Character discussion - Setsuna F. Seiei

[vspirit]

Originally Posted by KaiDamien

I understand what you are saying, but shouldn't he worry about Graham coming after him again unless of course he truly understand what Graham is thinking due to QBW and knew 'how to respond'. He could have easily killed Graham with the last strike that would have end Graham's life and move on before Graham's intention of ending his own misery.

Hmmm...QBW and what-not aside, Setsuna isn't exactly an overly complicated character. Not in my opinion anyway. I reckon with what he'd revealed to Graham in that white fuzz place where GN particles collect and his advice for the latter to live on would be enough for Graham to ponder over and accept but if they aren't, well, he'd probably figured he'd cross that bridge when he gets to it (if there's still one to cross, that is--if Graham decides to off himself anyway, well, that's his choice and it'd be one less thorn on Setsuna's side, either way).

At the end of the day, it probably isn't important whether or not he knows what Graham thinks. The guy can't harm him any longer so there's no point in killing him. Since the guy is all set in walking down the bushido path, it wouldn't take a QBW-user to see that he'll most likely kill himself in the name of honor, and in light of what they shared in the white place (if there's a name for it, I've forgotten what it is ^^; ), Setsuna tells him to forget that and live. He says his fill and leaves. Whether or not he wants to listen is up to Graham. One of the main things I've noticed about Setsuna's character (besides not being too complicated) is that he offers advise and help when they're needed but doesn't insist when people refuse to accept them. He never does.

[miroku2192]

Originally Posted by vspirit

Hmmm...QBW and whatnot aside, Setsuna isn't exactly an overly complicated character. Not in my opinion anyway. I reckon with what he'd revealed to Graham in that white fuzz place where GN particles collect and his advice for the latter to live on would be enough for Graham to ponder over and accept but if it isn't, well, he'd probably figured he'd cross that bridge when he gets to it (if there's still one to cross, that is--if Graham decides to off himself anyway, well, that's his choice and it'd be one less thorn on Setsuna's side, either way).

At the end of the day, it probably isn't important whether or not he knows what Graham thinks. The guy can't harm him any longer so there's no point in killing him. Since the guy is all set in to walk down the bushido path, it wouldn't take a QBW-user to see that he'll most likely kill himself in the name of honor, and in light of what the shared in the white place, Setsuna tells him to forget that and live. He said his fill and left. Whether or not he wants to listen is up to Graham. Setsuna offers advise and help when it's needed but doesn't insist when it's not accepted. He never does.

i get the feeling like graham will play an important part in the last episode or something, something to help "save" Setsuna...it just seems like that will happen to me, and then he finally dies trying to protect Setsuna for the "future", a true way and honorable way to die

[KaiDamien]

Originally Posted by vspirit

Hmmm...QBW and what-not aside, Setsuna isn't exactly an overly complicated character. Not in my opinion anyway. I reckon with what he'd revealed to Graham in that white fuzz place where GN particles collect and his advice for the latter to live on would be enough for Graham to ponder over and accept but if they aren't, well, he'd probably figured he'd cross that bridge when he gets to it (if there's still one to cross, that is--if Graham decides to off himself anyway, well, that's his choice and it'd be one less thorn on Setsuna's side, either way).

At the end of the day, it probably isn't important whether or not he knows what Graham thinks. The guy can't harm him any longer so there's no point in killing him. Since the guy is all set in walking down the bushido path, it wouldn't take a QBW-user to see that he'll most likely kill himself in the name of honor, and in light of what they shared in the white place (if there's a name for it, I've forgotten what it is ^^; ), Setsuna tells him to forget that and live. He says his fill and leaves. Whether or not he wants to listen is up to Graham. One of the main things I've noticed about Setsuna's character (besides not being too complicated) is that he offers advise and help when they're needed but doesn't insist when people refuse to accept them. He never does.

I understand what you are saying,but i do feel that sparing Graham was clearly a plot armor for Graham and was weird in a sense. In a battle people usually go for the kill especially when your enemy have no more weapons (other then the chest cannon) and not by poking the beam sabers into the shoulders. Besides after Setsuna destroyed both arms of Susanoo and was convinced that Graham would no longer be a threat/ died ,wouldn't he just fly off to find Louise or even return back to Ptolly. All these was a special treatment because it was Graham and his plot armour that made Setsuna stay , if it were other characters other than Ali and Louise he would flew off immediately or destroy the MS. ( In battle Set did destroy MS even though some have lost their arm/s.) It was about 10 secs of screen time after both arms of Susanoo was destroyed before Graham opened his cockpit, enough for Set to destroy the MS or fly away. Unless of course the animation slowed down for the effects. All these without consideration of QBW that Setsuna felt earlier, if he did.

[vspirit]

Originally Posted by KaiDamien

I understand what you are saying,but i do feel that sparing Graham was clearly a plot armor for Graham and was weird in a sense. In a battle people usually go for the kill especially when your enemy have no more weapons (other then the chest cannon) and not by poking the beam sabers into the shoulders. Besides after Setsuna destroyed both arms of Susanoo and was convinced that Graham would no longer be a threat/ died ,wouldn't he just fly off to find Louise or even return back to Ptolly. All these was a special treatment because it was Graham and his plot armour that made Setsuna stay , if it were other characters other than Ali and Louise he would flew off immediately or destroy the MS. ( In battle Set did destroy MS even though some have lost their arm/s.) It was about 10 secs of screen time after both arms of Susanoo was destroyed before Graham opened his cockpit, enough for Set to destroy the MS or fly away. Unless of course the animation slowed down for the effects. All these without consideration of QBW that Setsuna felt earlier, if he did.

*thinks* It didn't come off especially weird to me but well, yes, I can't deny there's a good deal of that plot armor thing you spoke of. He is the obligatory masked character that all Gundam series must have, after all. >.<

[Zantetsuken]

well, usually there is a good reason for some character get a plot armor. I just hope that graham's plot armor is because of a good reason

[Nvis]

Was it even necessary at all for Regene and Ribbons to continue to call Setsuna by his code name?

They should have known his real name by now.

[Foreshadow]

Originally Posted by Nvis

Was it even necessary at all for Regene and Ribbons to continue to call Setsuna by his code name?

They should have known his real name by now.

When Ribbons took over Veda all the information on the meisters was deleted

[Roadie]

Ribbons mentioned it in 14.

[Rising Dragon]

Originally Posted by Nvis

Was it even necessary at all for Regene and Ribbons to continue to call Setsuna by his code name?

They should have known his real name by now.

Considering the path he's chosen, its better for him to go by Setsuna, the name of Celestial Being's Gundam Meister, rather than the original name of his past.

[Revolutionist]

I'm glad Ribbons calls him by his code name and not his real name. Setsuna F. Seiei sounds infinitely cooler than Soran Ibrahim.

[Tokkan]

Originally Posted by Revolutionist

I'm glad Ribbons calls him by his code name and not his real name. Setsuna F. Seiei sounds infinitely cooler than Soran Ibrahim.

It's actually spelt Soran Ebrahim, not Ibrahim, according the meister ID card that came with the Hakanaku mo Towa no Kanashi LE single.

[Zenemis]

Yeah but... if we do that, we have to start saying Raww, and Susanowo, and Ice-Cleam.

[Tokkan]

Originally Posted by Zenemis

Yeah but... if we do that, we have to start saying Raww, and Susanowo, and Ice-Cleam.

Apart from the fact that both Ibrahim and Ebrahim are actual real names and Susanowo is not technically wrong. The ID card is actually the only written source for a spelling of his name, apart from possibly the official subs when the DVDs get released.

[Dean_the_Young]

Originally Posted by KaiDamien

I understand what you are saying,but i do feel that sparing Graham was clearly a plot armor for Graham and was weird in a sense. In a battle people usually go for the kill especially when your enemy have no more weapons (other then the chest cannon) and not by poking the beam sabers into the shoulders. Besides after Setsuna destroyed both arms of Susanoo and was convinced that Graham would no longer be a threat/ died ,wouldn't he just fly off to find Louise or even return back to Ptolly. All these was a special treatment because it was Graham and his plot armour that made Setsuna stay , if it were other characters other than Ali and Louise he would flew off immediately or destroy the MS. ( In battle Set did destroy MS even though some have lost their arm/s.) It was about 10 secs of screen time after both arms of Susanoo was destroyed before Graham opened his cockpit, enough for Set to destroy the MS or fly away. Unless of course the animation slowed down for the effects. All these without consideration of QBW that Setsuna felt earlier, if he did.

Yes, the animation was deliberatly slowed for dramatic effect, but you're understanding is way off.

Plot armor is when a character who should be dead for very physical reasons (caught in a definitely final cockpit explosion, caught inside a superweapon beam, reactor explosion, masked helmet off in space, etc.) is returned alive for no established reason until a later retcon. Things that should kill them don't merely by director fiat. You can make a case for that with Graham in the final of S1, though if Setsuna didn't die from a beamsaber into the cockpit, then Graham didn't need to either.[/QUOTE]

Setsuna not killing Graham is not plot armor, it's Setsuna's character development. That was the entire point of that fight; Graham was twisted into someone who only wanted to fight to win, while Setsuna was finally Innovating towards a future where he wouldn't have to fight. Setsuna is not most people and he doesn't do what people "usually" do; he doesn't kill without a reason, and once the battle is over he doesn't go around finishing off pilots. He never has. He fights while others still fight, but once they stop and can't fight back he stops. That was the difference between Setsuna and Graham after two seasons of developing; Graham came to live only to fight, but Setsuna now only fights to live for the future.

Now, if Graham survived a beam/stab through the cockpit, or stood unharmed through a Memento Mori blast, or had a machine that took shots that by all accounts should have torn his suit to pieces but didn't even leave a scratch, that would be plot armor. But if he stands in space and Setsuna sees no reason to kill him and flies off, yes, in search of Louise, that's not plot armor. That's Setsuna choosing not to kill him.

[vspirit]

Ice-cleam...I dunno why but I like that pronunciation...

I thought Soran's a pretty cool name. I like it better than Setsuna, in fact. =) Soran Ebrahim (Ibrahim in some parts of the world) certainly rolls off my tongue smoother than Setsuna F. Seiei does. The latter just makes my mouth muscles work overtime to pronounce.

[Zenemis]

Originally Posted by Tokkan

Apart from the fact that both Ibrahim and Ebrahim are actual real names and Susanowo is not technically wrong. The ID card is actually the only written source for a spelling of his name, apart from possibly the official subs when the DVDs get released.

That's my point. While they aren't technically wrong, (except the obvious one), they look terrible when translated to English, and likely won't be used.

[vspirit]

Originally Posted by Zenemis

That's my point. While they aren't technically wrong, (except the obvious one), they look terrible when translated to English, and likely won't be used.

*blinks* While I'm not so sure about Ebrahim, Ibrahim looks just fine to me. Having grown up in a Muslim country where English is the second language, names like that spelled in roman letters is a norm for me. Ibrahim, Iskandar, Abdullah, Mohammad, Ismail, Yusoff, Jafar, Zulkifli, Abdul something or other (i.e. Rahim), etc., are some of the common Muslim names here, spelled exactly like that (with a couple of variations here and there).

So as far as I'm concerned, Setsuna's real name is Soran Ibrahim (even if the official spelling's Ebrahim).

...unless you're talking about about ice-cleam and Sunanowo, in which case you can just ignore what I've just said (though I really do kinda like "ice-cleam").

[astranagun]

Found this meaning of Setsuna name

Spoiler for Setsuna name:

A Moment From The Holy Eternity". If you translate it to Japanese except the "From" , which you will remove the other three letters after "F", you'll get Setsuna From Seiei.

Sorry if it was already posted

[Zenemis]

Originally Posted by vspirit

*blinks* While I'm not so sure about Ebrahim, Ibrahim looks just fine to me. Having grown up in a Muslim country where English is the second language, names like that spelled in roman letters is a norm for me. Ibrahim, Iskandar, Abdullah, Mohammad, Ismail, Yusoff, Jafar, Zulkifli, Abdul something or other (i.e. Rahim), etc., are some of the common Muslim names here, spelled exactly like that (with a couple of variations here and there).

So as far as I'm concerned, Setsuna's real name is Soran Ibrahim (even if the official spelling's Ebrahim).

...unless you're talking about about ice-cleam and Sunanowo, in which case you can just ignore what I've just said (though I really do kinda like "ice-cleam").

No, Ibrahim is quite normal; I forgot to mention that as an exclusion, sorry if I offended you.

[furato]

Ibrahim or Ebrahim, they're both still إبراهيم‎ in the original language, just like different romanisation can give us Kujoh or Kujou.

But if it's officially Ebrahim, it must have been taken verbatim from the name of the Turtles Can Fly actor.