Macross Zero Discussion Thread

[Onizuka-GTO]

Originally Posted by Fel

So for us poor deprived ones out there who have yet to see any Macross stuff yet (yes we exist, though our numbers dwindle quicker than WWII vets), would we be better off watching Macross Zero before Macross or not?

In other words, is Macross Zero a prequel that can only be properly understood/appreciated after seeing original Macross, or would it be okay to go Macross Zero -> Macross?

Yep. you can watch it in any order YOU LIKE! the best tihng about Macross that if you haven't seen any of the previous series, you will still enjoy it.

It series can stand on it's own, or watched in chronicle order.
(edit: oh wait! except Macross Dynamite and Macross 7: The Galaxy is Calling me! episode special)

personally, when i re-watch the macross universe again (make that in a weeks time, cos i only watched them 3 times this year.)
I wil lbe watching them from Macross Zero to Macross Dynamite -> Macross Trash (manga)

It's gonna be a weekend of fun!! (No i don't have any friends *sob* besides anime and b33r! ehehehheh )

[dreamless]

well, it helps to watch Macross before Macross 7.

Macross Zero doesn't have much to do with the other Macross series, however maybe if you watch Zero first then Macross, you may wonder why the Valkyrie in Macross doesn't look as good as those in Zero

[Radd]

I'm rather pleased with the ending, though it did seem rushed in both the story and animation department. It would have been much better had the episode been about twice as long. As it was, they just kept jumping from scene to scene.

As for glyph's spoiler tagged comment:

Spoiler:

I reccomend rewatching the episode. AFOS survived the nuclear attack, but looked to be a lot worse for the wear. Certainly not what you would call "unscathed".

As for what happened, Sara and the AFOS absorbed the attack, and then made a quick exit, taking the dangerous power and radiation of the explosion with them out into space.

I would call the end to Shin and Sara's story rather bittersweet. I would not say they lived or died, but rather something else.

Given what we know happens about 3 years later, Macross Zero is rather tragic overall.

[Radd]

Originally Posted by dreamless

well, it helps to watch Macross before Macross 7.

Macross Zero doesn't have much to do with the other Macross series, however maybe if you watch Zero first then Macross, you may wonder why the Valkyrie in Macross doesn't look as good as those in Zero

Well, the VF-1 Valkyries were designed way back in the early 80's. When they made Macross Zero they decided to make the VF-0 larger, bulkier, and more ungainly. If you prefere that in your mecha, well, it cannot be helped that the VF-1 Valkyries were sleeker and more refined looking.

[Onizuka-GTO]

VF-Zero have more resemblance to modern day millitary aircrafts then VF-1's.
They just look better cos they animation quality is better, it can't be helped. but if you look at the detailed designs of the VF-1 compared to the VF-0 you can clearly see that mechanically and design wise the vf-1 are much more efficient, doing away the restraints that atmospheric aircrafts had.
ah... pardon my Otakunese....

[ultramantaro]

I was quite impressed by the final episode but I too must echo the ending is a bit short. At the very least they should be able to stretch another episode.

Unfortunately this didn't have a "happy" ending unlike the original unless you are a Minmay fan.

[FlyByNite]

Originally Posted by dreamless

well, there are different interpretations of the ending

Spoiler:

1. Shin and Sara warped away from Earth.
2. Shin and Sara died.
3. Sara died, Shin got saved by Sara's spirit.
4. Sara warped away from Earth, Shin got saved by Sara and remained on Earth.

one thing to keep in mind, 3 year after Macross Zero, all people on Earth got blown into oblivion in the Doomsday, only a couple hundred thousands people survived. So it doesn't really matter that much on who lived or who died...

Spoiler for anti-UN forces:

they want to take control of AFOS and defeat UN with it, same as UN want to take control of AFOS and defeat anti-UN with it

Spoiler:

1,2, or 3 is possible. I don't think 4 is since we saw Shin leave. But I suppose he could have came back.

I'm going to decide to believe that Sara left Earth in the AFOS to get the potentially dangerous weapon away from the Earth and who might find it. Shin somehow evolved into a bird-man with those types of powers and went afte her. What happened after that? Who knows. Maybe they both evolved into some higher forms of beings and are out there in the universe together. You can pretty much choose you own ending since it's unresolved at that point.

And I wonder if it even mattered like you said. The Earth is scorched and most of it is burned to a crisp. Did the Mayans even survive that. All of that? To then be blown away just a few years later?

Kinda sad.

[dreamless]

Originally Posted by FlyByNite

Spoiler:

1,2, or 3 is possible. I don't think 4 is since we saw Shin leave. But I suppose he could have came back.

I'm going to decide to believe that Sara left Earth in the AFOS to get the potentially dangerous weapon away from the Earth and who might find it. Shin somehow evolved into a bird-man with those types of powers and went afte her. What happened after that? Who knows. Maybe they both evolved into some higher forms of beings and are out there in the universe together. You can pretty much choose you own ending since it's unresolved at that point.

And I wonder if it even mattered like you said. The Earth is scorched and most of it is burned to a crisp. Did the Mayans even survive that. All of that? To then be blown away just a few years later?

Kinda sad.

Spoiler:

I really hope Mao don't die... well, she's quite fascinated by advanced technologies and things, so maybe she could have moved to the Moon or some space colony before the Doomsday... anyway for all people who remain on Earth, they are all doomed, only some people inside Grand Cannon III and IV, and some on the Moon and space colonies survived it, anywhere else the survival rate is just 0

[Yebyosh]

Originally Posted by dreamless

Spoiler:

1. Shin and Sara warped away from Earth.
2. Shin and Sara died.
3. Sara died, Shin got saved by Sara's spirit.
4. Sara warped away from Earth, Shin got saved by Sara and remained on Earth.

Originally Posted by FlyByNite

Spoiler:

1,2, or 3 is possible. I don't think 4 is since we saw Shin leave. But I suppose he could have came back.

I'm going to decide to believe that Sara left Earth in the AFOS to get the potentially dangerous weapon away from the Earth and who might find it. Shin somehow evolved into a bird-man with those types of powers and went afte her. What happened after that? Who knows. Maybe they both evolved into some higher forms of beings and are out there in the universe together. You can pretty much choose you own ending since it's unresolved at that point.

Personally,

Spoiler:

I believe that Sara and AFOS left the Earth in disgust, Sara having been reawakened by Shin, became an instrument in persuading AFOS to leave rather than staying on Earth and wiping out humanity.

Shin having seen through the Kaduns of anger, grief and destruction, became enough of an enlightened state that a psychic boost provided by the Mayans was enough to 'ascend' him to be a birdman, thus allowing him to ascend the heavens to search for Sara.

On another issue,

Originally Posted by FlyByNite

Spoiler:

And I wonder if it even mattered like you said. The Earth is scorched and most of it is burned to a crisp. Did the Mayans even survive that. All of that? To then be blown away just a few years later?

Kinda sad.

Spoiler:

Who knows, there are survivors. They might be one of them, or they might have 'ascended' themselves, having witnessed the Zero miracle and became true believers and left this mudball behind to fly the cosmos with Shin and Sara

[Ombrenuit]

I thought it was the most beautiful piece of film I've ever seen

Is it safe to say that

Spoiler:

Bird Humans are aliens, and when they say Shin was a bird human after all...it means that Shin was an alien, a being from space, all along. Could this explain the flashbacks in the beginning in a new light? When they say the beings of space came...he was one of the immigrants?

[FlyByNite]

Originally Posted by Ombrenuit

I thought it was the most beautiful piece of film I've ever seen

Is it safe to say that

Spoiler:

Bird Humans are aliens, and when they say Shin was a bird human after all...it means that Shin was an alien, a being from space, all along. Could this explain the flashbacks in the beginning in a new light? When they say the beings of space came...he was one of the immigrants?

Spoiler:

I think it's explained that the aliens came to earth in the past and messed with the genetics of some humans. I think the old doctor or Aries explains it. But basically they put some stuff into the human DNA and Shin it turned out had that in his DNA and it activated for him and allowed him to evolve to the Bird Human powers. Same way that Sara and Mao have their powers, they were born with them.

[Alterscape]

Spoiler:

Call me a hopeless romantic, but with Sara's spirit guiding Shin's hands on the VF-0's controls, I imagined that by setting aside anger and fear (insert Yoda reference here) he was able to, like some others have said, manifest the powers the Bird Man gave the original humans, and fly off to more or less join Sara in whatever new state of being she and AFOS obtained.

[Baba]

I'll go with Alterscape 's version since I unerstood the same thing from seeing the episode. So call me a hopless romantic too .
Otherwise, nice episode and great OAV alltogether, the best fighting scenes ever, and a story that might not have been great but that was realy decent and did it's job well.
The only drawback is that now I'll never be able to appreciate regular's anime mecha fighting scenes as much .

HOORAY FOR MACROSS

[stormy001_M1A2]

Not enough blood for me. But I am damn happy when I see a Monster MK 2 MAC deployed. Those artillery mechas is beautiful.

Storywise, Zero lacks a lot of development, especially the Russian group. The superlative animation is a good compensation.

[Sugetsu]

Just watched the first 3 episodes... It is ok, nothing great about them. Yeah good graphics... so what? who cares. The story is prety lame. But the action secuenses are pretty good. Of course, in my opinion they are no way better than the ones in scrapped princess so far.

Gotta love that fanservice...

I wonder why people give good ratings to almost every anime with good graphics, cute characters, or a pretty good intro/ending song, when the story line, which is the main part isn't outstanding at all.

Samurai 7 anyone?

We are sooo shallow... Including me of curse... I watched Elfen Lied too, and loved its fanservice, its blood and cute naked gilrs...

[Phych]

Like everyone else said, I love the fighting sequences but the story sucked.
It would have been kewl to see some sort of flash forward of Minmay & Rick & the others...or at least a scene w/ SDF-1 at the end or something.

[arias]

Like many of the earlier posts said; Sara's faith and hope guided Shin to become a "Birdhuman" to fly (despite the wrecked engine, boosters etc); to wherever it may be. One thinks, and hopes, that it is a search and eventual reunion with Sara. Watching it again, it really probably is the case.. since you see his plane flying vertically up into space.

I for one thought that Macross Zero was very promising from chapter 1-4.. of course the story was abit flimsy; the characters were not really well developed, but there were parts that were truly beautiful and artistic. And I don't mean only the awesome battle scenes; anyone remember the Maya Island? The waters and everything.. it was awesome. There was alot of attention paid to detail in the animation for the first few chapters; lighting, sound, the peace of the islands.. all very beautiful.

Chapter 5 had pretty good animation when compared to other OVAs, but it was a letdown compared to it's earlier episodes. I was expecting something truly spectacular. However, the battle scenes are rendered so beautifully they might just match up to Ghost in the Shell 2.

The story sucked. Chapter 5 just got on my nerves.. could you believe that I actually skipped through most of it because it was too formulaic? The pace, presentation, structure, and character interaction was just too weak. I was THOROUGHLY shocked that I waited 6 months for such an episode. I was expecting a blast, but I just shook my head in disappointment.

Honestly it had so much potential.. not to forget, one of the MOST beautiful songs I've EVER heard in my life. The ending song played for Chapter 01 and Chapter 05.. the one sung in French. It promises such an epic tale but instead what we get is a hashed plot. I've heard that this is the most expensive OVA ever created; costing around US$10 million or more.. I wish they could've put more money on the script; and that the director, no offence to Shoji Kawamori, could have been more skilled.

Ahh.. T__T. It's just sad.

[Radd]

While I agree that the final chapter seemed rushed, I would hardly say that the story sucked, or that it was rehashed. Sure, maybe it takes a lot of the premise from The Day the Earth Stood Still, but even so that's not exactly a commonly used premise, especially in this day and age.

And certainly the story was very untypical of a Macross show, yet retaining Macross' main themes of hope, peaceful solutions to conflict, and the idea that mankind will survive.

The series was really too short to develope more than a couple characters, but those that it did, it pulled off decently, if not spectacularly like a longer show such as Macross 7. DD and Nora were never main characters, you might as well complain that Col. Millard from Macross Plus was under developed, or the poachers Dynamite 7.

Overall, I rather liked the story and characters, right up to and including the end. I do, however, agree that it would have been even better had the episode been twice as long, or split into two episodes.

To those still speculating about the origins and purpose of the Bird Human, I can only reccomend you go watch SDF Macross, Do You Remember Love? and Macross 7, all of wich give more insight into the Protoculture.

As for the future of the survivors of Macross Zero...

Spoiler:

This really depends on wich version of the Zentradi bombardment of Earth that future series follow. According to the TV series, there were small pockets of humanity, mainly in undeveloped areas of the world, that survived. The number of survivors was less than a million I believe. According to the movie events, no one on Earth survived, only the people from the Macross.

Before anyone says, "Well, they use the tv series story and the movie visuals for the sequels" I will remind you that this is a simplification. Kawamori has been quoted as saying that the true story of Space War I incorporates story and visual elements from both.

Before anyone points out that Plus takes place a short 30 years after SWI, yet there seems to be plenty of people, not to mention millions of colonists leaving Earth all the time, might I remind you of the Human Emmigration Project that Admiral Global put into effect, using Zentradi cloning technology to clone humans and repopulate the Earth and spread humankind across the galaxy to prevent mankind from ever coming so close to extinction.

[hunterx]

interesting comments, I thought the last episode saved the ova since it seemed to take a downturn around episode 3 & 4. I've watched a lot of anime and very few of them are able to have any sort of good endings, except the quality ones of course like the kenshin ovas and even macross plus. Macross Zero was high up there too.

[Colonel-]

Beautiful ending, stunning animation, and awesome fight scenes. The characters could use more screen time since they all have a lot of potential, especially DD Ivanov. About the Bird Human... it looks too much like a Peacemaker from another series to me, but i don't complain since that scene is so awesome.