had few if any easy choices, and I don't envy the editing job they had to do.

[LoweGear]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

Well, that probably explains why Walkure seemed less impressive to me here in the TV version than in the original.

I'm not sure if that particular scene was enough to give you the feeling that Walkure is less impressive, since most of the scene involved Delta Squadron, and the only thing Walkure themselves do is calling the drones and asking for a recharge.

Most of the more impressive off-the-wall abilities done by Walkure in the episode were retained in the TV airing, including Mikumo doing head-to-head against that Quaedluun, and tanking a missile barrage.

[Triple_R]

Maybe it's just that certain things are at their most impressive the first time you watch it, and lose some luster on repeat viewing.

Walkure still seems very cool to me overall. I still love their costumes and overall style.

Given how wowed I was by the preview airing, a perceived step down was almost inevitable really. I'm still very much looking forward to Episode 2.