2012-07-11, 05:02 | Link #61 | ||
Ninja Emperor
Join Date: Oct 2004
Age: 38
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Oro not only maintains eternal youth by possessing the bodies of young hosts he inherits the powers of each of his victims. That is why powerful Ninja are so valuable to him because his vessel needs to be strong and he gets their unique abilities. The Cursed Seals could be used as a last ditch effort to ensure that he isn't killed off if his physical body dies. The more people with the cursed seal the greater chance Orochimaru has at survival and possible revival. I guess he actually has to be dead in order to be revived. I thought Oro's revival was actually pretty creative. Since Kabuto had Oro's cells he could be used to regenerate Orochimaru's body with its full powers while his consciousness resides within cursed seals (and he remains in the loop about everything his victim witnesses while his consciousness is sealed within them).
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2012-07-11, 05:20 | Link #62 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: The Dark Side of The Moon
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2012-07-11, 06:15 | Link #63 | |
lost ronin
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: in the recesses of my convoluted mind...
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2012-07-11, 06:39 | Link #64 | |
a
Join Date: May 2004
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It doesn't really seem that similar to me - I doubt Kishimoto has ever even read it. |
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2012-07-11, 08:06 | Link #65 | |
lost ronin
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: in the recesses of my convoluted mind...
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i never said the two stories are the same but there are some similarities, especially when it comes to its two main villains and two lead characters. anyway, my point is the cursed seals do remind people of the horcruxes and that's why oro's revival seemed ridiculous.
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2012-07-11, 08:35 | Link #67 | |
ANIUE!111
Join Date: Oct 2006
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2012-07-11, 08:35 | Link #68 | ||
Bubbly and super fun
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Doesn't look like Kansas
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Let me ask you this, did Naruto meet his parents? Were they chakra construct deluded into thinking they were real people? If they can be deluded and self aware are they people regardless? If they're people can they be considered the same person they used to be in the flesh? Or are they some kind of digital twins? And if so do they still have souls? And in this case can the soul be copied? Afterall Kushina, Minato and Orochimaru proved the mind is quantifiable and can be copied and uploaded. Is the soul different from the mind then? In what way? And even so is it quantifiable as well? Let's go further, Orochimaru reached immortality by uploading his mind into the body of others. Did he upload his soul as well or did it "died" with his old body? If so did those new Oro have a new soul as they become a new individual? If so are they different people than their previous iteration? If so can the new Orochimaru be blamed for the acts of his previous self only because he remembers doing them? In our case it seems the various CSs keep track of Orochimaru's memory in real time considering how much this Oro knows (and I'd like an explanation for that to be honest but oh well) so how different does this new Oro need to be before he's a separate person from his old/previous self? And if he's not different then I return to my first claim : is there a "real" Oro at this point? People will start thinking I have something against "the Professor" but it's kind of funny when you think about it |
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2012-07-11, 08:57 | Link #71 | |
Ninja Emperor
Join Date: Oct 2004
Age: 38
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When Orochimaru performed the Immortality Jutsu to take over Sasuke's body their consciousness was transported to an alternate dimension that Orochimaru said was inside of him. There the souls of his previous hosts were still trapped. So I'm assuming that once Orochimaru possesses a victims their mind, body and spirit are his forever. Even after he discards their body for another he still has their abilities as they have bounded with the White Snake permanently (meaning if one of his hosts was an Uchiha and he wanted a Hyuuga next Orochimaru could have the power of the Sharingan and Byakugan, he could have any bloodline trait or unique ability he wanted with this jutsu). Since Orochimaru's "soul" is sealed within his curse seal all of his abilities likely are as well and once revived Orochimaru has all of the knowledge and power he ever gained in life. One interesting thing to consider is that since Orochimaru took his cells back from Kabuto he probably has the abilities of a Snake Sage as well. I wonder how relevant he will be to the series at this point. Maybe he and Sasuke will have a proper battle this time around. By the way does anyone else think it's hilarious that Suigetsu, who upon his introduction to the series claimed that he wanted to kill Orochimaru is now terrified now that he is face to face with him?
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2012-07-11, 13:56 | Link #72 | ||
Wingedmercury
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: California
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BTW... Spoiler for The Origins of Orochimaru:
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2012-07-11, 14:05 | Link #73 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: The Dark Side of The Moon
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however your point about a different dimension answers my question does any one think that all of these oro developments will be leading to an arc after the war? especially since tobi's about to summon the juubi, a tad prematurely i think and i just thought, maybe the reason madara wouldn't want to return in an edo body is because how effective a jinchuuriki does an edo body make? it's possibile in some way shown by tobi, but is it the same as using a regular body? ... and does madara really plan to still be the juubi jinchuuriki... unlimited chakra cuz of his edo body, why doesn't he just try using mugen tsukiyomi now?
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2012-07-11, 15:33 | Link #75 |
HI, BILLY MAYS HERE
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What's with the "what is a soul" discussion? I almost want to play the "a wizard did it" when it comes to the alleged duplication of so-called "souls"...norly, I'm being serious; It makes me wonder if it has anything to do with ninjutsu, not on the obvious sense because it is what it is, but because there's just a lot of ninjutsu techniques that directly deal with the soul or life force and treat it as easily manipulated as chakra itself, going all the way back to Rikudou Sennin's Banbutsu Souzo, using Yang Release techniques to put life into a creation...Speculative, but I want to say things like that didn't exist before ninjutsu existed, and to say "A sage did it" seems like a cheap way to just hand wave it, it does raise a lot of interest behind the exact mechanics of ninjutsu...You can't have a soul without life, but can you have life without a soul? Given that Orochimaru can transfer his soul between bodies, but was resurrected through a duplicate of his consciousness, he's definitely still alive; So my resolution to this (Before I start wrapping my mind too deep in fuxk over the whole "soul" issue), is that Orochimaru is, at the very least, sentient...Given the amount of references to Buddhism in Naruto, and the technical term of "sentient beings" in Buddhism, this makes me believe this is the best description to give to Orochimaru's state of life...
And for being a sentient being, Orochimaru just does not GAF about anything that has happened; It doesn't matter that Sasuke came this close to killing him, or that Itachi sealed the "real" Orochimaru within the Sword of Totsuka, or that Kabuto tried to pull a Starscream in Orochimaru's absence by implanting Orochimaru's DNA into his own body...Still being aware of everything through Anko, Orochimaru just rolls out of bed like it's another Tuesday; Still vying for Sasuke's hawt Uchiha body while walking up to Kabuto still stuck in his Sage mode, getting back his own chakra out of Kabuto as if he were walking to a cabinet to grab a bottle of vitamins...Does Orochimaru even care for anything that's ever transpired since his "death", as far as he's aware from Anko's exploration? He has to have some sort of angle for walking around with Sasuke, helping him out like he's a long time friend with no bad blood; Makes me wonder if there's an agenda in this trip for Orochimaru...He was given a lot of time to just think about things, no doubt...
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2012-07-11, 16:20 | Link #76 | |||
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Hidden Village of Sake
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I think Kishimoto is just playing a game here, he wants us to believe this is the true Orochimaru, but then later he will reveal that this version of Orochimaru is somehow crippled. Orochi's "nice" behaviour might be due to that, if he know that he's not at full power he would not risk a battle against Sasuke. If this was the real full powered Orochimaru i would expect a much more serious effort to bring him back, something more epic than this simple way of pulling him out of a seal and a piece of flesh. Something like traveling half the world, gathering stuff, then having some fancy ritual. But not this anticlimactic way of bringing him back.
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One basic rule i was thinking of was that the soul is what guarantees the uniqueness of a person, so that it cannot be copied in a way like Agent Smith was destroying the matrix by copying himself infinitely until he overwrites every other personality there exists in the world. In case of Orochimaru we have seen his soul being transferred from one body to another, after the transfer the original body was not Orochimaru any more. Quote:
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Juugo can interact with nature, also Naruto and Kabuto in sage mode interact with nature. So maybe the CS being sage-like thing makes it possible for different CS-Orochimaru-minds to be in contact through nature itself which surround them at all time. They can resonate with each other on their soul-frequency, or some bullshit like that The only problem with the idea of real time link is that when Sasuke attacked Orochimaru the CS in Sasuke didn't warn Orochimaru about Sasuke attacking him. But one could say the CS links have a high ping Sure he becomes a more scary life form if we can't even point at someone/something and say it is him Last edited by Ero-Senn1n; 2012-07-12 at 13:52. |
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2012-07-11, 16:32 | Link #77 | |
❤Ichigo 100%❤
Join Date: Jan 2011
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Isn't that enough reason not to kill? Plus Sasuake and his group are saints! lol
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2012-07-11, 17:16 | Link #78 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: East Cupcake
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2012-07-11, 17:31 | Link #79 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Hidden Village of Sake
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