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Old 2015-01-15, 22:26   Link #35421
Urzu 7
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Join Date: Apr 2006
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Japan asks U.S. textbook publisher to 'correct' info in one of it's books about 'comfort women'

Excerpt from an article:

Quote:
Japan has asked a major U.S. publisher to “correct” a school textbook that references World War II sex slaves, the Foreign Ministry said Thursday, as Tokyo’s bid to polish its history moves abroad.

Diplomats petitioned McGraw-Hill to change passages of a book used in American schools that refer to “comfort women,” Japan’s euphemism for females forced to work in military brothels.

“The Japanese government, through an overseas diplomatic office, in mid-December asked McGraw-Hill executives to make a correction in the content of their textbook titled ‘Traditions & Encounters: A Global Perspective on the Past,’” a ministry statement published by the Wall Street Journal said.

They did this “upon finding grave errors and descriptions that conflict with our nation’s stance on the issue of ‘comfort women.’”

The Japanese government under nationalist Prime Minister Shinzo Abe has embarked on a global campaign to right what it sees as the wrongs of global perceptions of its wartime violence.

Mainstream historians agree that around 200,000 females, mainly from the Korean Peninsula, but also from China, Taiwan and the Philippines, were forced to provide sex to Japanese soldiers in a formalized system of slavery.

Right-wingers in Japan dispute this, and insist the women were common prostitutes. They say neither the state nor the military was involved in any coercion.

McGraw-Hill Education confirmed it had been approached by “representatives from the Japanese government … asking the company to change the description of ‘comfort women’ in one of our publications,” according to the Journal.

Full article: http://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/201.../#.VLh6dyvF-Tk


Seriously, Japan? Love you guys, but you need to get your shit straight on all of this and sugar coating Japan during WW II and not owning up to what many Japanese people did during those times.


Also, they have some gall to say that these women who were sex slaves were 'common prostitutes'. They say "Oh, btw, they were prostitutes anyway'. No, they were ordinary citizens and they were forced to be sex slaves and they were raped.
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Old 2015-01-16, 03:29   Link #35422
hawkeyesvn
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Meanwhile, IS leader decide that he should show his men his example of the trope "You have failed me."

Baghdadi orders execution of 56 IS members following defeat in northern Iraq

The guy must think he's a physical god or something.
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Old 2015-01-16, 08:27   Link #35423
ganbaru
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Fifteen detained after Belgian police kill Islamist gunmen
http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/...0KP11O20150116

Saudi Arabia postpones activist's flogging: source
http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/...0KP19C20150116

Man takes hostages in post office near Paris - official
http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/...0KP1DW20150116
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Old 2015-01-18, 08:46   Link #35424
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Ghost in the Shell Singer Origa Passes Away

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Old 2015-01-18, 10:45   Link #35425
Nicaea
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Urzu 7 View Post
Japan asks U.S. textbook publisher to 'correct' info in one of it's books about 'comfort women'

Excerpt from an article:




Full article: http://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/201.../#.VLh6dyvF-Tk


Seriously, Japan? Love you guys, but you need to get your shit straight on all of this and sugar coating Japan during WW II and not owning up to what many Japanese people did during those times.


Also, they have some gall to say that these women who were sex slaves were 'common prostitutes'. They say "Oh, btw, they were prostitutes anyway'. No, they were ordinary citizens and they were forced to be sex slaves and they were raped.
I was under the impression that Japan has had to apologize a lot of times.

Germany for instance, has apologized for it's past, put heavy laws concerning denial of holocaust (and stuff related to the holocaust) and has made major contributions in keeping peace around the world.

More often than not I see on the internet how Japan has to apologize for it's imperial past.

I'm not defending Japan but I wonder what it will take for people to actually let the past go (Japanese people and their right wingers too) because at this point every official apology is going to sound unsincere and forced anyway or even simply not accepted.
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Old 2015-01-18, 14:06   Link #35426
Ghiest Cid
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nicaea View Post
I was under the impression that Japan has had to apologize a lot of times.

Germany for instance, has apologized for it's past, put heavy laws concerning denial of holocaust (and stuff related to the holocaust) and has made major contributions in keeping peace around the world.

More often than not I see on the internet how Japan has to apologize for it's imperial past.

I'm not defending Japan but I wonder what it will take for people to actually let the past go (Japanese people and their right wingers too) because at this point every official apology is going to sound unsincere and forced anyway or even simply not accepted.
One reason they don't apologize is money. Apologizing means they accept fault and thus have to pay compensations.
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Old 2015-01-18, 14:17   Link #35427
Xellos-_^
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nicaea View Post
I was under the impression that Japan has had to apologize a lot of times.

Germany for instance, has apologized for it's past, put heavy laws concerning denial of holocaust (and stuff related to the holocaust) and has made major contributions in keeping peace around the world.

More often than not I see on the internet how Japan has to apologize for it's imperial past.

I'm not defending Japan but I wonder what it will take for people to actually let the past go (Japanese people and their right wingers too) because at this point every official apology is going to sound unsincere and forced anyway or even simply not accepted.
Japan has both apologies and even pay compensation. But the issue is the sincerity of those apologies. No German politician has to my knowledge question the holocausts or the role of Germany in WWII. However Japanese politicans has made statements questioning war crimes Japan "supposedly" committed as well as trying to paint Japan as the victim of WW2. These politicians aren't some 2 bit hanger on. They are the Former governor of Tokyo and the current governor of Osaka, two of the biggest city in Japan.

The equivalent would be the Mayors of Berlin and Munich questioning the Holocausts. The Mayors of New York and Los Angeles questioning slavery in the US.
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Old 2015-01-19, 03:36   Link #35428
Vallen Chaos Valiant
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So since they aren't sincere, the money doesn't count then? You want them to pay again?

Japan doesn't have the obligation to make other people HAPPY. That's not what the compensations are for. You can be mad all you like, but that has nothing to do with the fact that Japan had paid back with interest. If you are not satisfied, if you want more, if you want the Japanese to SUFFER, then that unfortunately isn't what the compensation is about.

If you hate the Japanese, the only way to make you happy isn't them being sorry. It is by declaring war, killing their women and children, and raze their country to the ground. That's how you get your revenge. Money or saying sorry has nothing to do with making you happy.

You want to defend your honour? Then do it. But demanding more money isn't it.
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Old 2015-01-19, 08:58   Link #35429
ganbaru
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China calls Snowden's stealth jet hack accusations 'groundless'
http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/...0KS0T820150119

Israeli strike in Syria kills senior Hezbollah figures
http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/...0KR0K620150118

Oil prices slip on gloomy Chinese prospects, record Iraq output
http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/...0KS02D20150119
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Old 2015-01-19, 10:25   Link #35430
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiberium Wolf View Post
Ghost in the Shell Singer Origa Passes Away

T_T Rest in peace. I loved your songs.
That's a real shame. Her voice was something very appropriate for all the GITS songs; I cannot imagine anyone else to make the intro memorable for that series.

Smoking just claims too many victims.
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Old 2015-01-19, 11:35   Link #35431
KiraYamatoFan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant View Post
So since they aren't sincere, the money doesn't count then? You want them to pay again?

Japan doesn't have the obligation to make other people HAPPY. That's not what the compensations are for. You can be mad all you like, but that has nothing to do with the fact that Japan had paid back with interest. If you are not satisfied, if you want more, if you want the Japanese to SUFFER, then that unfortunately isn't what the compensation is about.

If you hate the Japanese, the only way to make you happy isn't them being sorry. It is by declaring war, killing their women and children, and raze their country to the ground. That's how you get your revenge. Money or saying sorry has nothing to do with making you happy.

You want to defend your honour? Then do it. But demanding more money isn't it.
All of that stuff about comfort women needs extreme caution because it would not be the first time the so-called victims are doing this to try extorting more money. I see that kind of BS happening very often in the news and there are many cases when the case is made up. If Japan was genuinely unrepentant or seriously fed up, they could have said "you can stick any demand for an apology or a claim for compensation money up where the sun doesn't shine". But that's nowhere near what happened.

Meanwhile, I wish someone can explain to me why we haven't heard much about Chinese and Koreans hunting down ex-pimps who contributed to the situation and may have gone into hiding for decades under a new name. Also, I haven't heard anyone going into a lawsuit against the South Korean government for holding up a very similar system during the Korean War although victims could sue if we go by the same standard compared to the situation with Japan here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wikipedia
The South Korean armed forces also used to same arguments as the Japanese military to justify the use of comfort women, viewing them as a "necessary social evil" that would raise soldiers' morale and prevent rape
Also I think it was a year ago that a Korean professor went on local TV news and raised the topic as to how several local traders got those women involved and he even called those women as mere prostitutes. A Korean professor, of all people, said that! That's part of why I use extreme caution regarding that debate, especially when governments are using the topic for political purposes at this time.

Last edited by KiraYamatoFan; 2015-01-19 at 13:17.
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Old 2015-01-19, 14:15   Link #35432
SaintessHeart
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China Is Mad At Japan Over Comments About A Border Dispute With India
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Old 2015-01-19, 16:00   Link #35433
Xellos-_^
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant View Post
So since they aren't sincere, the money doesn't count then? You want them to pay again?

Japan doesn't have the obligation to make other people HAPPY. That's not what the compensations are for. You can be mad all you like, but that has nothing to do with the fact that Japan had paid back with interest. If you are not satisfied, if you want more, if you want the Japanese to SUFFER, then that unfortunately isn't what the compensation is about.

If you hate the Japanese, the only way to make you happy isn't them being sorry. It is by declaring war, killing their women and children, and raze their country to the ground. That's how you get your revenge. Money or saying sorry has nothing to do with making you happy.

You want to defend your honour? Then do it. But demanding more money isn't it.
did my post even mention anything about japan needing to pay more compensation?

You are the one reading stuff that isn't there. My post was about how Japan's apologies isn't seen as sincere. Part of it is japanese voter keeping these right winger in.
I wrote nothing about Japan needing to pay additional compensation.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KiraYamatoFan View Post
Also I think it was a year ago that a Korean professor went on local TV news and raised the topic as to how several local traders got those women involved and he even called those women as mere prostitutes. A Korean professor, of all people, said that! That's part of why I use extreme caution regarding that debate, especially when governments are using the topic for political purposes at this time.
Local where?

what are the professors credentials? What is he a professor of?
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Old 2015-01-19, 16:23   Link #35434
aldw
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Compensation paid to governments is often separate from those claimed by individuals, that's why for example even after Germany settled such issues with other governments, compensation claims by individuals over things such as forced labor, loss property, etc can and do continue on. This is also why claims by comfort women can continue even when the governments have worked out their sides of compensation.
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Old 2015-01-19, 16:32   Link #35435
Dhomochevsky
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xellos-_^ View Post
Japan has both apologies and even pay compensation. But the issue is the sincerity of those apologies. No German politician has to my knowledge question the holocausts or the role of Germany in WWII. However Japanese politicans has made statements questioning war crimes Japan "supposedly" committed as well as trying to paint Japan as the victim of WW2. These politicians aren't some 2 bit hanger on. They are the Former governor of Tokyo and the current governor of Osaka, two of the biggest city in Japan.

The equivalent would be the Mayors of Berlin and Munich questioning the Holocausts. The Mayors of New York and Los Angeles questioning slavery in the US.
The comparison with Germany is often made, but the circumstances leading into the war and at the end of the war were very different.

For Germany, the Nazis (democratically) seized control from the democratic parties of the Weimar republic, arrested or banished some of their politicians, then later the country went to war under Nazi regime.
After the war, the (mostly) same parties from before were reinstated, some of their top politicians returning to Germany from their foreign exiles.
Because of this, politically it has always been easy for Germany to make a cut and condemn everything we did under Nazi rule.
But you have to remember, that whenever our politicians apologized for Germany's warcrimes, even in the years right after the war, it was always
with this mindset of 'Sorry the Nazis did those things to you (we are not Nazis though)'.

So to compare this with Japan, who quite the contrary tried to maintain a certain political continuity, is problematic.
Personally, I am more impressed with Japan's way to handle its past without resorting to conviniently blame everything on some mystical force of evil mindcontrol.
They take more of the actual responsibility that way and consequently this seems to cause more turmoil in their conservative and right wing spectrum.

In Germany, the topic of regular army and civilian involvement in warcrimes was never touched for a long, long time (basicly we waited until most people concerned died of old age). So much for the comparison of how well we can handle those things without relying on the Nazi booman.

Last edited by Dhomochevsky; 2015-01-19 at 16:45.
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Old 2015-01-19, 17:49   Link #35436
Vallen Chaos Valiant
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I just don't get it. If people hate the Japanese so much, why not declare war? Isn't that what you do when you think so low of such people?

Of course, there are much worse people than the Japanese right now, and yet it seems the Japanese are treated like they are some kind of suppressed supervillain.
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Old 2015-01-19, 18:04   Link #35437
Xellos-_^
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant View Post
I just don't get it. If people hate the Japanese so much, why not declare war? Isn't that what you do when you think so low of such people?
calling out Japan for trying to whitewash its history or the voters for voting in these right winger isn't hating Japan.

There is a ton of middle ground between hate and annoy.
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Old 2015-01-19, 18:47   Link #35438
Irenicus
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dhomochevsky
But you have to remember, that whenever our politicians apologized for Germany's warcrimes, even in the years right after the war, it was always
with this mindset of 'Sorry the Nazis did those things to you (we are not Nazis though)'.
Wasn't it during the era of the boomers coming of age -- 60's, 70's -- that there was a major generation gap wherein the boomers were essentially digging up dirt on the silence around Nazism, calling their parents Nazis, and force German society to engage in a sort of "it was us" recognition? I seem to also recall that the individual compensation programs didn't really take off until this more proactive mindset set in.

I understand that this is a different understanding of how Germany engaged with its legacy than the "they did it all right from the start" portrayal.

Either way I know for a fact that the individual compensation program for victims of the Holocaust is still ongoing and will continue until the last survivor passes away. Germany committed at least that much, and that funding genuinely supports the care of the now-senior Holocaust survivors scattered across the planet. Human rights and issues of fairness and justice aside, it was just good PR.

Unlike the idiotic Japanese government, which paid very great amounts of reparations themselves to the People's Republic, yet refused to call it that for the sake of "honor" (they called it foreign aid) -- allowing later generations of PRC leadership to conveniently ignore everything Japan ever paid. lol.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant View Post
Of course, there are much worse people than the Japanese right now, and yet it seems the Japanese are treated like they are some kind of suppressed supervillain.
They make it really easy.

Japanese politicians don't need your moral defense, Vallen. They are scum -- they asked for it. What other modern country's political class would feel the need to come out regularly to screw up sensitive diplomatic efforts or even a heartfelt apology, through victim blaming and neanderthal hatefulness?

...okay, okay, don't answer that. I know who controls Congress now, 'kay?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xellos-_^
My post was about how Japan's apologies isn't seen as sincere. Part of it is japanese voter keeping these right winger in.
I'm pretty sure the Murayama Statement was genuine. And it is still the official position of the Japanese government, according to MOFA.

And while I understand where you are coming from regarding the idiots in the LDP and those to their right, it's not like Japan's voters were given much choice. The reelection of LDP was almost entirely driven by domestic concerns, namely, the utter failure of the DPJ experiment, not some nationalistic surge and a gung-ho need to start shit.

Last edited by Irenicus; 2015-01-19 at 18:59.
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Old 2015-01-19, 19:54   Link #35439
KiraYamatoFan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xellos-_^ View Post
Local where?

what are the professors credentials? What is he a professor of?
That was not easy, but I found the man:

An Byeong-jik (spelling can vary on various websites)

Professor emeritus at Seoul National University and 78 years old, his research focuses on economic history of Korea under Japanese colonial rule, but he also taught social science. OK, he has been criticized for a number of positions on many topics, mainly because of his neoconservative views (to which the current SK president adheres to). Still, his position on the topic reminds everyone that wartime prostitution is always and very unfortunately a very lucrative business.

Having read that, you can see why anything the self-proclaimed victims say should be taken with a huge pinch of salt. There have been just too many cases of extortion already in the real world.
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Old 2015-01-19, 20:35   Link #35440
Newhope
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant View Post
I just don't get it. If people hate the Japanese so much, why not declare war? Isn't that what you do when you think so low of such people?
Not as simple as that, Japan has a treaty with the US if Japan is attacked the US will back them.
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