Umineko no Naku Koro ni - Episode 20 Discussion / Poll

[KanonTheFurniture]

Will need to wait for subs to accurately judge how much of the info was kept, but all things considered it wasn't nearly as bad as I was expecting (based on the preview). There's only one scene I was REALLY upset to see ruined, while for the rest, well, couldn't exactly expect them to keep the depth of the VN, and all things considered I think they did well...

Spoiler for minireview:

-Ange standing up angrily over the happy Rosa and Maria was kept; I kinda expected the episode to just start straight out with the flashbacks so this was a nice transition.

-Lion Sakutaro walking towards Maria, "uryu, uryu, uryu, uryu", God I almost died of cuteness...scratch that, the whole Maria/Sakutaro 'pajama party' scene was adorable in general. That's a good thing,; considering the freak of nature DEEN turned Maria into with her FACES, it's good to see they're doing a nice job with EP4's cute Maria.

-Rosa's receipt scene was kept, but as Auria said, they made up way too fast. Not terrible, it makes Rosa's moodswings seem just as unstable, but it just feels...weird.

-Beatrice appearing before Ange? I don't remember that happening in the VN...am I forgetting things or did the Anime add that in?

-The signature beneath Beatrice's definitely says 'Warugiria'. Lolwow time paradox, since she doesn't take that name until she talks with Battler...makes the exact timing of these flashbacks seem very confusing.

-Shota nekomimi role is fulfilled - Anime Sakutaro is adorable. His voice feels even more appropriate now that he's in 'human' form.

-Ange summoned the stakes too easily. They could have at least made her face look a little more strained, to show just how difficult it was for her. Makes it look like Ange is naturally talented...

-I expected Mammon's voice to be a little deeper (not quite Belphegor deep though), but it's not bad.

-OHGOD BATTLER IN NORMAL CLOTHES!! I like that they kept the information about her hair clips, though, it was something I honestly expected to be cut completely.

-Saint Lucia scenes felt disjointed and all over the place, but they really butchered the scene where she denies the stakes. That, and the Maria convenience store scenes, were the flashback portions I really liked, so it kinda upsets me to see it reduced to a 2-second flashback within a flashback...I would have much rather seen this scene kept than the stakes glomping Sakutaro -_-

-Congrats, Witch Hunt, for the Anime shout-out!! I kinda liked this whole scene, actually, since I think the message bottle incidents are really important clues for solving the mystery. They spent just the right amount of time explaining it, so it didn't just come across as a footnote.

-And now the scene that really pissed me off. DEEN really must hate 34, because they seem to be Hell-bent on cutting down all of her scenes. And this was the scene I was looking forward to most from this episode, the one I was saying 'they're probably going to have to turn the flashbacks into a cliffnotes summary, but as long as they do Lambda's scene right, I'll be happy'...*sigh* No MirageCoordinator either, of course. Guess I've just been so content with DEEN's work in the past few episodes that I was expecting better. Scene didn't feel like the mind-breaking revelation it was supposed to be for 1998 Ange, nor have we seen Lambda's true crazy colors revealed in the Anime yet between this and EP3's tea party. Nnnngh...

Overall I expected a pretty boring episode, so it didn't betray my expectations too much. They did better than I thought on some of the flashbacks, and didn't really do worse on the ones I expected to be butchered either way, especially since none of the important stuff was cut altogether (though the stake denial scene may as well have been). Boring VN flashbacks overall, so naturally we'd get a pretty boring Anime episode out of them, but things will start to kick into gear next week, and that's what I'm looking forward to.

Not rating it until I see the subs, but I'll probably give it a 7, for being better than I expected.

[bigemperor]

Originally Posted by Marion

Lambda's scene was reduced to incredibly low levels - she didn't even troll Ange she was just telling her off. I swear I think DEEN just hates Lambda, because every scene she's been in so far as been drastically shortened and at times ruins her characterization. And Ange didn't even look like she had a hard time summoning the stakes, when in reality she was struggling just to keep conscious through the entire thing while Mammon kept pressuring her.

Best review from this episode, poor lambda deen really hate her.

I cant`t beleive some people give a 10 to this episode.

[punchyout]

Why is everybody saying they cut the 'bully scene'? Doesn't it actually happen later?

[AmyElizzabeth]

Is Human Sakutarou still voiced by Minori Chiharha?

[June 1983]

Originally Posted by punchyout

Why is everybody saying they cut the 'bully scene'? Doesn't it actually happen later?

I think people are concerned that since they showed a flashback to it in this episode, they will use that as an excuse not to show the actual scene.

I'm not convinced of that myself, but we'll see.

[chronotrig]

Well, I was tempted to throw in a 10 just for the WH reference, but my unbiased (or less biased...) rating has to take a couple things into account.

Spoiler for size:

The first half was done very well and the prof section was perfect imho, but they spelled Virgilia's name wrong...

By the way, the anime creators did not make a mistake in using the name Virgilia, though it does open up some interesting possibilities. Remember, this scene is (probably, the following is just a theory) seen through Ange's eyes after she read Maria's diary, so she doesn't know anything that isn't written in the diary. In other words, it's probably safe to say that these flashbacks are Ange's imagination, like her mind is acting out the events written in Maria's diary.

However, this does prove that someone in the outside world knows the name Virgilia and wrote it on that paper. Unless this is a Deen mistake, it might be a big clue.

Also, I was very disappointed in the Lambda scene at the end. It's like Deen is draining the life out of every fast-paced or hard hitting scene they can... You don't get to excuse this one as a time issue or even a music issue, since they could have reused an old track here. Thanks mostly to this, the episode barely gets a 7.5 rounded up to an 8.

[Workworkwork]

I wasn't talking about an actual numerical balancing, sheesh.

[ameskitty]

Originally Posted by punchyout

Why is everybody saying they cut the 'bully scene'? Doesn't it actually happen later?

You can't really judge whether it's been totally cut until next week, but they showed it in a flashback this week.

Like I said, though, there's still a chance that it might be a narrative device to make the timeline more coherent, because, as you said, it does happen later (in the story, not in the timeline).

I'm disappointed if it is cut and that was all we got, but even if it wasn't...this episode was still really boring (Lambda scene especially) . Wouldn't change my rating either way, now that I think about it.

[Ithekro]

Is Human Sakutarou still voiced by Minori Chiharha?

Yes. I recognize her shota voice from Today in Class 5-2.

[Christen]

I haven't seen the episode yet, but I feel the disappointment of toning down Lambda's personality.

Spoiler:

The Virgilia signature seems interesting.

[Ithekro]

Maybe they are holding off on Lambda until later for some reason...shock value perhaps? Though both her and Bern are rather lightly used so far.

[MarthX]

The only scene I really have a problem in this episode is the Lambda scene. Aside from that, it was a good adaption. But it's a good adaption of the boring parts of EP4.

[Christen]

Finished the raw.

Spoiler for review:

Looks like it was a slow-paced episode but managed to rush through the scenes.

I have mixed reactions on the way they handled Ange and Mammon's friendship, then Ange's denial of magic, etc. They were dragging in the SN, but they also carried a lot of Ange's backstory in order for the reader to sympathize with her. However, if they did adapt the necessary minimum to portray that, we'd need more than 8 episodes and Umineko will turn into a melodrama for at least 3-4 episodes before we get back to it's actual genre.

In any case, the cuts was handled better than I expected at least. The only scene that lacks power was Lambda's. Lambda's character was toned down. DEEN could have portrayed her better given the same time allotment. You only need a few changes in voice tone, facial expressions, and music.

Gave this episode a 7 out of 10. We're two episodes into Episode 4 and we've already arrived at this point. Looks like we'll have plenty of time for the rest of the Episode.

[Marion]

Originally Posted by Ithekro

Maybe they are holding off on Lambda until later for some reason...shock value perhaps? Though both her and Bern are rather lightly used so far.

But Lambda isn't suppose to be surprising that she's evil - at least not after EP 3's tea party.

[Dante_Sword]

I give 3 to chapter, to state very boring and although it fits well have lost all sense of the novel, plus some scenes destroyed ...

deen quality is as bad as ever, where are the big expressions?

[Starks]

Good episode. Not enough Mammon.

[serenade_beta]

WAROSU, WAROSU!
Doll turning into a human... No thanks, no thanks, Ryukishi.

Ange... Why are you even showing hesitation? Yeah, Schrondinger's Cat or whatever, but even if it isn't you, at least another you gets to have your brother back, right? Or is it fine that your brother stays dead? At least do it for his sake.
Looking forward to see how she reacts to what 34 said, but I hope she doesn't fall for her proposal...
Still... Get away from the witch business, Ange... You should know that people who talk to stuffed animals as if they were real and etc., etc. should just be reported to the hospital... Anyways, Maria --> Hospital, the talk can come later...

[Used Can]

DEEN did go light-speed in this episode, did they not? Anyhow, I won't complain about this, as long as I get my cake in the final episodes.

Also, lol at Warugiria.

Anyway, Umineko has many nice BGMs, why can't DEEN use more of them? If I remember correctly, miragecoordinator was supposed to play during the scene Lamdadelta met Ange. Oh well...

[MarthX]

Not at all. This episode only covered 3 chapters.

19 covered 4 plus the prologue.

[Proto]

That doesn't say much considering how different are some chapters length-wise. This is specially true for the school chapters in this arc.