(L) Monogatari Series Light Novel discussion

[revenant]

Originally Posted by omimon

Wooh....where did this come from?

obviously from the 4chan trolls

[omimon]

I just read an interesting idea....what if Kaiki actually died at the end of Koi and he was actually a ghost in Hana like Numachi.

[Shikijin]

I doubt it. I think to remember that in Hana Kanbaru mentioned Kaiki having fillings in his teeth, and in Koi Kaiki is actually kicked in the mouth by Nadeko, and he mentions one has to pay a lot to fix teeth.

[Knightrunner]

What do Araragi's sisters think about Senjogahara and how was there first meeting?

[Romanticide]

The First made his swords from his body while he was still human, right? Is there any other mention of how he did that?

[Malkuth]

I can recall a vampire doing that in Kizu-... if relevant

[HasuMasu]

^ You mean Dramaturgie? I doubt the first could transform before turning into a vampire.

[Shikijin]

Originally Posted by Romanticide

The First made his swords from his body while he was still human, right? Is there any other mention of how he did that?

No, when he was human he had the original Kokorowatari.

[Romanticide]

Originally Posted by Shikijin

No, when he was human he had the original Kokorowatari.

I can't remember if he had it himself or not. Didn't he also have Yumewatari?

[Shikijin]

Yeah, he had both.

[redgrnbluylw]

Recently I've been reading Hitagi Crab, Mayoi Snail, and Tsubasa Tiger on Bakatsuki, and I'm really loving these stories. I especially love how the Monogatari books are generally written in the direction of comedy, but they still can at times maintain an air of mystery and suspense while making the characters' personalities so vulnerable and genuine. Does anybody know what nisioisin's inspiration is for writing the series and designing the novels' eccentric characters to be who they are? Why revolve the series around the theme of supernatural oddities and their intervention in human life?

[Malkuth]

Well contrary to western critical belief things get better with Kizu- and particularly Nise- in that front

[omimon]

Originally Posted by redgrnbluylw

Recently I've been reading Hitagi Crab, Mayoi Snail, and Tsubasa Tiger on Bakatsuki, and I'm really loving these stories. I especially love how the Monogatari books are generally written in the direction of comedy, but they still can at times maintain an air of mystery and suspense while making the characters' personalities so vulnerable and genuine. Does anybody know what nisioisin's inspiration is for writing the series and designing the novels' eccentric characters to be who they are? Why revolve the series around the theme of supernatural oddities and their intervention in human life?

In terms of inspirations I believe it's been mentioned before but at least for the first season the books were entirely his own desires. They weren't meant to be serious works which was why Nise had soooooo much incest. When the anime came out I guess he sorta realize people is actually reading his stuff seriously which was why season 2 had in my opinion more "work" into it.

Araragi is basically Nisio's self-insert. Which in turn means he wants to have little sisters where he can fool around with and lolis EVERYWHERE.

[Shikijin]

Originally Posted by redgrnbluylw

Does anybody know what nisioisin's inspiration is for writing the series and designing the novels' eccentric characters to be who they are? Why revolve the series around the theme of supernatural oddities and their intervention in human life?

I think Nisio's ispiration for Bakemonogatari comes from psychiatry. Several characters present clear symptoms of a personality disorder, especially when analyzed up close. Other characters instead may come from Nisio's previous works. For example I feel like the ispiration for Hachikuji came from Zaregoto's Hime-chan.

I don't think the theme of supernatural oddities has any particular relevance. He just didn't do something like that before. Possibly he thought he could exploit a vampire craze.

Originally Posted by omimon

In terms of inspirations I believe it's been mentioned before but at least for the first season the books were entirely his own desires. They weren't meant to be serious works which was why Nise had soooooo much incest. When the anime came out I guess he sorta realize people is actually reading his stuff seriously which was why season 2 had in my opinion more "work" into it.

I believe your opinion is mistaken. In the postscripts Nisio had to be humble as per Japanese custom, so he put on an act and told people he never meant this to be published. That was an obvious lie. Bakemonogatari was published because Nisio wanted the book to be sold. What Nisio never expected was for the series to get an anime. That changed things, because there are things you can do in books but not in anime (TV has more regulations than books). I think he restrained just to not cause too much trouble to the anime studio.

[redgrnbluylw]

Originally Posted by Shikijin

I think Nisio's ispiration for Bakemonogatari comes from psychiatry. Several characters present clear symptoms of a personality disorder, especially when analyzed up close. Other characters instead may come from Nisio's previous works. For example I feel like the ispiration for Hachikuji came from Zaregoto's Hime-chan.

I don't think the theme of supernatural oddities has any particular relevance. He just didn't do something like that before. Possibly he thought he could exploit a vampire craze.

Ah. I thought maybe the novels were based off of personal experiences, then translated into a story with lots of wild twists from reality, like some of the supernatural oddities and the fan service, but it turns out he was just testing his abilities and using them for money. I'm a little disappointed. I thought the coming of being of the story maybe had some moral lesson attached to it. And maybe the plot and it's characters made me think, but it's not like he is trying to really teach us anything. Its just a story for the sake of being a story. Oh well. Thanks for the answers, omimon and Shikijin.

[Shikijin]

Originally Posted by redgrnbluylw

Ah. I thought maybe the novels were based off of personal experiences, then translated into a story with lots of wild twists from reality, like some of the supernatural oddities and the fan service, but it turns out he was just testing his abilities and using them for money. I'm a little disappointed. I thought the coming of being of the story maybe had some moral lesson attached to it. And maybe the plot and it's characters made me think, but it's not like he is trying to really teach us anything. Its just a story for the sake of being a story. Oh well. Thanks for the answers, omimon and Shikijin.

I think Nisio once admitted normal people don't talk that way. The dialogues are his invention. And if Nisio really behaved like Araragi he should be in jail. The best you can say is that maybe there is some personal insight from him dissimulated here and there.

There is no reason to be disappointed. All authors write to sell in one way or the other. The Monogatari series in itself was not meant for testing his abilities, rather for trying something new while still mainstream. I think he knows perfectly what his abilities (and flaws) are.

The issue of whether the story has a moral lesson or not is a bit complicated. To begin with, there are several stories in the series, and each story develop its own themes. The very first stories were also so short there was not much room to develop something deep, so they end with a punchline and basically that's all. I also don't really know what you expected from the series if it was really based on Nisio's personal experience, reality often doesn't have a moral lesson. On the contrary, the Monogatari series in itself is deeply moral, as characters ultimately reap what they sow, and justice is one of the theme in some stories.

I won't say the series don't teach you anything. I learned a lot of obscure stuff from it But most of all, I found several deeply impressive scenes. The series definitively gives you something, although rather than the so called "food for thought" (which is not absent per se) I would say it's "fond memories".

[redgrnbluylw]

Originally Posted by Shikijin

I think Nisio once admitted normal people don't talk that way. The dialogues are his invention. And if Nisio really behaved like Araragi he should be in jail. The best you can say is that maybe there is some personal insight from him dissimulated here and there.

There is no reason to be disappointed. All authors write to sell in one way or the other. The Monogatari series in itself was not meant for testing his abilities, rather for trying something new while still mainstream. I think he knows perfectly what his abilities (and flaws) are.

The issue of whether the story has a moral lesson or not is a bit complicated. To begin with, there are several stories in the series, and each story develop its own themes. The very first stories were also so short there was not much room to develop something deep, so they end with a punchline and basically that's all. I also don't really know what you expected from the series if it was really based on Nisio's personal experience, reality often doesn't have a moral lesson. On the contrary, the Monogatari series in itself is deeply moral, as characters ultimately reap what they sow, and justice is one of the theme in some stories.

I won't say the series don't teach you anything. I learned a lot of obscure stuff from it But most of all, I found several deeply impressive scenes. The series definitively gives you something, although rather than the so called "food for thought" (which is not absent per se) I would say it's "fond memories".

Hahaha. I'm not disappointed in the series itself; it's well written and I do like the characters and the story, and I suppose I thought that since the novels were very well received, maybe there was something I could take from it.

I think you're right, there is no lesson in experiencing reality itself. Maybe I was just reading for the wrong reasons. Not that I would understand the comedy, either, since it is so obscure and requires knowledge of pop culture and manga/anime history.

[BaKaBaKaOtaKu]

Originally Posted by omimon

Araragi is basically Nisio's self-insert. Which in turn means he wants to have little sisters where he can fool around with and lolis EVERYWHERE.

This is just so wrong.

[Malkuth]

Originally Posted by omimon

Araragi is basically Nisio's self-insert. Which in turn means he wants to have little sisters where he can fool around with and lolis EVERYWHERE.

Originally Posted by BaKaBaKaOtaKu

This is just so wrong.

True... WTF omimon? Does he also have a fetish about having his blood sucked and getting mutilated (both by lolis), or beating up 10 year olds

Because he writes a work of fiction describing these does not mean he wants them to happen. Those that do have such desires are dead, behind bars, or hating in self-denial, definitely don't write novels, draw manga, or direct films.

[omimon]

Originally Posted by Malkuth

True... WTF omimon? Does he also have a fetish about having his blood sucked and getting mutilated (both by lolis), or beating up 10 year olds

Because he writes a work of fiction describing these does not mean he wants them to happen. Those that do have such desires are dead, behind bars, or hating in self-denial, definitely don't write novels, draw manga, or direct films.

Okay look, I don't have prove to back up my argument so it is basically just how I feel. However, consider this, Nisio does write a lot more on loli fetishes compared to other light novel writers. In Shoujo Fujuubun he wrote about bathing with a loli and many readers have consider that book to be an autobiography.